[quote]Vegg wrote:
Yeah, I’m actually using Bio-Oil right now. I’m also going to up my fat intake like crazy during my next bulking phase. (My only carbs will be in the morning and peri/post-workout) I’m going to try to keep fat gain at a minimum this time too. [/quote]
Don’t know if you have seen this or not, but it might be useful:
http://www.ironaddicts.com/forums/showthread.php?t=3398
[quote]xb-C wrote:
Well in case someone misses this in the other thread. This is a response for C_C as he asked me to write out what I was doing. Anyone can comment if they would like.
Alright this might be long I’ll write down directly from my log book what I did the last week for each body part to give you a better idea of what I’am doing.
7/24
front squats
135 x 3
155 x 2
185 x 1
205 x 1
225 x 2
then 185 for 10 doing 5 sets of 2 cluster sets
155 for 20 doing 8 cluster sets
7/25
delcine bench
95 x 8
135 x 6
155 x 4
185 x 1
205 x 1
225 x 3
165 x 12
145 x 10
incline bench
135 x 8
115 4x12
db flies
25’s x 12
35’s x 2x12
7/26
SHIPS
135 x 6
155 x 6
165 x 6
175 x 6
155 x 12
135 x 15
reverse pulldowns
100 x 12
125 x 12
150 x 10
112 x 12
112 x 12
chest supported row
45 x 15
90 x 2x10
100 x 7
7/27
sumo deadlift
135 x 5
185 x 5
225 x 3
275 x 3
315 x 1
335 x 3
7/28
incline
135 x 10
155 x 5
185 x 8
135 x 3x8
Decline
205 x 8
185 x 6
DB flies
35’s x 12
45’a x 2x10
Couple things:
This has been what my lifting has been like for about the last 9 weeks. I don’t think I have been slacking in the gym any. Upon getting everything out in the open it does look like my pressing volume is WAY TO FUCKING HIGH at least for now, maybe a cruise week is in order.
@ stunman mike, I’ve still been eating 5-6x a day. so I do not think that is the main reason my weight has stalled. I do need to bump my calories up some though, for the most part however I’ve been waking up around 180-183 and then going to bed weighing about 185-187.
A quick look at my diet in case anyone wants to see
meal one
super shake 1335cal
meal two
pasta, chicken, steak, or fish +16oz of 2%milk give or take 600cal
meal three
pb & j cottage cheese, 16oz 2%milk give or take 600cal
meal four
pasta and more milk
meal five
5-8 tbsp of peanut butter +16oz of 2%milk again like close to 1000cal here
meal 6
cottage cheese and more milk, or yogurt.
I dont know the exact number of calories I eat, if my stomach feels empty I eat something. This is usually and all day thing. I only write down the solid meals I eat. I snack constantly on peanuts, poptars ect. Usually get 8 hours of sleep or more. Dont drink booze, dont drink pop very much maybe 3-4x a month.
The main thing here is just that my joints feel “old” so maybe all I need is a weeks cruise or something, I did not start feeling “beat up” so to speak until this last week or so.
Stronghold suggested I do 531, less volume,huge room to progress. It would also give me the opportunity to rest more since I’d only be lifting 4 days a week. This could help my joints feel better. I’m also thinking of buying some fish oil to help with my inflamation.
Sorry this is so long and drawn out, just trying to get all the bases covered. [/quote]
Lack of structure in the way you go about your sets. Seems all a little random, and you have a lot of heavy doubles or triples and such in there… Doing that all the time isn’t too nice on the joints.
On other lifts you use way too much volume (SHIPS, for example).
All that sort of combines and creeps up on your bodies’ recovery abilities.
Exercise selection/balance is a little funny.
You need more “healthy” fats in your diet… IMO joints/tendons rebel whenever either carbs or healthy fats are practically absent from your diet.
I agree with stronghold on 5/3/1, mostly. I’m still a little torn on the issue though… I think some higher frequency bb routine might not be a bad idea, you are far too light for your height and your leverages suck as a result… That may be another reason for why your joints/tendons start to feel bad, if you do full-ROM bench/incline all the way down to the chest and that’s too much ROM for your shoulders… Even with an arch.
