[quote]Waittz wrote:
Sounds like you want to cheat sexually on your wife and are looking for others to tell you it’s ok.
It isn’t my business or anyone else’s to tell you what you should find to be right or wrong based on your own values, morals and ethics. Make your own decisions and accept the consequences because there will be for either the action or lack of(pun not intended). There will be consequences, and when they come you will face them alone, so make the decision in the same way.[/quote]
thanks for the discussion W -
let me paraphrase what I read “do whatever the fuck you’re going to do asshole”
[quote]on edge wrote:
Edgy, lets quit beating around the bush. Have you actually talked to your wife about this stuff? If so, what did the conversation go like? If not, why the hell not?
[/quote]
Yes, that’s my question, too, but phrased in 30 words or less. :)[/quote]
thanks Little Edgie, and Emmie -
the question is whether or not the mores should line up with what is either acceptable, or should be acceptable - so , no i have not discussed this with Mrs Edgy, this is a thought that has been bouncing around in my head for some time, and i would like your input on it~
intimacy is more than sex, sex is recreational, it is not ethereal.
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Sex is the foundation of intimacy. It is not recreational in a committed relationship. It’s serious fucking business (LOL). Just because it’s fun doesn’t mean there isn’t more to it than that.[/quote]
thanks Steelie - but have you not been intimate without having sex?
can you have intimacy with another man that does not result in a homosexual act?
sex and intimacy are two different things, imo~[/quote]
Yes, absolutely. Good point.
However, I’m not talking about intimacy between male friends. We’re talking about intimacy as it pertains to marriage; and no, I cannot have intimacy (in the common parlance sense of the word) in my marriage without an adequate amount and quality of sex. My wife essentially morphs into my business partner when our sex life slips (which is always my fault - seriously, no sarcasm intended). We still get along, and our marriage is still a functional entity, but the intimacy disappears. I suppose YMMV, though I know I’m not the only one that experiences this.
If you are unsatisfied in a relationship you always need to step back and evaluate that relationship. In opening the conversation about the relationship with the other person you will need to be prepared to listen to what the other party has to say and how it makes them feel especially if it is someone that you value in your life. You might also read the following blog posts.
I ye olden days apparently boy met girl, they fooled around a bit, then got married, kids, died.
It does not work like that anymore, there are emotional tampons that are used for intimacy and commitment but get no sex, there are sluts that get sex but no commitment…
It seems to to me that in a sexual marketplace that is utterly broken people who do not give a shit about other peoples feelings or never even consider that they might have feelings fare the best.
I hate “he who cares least wins” with a passion, but its true.
Now even if you had a contract in writing what is and is not permissible, who will hold the utter party accountable?
Again a case where the party that fires the first shot is the one that benefits.
People that still hold some mushy ideas about social conventions really only come in two varieties:
Ok Edgy… I put some time into my response after I erased the first scathing one.
First off I tell people to stay married! Yeah, that’s right me, the divorcee!
Secondly, I tell people to talk it out no matter what, who, or where. Fight if you have to, to come to a compromise, especially if you care deeply about the subject.
Then I learned to take a step back from my own wants and look though someone else’s eyes even if I disagree. This is where the “WE” comes to play.
Harder yet find a way to cool the temperature of the conversation when emotions run high. My current partner is a studly champion at this. He hugs me and tells me he loves me when we are fighting.
An affair will always be found out. Hiding, deceit, betrayal – these are the means to an end. If you are all hell bent on having one of these, what did you call it, “out sourcing?” you will ultimately cause all of the things to your family you wish to avoid with one other consequence – humiliation.
[quote]Edgy wrote:
in a relationship, if a man brings home his full paycheck, is involved in the family emotionally, takes care of all things expected, yet has a relationship on the side, is that to be considered cheating?
if a man spends his paycheck on gambling, drinking and hobbies, leaves his family destitute monetarily and emotionally, yet does not have relationships on the side, is that to be considered cheating?
i am having a hard time figuring this out.
nowhere in the marriage vows is there a reference to remaining sexually faithful, just love,honor,cherish, sickness and in health, death do us part kinda stuff.
the unspoken marriage contract, at least in the west, does expect fidelity, but is that how it is supposed to be? Historically, there were liberties given to both sides in a relationship, maybe it’s time revisit this experience?
anyway, i need your thoughts, cause i am either on to something here, or way off base, and discussing this relationship quandary with a bunch of weight lifting meat heads may clear this up.
Edgy, I’ve been on both sides of the dilemma you face. Have been in a near-sexless marriage that I valued for many reasons, and I have been cheated upon. I have never cheated myself.
During my marriage I thought about going outside of it for a fling, because I didn’t want to live the rest of my life without any sex and it had come to that point in the marriage. It was easy for me to justify it because the husband I would be cheating on had cheated on me, at least a couple of times (one distant past that I found out about when I told a friend that I’d found viagra in his travel bag).
Several things stopped me. One was the fear of having everything I cared about come crashing down if I accidentally fell in love. The other was that, setting aside my own moral issues with it, I couldn’t see wanting a man who would want me under those conditions.
I don’t know what to tell you except, talk to her. Tell her where you are, what you’re thinking. Shit, maybe she’d welcome you looking elsewhere, who knows. I think some women are relieved. I know my ex was happy not to have the pressure of my desire for intimacy, fidelity, and fiscal responsibility when we finally separated. Maybe he would have welcomed my taking a lover. (He actually wanted to bring another man in for a 3-way, but that’s revolting to me.) (I wonder sometimes if he’s going to someday come out as gay.) (But whatever. Not my problem now.) (lol)
the question is whether or not the mores should line up with what is either acceptable, or should be acceptable - so , no i have not discussed this with Mrs Edgy, this is a thought that has been bouncing around in my head for some time, and i would like your input on it~
srsly~[/quote]
I basically agree with the gist of what many others are saying. It boils down to being in agreement with your SO about what’s acceptable and what’s not. (With a disclaimer for rationality. If my wife told me it’s being unfaithful to even look at another chick, she would be out of luck on that one)
I think people need to be very careful when venturing outside their marriage even with permission. A guy might get some on the side with full consent of his wife, have no emotional attachment and not spend any family resources in the process. He might also bring home an STD or get the other girl pregnant. The guy might not get emotionally attached but the other girl might. The wife might have thought she wouldn’t get jealous but does. Friends, family, neighbors or coworkers might find out about it. It’s a huge can of worms with close to zero upside for a committed relationship. Never the less, if my wife gave me the green light I’d totally bang some hottie if I had the chance.