What is Charles Poliquin Talking About?

Training Bodybuilding
41

[quote]Professor X wrote:
That is one retarded way to look at anything on the planet, let alone PERSONAL TRAINERS. If you honestly believe that no one can judge these guys until they meet them in person, take notes and try everything they are selling, then I envision a very financially fucked up future for you.

People who think like this are notorious for being suckers. Weight lifting isn’t that damn complex and the guys who make it seem like it is do so because they know they can rope newbies into buying several hundred bucks worth of books and seminars.

It is funny though how few of the guys who search for info this way actually look impressive.
[/quote]

Of course you don’t fall for every gimmick on the market and waste your money on it. You pick and choose the best and learn from them. What’s this forums favourite qoute? Success leaves clues? Coaches give you clues.

But are you seriously going to tell me that paying money to listen to coaches of CP calibre talk about maximum strength training techniques that he learnt from the eastern europeans is a waste of money? Please.

The very reason why so many strength coaches, personal trainers or ANY PROFESSION are so bad at what they do is because they don’t invest in their education. They believe they can get everything they need to know from members on internet forums who have a training population of 1, themselves, and magazines you can buy at an airport.

Sorry X. I respect your enthusiasm, motivation and love of bodybuilding, but my version of retarded is thinking you know everything. The more you learn the the less you realise you know.

Do you take this attitude into your own profession? I hope not.

42

[quote]stockzy wrote:

But are you seriously going to tell me that paying money to listen to coaches of CP calibre talk about maximum strength training techniques that he learnt from the eastern europeans is a waste of money? Please.[/quote]

Yes. How the hell is any of that info going to help me? Why would I care about how Eastern Europeans train?

Bigger question…why are so many of you who DO care about shit like that so NOT impressively developed yourselves?

[quote]
Sorry X. I respect your enthusiasm, motivation and love of bodybuilding, but my version of retarded is thinking you know everything. The more you learn the the less you realise you know.

Do you take this attitude into your own profession? I hope not.[/quote]

I don’t think I know EVERYTHING. In fact, I know I do not even need to know EVERYTHING and that wasting my time worrying about EVERYTHING will only hold back my progress.

You have a choice in life. You can either become an expert in a few categories yourself (which usually leads to you becoming a PROFESSIONAL in some field yourself…or know just enough to get yourself in trouble about ALL categories.

43

[quote]morepain wrote:
Professor X wrote:
stockzy wrote:
When it comes to strength training Poliquin has no peer. (I said strength training)

Everything else he’s even.

But unless you’ve sat with a coach, any coach, and taken notes from them, AND THEN implemented their methods, only then will you ever truely understand what they’re on about. Then you can judge.

How much do you think these guys give away for free on the fucking internet? Just carrots to donkeys…

That is one retarded way to look at anything on the planet, let alone PERSONAL TRAINERS. If you honestly believe that no one can judge these guys until they meet them in person, take notes and try everything they are selling, then I envision a very financially fucked up future for you.

People who think like this are notorious for being suckers. Weight lifting isn’t that damn complex and the guys who make it seem like it is do so because they know they can rope newbies into buying several hundred bucks worth of books and seminars.

It is funny though how few of the guys who search for info this way actually look impressive.

golden…its not freaking rocket science…
[/quote]

Ok I think this is over simplifying it. Any jackass can get someone to a high level of preformance. It’s at a high level where CP and many many other coaches advice really becomes it’s most effective. I agree that few of the coaches who chose this route look impressive, but the best tend too.

44

[quote]Professor X wrote:
stockzy wrote:

But are you seriously going to tell me that paying money to listen to coaches of CP calibre talk about maximum strength training techniques that he learnt from the eastern europeans is a waste of money? Please.

Yes. How the hell is any of that info going to help me? Why would I care about how Eastern Europeans train?

Bigger question…why are so many of you who DO care about shit like that so NOT impressively developed yourselves?

Sorry X. I respect your enthusiasm, motivation and love of bodybuilding, but my version of retarded is thinking you know everything. The more you learn the the less you realise you know.

Do you take this attitude into your own profession? I hope not.

I don’t think I know EVERYTHING. In fact, I know I do not even need to know EVERYTHING and that wasting my time worrying about EVERYTHING will only hold back my progress.

You have a choice in life. You can either become an expert in a few categories yourself (which usually leads to you becoming a PROFESSIONAL in some field yourself…or know just enough to get yourself in trouble about ALL categories.
[/quote]

I’m pretty sure a real max strength training cycle would do you, and every other forum member who wants to put on muscle, some good every 4 to 6 months. What are the old dogs crying about? Where’s the camaradarie gone?

I weighed 55kg at the end of highschool and i now weigh just on 90kg with less bodyfat being 2 -4 abs showing. I’m shooting to be a 100kg in 12 months. I’ll be pretty impressed by then.

Considering i now train mostly athletes who need speed and power over short distances, my choice is to learn from coaches like CP. But he is one of many.

45

[quote]stockzy wrote:
Professor X wrote:
stockzy wrote:

But are you seriously going to tell me that paying money to listen to coaches of CP calibre talk about maximum strength training techniques that he learnt from the eastern europeans is a waste of money? Please.

Yes. How the hell is any of that info going to help me? Why would I care about how Eastern Europeans train?

