What To Do..What To Do??

Training Beginners
1

Hi everyone… you too static-x… I posted here a few months ago with an issue, mainly about not having energy enough to feel like doing anything but sleep and lay around due to my odd work schedule . I was led to get off my ass and begin my personal transformation.

Well, the time has come. I recently took a position in my company that allows me to have a regular work schedule. “YIPPIE”. At work at 7am and off about dinner, 5 days a week. June 1st I joined a gym. I work out 4 days straight with a total of 30 mins of cardio each of the 4 days. Two upper and two lower body. I dont do anything the other 3 days.

Got one of the, claimed to be educated in the fitness world employees, to line me up with a light routine to start off with. 3 sets/10 reps of this and that. Worked out pretty descent for the first week or two. Then I had some questions about my program. Well, they then told me to go to 4 sets ( 12,10,8 & 6) and maybe go up 10 lbs on one set every other set. Sounded logical, in a way. No sense in pumpin the same weight day in and day out. Is that a positive option though?

Because I found myself getting exhausted early and not being able to complete my workout. I went back to 3 sets of 10 on my own and like that a lot better. I was also told that, say, if you work your upper body, you need to let it rest for two days. Is that true? P.S. I only have access to the gym 4 days because I work out of town and am at home the other 2.

I could go on and on, and I have a ton more questions, but for now, what do any of you suggest my sets/reps to be for more of a defining physique. My joints are a little too bad for strength training. And on that note, is there anything I can take for joint relief, besides the surgeons knife?

My rotator cuff in both arms are slightly damaged and my right knee ran a muck the other day which has altered my squats.
Static, I have witnessed the socialites and avid cell phone users you mentioned can be found at almost any gym. I leave my phone in the truck, but I do take time, between wiping the sweat off my brow and catching my breathe, to scope out some of the nice phillies that the good Lord blessed us with by putting them on this earth so’s we can scope em’ out… No harm in scopin.

2

Id vary your rep scheme and exercises maybe the 3 x 10 you like on one day but the other do say 5x5 or 8 x 3 or 2 x 20 something different

yhea youll be fine going on the split you have you may be a lil beat up come the last day but then you have 3 complete days of rest its all good.

Phill

3

Oh and if you really want some more help etc you need to actually tell us what it is you are doing in the gym

Phill

4

Also some more information on your diet will help too.

5

Noone can help you as much as you, yourself. Read up on this wonderful site, there is much to learn. Most people should start with basic compound exercises. Certain rep/set/loading schemes can elicit different responses.

For instance a scheme suited to pure strength may look like: 10x2x90% while a scheme more suited to hypertrophy may look more like: 3x8x75%

Also, if you’re getting tired early, you may need to provide more information. Which exercises are you performing? How much rest between sets? What about your diet? Getting plenty of sleep?

For joint relief, you may try glucosamine/chondroitin(sp?). It does wonders for myself and many others, but some may not benefit as much as others.

As for the cell phone-abusers, I reccomend a cro-bar, they’ve done wonders for me! :wink:

PS. If you can, try box squats as they may put a lot less sheering force on your knees than an oly squat.

6

Joint Relief: There is a whole section in the vitamin store dedicated to it. I’ve had good luck with Glucosamine/Chondroitin/MDM.

Fish oil (specifically omega 3s) is also supposed to be good for joint health in larger doses - the authors on this site usually recommend 2-3g of omega 3s from fish oil a day as a starting point. Some people here take a hell of a lot more than that and have good results.

Also, make sure you are stretching and warming up. There are good articles on this site regarding both.

Finally, form form form form form form form. Joint injuries can easily be caused by overuse or improper form or both. Make sure you always use good form on all your lifts on every rep. When you notice your form breaking down, stop. You can lower the weight if you still want more volume, but don’t be the guy doing violent full body spasms to finish his set.

7

Carnak makes a very good point about both warming up/stretching and form. First of all, you should be using dynamic stretches prior to lifting and static stretches post workout. Read up on 'em.

