Better Than the Best

Off Topic
201

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]USMCpoolee wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]USMCpoolee wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]USMCpoolee wrote:

Because if someone has that natural ability they will (most likely) be driven to it.[/quote]

Bullshit. That may happen in many cases, but not all. There will always be that guy with the talent who lacks the desire…or the guy with the talent who chooses another pursuit.

[/quote]

Hence the “(most likely)” still waiting for some proof of these outlandish claims[/quote]

Outlandish claims? Like “it is possible for someone to exist with great talent and NOT be thrown into pro sports”? Claims like that?

Yeah, I can see how outlandish that is.[/quote]

You’re terrible at having a mature argument aren’t you? No by outlandish I meant when you said there are ball players in Harlem better then MJ. Still waiting for proof by the way[/quote]

I didn’t say that. I said this:

You see, things get much harder to debate when you actually quote what was actually written.[/quote]

LOL! Semantics, show me proof of someone on the streets of harlem that can play as well as MJ? Is that better? Because you cant prove that one either. Still a very easy debate

202

[quote]cueball wrote:
But I have to mention that Lew wrote “for 6-15”. You guys calling BS have gone straight to the end of range to argue with, though. Do you guys calling BS have as much problem with 495x6? If his working rep range was 6-15 and that’s all he was really talking about was a rep range, then maybe he never actually hit 15 for that top set. Granted, he hasn’t come back to qualify it in that manner though.[/quote]

One man’s ‘qualifying’ is another man’s ‘back pedaling’.

That boat has long since set sail, though.

The rest of the debate is rubbish because the people arguing against underground street ball phenoms are making an argument more analogous to Lew’s claim, whereas the people saying that there are individuals out there with potential who never follow through on it for one reason or another are arguing something completely different.

The latter has nothing to do with someone actually existing who can actually do better than the best.

203

[quote]randman wrote:
I came late to this thread but I think it’s utterly ridiculous to suggest some streetballer could have haad the potential to be greater than MJ if he was “discovered”.

What people fail to realize is even if you had some guy who’s supremely gifted athletically can just go into the NBA and dominate the league like MJ is smoking something. People overlook the mental aspects of this argument. To have the drive, fortitude, obsession, dedication to spend every waking hour honing your craft; studying tape; having an overwhelming will to crush opponents, spend hours upon hours going through each move, shot, dribbling exercise, etc.

The best analogy I can come up with is Tracy McGrady. This guy did make it into the NBA and has had a pretty good career. The reason I bring him up, however, is that anyone who knows him, scouts, coaches, etc says that he has the most natural talent and perfect physical attributes of a basketball player that they have ever seen. Many agree he could have been one of the greatest. So it begs the question; why wasn’t he? Why didn’t he reach that potential to take MJ’s throne or knock Kobe Bryant off his perch?

They all say the same thing. He was so damn talented that he took his gifts for granted and never really had the maniacal drive to really work at his craft. He rode on his talents. And now he’s an afterthought in the NBA playing on the Pistons with a career that could have been so much more.

It is an extremely rare individual to have the physical gifts and the mental makeup of an MJ. It’s much easier to find someone that has these awesome physical gifts that lit up for years in a random New York basketball court and became a local legend in the process. It’s a whole different scenario to find that same dude that has the mental capacity to achieve success at the highest levels in life.

[/quote]

Good post. Not sure how “LWH can’t really bench 495x15” turned into “there are better bball players on the street than MJ” though. While it is a very large claim, and I don’t particularly care if it’s true or not, I don’t find it as unreasonable as some here.

Here’s an example of a guy that nobody’s heard of that could probably outbench everyone except Hoornstra, Mendy, and Kennelly:

I think he posted this in the PL forum here a while ago.

204

[quote]austin_bicep wrote:

[quote]Loudog75 wrote:

Why would you post this?

FTR quite a few guys have pressed over 1000 pounds equipped. This lift is pretty common amongst SHW equiped bench pressers…[/quote]

Quite a few? Common? WTF?

205

[quote]austin_bicep wrote:

[quote]Loudog75 wrote:

Why would you post this?

