Advice to a Thai Boxer

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1

I have been training in Muay Thai (Tahi Boxing) for about 3 years now. I have fought in a few non-sanctioned matches just for fun but I am in no way aspired to become a professional Thai Boxer (it doesn’t pay nearly enough… =] )

So here’s the deal, I consider myself an intellect, I am currently pursuing a MS in computer engineering while working full time as a systems engineer. In short, my brain is my money maker. Now if you know anything about Thai Boxing, any fighter in a match risks getting knocked out (i.e. concussion) which is not good for someone who’s money maker is his brain

My issue is this, I want to keep fighting, I have had 4 matches and lost my last one (thanks for the dumb advice of losing 10 lbs for it even though I was at like 6 or 7% bodyfat…). I gassed. So you can imagine I am hungry for another match.

Well, here’s the catch, through playing rugby I have already suffered two concussions, and if you know anything about concussions… each one builds on the previous one, i.e. if I were to get a third concussion, the risks of me suffering permanent brain injury are tremendous.

So I am in a conundrum, my ego tells me to fight again albeit there’s not much to gain other than just satisfying my ego while my brain says to be self-preserving and forgo my ego and pride…

What do you guys think? (Insights from the staff would be greatly appreciated along w/ the general publics’, thanks.)

2

This is a stupid question, no one but you can answer it. Do what makes you happy even if it leads to permanent brain damage. Its your life live it wisely, Nuff said.

3

I’m interested in responses to the question posed. I’m in a similar situation, I’ve had two concussions in my life: One on the playground in 6th grade and another when I was 19 playing rugby in college.

I’ve been wanting to compete in an amateur boxing tournament (Golden Gloves this winter). Should I be concerned?

Thanks.

4

I just started doing MMA and IMO you should look at grappling arts. You obviously enjoy the combat aspect, why not simply do it in a submission setting rather than a striking setting.

you’ll probably get the same thrills

5

As with all things in life, the answer can be found in the Simpsons.

Homerpalooza - s7e24

Homer brings Bart and Lisa to a music festival that features Cypress Hill, The Smashing Pumpkins and more. While there, Homer discovers a new talent. He can take a shot to the gut really well. The festival asks him to travel with them and continue getting hit by cannonballs. He discovers that cannonballs have wreaked havoc on his internal organs. The vet tells him to quit before he dies. Homer makes the right choice.

Or rent Rocky 5, but don’t get in a street fight with a man who’s HIV positive.

I’ve had the week off and am really bored. Sorry for this.

6

The aging process is a result of accumulated damage. The faster you accumulate it the faster you’ll age. In Thailand Muay Thai is away for some to work their way out of poverty and retire with a farm if they are good and lucky. Because of the way they beat on nerve centers besides the brain, Muay Thai fighters don’t live to be very old. Most of the great masters of Okinawan karate died very young also.

Muay Thai and Karate are Yang styles. The Chinese feel that it is very important for ones health to have the forces of Yin and Yang in balance. People who do not balance these forces will show it in other areas of their life i.e. you’ll see things like alchohol abuse, spouse abuse and child abuse. Mike Tyson is a good example of someone who had way too much Yang energy. Think about what a pathetic freak show his life has been.

You unlike Mike have education and can do something more with your life than be a fighter.

Just because you enjoy this pursuit as a young man, you might have much different interests as you get older. The sacrifices you make now could come back to haunt you for the rest of your life. When you are fifty being a paid systems engineer is going to be a lot is going to be a lot cooler than a punch drunk stumble bum.

The great karate master Bushi Matsumura summed it up best when he said that the goal in karate should be to live long and become as wealthy as possible.

7

So what would be a Ying style, sensei sifu?

Yoga, tai chi…??

8

Sifu, thanks for that. And BOSS, yes, to some it may seem like a stupid question, in which case, thanks for dignifying it with a not so brilliant response.

I am only 23, to go through life without at time look to others (who are hopefully wiser) would be naive of me. Instead of flipping a coin to decide my fate on a decision which I am obviously so torn on, I went to you guys in hopes that some of you may be emphathetic.

I guess at times it is hard for me to train in an environment whose sole goal is to “fight”. I think I just have to forgo my ego and look at it in the long run. I have to forget about some of the people whom I train with who are gun-ho and who are disappointed, to say the least, in my choosing not to fight any more. Do they understand? Probably not considering some of them LIKE to pick street-fights… Should I care, definitely not (but my pride still gets the best of me now and then).

Maybe I am just looking for those who may understand my decision not to fight, who can look past tomorrow in terms of planning long term. I do plan on going into grappling, specifically traditional jiu jitsu which focuses on the mind and spirit as well.

9

[quote]IronHell wrote:
Sifu, thanks for that. And BOSS, yes, to some it may seem like a stupid question, in which case, thanks for dignifying it with a not so brilliant response.