Might be a nice idea to firstly take it easy for a week and then go on to some mostly higher-rep bodybuilding routine, 6+ reps on everything for a while.
You can use 5/3/1 principles on your main exercises still, just make sure you really do underestimate your max correctly so that your actual reps on your last set on wave 1-3 will be above 5, then do your assistance work ramped, bb-style.
Quite frankly, whether you want to be a good powerlifter or look like a bodybuilder or both, you need to beef up and get yourself above 200… “Easily” doable, too. I figure you could make it to 210 before the end of this year without any excessive fat-gain, possibly even 220+… What do you say?
slaps Strongholds ass Whatever I roll with whatever. This is the fucking internet and I’ve been here long enough
So…
FUCK YEAH!! Hit motherfucking biceps yesterday. 1 motherfucking 55 on the barbell for 6 reps. I’m down to two aleve before bed compared to my 4 Advil 5 times a day with enough Codeine to kill a horse before bed. Everything is starting to spool up again. Next week for damn sure I’ll be back to hitting it hard.
This may sound slightly idiotic but when would ye consider a 6ft guy “big” is there a certain threshold for it ? I mean Waylander is nearly freaking 300lbs lol is THAT considered big or am i thinking to small ?
[quote]SmallToBig wrote:
This may sound slightly idiotic but when would ye consider a 6ft guy “big” is there a certain threshold for it ? I mean Waylander is nearly freaking 300lbs lol is THAT considered big or am i thinking to small ?[/quote]
Depends on his structure, muscle-belly-shape/attachments and bf levels etc… Some 6 feet guys may look great at 230-240 (when very lean), most will need to weigh much more… It’s really just guessing unless you can see what he actually looks like.
[quote]waylanderxx wrote:
Xbc, if you feel the volume is too much you can probably fix that just by cutting out those drop sets you seem fond of. I mean you already ramped up to your top weight, not really any reason to do anymore IMO.
Do you use EVOO and supplement with fish oil? Fixed my joint problem right up after about 2 weeks.[/quote]
I take regular conola oil, idk if there is a difference, on the label it says its just polyunsaturated and monounsaturated fats and I know those are the healthy kind so thats why I take it. I mix 4 tbsp of it into my shakes, talk about an easy way to get another 400-500cal.
[quote]xb-C wrote:
waylanderxx wrote:
Xbc, if you feel the volume is too much you can probably fix that just by cutting out those drop sets you seem fond of. I mean you already ramped up to your top weight, not really any reason to do anymore IMO.
Do you use EVOO and supplement with fish oil? Fixed my joint problem right up after about 2 weeks.
I take regular conola oil, idk if there is a difference, on the label it says its just polyunsaturated and monounsaturated fats and I know those are the healthy kind so thats why I take it. I mix 4 tbsp of it into my shakes, talk about an easy way to get another 400-500cal.[/quote]
I might be mistaken but I think physiologik (a great T-cell member) said canola oil was shit, I’ll see if I can find it.
[quote]Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
Lack of structure in the way you go about your sets. Seems all a little random, and you have a lot of heavy doubles or triples and such in there… Doing that all the time isn’t too nice on the joints.
On other lifts you use way too much volume (SHIPS, for example).
All that sort of combines and creeps up on your bodies’ recovery abilities.
Exercise selection/balance is a little funny.
You need more “healthy” fats in your diet… IMO joints/tendons rebel whenever either carbs or healthy fats are practically absent from your diet.
I agree with stronghold on 5/3/1, mostly. I’m still a little torn on the issue though… I think some higher frequency bb routine might not be a bad idea, you are far too light for your height and your leverages suck as a result… That may be another reason for why your joints/tendons start to feel bad, if you do full-ROM bench/incline all the way down to the chest and that’s too much ROM for your shoulders… Even with an arch.
Might be a nice idea to firstly take it easy for a week and then go on to some mostly higher-rep bodybuilding routine, 6+ reps on everything for a while.
