Chasing Big Strick

Bigger Stronger Leaner Over 35 Lifter
41

Bench day…

I really thought, after my warmup sets, that it was going to be a bad day. I had no energy and the weight felt heavier than it should. In the end, I got my 5x5 and actually felt pretty good about it. I even got a couple of vids and would appreciate a form check…

Bench Press
Barx15x2
95x15
135x10
185x5
225x2
240x5x5

First video is my 1st set at 240#

Last (5th) set at 240#

Close Grip Bench
225x4
225x3
205x8
205x6

Machine Flyes
130x12
160x8
160x6

DB Incline Press
65sx12x2

Tricep Pushdowns
100x7x2
100x4
80x10

The incline was painful again…on top of my left shoulder. It appears that any movement where my upper arms are perpendicular to my torso causes great distress in the area. I think I will go back to BB and use a closer grip, to bring my elbows in some.

I got a video of my close grip press, as I wanted opinions on my hand placement and form. It appears that the video is corrupt, though. I will continue to work with it.

As for the back issue, I think that I am going to continue as I have, but use a belt for anything over 225#. Also, on my off days, I am going to add significant core strengthening exercises. I will re-evaluate as weights go up. I am in no hurry on this, but I feel like I need the full body stress of squats and deads to help with the upper body work.

42

That last set had power to spare. You’re going light on bench, ain’tcha?

No criticism of form, but hit up maraudermeat. He’s the technician here. As always, try to increase your arch and get some leg drive coming out of the bottom.

43

Skid - Thanks for the insight. I am losing some of my arch because I am spotting myself. Normally my wife would help with the liftoff, as best she can…but she was taking the video. There are sets when I get the weight up then walk my shoulders back up under me. It sucks to have to do, but, fortunately, the weight is light enough that I can get away with it. Unfortunately, that won’t be the case when it gets heavy enough. Not to mention, it is very distracting.

As to the weight…yeah, I started too light. I have been going up 5# every workout but probably should have started here, not 225. It is really stretching my patience, waiting to up the weight.

I do have a question about the leg drive, though. I keep hearing that, but don’t understand exactly what it is. If I push hard enough with my legs, won’t my rear come off the bench? Or are we talking about a different form of leg drive?

I was able to salvage the close grip vid. Again, as I have a wrist issue, I can’t get my hands any closer. Keeping that in mind, what is everyone’s opinion on the form? It is a new exercise for me.

Thanks for the time and advice…

44

Strick, tense up your whole body when you’re pushing (and bringing it down for that matter). If your feet are positioned as far underneath your body as you can, and your back is arched good and plenty, you’ll be able to feel not only your arms and chest, but also your legs driving the weight up.

There is an awful lot to focus on at one time in the bench press, as simple as it seems. One more thing to think about (at least until you do it so many times you don’t have to think about it; I’m not there yet).

Do some searching on this site for bench press form. There’s a lot of great info.

45

It’s not as if your legs actually move anywhere, but the act of trying to push yourself up the bench does two things:

  1. It actually increases your arch
  2. It sends a signal from your brain to your body that this is serious business and that you may die if that weight doesn’t come off the chest. You get better neural activation of the pressing muscles. Sometimes that weight will practically jump off your chest if you have the right setup and use leg drive.

I try to use meat’s technique of setting up. I lay down on the bench and then pull myself headwards to and past the bar until I can put my feet up to the middle of the bench. I then push my self down the bench while keeping my feet in place as much as possible and trying to get my ass and my shoulders as close together as possible. Sometimes I feel like I could kiss the soles of my shoes - I’m that tight. I try to end up with my shoulders under the bar so liftoff is easier. I press straight up though so that may not work for some folks.

Take a look at a few of meat’s bench vids. He’s rawelite on YouTube.com

46

[quote]sfp wrote:
Strick, tense up your whole body when you’re pushing (and bringing it down for that matter). If your feet are positioned as far underneath your body as you can, and your back is arched good and plenty, you’ll be able to feel not only your arms and chest, but also your legs driving the weight up.

There is an awful lot to focus on at one time in the bench press, as simple as it seems. One more thing to think about (at least until you do it so many times you don’t have to think about it; I’m not there yet).

Do some searching on this site for bench press form. There’s a lot of great info.[/quote]

Thanks. I did notice on the vids that I did not have my feet up under me. The bench I have is too high off the floor. You can’t tell on the vids, but I constructed a mini platform, from 4x4s and 3/4" plywood, that fits around that foot of the bench. That made up enough distance that I should be able to get my legs up under me. I was just being sloppy. Another great reason for video.

I will concentrate on that the next workout.