I am only 23, to go through life without at time look to others (who are hopefully wiser) would be naive of me. Instead of flipping a coin to decide my fate on a decision which I am obviously so torn on, I went to you guys in hopes that some of you may be emphathetic.

I guess at times it is hard for me to train in an environment whose sole goal is to “fight”. I think I just have to forgo my ego and look at it in the long run. I have to forget about some of the people whom I train with who are gun-ho and who are disappointed, to say the least, in my choosing not to fight any more. Do they understand? Probably not considering some of them LIKE to pick street-fights… Should I care, definitely not (but my pride still gets the best of me now and then).

Maybe I am just looking for those who may understand my decision not to fight, who can look past tomorrow in terms of planning long term. I do plan on going into grappling, specifically traditional jiu jitsu which focuses on the mind and spirit as well.

[/quote]

Dude, I have been vacillating for years on whether or not to compete in boxing. And I totally empathise; the decision is not as easy as it may seem especially for people in our situation. I spent the last 5 years as a software engineer and am in the process of applying to medical school, so I’m in the same boat of being concerned with preserving optimal cognitive functioning.

I’ve trained a boxing gyms before and I love sparring. But its a different situation when your trading with someone with the goal of knocking you out. There’s been so many times when I’ve been like, “Fuck it, lets do it.” Then, without fail, I always meet that really nice guy who has boxed for years and is just slightly off. You know how he doesn’t really look at you when you talk to him. His eyes seem to be slightly out of focus and sometimes he talks a bit too slowly. I guess you could describe him a slightly punch-drunk. Always really nice, though…SHIT! I don’t want to turn out like that!!!

Well I don’t know what I’ll do. It really doesn’t help having a father like mine who was, and still is, a legitimate bad-ass with a lot of street fights under his belt. This stuff is in my blood. I know I’m not getting any younger. And BTW if you haven’t found out already, what potential risks striking has to your brain, grappling is just as bad to your joints. I guess walking funny for the rest of your life beats struggling all the time to remember what you were just about to say.

10

I live in Pattaya, Thailand, The gym where I workout have a guy who’s stripping the bars for people that are too lazy to do it themself. This guy was one of the top Thaiboxers here in Chonburi… now he’s walking around (more like staggering) with a stupid grin on his face. He got a bit beat up in his last fight…Servere permanent braindamage. And this guy was GOOD!

You say your brain is your moneymaker, make your decision soon before it’s too late. A few more fights and it might be too late?

Good luck.

11

I remember some years ago watching a shaolin priest who was over ninety years old doing a spear form that blew me away. At ninety years old he was jumping around working this spear in such a way you would think he was nineteen. To me that was a true bad ass, old age wasn’t slowing him down one bit. Martial arts has the ability to improve your health but it can also be very detrimental to your health. The damage you do from really heavy contact, you don’t feel it when you are in your twenty’s or thirty’s but when you get into your forty’s it starts to kick in. There are a lot of knuckle heads in martial arts who let being gung ho overcome their common sense and they expect the rest of the class to be as unthinking as they are. There are a lot of old martial artists who are in pathetic shape because of the way the trained when they were young. You say some of your gym mates get into street fights, that’s a classic example of a gym that is way too yang. It wouldn’t surprise me if you told me that some of them like to drink and one or two has been known to smack their girl freind around. The martial arts has a lot of variety if you don’t get into jiu jitsu checkout some philipino arnis that’s some really cool stuff with a wide range of variety.

12

Hmmm…I see your point in both ways of looking at this situation. I can only answer from a point of view about what I would do. I would get into it! You are only going to have a limited time in this life to experience the sorts of thrills you can get from full on all out fighting and the pleasure of knocking someone out or kicking their ass…Let’s face it this sort of activity is instinct. Once you start getting older and your abilities and T levels drop you can concentrate on money making all you want if that’s whats important to you…What’s going to be important when you get older? The ability to look back and say that you fulfilled your passions ie. Muay Thai…or to have the second yacht?

13

Heh, Sifu, holy crap, you are dead-on. More than a few likes to drink, some do drugs, and a few have gone to jail for smacking their g/f/wife around… Yeah, that kind of puts things in perspective in terms of whose opinion of me I should care about…

Stucross, you are the other voice in my head… You are saying the exact same things half of me tells myself. “F* it, you only live once, carpe diem.” I use to be like that, I trained only a couple of months in Thai Boxing before my first match (I knocked the guy out w/ a body-shot within the first 40 seconds and I was PISSED that he stopped fighting, I was like, “c’mon bring it on! I wanna fight!”) But as I got my second concussion and as I matured, got a job, a place to stay at, making money etc… I think to myself, perhaps I have hit the preservation stage where like Stifu implies, I really am looking down the road two, three decades ahead and saying, “Do I WANT to have constant migraines as a result of fighting…?” “Are the risks worth it?”

