Zephead's Log

Training Training Logs
662

My dynamic cycle will be

Straight weight
Week 1 (70 %): 8x2 @ 235 lbs

Week 2 (73 %): 8x2 @ 245 lbs

Week 3 (75 %): 8x2 @ 250 lbs

Chains
Week 1 (70 %): 8x2 @ 235 lbs + 60 lbs of chains at top

Week 2 (73 %): 8x2 @ 245 lbs + 60 lbs of chains at top

Week 3 (75 %): 8x2 @ 250 lbs + 60 lbs of chains at top

Max effort rotation for squat won’t be much of a rotation, as I will be learning my suit.

will probably just do a lot of box/free squats, like normal.

I will be retesting my regular flat bench tomorow.

probably will do this for DE bench:

Straight weight: 8x3 @ 130 lbs

Chains: 8x3 @ 130 lbs + 40 lbs of chains at top (one 5/8")

the Deadlifting will probably be between 85-90% of my max pull with or without chains, for doubles.

according to Pripepins table

80-89% …2-4 …15 …10-20

663

talk about serious blue balls

664

[quote]zephead4747 wrote:
also do I base my speed work off of a new max whenever I hit a new weight? How do I add weight to my speed work?[/quote]

literature I’ve seen suggests waving thru a 3 week cycle for DE work .

bench…55 to 65%
squat…50 to 60%
deadlift…50%
these would be straight weight numbers ; chains/bands would be lower percentages .

but the percentages arent as important as the bar speed . if the barspeed seems too slow , your using too much weight . I’m pretty low in the learning curve on this matter , as when to know if you’re bar speed is too slow . just something to learn/figure out as you go .

I’ve never seen deadlift percentages in the 80% range suggested anywhere for DE work , as you indicated in another post (did I read that wrong ?). doesnt mean it cant work though .

and yes , if you hit a new max , you would increase your DE weight . example…

your bench max is 200 , so your DE weights with no accomidating resistance would be 110 , 120 , 130 lbs , waved thru 3 weeks . then you hit a new max of 220 ; so your DE weights would increase to 120 , 130 , and 140 .

IIRC , most lit suggests using 50% for the deadlift .

hope that helps

665

[quote]zephead4747 wrote:
I remember someone posting about the SE method on these forums a while back, but I can’t find any information on it anywhere.

anyone got any intel to share? I have an idea, but idk if it will do right or wrong.

I was planning on doing doubles with 385 or 365+chains for 4-5 sets until that got to easy and upping the weight, and so on.[/quote]

I remember that also . maybe check the WS library ?

666

[quote]marlboroman wrote:
zephead4747 wrote:
I remember someone posting about the SE method on these forums a while back, but I can’t find any information on it anywhere.

anyone got any intel to share? I have an idea, but idk if it will do right or wrong.

I was planning on doing doubles with 385 or 365+chains for 4-5 sets until that got to easy and upping the weight, and so on.

I remember that also . maybe check the WS library ?

[/quote]

I looked everywhere.

thanks for the speed work %s

667

I couldn’t train yesterday. I had some serious business to take care of. And it’s fixed so I won’t be missing a session again from it. I’m changing my availablility at work today so in the next week or two I should be able to train on a 4 day again.

668

[quote]marlboroman wrote:

I’ve never seen deadlift percentages in the 80% range suggested anywhere for DE work , as you indicated in another post (did I read that wrong ?). doesnt mean it cant work though .
[/quote]

it was called submaximum effort. I think dominator talked about it in one of the threads we had pertaining to the subject.

669

[quote]zephead4747 wrote:
marlboroman wrote:

I’ve never seen deadlift percentages in the 80% range suggested anywhere for DE work , as you indicated in another post (did I read that wrong ?). doesnt mean it cant work though .

it was called submaximum effort. I think dominator talked about it in one of the threads we had pertaining to the subject.[/quote]

yah , I now see I read that wrong . never mind .

but anyway , I’ll be checking outta here shortly , so I wont be updating my log anymore . so when I get back you better be benchin’ 275… AT LEAST !