As for form, I recommend everyone lift like a powerlifter. Even my grandmother.

8

[quote]Phill wrote:
Oh and if you really want some more help etc you need to actually tell us what it is you are doing in the gym

Phill[/quote]

Ok, here goes. I might not have all the names right.

First start with 10 min treadmill walk then stretch upper and lower.

Tuesday: Bench press 120 3x10
Incline bench press 120 3x10
Tricep pulldown 150 3x10
Reverse fly 25 3x10
Dumbell shoulder press 40 3x10
Front pull down 130 3x10
Rows 145 3x10
Bicep curls(dumbell) 30 3x10
Dips Me 225 1x8/1x6
Shrugs 120 3x15
Cable inward pulls
(both arms) 50 3x10

Wed: Leg press & calves 270 3x10
Reverse leg curls 100 3x10
Leg curls 135 3x10
Adductor 200 3x10
Abductor 200 3x10

I do stretch some about midway through. Then I get back on the treadmill. Walk 10-Run 5-Walk 5. And that’s about it. Repeat the other two days.

As far as my diet…Well, that definitely needs improving. I did pretty good the first two or three weeks. I saw a little weight shed and some off the waist. I would eat about 5x a day. So that definitely works.

But, to me, just getting back into this, and lack of obviously a lot of knowledge, I find all of the nutrition stuff immensely confusing. One says eat it and the other one says dont. Is there not just a simple and basic guide to follow that is effective and still leaves someone who loves to eat somewhat satisfied from eating?

Or do you just have to completely change your diet? I’m not looking to enter a Mr. America competition, so I feel like I should have a little more leeway than the competitors.

Thanks to all for the input and info. This truely is a damn great site.

P.S. Jamie Eason…I think your HOTT…

9

Damn, where did I get that from. What I meant was Jamie Eason. Forgiveness, please!!

10

I had Jamie Jameson up at first. Re-posted correction. Then edited…My bad!

11

Concerning your training frequency, amount of sets, rep speed etc., what you can do at this point will depend on factors like your age, how much lifting you have done earlier in your life, what sort of physical activities you’ve been into, whether you’re naturally athletic, what ratio of fast twitch and slow twitch muscle fibers you have, and even the way your bone structure is composed.

If you’re really serious about improving, you should seek out a coach or PT that can analyze which approach will suit you best, but make sure you hire someone with real experience and serious credentials. There are a lot of con men out there.
Also I would read up on diet, and perhaps seek some advice in that department as well. What you eat is just as important as your lifting.

You’d also do well to read T-Nation, but remember that many of the routines that are presented here, aren’t geared towards beginners.

EDIT: Oh yeah, and what’s with all the cardio? I don’t have to see you to say ditch it. It’ll just have a negative effect on your lifting (and vice versa). By all means do some cardio, but do it separate from your lifting, do mostly intense interval work and unless your only goal is to be thin with no regard to body composition, don’t overdo it.
If you do thirty minutes of cardio before your lifting, you won’t have energy left to contract your muscles with maximal effort.

12

Your routine is horridly misguided.

13

[quote]captaincalvert wrote:
Concerning your training frequency, amount of sets, rep speed etc., what you can do at this point will depend on factors like your age, how much lifting you have done earlier in your life, what sort of physical activities you’ve been into, whether you’re naturally athletic, what ratio of fast twitch and slow twitch muscle fibers you have, and even the way your bone structure is composed.

If you’re really serious about improving, you should seek out a coach or PT that can analyze which approach will suit you best, but make sure you hire someone with real experience and serious credentials. There are a lot of con men out there.
Also I would read up on diet, and perhaps seek some advice in that department as well. What you eat is just as important as your lifting.

You’d also do well to read T-Nation, but remember that many of the routines that are presented here, aren’t geared towards beginners.