FTR quite a few guys have pressed over 1000 pounds equipped. This lift is pretty common amongst SHW equiped bench pressers…[/quote]

Edited - I had to post a couple.

I don’t know the diff between a shirted vs raw lift. How much impact does it make?

206

[quote]USMCpoolee wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]USMCpoolee wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]USMCpoolee wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]USMCpoolee wrote:

Because if someone has that natural ability they will (most likely) be driven to it.[/quote]

Bullshit. That may happen in many cases, but not all. There will always be that guy with the talent who lacks the desire…or the guy with the talent who chooses another pursuit.

[/quote]

Hence the “(most likely)” still waiting for some proof of these outlandish claims[/quote]

Outlandish claims? Like “it is possible for someone to exist with great talent and NOT be thrown into pro sports”? Claims like that?

Yeah, I can see how outlandish that is.[/quote]

You’re terrible at having a mature argument aren’t you? No by outlandish I meant when you said there are ball players in Harlem better then MJ. Still waiting for proof by the way[/quote]

I didn’t say that. I said this:

You see, things get much harder to debate when you actually quote what was actually written.[/quote]

LOL! Semantics, show me proof of someone on the streets of harlem that can play as well as MJ? Is that better? Because you cant prove that one either. Still a very easy debate[/quote]

Hmmm, I wrote “To believe otherwise would be to believe that no regular guy on the streets of Harlem could ever play basketball as well as Michael Jordan…simply because you never heard of them.”

Notice the ‘COULD EVER’ in there? Nowhere did I write that someone right now plays as well as Michael and that I know who they are.

If this is the statement all of this is about, then debate what was actually written.

What was written was a statement of possibilities. That is why I brought up religion…because your stance is like screaming “prove to me God exists!!”…at anyone who claims it is possible there is one.

207

[quote]kothreat wrote:

[quote]gregron wrote:

[quote]kothreat wrote:
Yeah, and if you would actually read anything I’ve written then you wouldn’t have to resort to name calling. Fucking steroid monkey. Yeah, I went there. Don’t resort to names cunt puncher. Fucking now, that’s juvenile, and if you want to get juvenile I can do it with the best. Not once did I resort to such douchebaggery. You can go fuck yourself if that’s what you feel you need to resort to. Prick. I may respect you in the lifting game, but you can get fucked asshole.
[/quote]

How would The International Trivial Pursuit Federation (ITPF) feel about their Champion using such language? [/quote]

HA! Probably get kicked out. I feel bad for it now, and would like to apologize to Waylander. I took it a bit too personally.
[/quote]

obviously, you’re going to have to be penalized. We (myself and the ITPF council) are going to have to take away two of your correct answers. More than likely from the “Entertainment” (pink) category and the “Sports & Leisure” (orange) category since we have come to the conclusion that those would be the most difficult for you to get back… seeing as you’re an admitted hermit.

208

[quote]kothreat wrote:

[quote]gregron wrote:

[quote]kothreat wrote:
Yeah, and if you would actually read anything I’ve written then you wouldn’t have to resort to name calling. Fucking steroid monkey. Yeah, I went there. Don’t resort to names cunt puncher. Fucking now, that’s juvenile, and if you want to get juvenile I can do it with the best. Not once did I resort to such douchebaggery. You can go fuck yourself if that’s what you feel you need to resort to. Prick. I may respect you in the lifting game, but you can get fucked asshole.
[/quote]

How would The International Trivial Pursuit Federation (ITPF) feel about their Champion using such language? [/quote]

HA! Probably get kicked out. I feel bad for it now, and would like to apologize to Waylander. I took it a bit too personally.
[/quote]

lol I don’t take anything to heart on these internet arguments dude, no worries. Now.

Waylander: “what is the capital of Thailand?”
kothreat: “Bangkok”

nut checks kothreat

Fuck off mr. trivial pursuit.

<3 lol jk man

209

[quote]Steel Nation wrote:

[quote]randman wrote:
I came late to this thread but I think it’s utterly ridiculous to suggest some streetballer could have haad the potential to be greater than MJ if he was “discovered”.