If I dont see ya in the future , I’ll see ya in the pasture…

670

[quote]marlboroman wrote:
zephead4747 wrote:
marlboroman wrote:

I’ve never seen deadlift percentages in the 80% range suggested anywhere for DE work , as you indicated in another post (did I read that wrong ?). doesnt mean it cant work though .

it was called submaximum effort. I think dominator talked about it in one of the threads we had pertaining to the subject.

yah , I now see I read that wrong . never mind .

but anyway , I’ll be checking outta here shortly , so I wont be updating my log anymore . so when I get back you better be benchin’ 275… AT LEAST !

If I dont see ya in the future , I’ll see ya in the pasture…

[/quote]

wait, what??? why aren’t you coming back on here.

671

[quote]zephead4747 wrote:
So I was thinking…

ME squat:
-ME squat variation
-front squat or power squat
-good mornings
-glute hams
-leg ext
-weighted situps

ME bench:
-heavy bench
-low boards
-shoulders
-rows

DE squat:
-DE squat
-SE or DE deadlift
-leg press
-glute hams
-suitcase deads

DE bench:
-DE bench
-high boards
-pullovers
-vertical pull variation
-rear delt flys
-gunz

opinions? I will probably give this a go.[/quote]

revised.

672

I dont like it.

The SE method is something Westside uses with VERY advanced lifters with highly extended recovery capabilities (read: aas and peptides). As far as I know, they dont use it for their deadlifting because, even with their pharmacological advantages, its still too much. Not to mention, they are also lifting in multiply gear (which you are not) and need to practice in their gear as lifting in 2 plys of poly and 2 plys of canvas demands a far greater degree of technical precision than lifting in a single ply centurion. Context Zep, context.

You seem to be deadlifting heavy on a VERY regular basis. No problem with this, but realize that if youre going to pull frequently, youre going to have to keep the intensity down.

Here is what I would do: rotate your max effort movements weekly. Three exercises in the rotation. This way, youre getting the variety, but still getting back to movements fairly frequently so you can make constant progress on them. Remember that your max effort exercises should have some degree of carryover to each other so you should be able to progress on them without training them in consecutive weeks. After your max effort work, do speed pulls for 8 singles with chains or bands waving the bar weight %'s 50,55,60, repeat. Base your %'s for this off of 20-30 lbs higher than your current best pull and cycle through these for 9-12 weeks and then take a max effort pull attempt. This way, you practice your technique on a regular basis without beating the everliving shit out of your body or central nervous system.

Personally, I dont do speed squats, but rather my second lower body day each week is an assistance day that I use to get my volume in because I rarely feel like doing a lot of extra work after my max effort squatting.

This arrangement got me a 30 lb PR on my deadlift in 6 weeks. I pull sumo, very wide, and in a single ply metal viking. I plan on continuing to do this and will hopefully have my 500 pull by April/May.

Remember to think this stuff out, just because you CAN do it doesnt mean you SHOULD or that its going to be what is best for your lifting.

673

[quote]Stronghold wrote:
I dont like it.

The SE method is something Westside uses with VERY advanced lifters with highly extended recovery capabilities (read: aas and peptides). As far as I know, they dont use it for their deadlifting because, even with their pharmacological advantages, its still too much. Not to mention, they are also lifting in multiply gear (which you are not) and need to practice in their gear as lifting in 2 plys of poly and 2 plys of canvas demands a far greater degree of technical precision than lifting in a single ply centurion. Context Zep, context.

You seem to be deadlifting heavy on a VERY regular basis. No problem with this, but realize that if youre going to pull frequently, youre going to have to keep the intensity down.

Here is what I would do: rotate your max effort movements weekly. Three exercises in the rotation. This way, youre getting the variety, but still getting back to movements fairly frequently so you can make constant progress on them. Remember that your max effort exercises should have some degree of carryover to each other so you should be able to progress on them without training them in consecutive weeks. After your max effort work, do speed pulls for 8 singles with chains or bands waving the bar weight %'s 50,55,60, repeat. Base your %'s for this off of 20-30 lbs higher than your current best pull and cycle through these for 9-12 weeks and then take a max effort pull attempt. This way, you practice your technique on a regular basis without beating the everliving shit out of your body or central nervous system.

