I was just wondering how many out there perform only total body traing routines? I’ve been training for almost 20 years (should probably be in the over 35 section) and have done virtually all TBT. I’ve tried upper/lower, push/pull and bodypart splits from time to time but always seem to gravitate back to TBT.
Granite that TBT seems more well respected and represented here than in any other forum, but I stil sometimes feel like a beginner, just a strength athelete, or that I’m completely missing out on something in that the majority of BB’s don’t train this way. In the gym that I belong to, the only people performing TBT that I see are ones doing circut training or using only machines.
Keep in mind that I am always changing up set/rep schemes, exercises and switching through different programs (just ran a 6-week course on Joel Marion’s Stripped Down Hypertrophy) and I’m now on a variation of CW’s TBT where I train 4-5 days/week. Call it crazy, but I enjoy the variety of TBT rather than performing 12 sets of chest or the brutality of 12-15 sets of legs in one day.
I’m certainly no expert, but I’d just like to encourage anyone who enjoys TBT to give it a chance and don’t suffer from routine ADD. Any thoughts?
I’m doing CW’s TBT right now and really
like it. The variety really makes the routines interesting. This is the first TBT style routine that I’ve used and am seeing really good results. Nothing like 18x3 squats followed by 18x3 deadlifts to really make your day !! I’ve learned that certain muscle groups need more volume than others from this and the periodization is pretty cool.
Hmmm…really not trying to sound like a dick, but let’s take a couple of the comments from your post and put them together, and perhaps it might set off a “ureka” moment in you.
“I’ve been training for almost 20 years and have done virtually all TBT. But I still sometimes feel like a beginner. The only people that I see doing TBT are people doing circuits and using only machines. The majority of BB’ers don’t train this way.”
Seriously take a long look at that series of statements.
Do you want to continue wasting your years at the gym and still wind up feeling like a beginner in another 10 years? Then keep on doing what you’ve been doing.
Or, you can change what you are doing to what the big guys around you do and in 10 years be able to look back and wonder why you didn’t wake up sooner.
“The definition of insanity/stupidity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results.” -unknown author
I’ve briefly done an upper-lower split and a few cycles of OLAD, but most of my training has been some kind of full-body. As long as I keep getting bigger and the weights I’m moving keep going up I don’t see a need to change.
I train at home with pretty basic equipment (no squat rack, no bench) which makes big compound exercises and full-body training a lot more convenient. To do an effective bodypart split I’d need to invest in some equipment and make space in my garage. Maybe someday, once I stop making progress with what I got…
Hey Sentoguy, before we make conclusions i think that he should clears up what he means by “sometimes feeling like a begginer”: if he means that after 20years he did little progress and is still a begginer or he means that altough he is strong, big etc… he feels like a begginer because he is doing basic “beginer training”. I’m not sure what he means…
That being said, if its the first option, i would bet that the training split is the smallest of his mistakes. Progression, exercise selection, etc… are way more important, i believe the best split(or lack of it) is more a matter of convenience, and preference in most cases.
Yeah, I agree with both of you Sagat and Derek. I’m not saying that there aren’t good TBT programs out there (Bill Starr/Madcow 5x5 is a great intermediate program).
What I was saying was that it sounded to me like the OP had been training for 20 years and hadn’t made much progress, and used TBT type programs for the majority of that time.
To me that sounds like it’s not working all that well for HIM. If after 20 years I still felt like a beginner, I’d have to take a serious look in the mirror and ask myself what the hell I’d been doing for all that time.
So I’m not saying that TBT sucks, I’m just saying that whatever the OP has been doing hasn’t been giving him the results he was looking for. So he should start doing something different in hopes of improving his results.
You may indeed be right though Sagat, that it’s not his program that’s to blame but something else (diet perhaps).
I also agree that we need more information/clarification.
I’ve been training for 6 years. I’ve honestly mostly done total body training. I came from an athletic backround (football) and I’m in love with really heavy lifting. I didn’t lift for a year, got pretty fat, then made a body transformation that took a year and a half.
I tried moving to a split a few weeks ago. I can honestly say that I very much so dislike the split style training. Although at this point I could probably use a change, and it would probably make me grow like a weed after training total body for so long, I’m just in love with kicking the shit out of my self going all out with big movements that hit everything every other day.
I promised myself that this fall when the next semester starts I am going to set up a split and stick to it for a few months to see what happens though.
Here’s my deal. I love lifting weights. I just love to pick up heavy shit and go off. My biggest issue is I don’t see how deadlifts fit in with a lower/upper body split because after doing them I feel fatigued in my entire body, and without deadlifting, i truely feel like I’m cheating myself.
My biggest worry is, how can I keep getting bigger without giving up what I love to do?
I promised myself that this fall when the next semester starts I am going to set up a split and stick to it for a few months to see what happens though.
Here’s my deal. I love lifting weights. I just love to pick up heavy shit and go off. My biggest issue is I don’t see how deadlifts fit in with a lower/upper body split because after doing them I feel fatigued in my entire body, and without deadlifting, i truely feel like I’m cheating myself.
My biggest worry is, how can I keep getting bigger without giving up what I love to do?[/quote]
Dead lifts to me are more of a back movement than hamstring/glute movement, especially if you do them rack pull style. Say you deadlift on Monday as part of an upper body workout, Wednesday use a leg curl variation for hamstrings to not overdo the hip extension function of hte hamstrings. Next upper body maybe do a row variation for back, and the following lower body day do stiff leg dead for hamstrings. There will not be a tremendous amount of overlap if you arrange it that way.
