Forgive my ignorance, but when you bench should you bench straight back up or back towards the rack? In Dave Tate’s video, “6 Week Bench Press Cure”, he advocates benching back towards the rack but in his other video, “Westside Bench Press”, he says you should NEVER bench back towards the rack as it puts the weight above your face which is highly dangerous. Anyone willing to clear up the confusion? Thanks a lot.
[quote]The other Rob wrote:
I was under the impression they couldn’t refute the success of the metal militia benchers who press in an arc so began recommending it as well.[/quote]
Eh… not convinced. Especially if you have 800+ lbs on the bar, if something gives, your face is screwed.
You can push the bar back slightly without it coming all the way back over your face. The strongest position to finish is going to be directly over your shoulders since all the joints are in a straight line here. In the bottom, the bar is obviously going to be lower than shoulder level, so obviously the bar will have to come back if it finishes over the shoulders.
Eh the metal militia’s science behind benching back over the face, is that its easier to push something up a ramp (at an angle) than straight up. Which is true, but I still advocate the WSB science of pushing a shorter distance.
SRS2000 is correct in that you can arc but not go over the face.
Luckily I bench in this manner. I dropped the bar on press out with 335 and it landed on my lower chest.
I was happy it wasn’t my face.
The basic priciple is to tuck on the way down and flare about midway up to lockout. If it is done right it should be about shoulder area.
[quote]Chap Manly wrote:
Eh the metal militia’s science behind benching back over the face, is that its easier to push something up a ramp (at an angle) than straight up. Which is true, but I still advocate the WSB science of pushing a shorter distance.[/quote]
the metal militia guys also use the groove of the shirt VERY precisely for this. is the OP talking about raw, or with a shirt?
If you bench raw, then I don’t know why on earth you would be trying to press towards your feet and keep your elbows tucked the whole time. That sounds like absolute murder on your shoulders and a good way to not bench as much as you potentially could. The mechanics just don’t make sense, unless you’re holding the bar with your arms at an angle other than 90’ to your body (from the side) or you’re touching about 3 inches above your nipples and keeping your upper arms perpendicular with your body through the entire lift, then at some point, you have to arc back.
That said, there is a HUGE difference between just throwing the bar over your face (bad) and flaring your elbows at the proper moment to effectively decrease the distance the bar travels as well as recruit as much muscle mass as possible during a critical stage in the lift (good).
Look at how many guys who are benching huge, raw and equipped, push back over their shoulders and how many actually do this “push towards your feet” shit. Jay Fry (who trains at Westside and has the heaviest lb for lb bench ever to my knowledge, mind you) recommends arcing back, Kennelly does it, Mendy does it, Rychlak does it. The fact that the only 3 men over 1,000 choose to arc their bar path should tell you something.
Another thing to think about is IF you have a sick arch pressing back ‘over the face’ will not be much of an option cause you’d probably hit the uprights. Pressing the bar more or less straight up would be, by happenstance, ‘pressing towards the feet’.
[quote]The other Rob wrote:
I was under the impression they couldn’t refute the success of the metal militia benchers who press in an arc so began recommending it as well.[/quote]
Eh… not convinced. Especially if you have 800+ lbs on the bar, if something gives, your face is screwed.[/quote]
By the time you get to 800+ lbs on the bar, I’m sure you’ll have figured out what works for you.
In a shirt if you push back and hit it right the bar will move almost horizontally and be virtually weightless providing you can stop it going too far towards the rack the lift will be easy.
[quote]aaron_lohan wrote:
In a shirt if you push back and hit it right the bar will move almost horizontally and be virtually weightless providing you can stop it going too far towards the rack the lift will be easy.[/quote]
Yeah. only if you have alligator arms and a gut that’s as high as your arm length…lol I don’t know about that ‘weightless’ part tho
[quote]Chap Manly wrote:
Eh the metal militia’s science behind benching back over the face, is that its easier to push something up a ramp (at an angle) than straight up. Which is true, but I still advocate the WSB science of pushing a shorter distance.[/quote]
WHOA, think about what your saying about the ramp theory. thats like saying you would be able to handle more weight if you did a shoulder press by pushing the weight up and out in front of you(ending up somewhere between a shoulder press and a front raise), instead of going straight up above your head, which is obviously not true.
Yes its easier to push a piano up a moving truck ramp then lifting the fucker straight up, but when you go to the gym you dont have a fucking ramp.
but when you go to the gym you dont have a fucking ramp.[/quote]
Sure you do…Ever seen some skinny kid leg press 1000# yet get stapled with a 225# free squat?
Sorry…had to be a wise ass…
The bench shirt sort of acts as that ramp…but the Op benches raw so…
Since the shoulders are locked to the bench and the bar is in ones hands it can pivot and raise at an angle. If one has stronger delts the muscles will pull the bar towards the face.
[quote]Chap Manly wrote:
Eh the metal militia’s science behind benching back over the face, is that its easier to push something up a ramp (at an angle) than straight up. Which is true, but I still advocate the WSB science of pushing a shorter distance.[/quote]
WHOA, think about what your saying about the ramp theory. thats like saying you would be able to handle more weight if you did a shoulder press by pushing the weight up and out in front of you(ending up somewhere between a shoulder press and a front raise), instead of going straight up above your head, which is obviously not true.
Yes its easier to push a piano up a moving truck ramp then lifting the fucker straight up, but when you go to the gym you dont have a fucking ramp.[/quote]
Ok first of all that theory is credited to the metal militia. not me.
Secondly, of course not in the situation that your talking about bc you would be pushing the weight away from your center of gravity…but think, when people over head press, they push the weight not just straight up but backward as well. again, putting the weight in line with their center of gravity.
btw strengthdawg, the leg press vs squat is one of the examples the metal militia uses.
btw strengthdawg, the leg press vs squat is one of the examples the metal militia uses.[/quote]
Cool…
I often use the training style Sebastian describes on the MM site. It make sense for the shirted bencher but I’d say it has carried over to my raw bench as well.