Personally, I dont do speed squats, but rather my second lower body day each week is an assistance day that I use to get my volume in because I rarely feel like doing a lot of extra work after my max effort squatting.

This arrangement got me a 30 lb PR on my deadlift in 6 weeks. I pull sumo, very wide, and in a single ply metal viking. I plan on continuing to do this and will hopefully have my 500 pull by April/May.

Remember to think this stuff out, just because you CAN do it doesnt mean you SHOULD or that its going to be what is best for your lifting.[/quote]

Thanks SH, I will probably try doing it this way for a few weeks, and if it’s fucking with my recovery I will most deffinately move over to the way you describe, except I will be doing speed squats.

If I do it your way I’ll be doing
Low box squats w/ chains
deads with chains
squats

I’m young, not especially competitive at this point. I am however feeling the need to try different things and find one that works, and changing the SE deadlifts out is a pretty simple fix that I can do whenever. If I feel too beat up from them after the first week or two even I will be ditching them. It’s not worth fucking my ME work up.

I appreciate the response.

674

that stronghold seems to know what hes talking about

675

Hows your shoulder’s?

They might not be able to take the DE bench days.

676

[quote]zephead4747 wrote:

Thanks SH, I will probably try doing it this way for a few weeks, and if it’s fucking with my recovery I will most deffinately move over to the way you describe, except I will be doing speed squats.

If I do it your way I’ll be doing
Low box squats w/ chains
deads with chains
squats

I’m young, not especially competitive at this point. I am however feeling the need to try different things and find one that works, and changing the SE deadlifts out is a pretty simple fix that I can do whenever. If I feel too beat up from them after the first week or two even I will be ditching them. It’s not worth fucking my ME work up.

I appreciate the response.[/quote]

You’re not especially competitive at this point? Dont you want to get to that point as quickly as possible though? I dont have time to experiment to a huge degree, I want my elite by 23 and pro by 27. Thats a lot of ground to cover in a short period of time. If I wanted to lift weights for the sake of lifting weights, I would be bodybuilding.

I think you missed my point in regards to the deadlifting. Pulling at a high intensity on a frequent basis is going to hinder your progress in all three lifts.

Max effort pulling every third week is still fairly frequent given that you are maxing out on other exercises on the weeks that you arent pulling. The goal is to add weight to your TOTAL…that means all three lifts…do you remember when you were doing Coan/Phillipi what happened to your squatting?

You dont think taking a max on some exercise once a week every week and then pulling in the 80-85% range (which is more than C/P iirc) isnt going to have a very similar effect? Sure, you might set a 10 lb pr on your deadlift, but your squat and bench are likely to not only make progress, but REGRESS.

Its been 3 months since you pulled 425. If it was a 600-700 lb pull, that would be a reasonable amount of time to go without a real PR, but at this level, you should be making progress faster than that. Thats a sure sign that what youre doing isnt working. Keep doing what youve always done and youre going to get what youve always got.

Honestly, the programs and things I see you using in here are starting to look like one giant clusterfuck to me. You seem like you want to do a little of everything for no reason other than for the sake of doing it. I think youre so eager to try new things, that you arent taking enough to learn the hows and whys of what works and what doesnt.

My advice, is to do this:
http://www.elitefts.com/documents/9week-training-program.htm

Dont change anything with it. Follow it to the letter. Set PR’s, and then after the 9 weeks, step back and look at what worked and what didnt.

677

that stronghold guy is one sensible motherfucker

678

[quote]Stronghold wrote:
zephead4747 wrote:

Thanks SH, I will probably try doing it this way for a few weeks, and if it’s fucking with my recovery I will most deffinately move over to the way you describe, except I will be doing speed squats.

If I do it your way I’ll be doing
Low box squats w/ chains
deads with chains
squats

I’m young, not especially competitive at this point. I am however feeling the need to try different things and find one that works, and changing the SE deadlifts out is a pretty simple fix that I can do whenever. If I feel too beat up from them after the first week or two even I will be ditching them. It’s not worth fucking my ME work up.