What people fail to realize is even if you had some guy who’s supremely gifted athletically can just go into the NBA and dominate the league like MJ is smoking something. People overlook the mental aspects of this argument. To have the drive, fortitude, obsession, dedication to spend every waking hour honing your craft; studying tape; having an overwhelming will to crush opponents, spend hours upon hours going through each move, shot, dribbling exercise, etc.

The best analogy I can come up with is Tracy McGrady. This guy did make it into the NBA and has had a pretty good career. The reason I bring him up, however, is that anyone who knows him, scouts, coaches, etc says that he has the most natural talent and perfect physical attributes of a basketball player that they have ever seen. Many agree he could have been one of the greatest. So it begs the question; why wasn’t he? Why didn’t he reach that potential to take MJ’s throne or knock Kobe Bryant off his perch?

They all say the same thing. He was so damn talented that he took his gifts for granted and never really had the maniacal drive to really work at his craft. He rode on his talents. And now he’s an afterthought in the NBA playing on the Pistons with a career that could have been so much more.

It is an extremely rare individual to have the physical gifts and the mental makeup of an MJ. It’s much easier to find someone that has these awesome physical gifts that lit up for years in a random New York basketball court and became a local legend in the process. It’s a whole different scenario to find that same dude that has the mental capacity to achieve success at the highest levels in life.

[/quote]

Good post. Not sure how “LWH can’t really bench 495x15” turned into “there are better bball players on the street than MJ” though. While it is a very large claim, and I don’t particularly care if it’s true or not, I don’t find it as unreasonable as some here.

Here’s an example of a guy that nobody’s heard of that could probably outbench everyone except Hoornstra, Mendy, and Kennelly:

I think he posted this in the PL forum here a while ago.[/quote]

Impossible…because I never heard of him.

210

[quote]Steel Nation wrote:

[quote]randman wrote:
I came late to this thread but I think it’s utterly ridiculous to suggest some streetballer could have haad the potential to be greater than MJ if he was “discovered”.

What people fail to realize is even if you had some guy who’s supremely gifted athletically can just go into the NBA and dominate the league like MJ is smoking something. People overlook the mental aspects of this argument. To have the drive, fortitude, obsession, dedication to spend every waking hour honing your craft; studying tape; having an overwhelming will to crush opponents, spend hours upon hours going through each move, shot, dribbling exercise, etc.

The best analogy I can come up with is Tracy McGrady. This guy did make it into the NBA and has had a pretty good career. The reason I bring him up, however, is that anyone who knows him, scouts, coaches, etc says that he has the most natural talent and perfect physical attributes of a basketball player that they have ever seen. Many agree he could have been one of the greatest. So it begs the question; why wasn’t he? Why didn’t he reach that potential to take MJ’s throne or knock Kobe Bryant off his perch?

They all say the same thing. He was so damn talented that he took his gifts for granted and never really had the maniacal drive to really work at his craft. He rode on his talents. And now he’s an afterthought in the NBA playing on the Pistons with a career that could have been so much more.

It is an extremely rare individual to have the physical gifts and the mental makeup of an MJ. It’s much easier to find someone that has these awesome physical gifts that lit up for years in a random New York basketball court and became a local legend in the process. It’s a whole different scenario to find that same dude that has the mental capacity to achieve success at the highest levels in life.

[/quote]

Good post. Not sure how “LWH can’t really bench 495x15” turned into “there are better bball players on the street than MJ” though. While it is a very large claim, and I don’t particularly care if it’s true or not, I don’t find it as unreasonable as some here.

Here’s an example of a guy that nobody’s heard of that could probably outbench everyone except Hoornstra, Mendy, and Kennelly:

I think he posted this in the PL forum here a while ago.[/quote]

This guys lifts with the super training guys. Myself and many others have been aware of him for quite some time now. This just goes to show that someone of that caliber doesn’t go unnoticed.

211

Also, I cannot read this thread title without this popping into my head:

212

[quote]gregron wrote:

[quote]kothreat wrote:
You know what, I bet there are recreational lifters out there that have better lifts than world record holders. Different paths in life. One got into competitive lifting while another derives joy by doing it alone.
[/quote]

you bet there are “recreational lifters out there that have better lifts than world record holders”???