You can use 5/3/1 principles on your main exercises still, just make sure you really do underestimate your max correctly so that your actual reps on your last set on wave 1-3 will be above 5, then do your assistance work ramped, bb-style.
Quite frankly, whether you want to be a good powerlifter or look like a bodybuilder or both, you need to beef up and get yourself above 200… “Easily” doable, too. I figure you could make it to 210 before the end of this year without any excessive fat-gain, possibly even 220+… What do you say?
[/quote]
A couple things to point out.
The reason I do the drop sets is I remember reading in MODOKS thread in the t-cell about how phil hernon would work up to a heavy weight for 6 reps or so, then back the weight down, rep it out for 12, then back it down again and rep it out for another like 10-15 reps. I guess in my case, too much is a bad thing and my shoulders and elbows are suffering from it.
It’s is more of a discomfort feeling not so much pain. I’ll ice whatever is sore and after a day or two I’ll be fine up until I hit that particular body part again. That is when the joints and what not start being sore. I started using wrist wraps and elbow sleeves this has helped too, I suggest anyone who lifts heavy to invest in these. I’ve seen a big difference. I’ll also take some ibuprofen when I feel like it.
My goal was to get over 200lbs by the end of August, I think it is doable, and after much speculation I think going 4 days or so a week is much beter then 6. I’m not sure how I’ll set my split up, I’m almost certain I will keep my leg day the same as I’ve had no problems with my hips knees or what have you.
I’m thinking
Day 1
CHEST AND ARMS
Day 2
LEGS
Day 3
OFF
Day 4
BACK
DAY 5
SHOULDERS
Using lighter weights, ramping up to a top set in the 6-10 range I think on my compound lifts then doing something like 3-4 sets of 10-15 reps or however I see fit for accessory stuff.
C_C you’re much better at pairing muscle groups so I’ll just wait for your opinion.
My mistake Xbc I was thinking corn oil. He said coconut oil should be used for frying though so idk.
Xb what your doing is basically doing Big Beyond Belief except putting the 3 rep ranges into 1 set …
BBB works as Day 1,2 - 13-15 reps, Day 3,4 - 10-12 reps, Day 5,6 - 8-10 reps.
So your just doing it backwards… hhmm C_C is that an option for someone finished BBB to do o.0
[quote]xb-C wrote:
Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
Lack of structure in the way you go about your sets. Seems all a little random, and you have a lot of heavy doubles or triples and such in there… Doing that all the time isn’t too nice on the joints.
On other lifts you use way too much volume (SHIPS, for example).
All that sort of combines and creeps up on your bodies’ recovery abilities.
Exercise selection/balance is a little funny.
You need more “healthy” fats in your diet… IMO joints/tendons rebel whenever either carbs or healthy fats are practically absent from your diet.
I agree with stronghold on 5/3/1, mostly. I’m still a little torn on the issue though… I think some higher frequency bb routine might not be a bad idea, you are far too light for your height and your leverages suck as a result… That may be another reason for why your joints/tendons start to feel bad, if you do full-ROM bench/incline all the way down to the chest and that’s too much ROM for your shoulders… Even with an arch.
Might be a nice idea to firstly take it easy for a week and then go on to some mostly higher-rep bodybuilding routine, 6+ reps on everything for a while.
You can use 5/3/1 principles on your main exercises still, just make sure you really do underestimate your max correctly so that your actual reps on your last set on wave 1-3 will be above 5, then do your assistance work ramped, bb-style.
Quite frankly, whether you want to be a good powerlifter or look like a bodybuilder or both, you need to beef up and get yourself above 200… “Easily” doable, too. I figure you could make it to 210 before the end of this year without any excessive fat-gain, possibly even 220+… What do you say?
A couple things to point out.
The reason I do the drop sets is I remember reading in MODOKS thread in the t-cell about how phil hernon would work up to a heavy weight for 6 reps or so, then back the weight down, rep it out for 12, then back it down again and rep it out for another like 10-15 reps. I guess in my case, too much is a bad thing and my shoulders and elbows are suffering from it.