I appreciate the response.

You’re not especially competitive at this point? Dont you want to get to that point as quickly as possible though? I dont have time to experiment to a huge degree, I want my elite by 23 and pro by 27. Thats a lot of ground to cover in a short period of time. If I wanted to lift weights for the sake of lifting weights, I would be bodybuilding.

I think you missed my point in regards to the deadlifting. Pulling at a high intensity on a frequent basis is going to hinder your progress in all three lifts.

Max effort pulling every third week is still fairly frequent given that you are maxing out on other exercises on the weeks that you arent pulling. The goal is to add weight to your TOTAL…that means all three lifts…do you remember when you were doing Coan/Phillipi what happened to your squatting?

You dont think taking a max on some exercise once a week every week and then pulling in the 80-85% range (which is more than C/P iirc) isnt going to have a very similar effect? Sure, you might set a 10 lb pr on your deadlift, but your squat and bench are likely to not only make progress, but REGRESS.

Its been 3 months since you pulled 425. If it was a 600-700 lb pull, that would be a reasonable amount of time to go without a real PR, but at this level, you should be making progress faster than that. Thats a sure sign that what youre doing isnt working. Keep doing what youve always done and youre going to get what youve always got.

Honestly, the programs and things I see you using in here are starting to look like one giant clusterfuck to me. You seem like you want to do a little of everything for no reason other than for the sake of doing it. I think youre so eager to try new things, that you arent taking enough to learn the hows and whys of what works and what doesnt.

My advice, is to do this:
http://www.elitefts.com/documents/9week-training-program.htm

Dont change anything with it. Follow it to the letter. Set PR’s, and then after the 9 weeks, step back and look at what worked and what didnt.[/quote]

I think I will stick to the template you outlined in your orriginal post, sans SE deadlifting, and using the ME cycle I posted. You’re right about the lack of progress, and it’s fucking killing me.

679

[quote]detazathoth wrote:
that stronghold guy is one sensible motherfucker[/quote]

the squat vid will be up on tuesday, Turns out I don’t have time to lift before I go to the metallica show.

ghey.

680

[quote]BlackLabel wrote:
Hows your shoulder’s?

They might not be able to take the DE bench days.[/quote]

they are fine.

681

[quote]Stronghold wrote:

You’re not especially competitive at this point? Dont you want to get to that point as quickly as possible though? I dont have time to experiment to a huge degree, I want my elite by 23 and pro by 27. Thats a lot of ground to cover in a short period of time. If I wanted to lift weights for the sake of lifting weights, I would be bodybuilding.

[b]I think you missed my point in regards to the deadlifting. Pulling at a high intensity on a frequent basis is going to hinder your progress in all three lifts.

Max effort pulling every third week is still fairly frequent given that you are maxing out on other exercises on the weeks that you arent pulling.[/b] The goal is to add weight to your TOTAL…that means all three lifts…do you remember when you were doing Coan/Phillipi what happened to your squatting?

You dont think taking a max on some exercise once a week every week and then pulling in the 80-85% range (which is more than C/P iirc) isnt going to have a very similar effect? Sure, you might set a 10 lb pr on your deadlift, but your squat and bench are likely to not only make progress, but REGRESS.

Its been 3 months since you pulled 425. If it was a 600-700 lb pull, that would be a reasonable amount of time to go without a real PR, but at this level, you should be making progress faster than that. Thats a sure sign that what youre doing isnt working. Keep doing what youve always done and youre going to get what youve always got.

Honestly, the programs and things I see you using in here are starting to look like one giant clusterfuck to me. You seem like you want to do a little of everything for no reason other than for the sake of doing it. I think youre so eager to try new things, that you arent taking enough to learn the hows and whys of what works and what doesnt.

[b]My advice, is to do this:
http://www.elitefts.com/documents/9week-training-program.htm

Dont change anything with it. Follow it to the letter. Set PR’s, and then after the 9 weeks, step back and look at what worked and what didnt.[/b][/quote]

Bolded for emphasis.

Did you ever stop to think that there is a reason why the guys at Westside don’t pull heavy from the floor on a regular basis?