My biggest worry is, how can I keep getting bigger without giving up what I love to do?[/quote]
Keep getting stronger, then eat enough calories to build the muscle mass growth that you’ve stimulated.
And (this is sometimes a forgotten item) remember that as you grow bigger, your calories need to increase.
You may grow with 5,000 calories now but may need 5,300 several months from now. Unless your calorie intake keeps up with and surpassses perhaps, your size increases, you’ll stop growing.
i’ve been doing TBT for awhile and i’m trying to phase out. Just getting sick of it. Especially since TBT neglects my weaker points (arms/calves) Looking forard to adding in the iso. movements next week
To answer your question I don’t think TBT is necessarily beginner if it works for you and you see optimal results. Granted you will miss out on some things , but there goes the pros and cons for all style and principles of training.
My biggest worry is, how can I keep getting bigger without giving up what I love to do?
Keep getting stronger, then eat enough calories to build the muscle mass growth that you’ve stimulated.
And (this is sometimes a forgotten item) remember that as you grow bigger, your calories need to increase.
You may grow with 5,000 calories now but may need 5,300 several months from now. Unless your calorie intake keeps up with and surpassses perhaps, your size increases, you’ll stop growing.[/quote]
I appreciate your response, but it doesn’t really answer the question. My love is lifting the bar off the ground in the form of deadlifting. I’m too the point now where I know what I need to do nutritionaly (eat atleast 90% clean with emphasis on lean protein and fruits and vegtables, atleast 6 meals a day. I’m not very carb tolerant)
Dead lifts to me are more of a back movement than hamstring/glute movement, especially if you do them rack pull style. Say you deadlift on Monday as part of an upper body workout, Wednesday use a leg curl variation for hamstrings to not overdo the hip extension function of hte hamstrings. Next upper body maybe do a row variation for back, and the following lower body day do stiff leg dead for hamstrings. There will not be a tremendous amount of overlap if you arrange it that way. [/quote]
I agree that the lift isnt as big on the legs. When I do eventually try out the split again, I’ll probably try deadlifting on an upper body day.
Another variation I’m thinking about is this: Any thoughts?
Monday: Deadlift day, pullups, dips, maybe some bi/tri iso work (hate isolation work )
Tuesday: off
Wednsday: Chest
Thursday: Lower body (squat/lunge emph.)
Friday: Chest
The thinking here is that my chest is lagging behind my back. So the goal of this program would be to continue to get stronger on the big lifts while increasing chest size.
mthomps, one thing you could also try is a lift split, rather than bodypart split, like some power lifters do. This way you dont have to worry in which day do the Deads. For example:
Day1-Squat+assiastance exercises
Day2-Bench+assiastance exercises
Day3-Deadlift+assiastance exercises
Day4-other upperbody assistance
I never tried this myself, but there are many lifters that train this way.
I appreciate your response, but it doesn’t really answer the question. My love is lifting the bar off the ground in the form of deadlifting. I’m too the point now where I know what I need to do nutritionaly (eat atleast 90% clean with emphasis on lean protein and fruits and vegtables, atleast 6 meals a day. I’m not very carb tolerant)
[/quote]
If you know what to do nutritionally, why are you in doubt about what it takes to keep growing?
If your lifting is in order and you still aren’t growing then you aren’t doing what it takes in the kitchen.
I’m much the opposite, in fact.
I find that any time I do a TBT program, I switch as soon as possible (no sooner than 3-4 weeks, of course) to a split of some sort.
take, for instance, my current situation:
about 3 weeks ago, I chose a new program to start the summer off right: TBT-style (with an emphasis on strength). I figured that it’d be a good way to begin the summer working on a stronger foundation. The idea was that about half way through the summer, I’d switch to a split of some sort.
Currently, I lift TBT MWF and will often do some cardio or other stuff one of the days of the weekend.
The problem is that I want to lift more than 3 days a week, and as it is, I feel as if the idea that I have completely recovered from the workout I’ve completed two days ago is a bit of a stretch. It could be different, for sure, but I don’t recover as quickly as I could on account of the fact that I don’t leave the gym until every major muscle is CRYING. I just can’t leave the gym with a little bit left in the tank. I like to annihilate the muscles, which doesn’t lend itself to doing the same workout 3 times a week.
So, what I’ve convinced myself is that it makes more sense to do a two day split (say, upper/lower… I haven’t worked out the details yet) where I am doing one workout M and Th and the other T and F. This way, I have 3 days for recovery between the same workout and get to go to the gym 4 times a week (excluding weekends) instead of 3. AND I can continue pushing to the limit in the gym! And as for “cons” for this routine: I am hitting each body part 2 times a week instead of 3… yeah… that’s not so good, but I feel like I can make up for it in increased intensity and increased room for recovery…
I appreciate your response, but it doesn’t really answer the question. My love is lifting the bar off the ground in the form of deadlifting. I’m too the point now where I know what I need to do nutritionaly (eat atleast 90% clean with emphasis on lean protein and fruits and vegtables, atleast 6 meals a day. I’m not very carb tolerant)
If you know what to do nutritionally, why are you in doubt about what it takes to keep growing?
If your lifting is in order and you still aren’t growing then you aren’t doing what it takes in the kitchen.
[/quote]
When and where did I say I’m having trouble growing? All i said was switching styles would probably make me grow “like a weed.” Get off your church podium and stop preaching like a bodybuilding guru. lol.
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