EDIT: Oh yeah, and what’s with all the cardio? I don’t have to see you to say ditch it. It’ll just have a negative effect on your lifting (and vice versa). By all means do some cardio, but do it separate from your lifting, do mostly intense interval work and unless your only goal is to be thin with no regard to body composition, don’t overdo it.
If you do thirty minutes of cardio before your lifting, you won’t have energy left to contract your muscles with maximal effort.[/quote]

As of right now, I’m a ship without a sail. I joined this gym with great intensions and intend to keep them. Unfortunately, I assumed I would get proper advice and a routine from someone who worked there, but quickly found out that I do have to hire someone with knowledge to line me up with an effective program. I’m not opposed to that by no means, but I figured I could learn enough from here and reading different articles. But that could take lightyears.

So, I guess, hiring a pro would be the way to go. I agree with you on my past activities, lifting and all that, and sadly, it’s been pretty much zilch. I realize that there is a lot to learn as far as nutrition goes. And ten other peoples plan may not be for me. I need to find out what works for ME…Quick question on that note. Say I start a diet plan and a month or two goes by and I finally find what works for ME (calories, carbs, protein intake, etc.)how long do I stay with those numbers?

What I mean is, as time goes on and I progress, do I need to change things up as far as intake goes?

With all the cardio, I dunno. I just figured it was good for me so that’s what I’ve been doing. And yes I do get tired. I would love to do a more agreesive cardio plan. What is intense interval work that you’re referring to? I dont want to be thin. Ther’s definitly no chance of that, unless become anorexic(or however you spell it). I’m 36 and about 225lbs. An ole gal at the gym told me my ideal weight at 5’11" is around 165. I told her she’s crazy. I wont never see that.

14

[quote]colonelquack wrote:
Your routine is horridly misguided.[/quote]

What’s wrong with it. By all means shed some light. I’m open for anything that works. I’m getting tired of, not really wasting my time, but not having a program that is effective at all angles.

15

I know. Some training studios have competent people. Some don’t, and some have a mix. Far too many still think that long sessions of aerobic work are the key to better health. On saturday I dropped by the place I train to do legs, and there was a long line of people at the reception counter. It turned out they were mostly bewildered people of the skinny-fat type who were there for spinning.

I was asked by the receptionist if I was there to take the class. I told her no I had come to lift like I always do, and then she looks at me and says: “Well, that’s okay too”, like it was some kind of second rate activity for morons. Part of me really wanted to tell her the lay of the land, but I didn’t want to cause a scene, so I just shook my head and headed for the squat rack.

You see, quite a few people, even among those who are there to help you get fit, have a bias against people who want to build muscles. In short it’s frowned upon, but never mind what they think, because they are the true morons of the fitness business, not you.

Sure. You can learn a lot by reading, and this site in particular has some very sensible contributors, whose ideas are light years ahead of the average gym personell. You can read a lot, and experiment, and sooner or later you’ll hit pay dirt,but if you want to excel fast, you could benefit a lot from getting someone competent to help you

That’s a useful piece of information. That you are new to physical activity means that training is shock to your body and nervous system. In my humble opinion you should go relatively easy for the first few weeks. To avoid injury, you need a period to “acclimatize” the body to do hard physical work. At this stage you can’t train like an olympic weight lifter or a pro bodybuilder. That’ll do more harm than good. You have to gradually get the nervous system to accept the strain.

But how hard you should go at it is really not for me to tell you. If you’re doing this alone. Listen to your body. Push yourself gradually harder, but don’t do things that seem painful in an unnatural way. If something feels like it’s about to tear, there’s a good chance that it will happen, in which case it’s obviously better to stop.

You know the old saying don’t fix it if ain’t broke, right? :wink:
Still, if you gain a lot of muscle, you’ll need more calories to sustain them and gain even more, so you might feel a need to up the intake after a while. I’m not sure of your goals, but there are different strategies. The pros bulk and cut, but it’s not a very healthy approach. Maybe you should go for carb cycling instead. It can be a little complex to get it right, but if you hit the caloric spot so to say, you can actually gain lean mass, and drop the lard at the same time.
Take a look at www.burnthefat.com. Since you’re on the heavy side Tom Venuto might have the book to help you out.