For now, I just spar, albeit that also ain’t so great for the brain… And for now, I still kick serious ass, so that will have to provide me my gratification for a bit more.

Let’s not start with the fact that I just got done taking my motorcycle riding course and want to ride motorcycles… =]

14

This talk of potential injuries from sports is starting to smell of estrogen.

IH–If you want to avoid a concussion then you are right to doubt whether or not fc Muay Thai is the best thing for you. It prob isn’t.

WTF is up w/ the rest of you? “Oh you could get hurt. You need to make money. You’ll walk funny.”

Shut up! Play your sports, enjoy it, take care of yourself, and have some fucking balls. This is Testosterone nation, not “be careful-you might get hurt-I have a small withered nut sack” nation.

15

Its your call.
I trained kickboxing for a couple of years. What I promised myself from the start was that I would stop sparring heavily when I turned 32, Im 36 right know, I still do some kickboxing as my cardio but no sparring or if I do it is light and with protection.

Im also looking into doing some grapling obviously just for fun.

16

[quote]IronHell wrote:
Sifu, thanks for that. And BOSS, yes, to some it may seem like a stupid question, in which case, thanks for dignifying it with a not so brilliant response.[/quote]

You want a more dignified response will here it is!

When I was in my late teenage years I started to train with a legend in NHB fighting. This man fought at the time when NHB fighting was illegal and before it was controlled by the mob. Anyways back to the story; I trained with this living legend for 2 years learning very much about real fighting and myself. I then moved on to Thai boxing and Krav Maga; eventually getting certified in each style. After my trip to Thailand and the certs., I started tuff man fighting for a total of 6 bouts which I won all. After my 6 fights in tuff man, K-1 called and offered me a contract. I was undecided about whether to sign or not. I received my answer from my old NHB fighting coach the living legend, he has major frontal lobe brain damage caused by his 10 undefeated years of fighting. He also has and gets seizers, because of his brain damage. One of those seizures caused him his son , and car.

Lets do some pros and cons:

Pro-Lets recap he did become the greatest NHB fighter of all time

Con-severe brain damage

Con-limited short term memory

Con- dead son

Con-severe body damage because of seizures induced accident

I can’t think of other pros but I can think of at least 10 more cons.

Just my experiences and observations.
You have to do like I said in an earlier post decide for your self, fuck everyone else.
What’s more important a good long life or a short miserable life? Choose wisely, your life may depend on it.

17

Being a T-man doesn’t mean you have to be reckless with your life. Being wise isn’t the same as being nutless.

If you are worried about losing the feeling of belonging or the friendship you have, it can be replaced.

If you are looking for thrills, there are a million sports out there to choose from.

However, it certainly is your life. You can choose to take any level of risk that you want. Make sure the risks you take give enough back to you to make them worthwhile.

I’m not sure feeling good and having some fun kicking ass is worth risking your livelihood. The downside is pretty damned severe.

Can you find a less risky way to get the same upside? There are a lot of ways to feel good.

18

Obviously getting kicked in the head, and/or getting concussions are not the best things to do to yourself, - but a lot of things arent: Do you drink ? Smoke (cigarettes/dope) ?? Not very good for you either…

I used to fight full contact stick-fighting (lots of impact with light headgear) played defensive tackle (lots of impact again), got a couple of concussions (milder). Hasnt stopped me from getting my PhD in neuroscience and working full time as a researcher.

Dont make a habit of getting concussions, - but also dont be afraid of doing the things you feel like doing…knowing when to stop is up to you.

19

Heh, BOSS, thank you for that, appreciated that story.

I will recap what I have been reminded:

  1. Fighting and getting knocked around aren’t constructive towards having a healthy brain and life later on.
  2. Pride and ego are things where instant gratification is feasible but could be at a cost, perhaps higher than they are worth.
  3. Pride and ego are short-lived, life isn’t…
  4. Learn to earn the respect from RESPECTFUL people, not from bozos who can’t tell their right from their left.
  5. Always weigh the pros and cons, are the risks worth the payoff?
  6. Balance between being “tough” and being “smart”.
  7. Perhaps there are other alternatives that may provide the same satisfaction.
  8. Yes, it is my F*ing life. No shit.
  9. Put socks on before shoes.

Hey all thanks for the responses and advice. They were all well received, some were more direct than others, but those messages were heeded nonetheless. Perhaps I will save my third concussion for the time in the future when my beautiful hot model future wife and I get jumped by seven midgets with baseball bats and after knocking down six of them the seventh one manages to smack me in the head with the bat as I Muay Thai kick his…

Cheers.

20

As long as you can kick like Crocop, walk away from MT with Pride! (pun)

Who saw the show last night