You cant be serious with this.

I bet there are recreational runners out there who would win the Boston Marathon… but they just love the joy of doing it alone.

I bet there are recreational swimmers out there who would out swim Michael Phelps… But they just love the joy of doing it alone.

I bet there are recreational sprinters out there who would beat Usain Bolt in the 100m… but they just love the joy of doing it alone.

do you see how absolutely dumb that is?

Records are made to be broken and, theoretically, they all will be broken in time… but saying that a “recreational” anything would beat the greatest person at that sport is absolutely ridiculous.[/quote]

THIS

EXACTLY THIS

NO ONE. I literally mean NO ONE in todays world can be so genetically gifted that they are the single best performer in their sport while only pursuing it to a recreational extent. Bolt, Phelps, Mendleson spend thousands of hours per year perfecting what they do to become THE (1) best in the world. Recreational athletes dont become the best in anything because there are far too many people whose top priority is to be the best.

Potential has nothing to do with this. It should never have been mentioned. The fact is that a random guy who lifts weights IS NOT incline pressing 495lbs for 15 reps.

I think the problem is that most people here are too wet behind the ears to comprehend the magnitude of such a feat.

213

what the H? My post isnt showing up

214

That 600 bench is pretty crazy

215

[quote]kothreat wrote:

[quote]kothreat wrote:

[quote]waylanderxx wrote:

[quote]kothreat wrote:

[quote]waylanderxx wrote:

[quote]kothreat wrote:

[quote]gregron wrote:

[quote]kothreat wrote:
You know what, I bet there are recreational lifters out there that have better lifts than world record holders. Different paths in life. One got into competitive lifting while another derives joy by doing it alone.
[/quote]

you bet there are “recreational lifters out there that have better lifts than world record holders”???

You cant be serious with this.

I bet there are recreational runners out there who would win the Boston Marathon… but they just love the joy of doing it alone.

I bet there are recreational swimmers out there who would out swim Michael Phelps… But they just love the joy of doing it alone.

I bet there are recreational sprinters out there who would beat Usain Bolt in the 100m… but they just love the joy of doing it alone.

do you see how absolutely dumb that is?

Records are made to be broken and, theoretically, they all will be broken in time… but saying that a “recreational” anything would beat the greatest person at that sport is absolutely ridiculous.[/quote]

I see how absolutely dumb it is on both sides.
[/quote]

You act like people of this caliber would not be noticed by others, are they hermits living completely apart from society?[/quote]

This is a possibility. I’m pretty much a hermit and distance myself from society. Although, no superpowers how would anyone know?

You act like everybody that is great at something wants to showcase it.
[/quote]

Being great at something means you have to practice something. Someone can practice their amazing ability in complete solitude their entire life without being noticed for it? Right.

Once again, strongholds post ends this stupid debate.
[/quote]

I agree this is a stupid debate. And, yes I do believe it’s possible for someone to become great at something without being noticed.
[/quote]

If I may use myself as an example. I kicked some crazy as at trivial pursuit. Against a guy that I’ve known for years. You know what he said at the end of the game? ‘I didn’t realize you were that smart’ (read: knew so much useless shit). Why? Because of my level of introversion I don’t go around displaying my abilities errr whatever, fuck.

This may be a reason why all you crazy extroverts have a tough time realizing there are people out there that do things solely for themselves.
[/quote]

Horrendous analogy.

Were not talking about “oh wow I didnt know you were SO STRONG” (completely subjective, youre friend may be a complete retard). Were talking about “oh wow youre THE STRONGEST presser in the whole world”

And that whole thread blew up because LWH got unbelievably defensive the instant someone asked for proof. Before anyone said that he couldnt do it, it was said how amazing it would be (if true) and was asked if theres proof of it. He freaked out because people were SKEPTICAL. He freaked out before anyone simply said ‘bullshit’. He got the benefit of the doubt right off the bat but the sane people asked for something a bit more than good fait claims. Um yea. Exactly. Delusional people are delusional.

