[quote]PGJ wrote:
Go heavy fool wrote:
PGJ wrote:
Come on, be honest. You are 18 years old and think you have it all figured out. I’m a senior officer in the Marine Corps. Don’t try to lecture me on determination and heart. I’ve done shit that you can’t imagine.
My point is, to be an Arnold-level guy (your choice of examples) all it takes is hard work and determination. I disagree. YES, it takes a lot of hard work, but you have to have certain physical characteristics that can not be earned or trained. I have friends who have naturally thick joint (I mean huge). I will never bench as much as they do (assuming we both put our time in under the bar). I have friends who are naturally fast runners. Guys who can run 6-minute miles without training. My brother is a professional gutarist. It’s just something he has a knack for. He has a gift. Some people are just gifted. Kind of like the movie “Good Will Hunting”. Frustrated the hell out of the professors that this uneducated janator was a super-genius. That’s genetics. A lot of us have uptapped genetic potential for something. I will never have 22" arms like Lee Priest, but I bet I can kick his ass in a foot race. I was always faster in sprints than other kids. I didn’t train for it, I was just faster. It’s not a hard concept.
Great genetics + determination = champion
not so great genetics + determination = the best YOU can be.
ok, I will respond one last time since you struck a note. I also play the guitar and been doing that for 15 years and it also requires no genetic material. I for one am the best example. I cannot read a note of music but I can play any song by ear. I can literally figure out a song by listening to it within a very short time. That kind of talant is learned. It came from practice.
Now your equation.
Why does Arnold fit in to your equation and not Frank Zane.
Good Genetics + Determination = Champion. ok makes sense to me, that’s Arnold Schwarzenegger to most people.
Not so good genetics + determination = best you can be (huh?)would you consider Mr. Olympia best you can be or Champion…because that would be Frank Zane
Frank Zane had not so great genetics and was a Mr. Olympia champion.
What you overlooked was the determination factor. Both equations had it, so both produced champions. Both equations did not have great genetics, only one had it.
So that might prove my point. Genetics don’t matter.
Now if someone failed to become a champion with determination, then they obviously didnt have enough of it. Arnold did. Frank did. Anybody can.
Arnold proved to be a 7 time champion was my example because he made have had some great assets, but he worked with what he had and was determined not to fail. He never had legs, at least what we now know as real quads, his genetics weren’t perfect. There is no such thing. Everyone has short commings. Only the best will be determined not to let then get in their way or be a factor. And the best of the best will use their short commings as an advantage. Arnold produced a physique that nobody else had because he used what he had. He was never going to have legs like Ronnie Coleman but he found a way to look damn good without them. His Chest and biceps are still mind boggleing. His mid section was never that sharp either.
Shawn ray would make Arnold look like amature. Again, genetics are nothing more than an excuse for those who will never become a champion. Arnold was never going to let that become a factor. He is the best example i have. Arnold would still find a way to beat every bodybuilder of today if he were competeing and off age. His determination factor is why he was what he was. What was in his mind is not something that you will often. That is very rare to have that kind of “DETERMINATION”
Like I said before…“only the strongest individuals can define their genetics, not have their genetics define them”
Being a professional guitarist takes a tremendous amount of eye-hand coordination, endurance (my wrists get tired after about 5 minutes) and logic. I doubt you are even in the same solar system as my brother. He just picked it up naturally at a young age. Genetically gifted.
Now, who in the world can you say Zane had terrible genetics? Look at the guy. He has perfect symetry. He wasn’t as huge as Arnold or Lou, but the guy was perfect. What is your definition of genetics anyway?
Drop the Disney cliche “you can be whatever you want with enough hard work”. I’ll never be in the NBA or compete in the WSM competition. Ever heard of having reasonable and achievable goals? That’s the bedrock of weightlifting. I refuse to use steroids. I will NEVER be Mr. O. Life is not as simple as you seem to think. ALL champions have something special. It’s a lot more than determination. You just don’t wake up one day and say I want to be a professional quarterback or run a 9.6 100M. People ARE born with certain skills.
I’ve been coaching youth baseball, soccer, football and basketball for 5 years (5-10 year olds). Some kids are just naturally better than others. I see kids busting their ass all day at practice, yet they aren’t even close to some of the slackers. Some are just naturally better athletes.
Here’s a simple plan. You go and train your ass off for a marathon, I mean go all out. Buy the best shoes, hire the best trainers and nutritionists. Those Kenyans will still destroy you. Those guys who win marathons are genetically different than the rest of the population. Literally build to run long distance. But you know what, champions that they are, heart of a lion, they couldn’t be professional bodybuilders. Different genetic gift.
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i don’t know about you or your brother or what solar system your from
but for me, i play Joe Satriani by ear. Hendrix and clapton are basic and every guitarist should be able to manage that. Now playing for 5 minutes and you’re tired. wow. I could play for 5 hours and not be tired. now that i will admit takes years. You have to train your fingers for that kind of abuse and endurance…but then again thats learned and ive been doing it for 15 years, its not a problem to play 12 hours straight for me.
as for the league im in, you don’t wan’t to go there. i’m sure your brother will know who Satch is and ask him how difficult that is to play be ear.
as for this thread.
just kill it.
i like my genetics and i gain muscle unfairly but i also put forth alot of effort, i didnt write this for me, it was for those without i guess.
nobody’s opinion is going to change. you can see what you want. i will look at the obvious. frank zanes horrible chest genetics with a gap in it and he made Mr olympia. and Arnold someone who had measly 28 inch geneticly bad thigh’s compared to his 22 inch arms and he made a 7 time Olympia. the fact is this. Genetics are genetics. good or bad ones is opinion. so the losers are bad and the winners are good. i see your logic.
if you would have had the logic of a winner, then your genetics would have been good
“champions define their genetics, losers will let their genetics define them”
nobody is gonna change any ones mind about anything anyway, people believe what they wanna believe—bottom line
arnold believed he was a champion before he was even 200 lbs, that’s the point that was ignored in this thread