It’s is more of a discomfort feeling not so much pain. I’ll ice whatever is sore and after a day or two I’ll be fine up until I hit that particular body part again. That is when the joints and what not start being sore. I started using wrist wraps and elbow sleeves this has helped too, I suggest anyone who lifts heavy to invest in these. I’ve seen a big difference. I’ll also take some ibuprofen when I feel like it.
My goal was to get over 200lbs by the end of August, I think it is doable, and after much speculation I think going 4 days or so a week is much beter then 6. I’m not sure how I’ll set my split up, I’m almost certain I will keep my leg day the same as I’ve had no problems with my hips knees or what have you.
I’m thinking
Day 1
CHEST AND ARMS
Day 2
LEGS
Day 3
OFF
Day 4
BACK
DAY 5
SHOULDERS
Using lighter weights, ramping up to a top set in the 6-10 range I think on my compound lifts then doing something like 3-4 sets of 10-15 reps or however I see fit for accessory stuff.
C_C you’re much better at pairing muscle groups so I’ll just wait for your opinion.[/quote]
4 days per week (this works really well with 5/3/1 on the main exercises, though you probably don’t want to do back squats/sldls AND floor deads in the same week):
Day 1 - Chest, Back
Day 2 - off
Day 3 - Legs
Day 4 - Delts (can do some rehab/prehab and maybe even additional back work here though)
Day 5 - Arms
Day 6 - off
Day 7 - off
5/3/1 on bench or incline for chest and rows perhaps for back… (or rack pulls or floor deads if you don’t back squat/sldl on leg day… You can do front squats there instead)
Also, 5/3/1 on back squats if you do them, otherwise cluster-training on front-squats (perhaps fattyfat’s protocol of 25 cluster reps, no matter how many sets it takes, and just keep increasing the weight from 60 percent of 1RM to your old 1RM or beyond, then restart cycle…).
And finally, 5/3/1 on either overhead presses for delts or CGP for arms… your call…
Now, alternatively you could try the trusty old yates-3-way that josh is doing, for example (is pretty low volume).
chest, bis, tris
legs
off
delts, back
off
repeat or another off day.
do any of you guys wake up to pee in the middle of the night and your starving? it fucking sucks haha
[quote]xb-C wrote:
A couple things to point out.
The reason I do the drop sets is I remember reading in MODOKS thread in the t-cell about how phil hernon would work up to a heavy weight for 6 reps or so, then back the weight down, rep it out for 12, then back it down again and rep it out for another like 10-15 reps. I guess in my case, too much is a bad thing and my shoulders and elbows are suffering from it.
[/quote]
This was not meant to be done as a drop set. This is 3 separate work sets with 3 different weights.
i have a question for you guys, how important do you guys think casein protein is? I mean if i had tuna which i do is it really that big of a deal?
[quote]Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
xb-C wrote:
Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
Lack of structure in the way you go about your sets. Seems all a little random, and you have a lot of heavy doubles or triples and such in there… Doing that all the time isn’t too nice on the joints.
On other lifts you use way too much volume (SHIPS, for example).
All that sort of combines and creeps up on your bodies’ recovery abilities.
Exercise selection/balance is a little funny.
You need more “healthy” fats in your diet… IMO joints/tendons rebel whenever either carbs or healthy fats are practically absent from your diet.
I agree with stronghold on 5/3/1, mostly. I’m still a little torn on the issue though… I think some higher frequency bb routine might not be a bad idea, you are far too light for your height and your leverages suck as a result… That may be another reason for why your joints/tendons start to feel bad, if you do full-ROM bench/incline all the way down to the chest and that’s too much ROM for your shoulders… Even with an arch.
Might be a nice idea to firstly take it easy for a week and then go on to some mostly higher-rep bodybuilding routine, 6+ reps on everything for a while.
You can use 5/3/1 principles on your main exercises still, just make sure you really do underestimate your max correctly so that your actual reps on your last set on wave 1-3 will be above 5, then do your assistance work ramped, bb-style.