47

[quote]skidmark wrote:
It’s not as if your legs actually move anywhere, but the act of trying to push yourself up the bench does two things:

  1. It actually increases your arch
  2. It sends a signal from your brain to your body that this is serious business and that you may die if that weight doesn’t come off the chest. You get better neural activation of the pressing muscles. Sometimes that weight will practically jump off your chest if you have the right setup and use leg drive.

I try to use meat’s technique of setting up. I lay down on the bench and then pull myself headwards to and past the bar until I can put my feet up to the middle of the bench. I then push my self down the bench while keeping my feet in place as much as possible and trying to get my ass and my shoulders as close together as possible. Sometimes I feel like I could kiss the soles of my shoes - I’m that tight. I try to end up with my shoulders under the bar so liftoff is easier. I press straight up though so that may not work for some folks.

Take a look at a few of meat’s bench vids. He’s rawelite on YouTube.com[/quote]

Now that makes sense, if I am understanding it right. I am not driving my body up, towards the ceiling. I am driving myself into the arch, correct? I am using my legs, cocked underneath me, to drive my lower body into my upper body, thereby tightening and stablilizing the arch?

And I can see how that push, as you start to press the weight up could cause the “jump” that you mention.

Does this sound right or do I need to layoff the Rx?

48

Nope - you got my meaning.

49

You dont want your butt coming off the bench. Try to drive every thing towards your shoulders.

50

Yeah. Now that I have an idea of what is meant by “leg drive”, I want to redo the workout. I am pumped about improving my form and seeing the difference.

Thanks Gents!

51

63G and kmcnyc,

Thank you for the info/advice on warming up. Yesterday I did a few shoulder warm-ups prior to starting, did, as you can see, sets with the bar and 95, with light stretching in between. Yesterday was the first time that I can remember doing bench and not getting that strained feeling. It felt great the whole way through.

Given the revelation concerning my back, my short-term goals need a bit of modification. These are by 5/28 (last workout before my b-day)

Bench - 315#
Squat - 225x10 deep
Deadlift - 375#

The deadlift is problematic because my legs are the weak link and I am averse to pushing the squats too fast.

The bench I really don’t know what to think. I know that I can already do over 285#, but have no idea where I actually am. I am tempted to do a max session next workout, but hate to so close to goal testing.

Also pertaining to bench, as I obviously started too low in weight on my 5x5s, I am toying with a 10# jump next workout…but hate to break my pattern.

Any suggestions on that?

52

I was twitting you about the poundage, but I would stick to whatever plan you’ve developed, if I were you. There’s no need to hurry and get heavy and you obviously have the strength in reserve.

My bench estimates at 290 right now, but I am not going to change my working max of 245 at all. That number just tells me I’m doing the right stuff. I’ll get there eventually.

53

Last time you went 5x5x240. Is that what you planned to do again? If so I probably would jump 10. If you get your 5x5, great. If you dont, get what you can and hit it again next time.
Or stay @240,and add a rep on each set.

I did that until I got in the mid 3s. If I werent heading into a cycle Id pick it back up.

If you meant add 10 above your scheduled jump, I think Im with Skid, slow down, stick to your plan. Its working.

54

Skid- I didn’t in any way take affront to the comment. Heck, your comments, on your log and others, are one of the best parts of the forum! The comment, along with the video, did, however, confirm that I started too light. I have never done a 5x5 before and had no idea where to start. Hell, for bench, I have never done anything but go in and do a 1/2 pyramid…up, up, up to a set of 1-3 reps, follow it with the same weight and add a forced rep, then one lighter set.

I am really pumped about doing 5x5s, 5/3/1 and everything else I haven’t tried. The struggle for me is the not knowing. Given the way I used to do it, I could always throw in a max attempt set. This time around I am actually trying to stick with the spirit of a program.

63G- I have been adding 5#/workout. In my current rotation, that has been 3 bench days every 2 weeks. My thought was to skip 245# and go to 250#. On the face of it, that sounds easy…only 10 more pounds. Over the 5x5, though, that is an additional 250# for the working sets. I am wary of failing to get the full 5x5 prior to crossing over 250# (just a mental thing). So, playing it safe and just sticking to the 5# increments feels comfortable.

As you can tell, patience is not a virtue I hold in abundance. I am working on it though.

55

Man I go for it. If you get 4 good sets and come up short by a rep on the 5th so what? You still get strong. Thats why I like the 5x5. I can move around a little and still gain.

I start by telling my self I want 5 sets. If its a real heavy weight Ill go 5x3 one week, the next Ill go for 5x4 and so on. I have actually went 5x3 to 5x5 form one workout to the next with the same weight. Thats why I like it. If Im ready to make a gain I can if not I still get a good workout.

56

[quote]63Galaxie wrote:
Man I go for it. If you get 4 good sets and come up short by a rep on the 5th so what? You still get strong. Thats why I like the 5x5. I can move around a little and still gain.