It’s not bad for you. It’s just not optimal for fat loss and muscle gain. Your cardiovascular system loves it, but it loves lifting and short intense work too. It just develops an anaerobic capacity instead of an aerobic one. I do different things. Some times I’ll run up and down a steep hill at irregular, but short intervals. Other times I do 20 second sprints with 10 second breaks. I usually do only eight of those. On rare occasions I also do one minute hill runs with one minute breaks.

The details don’t really matter that much. The important thing is that you work on your anaerobic capacity more than the aerobic one. But make sure to warm up for at least ten minutes first. Sprinting when cold is not a good idea.

Good luck!

16

Captaincalvert, hey I appreciate the word. I’m not looking to win Mr. America, but, I definitely want to change my lifestyle and physique. I’ve always been fascinated with bodybuilding, with the often “I wish I looked like that” comment to myself. And now is the time to make that come true.

Even at 36 I feel like I still have enough time to get my “SWOLE” on… I’ve only been at it 2 months now and I can feel and see a small substantial difference in my arms. Seeing these small results in such a short time is really inspirational, for me at least. I’ll checkout the site you gave. Thanks again.

17

stick to the basics I do a upper/lower split too.

me=
Lower:
-squats 3x5
-Deadlifts 3x5
-SLDL 3x5
-Powercleans 3x5
-calf raises 3x8

Upper:
-Flat bench press 3x5
-Chin ups 3xfailure////I do barbell rows on 2nd day
-Barbell curls- 3x8///preachers on 2nd day
-weighted dips 3x5-7//skull crushers on 2nd day
standing militaries 3x5

Ofc you could keep it even more basic which is what I would have done when I was starting out

Lower:
squats
deadlifts
cleans///raises-optional

Upper:
bench
rows/chins
military press-optional

18

[quote]zephead4747 wrote:
stick to the basics I do a upper/lower split too.

me=
Lower:
-squats 3x5
-Deadlifts 3x5
-SLDL 3x5
-Powercleans 3x5
-calf raises 3x8

Upper:
-Flat bench press 3x5
-Chin ups 3xfailure////I do barbell rows on 2nd day
-Barbell curls- 3x8///preachers on 2nd day
-weighted dips 3x5-7//skull crushers on 2nd day
standing militaries 3x5

Ofc you could keep it even more basic which is what I would have done when I was starting out

Lower:
squats
deadlifts
cleans///raises-optional

Upper:
bench
rows/chins
military press-optional[/quote]

SLDL, preachers, skull crushers??? All this I will have to look up. Never heard of them. Thanks for your input. What is your workout schedule? I only have 4 days to use the gym. Would you suggest splitting daily for 4 days?

Also, at what point would I know when to advance to the next level, in accordance with the basic routine you would have done starting out?

19

basically when you aren’t feeling as burnt out after a workout regardless of intensity, just give it a month or two then switch, it isn’t a big deal I just would have liked learning the most important lifts before doing extra stuff. Skullcrushers are pretty simple just google it.

SLDL is a straight leg deadlift just keep your legs straight and pick up the weight. Don’t worry about preachers I do them because it’s available and enjoy them. They aren’t worth looking up unless you are really interested.

Make sure you eat enough because If I don’t I’m still sore by my second lower body day… and a sore ass when trying to squat deep isn’t fun.

BTW: a skullcrusher you lie on a bench and hold a barbell so that your hands are parralel with you’re shoulders.push the bar up like a bench press but instead of bringing it back downbench your elbows so the bar is a little bit above your forehead or you can do it a little behind your head if you’re afraid to “skullcrush” yourself.

Goodluck,
have fun

Zep.

20

Thanks Zep… I ain’t skeered!