216

[quote]Loudog75 wrote:

I could dunk from almost the free throw line in highschool. Hope nobody needs proof cuz I don’t have it. There was no Youtube in the early 90’s.[/quote]

No need. Dozens of men have done that. You arent claiming to be able to dunk from the top of the circle…

217

[quote]Steel Nation wrote:

[quote]randman wrote:
I came late to this thread but I think it’s utterly ridiculous to suggest some streetballer could have haad the potential to be greater than MJ if he was “discovered”.

What people fail to realize is even if you had some guy who’s supremely gifted athletically can just go into the NBA and dominate the league like MJ is smoking something. People overlook the mental aspects of this argument. To have the drive, fortitude, obsession, dedication to spend every waking hour honing your craft; studying tape; having an overwhelming will to crush opponents, spend hours upon hours going through each move, shot, dribbling exercise, etc.

The best analogy I can come up with is Tracy McGrady. This guy did make it into the NBA and has had a pretty good career. The reason I bring him up, however, is that anyone who knows him, scouts, coaches, etc says that he has the most natural talent and perfect physical attributes of a basketball player that they have ever seen. Many agree he could have been one of the greatest. So it begs the question; why wasn’t he? Why didn’t he reach that potential to take MJ’s throne or knock Kobe Bryant off his perch?

They all say the same thing. He was so damn talented that he took his gifts for granted and never really had the maniacal drive to really work at his craft. He rode on his talents. And now he’s an afterthought in the NBA playing on the Pistons with a career that could have been so much more.

It is an extremely rare individual to have the physical gifts and the mental makeup of an MJ. It’s much easier to find someone that has these awesome physical gifts that lit up for years in a random New York basketball court and became a local legend in the process. It’s a whole different scenario to find that same dude that has the mental capacity to achieve success at the highest levels in life.

[/quote]

Good post. Not sure how “LWH can’t really bench 495x15” turned into “there are better bball players on the street than MJ” though. While it is a very large claim, and I don’t particularly care if it’s true or not, I don’t find it as unreasonable as some here.

Here’s an example of a guy that nobody’s heard of that could probably outbench everyone except Hoornstra, Mendy, and Kennelly:

I think he posted this in the PL forum here a while ago.[/quote]

That guy backed up his claim, and his claim wasn’t world record shattering. Not “beating”, but shattering. Anyway, this shit is getting fucking ridiculous. PX just wants to argue and when people realize he skirts the issue and won’t accept what’s what he puts them on ignore and finds someone else to argue with. One again, there’s no one inclining 5-hundo 15 times and there’s no streetball player near the level of your average NBA player let alone MJ running around in obscurity and that’s that.

218

[quote]USMCpoolee wrote:

Heyzeus Christo, it’s hard for me to believe there are people out there that think that every single person that is great at something likes to compete.

[/quote]

Great =/= THE BEST THE WORLD HAS SEEN.

Everyone loves to make up their own definitions to words and add facts to the original claims.

219

^ I did not say that lol.

X, you have claimed (too lazy to go find the quotes) that these people exist, that there are recreational athletes out there better than the current record holders, so again I say prove it. Everything in between is semantics and you trying not to be wrong, but you are. Honestly I don’t see how you can keep trying to defend such a ridiculous statement. Bonez hit the nail on the head, the best of the best work full time perfecting their craft, so now, show me a random joe who can beat someone at the top of their sport.

220

[quote]anonym wrote:

[quote]cueball wrote:
But I have to mention that Lew wrote “for 6-15”. You guys calling BS have gone straight to the end of range to argue with, though. Do you guys calling BS have as much problem with 495x6? If his working rep range was 6-15 and that’s all he was really talking about was a rep range, then maybe he never actually hit 15 for that top set. Granted, he hasn’t come back to qualify it in that manner though.[/quote]

One man’s ‘qualifying’ is another man’s ‘back pedaling’.

That boat has long since set sail, though.

The rest of the debate is rubbish because the people arguing against underground street ball phenoms are making an argument more analogous to Lew’s claim, whereas the people saying that there are individuals out there with potential who never follow through on it for one reason or another are arguing something completely different.

The latter has nothing to do with someone actually existing who can actually do better than the best.[/quote]

Good post…but if they accept that, then there is nothing left to argue about.

I think we can all see what the goal is.