how much back work would you do/currently doing to get a strong back? currently hitting back about 3 times a week. i do 531, upper lower split.
so a typical upper body session would have about 30-40 pullups + 5x5 bb rows + 5x8 machine rows, twice a week A deadlift session would be just deadlifting, RDLs, lower back extension and 5x8 latpulldowns. would anyone prescribe more volume? or how would you go around doing it.
What you’re doing looks sound.
Personally, (and if anyone hasn’t noticed yet, there is something seriously wrong with the way my head works) I train Upper Back EVERY DAY. Usaully something stupid like 100 face pulls with varying band tensions or seated DB powercleans for time or super high rep pull aparts from different angles. I will also, occasionally do some high rep vertical rowing on lower body days.
I do all this because my upper back was giving out first on my squats and I felt it was more a conditioning problem then a strength problem. This has helped my squat, bench, and deadlift tremendously. My back is staying locked in on squats, my lockouts on my pulls are as solid as they have ever been (shooting for 830 at the Arnold), and benching has never felt better.
Again, I’m nuts. Just wanted to share my experience.
This is interesting …
Could you say more about what you mean by a conditioning problem as opposed to a strength problem please?
I have one day per week dedicated to pulls; deadlifts (or some variation), back, and some hamstrings. BUT, the thing that has really healed my shoulder pain, helped my grip, and just made me feel better is doing 4 sets of pull-ups everyday (well, everyday that I train… usually 4-5 days/week). I do not go to failure, and I vary my reps each day. So monday, I may do 4 sets of 6, Tuesday 4 sets of 8, Thurs 4 sets of 5, then on Friday, usually my pull day, I will do weighted pull-ups in addition to my other back work. Not my intent, but my back has grown a pretty good bit in the 2 months that I have been doing this too. I also have little doubt doing this has attributed to helping my lockouts on my deadlifts… good stuff.
stormthebeach: i was thinking about increasing the volume. could you give some more examples of these exercises you do daily? do you feel sore after, or is it just a takes a while and you’ll get used to it thing.
[quote]ros1816 wrote:
This is interesting …
Could you say more about what you mean by a conditioning problem as opposed to a strength problem please?
[/quote]
As in I could do seated dumbbell power cleans for sets of 10 with 60-70lb dumbbells and I have done upper back good mornings with 400+lbs. So the strength was there, I was just lacking the ability to maintain the strength/tension with a heavy bar on my back.
So, spending more time under tension has added some size and the ability to hold my scaps isometrically for a longer period of time under heavy loads.
Makes sense. I’ll try it.
[quote]LTKO wrote:
stormthebeach: i was thinking about increasing the volume. could you give some more examples of these exercises you do daily? do you feel sore after, or is it just a takes a while and you’ll get used to it thing.[/quote]
I started off with a light band and did as many sets as I had to to get to 100 reps 2-3 times a week, then did 100 pull aparts with a mini band 2-3 times a week. It took a couple weeks but when I could get 100 straight reps without stopping on the face pulls, I started using an average band for 50 rep sets, and a monster mini for the pull aparts. You will get pretty stiff for the first week or two. You get used to it pretty quick.
I did 5 minuntes straight of face pulls with a light band yesterday. I did a max good morning today and had no soreness in my upper back at all.
will try it out although 100 reps at a shot is crazy. haha
[quote]LTKO wrote:
will try it out although 100 reps at a shot is crazy. haha[/quote]
This is the boring shit that no one else seems to do. I did 100 deadlifts last night with 135lbs. I feel like I could jump to the moon today.
I tried to do this 100 face pull thing today and I made it to 75…
I am going to start doing it all the time though. Maybe tomorrow I’ll try for 77, ha!
I’ve been trying to hit upper back at least twice a week, for both strength and posture reasons. The key is to not do it too soon before deadlifting. From experience, if I do heavy rows too soon before my deadlift day, I have trouble keeping my shoulders back, and end up looking like a hunchback when I try to lock out heavy weight.
Been doing the 100 pullaparts a day for a few weeks now. As Wendler so eloquently stated, we could all use more upper back thickness. And I’m thinking some shoulder health benefits can also be gained, not to mention help balance out those front/rear delts.
I’ve been doing a 100 band pull aparts a day for the last 3 months and my shoulders have never felt better. Just try to do it in less and less sets and then start moving your hands closer and closer together once you can do 100 without stopping.
Not sure if i skipped it, but you never mentioned what kind of grip you were using?
Closer grip underhand (inside shoulder width) 
Your welcome.
Kroc Rows and the boring but big assistance for deadlift
I 100% agree with Storms strategy of training the back every day. I started using a lil trick that i found in one of Pavels books which is doing pullup ladders (ex: 1 rep, 5 seconds rest, 2 reps, 5 seconds rest, 3 reps, 5 seconds rest, 4 reps, 5 seconds rest, etc) this has made my back much stronger on rows and within a month my weight for hammer curls was up 12.5 lbs. I did the ladders every single day for 14 days, took 4 days off and then did 12 more days of it. The thing i think that helped the most is that i did NOT take a single set to failure (always 1 rep shy).
Hope this helps!
[quote]Mike T. wrote:
Not sure if i skipped it, but you never mentioned what kind of grip you were using?
Closer grip underhand (inside shoulder width)
Your welcome.[/quote]
For what? Rows or pullups?
Storm, you do your face pulls with bands? or rope via cable. also are you talking about band pull a parts?