Quite frankly, whether you want to be a good powerlifter or look like a bodybuilder or both, you need to beef up and get yourself above 200… “Easily” doable, too. I figure you could make it to 210 before the end of this year without any excessive fat-gain, possibly even 220+… What do you say?
A couple things to point out.
The reason I do the drop sets is I remember reading in MODOKS thread in the t-cell about how phil hernon would work up to a heavy weight for 6 reps or so, then back the weight down, rep it out for 12, then back it down again and rep it out for another like 10-15 reps. I guess in my case, too much is a bad thing and my shoulders and elbows are suffering from it.
It’s is more of a discomfort feeling not so much pain. I’ll ice whatever is sore and after a day or two I’ll be fine up until I hit that particular body part again. That is when the joints and what not start being sore. I started using wrist wraps and elbow sleeves this has helped too, I suggest anyone who lifts heavy to invest in these. I’ve seen a big difference. I’ll also take some ibuprofen when I feel like it.
My goal was to get over 200lbs by the end of August, I think it is doable, and after much speculation I think going 4 days or so a week is much beter then 6. I’m not sure how I’ll set my split up, I’m almost certain I will keep my leg day the same as I’ve had no problems with my hips knees or what have you.
I’m thinking
Day 1
CHEST AND ARMS
Day 2
LEGS
Day 3
OFF
Day 4
BACK
DAY 5
SHOULDERS
Using lighter weights, ramping up to a top set in the 6-10 range I think on my compound lifts then doing something like 3-4 sets of 10-15 reps or however I see fit for accessory stuff.
C_C you’re much better at pairing muscle groups so I’ll just wait for your opinion.
4 days per week (this works really well with 5/3/1 on the main exercises, though you probably don’t want to do back squats/sldls AND floor deads in the same week):
Day 1 - Chest, Back
Day 2 - off
Day 3 - Legs
Day 4 - Delts (can do some rehab/prehab and maybe even additional back work here though)
Day 5 - Arms
Day 6 - off
Day 7 - off
5/3/1 on bench or incline for chest and rows perhaps for back… (or rack pulls or floor deads if you don’t back squat/sldl on leg day… You can do front squats there instead)
Also, 5/3/1 on back squats if you do them, otherwise cluster-training on front-squats (perhaps fattyfat’s protocol of 25 cluster reps, no matter how many sets it takes, and just keep increasing the weight from 60 percent of 1RM to your old 1RM or beyond, then restart cycle…).
And finally, 5/3/1 on either overhead presses for delts or CGP for arms… your call…
Now, alternatively you could try the trusty old yates-3-way that josh is doing, for example (is pretty low volume).
chest, bis, tris
legs
off
delts, back
off
repeat or another off day.
[/quote]
Couple questions:
Do you think doing 531 for front squat would be bad? It’s either that or doing the cluster sets you described.
If I did bench or incline bench on chest day using 531, would doing CGB on arms day be again too much? Or would you just ramp up to something like 60-70% of my 1rm and rep it out?
Overall I think the way you have 531 set up is pretty solid. I’ll take the rest of the week off, I’ve got plans to squat next monday so I will do that and take it easy the rest of that week and hopefully start 531. Thanks a lot C_C
[quote]Scott M wrote:
xb-C wrote:
A couple things to point out.
The reason I do the drop sets is I remember reading in MODOKS thread in the t-cell about how phil hernon would work up to a heavy weight for 6 reps or so, then back the weight down, rep it out for 12, then back it down again and rep it out for another like 10-15 reps. I guess in my case, too much is a bad thing and my shoulders and elbows are suffering from it.
This was not meant to be done as a drop set. This is 3 separate work sets with 3 different weights. [/quote]
ugh, sorry.
Thats probably why I always sucked on my last set of those.
Thanks for clarifying that scott.
[quote]SmallToBig wrote:
Xb what your doing is basically doing Big Beyond Belief except putting the 3 rep ranges into 1 set …
BBB works as Day 1,2 - 13-15 reps, Day 3,4 - 10-12 reps, Day 5,6 - 8-10 reps.