I start by telling my self I want 5 sets. If its a real heavy weight Ill go 5x3 one week, the next Ill go for 5x4 and so on. I have actually went 5x3 to 5x5 form one workout to the next with the same weight. Thats why I like it. If Im ready to make a gain I can if not I still get a good workout. [/quote]

The more I think about it the more I agree with you. If I complete the full 5x5, then I saved myself a workout…of working below where I need to be working. If I don’t, then I have finally found where I actually need to be in the progression.

Besides, I am hopeful that the form tips from you, skid and meat will more than makeup for the jump in weight.

That being said, yesterday’s workout must have been okay. My pecs and tris are grumbling a bit. Whiny, stinkin’ muscles. I suppose that having a desk job doesn’t help. Unless we are installing new equipment, which can get rather heavy, about the most weight I move in a day is the 32oz. of water I have at lunch…drop sets, of course.

57

Oh yeah…the new power rack arrived today. I got to work out some of my soreness by piecing it together. It is a Yukon PR-127. It definitely isn’t as sturdy as what I was used to at the gym, but more then sufficient for me. And for the price, it is hard to beat…unless, of course, you snag free stuff off of CL.

58

Tell you what, I can recover quicker if I use Surge Recovery. I take it right after my workout. It helps.

59

[quote]63Galaxie wrote:
Tell you what, I can recover quicker if I use Surge Recovery. I take it right after my workout. It helps.[/quote]

Do you think it is that much better than other alternatives? I have never posted any dietary/supplement intake in detail. At present, it goes something like this…multivitamin, glucosamine, flaxseed and trib in the a.m. (before I leave for work)…protein bar, orange (or banana), a handful of peanuts (I LOVE peanuts. But, hey, I’m originally from GA. What would you expect!?) and some Kashi crackers to munch on until lunch.

I eat lunch around 11:00-11:15. That is comprised of cottage cheese with peaches (drained light syrup), a double serving of broccoli and/or cauliflower, 8-14 oz. of meat and a starch of some sort (serving of potatoes, bread or the like). Right after lunch I take a vitamin c, vitamin e, glucosamine and trib. Sometimes I sub a flaxseed for the glucosamine.

About 3:30, I will finish whatever I haven’t eaten from my “morning supply”, which is usually never more than the fruit. About 1/2 an hour to 45 minutes later I have a multigrain bagel with either cream cheese or peanut butter, depending on mood, and wash it down with a 40g protein shake (whey, skim milk with creatine and BCAA added)…pre-workout meal.

Within 20 minutes of finishing the workout I take a 60g protein shake…same as above, just more powder and skim milk. All of my shakes have 3-5g of creatine and BCAA added. During my workout I normally have some AJ with me, for energy levels.

Supper, on workout days is hard, as I usually don’t finish until late and don’t feel like eating. I will, during the week, force down a portion of meat with veggies and down some V8 frusion with it. Unless it is the Sunday workout. I workout earlier and have time to grill out. So, Sunday’s supper often includes steak. As I am not overly strict, this might include a little pasta or bread. And a small desert is not unheard of 1-2 times a week.

Before bed I have my own bastardized protein smoothie (whey powder, skim milk, frozen blueberries and strawberries (sometimes cherries), BCAA, creatine and a teaspoon of pudding powder, for flavor and the insulin spike. I use the sugar in powder, as my body has zero tolerance for artificial sweeteners. Aspartame, Splenda, Nutri-sweet, doesn’t matter. If I eat it, I will get a headache, get bloated and nauseous within minutes. Along the same lines, sugar alcohols do the same thing, but worse. I have to be careful about which protein bars I eat because of that. Also, I take another flaxseed and glucosamine. I used to take ZMA, but it made me feel odd and caused my blood pressure to go wonky.

On off-days (day between workouts), it is pretty much the same, except that I add a smoothie in the morning, before work. On the weeks where I work 7-4, instead of 8-5, I will sometimes go get eggs and a piece of bacon (for flavor) when I get to work.

On a side note, we are really lucky, here in OK. We have Braum’s. Their skim milk has 13g of protein per serving, instead of 8. When I questioned this, it was explained that, when they skim their milk, they don’t replace the lost volume with water, as do most dairies. They replace it with skim milk. It makes it more like 1% than the chalk water I was used to.

Sorry this is so long. I was just wondering if you thought the Surge was that much better than what I am doing post workout.

60

Question for everyone…
As I have mentioned, I am doing a “me” version of 5x5 …at least on Bench, but will start on squats/deads. I am using the same weight for all 5 sets. I have seen versions where the weight is ramped up each set…225x5, 235x5, 245x5, etc…

How do you normally do it? Ramping or static in the workout? Or, for that matter, have you done both? Does one seem to work better than the other for you?