So your just doing it backwards… hhmm C_C is that an option for someone finished BBB to do o.0
[/quote]
The 5, 10, 15 approach of Phil Hernon (or even 8, 12, 20, whatever)… Haven’t tested that enough yet… Modok and ScottM are trying it, I think.
And no, you don’t do all 3 rep ranges in 1 set. It’s 3 individual sets, not a drop set.
In Phil’s routines you could do, say:
Chest (3 sets per bodypart)
-Low-Incline BB - 405 x 5, 345 x 8
-Flat HS Press - whatever x 16
Or
Chest
-Low-Incline BB - 405 x 5, 345 x 8, 315 x 15 or so
That kind of thing…
Anyway, I want to see how well modok does on that.
Btw XBC, when doing a higher frequency thing like the yates routine or so… I’d go for a double-rotation, perhaps…
That can mean either having 2 sets of different exercises or 2 sets of rep ranges (or both)…
One might do
Chest
-Low-Incline BB 375 x 8, 385 x 5-6
And then next session do
-Low-Inc. BB 315x 10-20, AMRAP basically for higher reps… This session would give the joints a rest, might also make this incline DB instead of BB… Whatever. The other session is where you go somewhat heavier, but I’m personally not so sure about having you start off with a 4-6 RM on your first work set… You need to keep your technique good and let your joints rest up some, hence doing the lighter set first (8-12) and then just slapping on a little more weight and doing 5-7 reps…
Hope I’m not confusing you here lol
I actually think that approach might work pretty well for you… Kind of a heavy/light type of routine.
Eh, I need to write my thoughts on this stuff down before I forget about it again.
Gotta eat first, though.
[quote]crod266 wrote:
i have a question for you guys, how important do you guys think casein protein is? I mean if i had tuna which i do is it really that big of a deal?[/quote]
its not a big deal dude, thats splitting hairs over nothing. IMO the only time nutrition breakdown is ultra important to that kind of detail is when you’re dieting down and of course the leaner your goal the more focus required.
[quote]crod266 wrote:
i have a question for you guys, how important do you guys think casein protein is? I mean if i had tuna which i do is it really that big of a deal?[/quote]
I don’t quite understand your question. Casein isolate/concentrate (think Metabolic Drive) is good because casein digests more slowly. This is beneficial if you have it right before going to bed (so your body has nutrition throughout your sleep) or if you’re dieting and need something to keep you fuller for a longer period of time (think V-Diet). However, casein hydrosylate (Anaconda, PeptoPro) is supposedly the fastest-absorbing protein out there, so it’s good if you need a quick protein fix (think CT’s amino pulsing protocol).
In the end, I honestly don’t think protein type really matters unless you’re already pretty big and are not getting anywhere with your current eating habits. But I guess we’ll see once I, Bodybuilder comes out.
[quote]Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
Btw XBC, when doing a higher frequency thing like the yates routine or so… I’d go for a double-rotation, perhaps…
That can mean either having 2 sets of different exercises or 2 sets of rep ranges (or both)…
One might do
Chest
-Low-Incline BB 375 x 8, 385 x 5-6
And then next session do
-Low-Inc. BB 315x 10-20, AMRAP basically for higher reps… This session would give the joints a rest, might also make this incline DB instead of BB… Whatever. The other session is where you go somewhat heavier, but I’m personally not so sure about having you start off with a 4-6 RM on your first work set… You need to keep your technique good and let your joints rest up some, hence doing the lighter set first (8-12) and then just slapping on a little more weight and doing 5-7 reps…
Hope I’m not confusing you here lol
I actually think that approach might work pretty well for you… Kind of a heavy/light type of routine.
Eh, I need to write my thoughts on this stuff down before I forget about it again.
Gotta eat first, though.
[/quote]
I understand what you’re talking about. I was having a little trouble figuring out how I would set up 531 on the split you posted for it earlier. I like the idea of the yates 3 way with alternating heavy and light days or whatever. It sure beats going heavy ALL the time and feeling like shit afterwards.
And what do you mean by AMRAP?