Bigger question…why are so many of you who DO care about shit like that so NOT impressively developed yourselves?

Sorry X. I respect your enthusiasm, motivation and love of bodybuilding, but my version of retarded is thinking you know everything. The more you learn the the less you realise you know.

Do you take this attitude into your own profession? I hope not.

I don’t think I know EVERYTHING. In fact, I know I do not even need to know EVERYTHING and that wasting my time worrying about EVERYTHING will only hold back my progress.

You have a choice in life. You can either become an expert in a few categories yourself (which usually leads to you becoming a PROFESSIONAL in some field yourself…or know just enough to get yourself in trouble about ALL categories.

I’m pretty sure a real max strength training cycle would do you, and every other forum member who wants to put on muscle, some good every 4 to 6 months. What are the old dogs crying about? Where’s the camaradarie gone?

I weighed 55kg at the end of highschool and i now weigh just on 90kg with less bodyfat being 2 -4 abs showing. I’m shooting to be a 100kg in 12 months. I’ll be pretty impressed by then.

Considering i now train mostly athletes who need speed and power over short distances, my choice is to learn from coaches like CP. But he is one of many. [/quote]

I think you are missing the point. If X’s goals were to become a better athlete, then CP’s training advice would be more more relevant. While it may be true that bodybuilders can learn a thing or two from strength athletes and vice versa, it would be a waste of X’s time (or any bodybuilder) to pour through everything CP knows about eastern european strength training in order to learn that one or two little nuggets of useful information.

46

[quote]iwong wrote:
BONEZ217 wrote:
MytchBucanan wrote:
I remember Charles mentioning a Russian Olympic heavyweight wrestler who benched 540 for 8 reps. He supposedly did his reps with a four second negative and a two second pause. I’m sorry but that’s impossible.

Ronnie Coleman claimed his best was 500 for 8 and I’m sure that was a normal rep style.

Ronnie isn’t the be all end all when it comes to human strength. Sure he was strong as hell, but he didn’t train for strength/power specifically. I have no idea if that claim is accurate but using Ronnie as an example is poor.

I don’t think it’s that hard to beleive that someone who trains specifically for strength can do what was claimed.

A heavyweight wrestler doesn’t train specifically for strength either. But otherwise I agree that it is not necessarily an ideal comparison.[/quote]

Im saying that someone who DOES specifically train for stregth can probably do it.

47

[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:
iwong wrote:
BONEZ217 wrote:
MytchBucanan wrote:
I remember Charles mentioning a Russian Olympic heavyweight wrestler who benched 540 for 8 reps. He supposedly did his reps with a four second negative and a two second pause. I’m sorry but that’s impossible.

Ronnie Coleman claimed his best was 500 for 8 and I’m sure that was a normal rep style.

Ronnie isn’t the be all end all when it comes to human strength. Sure he was strong as hell, but he didn’t train for strength/power specifically. I have no idea if that claim is accurate but using Ronnie as an example is poor.

I don’t think it’s that hard to beleive that someone who trains specifically for strength can do what was claimed.

A heavyweight wrestler doesn’t train specifically for strength either. But otherwise I agree that it is not necessarily an ideal comparison.

Im saying that someone who DOES specifically train for stregth can probably do it. [/quote]

Hehe, I was just nitpicking.

48

I stopped listening to Koresh… um, I mean Charles Poliquin… a long time ago. The thing that drove me over the goddamn edge was when he wrote about a female client of his sporting thighs bigger than Platz’s and a Strongman client of his that has quads that make Ronnie Coleman’s look small.

49

[quote]BONEZ217 wrote:
MytchBucanan wrote:
I remember Charles mentioning a Russian Olympic heavyweight wrestler who benched 540 for 8 reps. He supposedly did his reps with a four second negative and a two second pause. I’m sorry but that’s impossible.

Ronnie Coleman claimed his best was 500 for 8 and I’m sure that was a normal rep style.

Ronnie isn’t the be all end all when it comes to human strength. Sure he was strong as hell, but he didn’t train for strength/power specifically. I have no idea if that claim is accurate but using Ronnie as an example is poor.

I don’t think it’s that hard to beleive that someone who trains specifically for strength can do what was claimed. [/quote]

Well Ronnie was a powerlifter and did those numbers several years back. He said his strength subsided more in recent years (he is in his 40’s after all). I remember reading how Ted Arcidi also got 8 reps with 500 lbs as a personal test once.

I think the straw that broke the camel’s back, so to speak, was not the added 40 lbs, but the superslow rep count. CP claimed this guy did it without a shirt or gear of any kind. I just found that too hard to believe.

50

Regarding my previous post: My friend did not want to give an opinion of the thought process involved in the myostatin gene statement.

So I don’t know.

51

Actually, do you think it might just be Poliquin’s way of saying that most of the Olympia competitors are using so much gear that there’s no point trying to look like them, while avoiding any fallout that would result from making such a statement.

52

[quote]Rational Gaze wrote:
Actually, do you think it might just be Poliquin’s way of saying that most of the Olympia competitors are using so much gear that there’s no point trying to look like them, while avoiding any fallout that would result from making such a statement.[/quote]

That would be an even dumber statement. More than 90% of the population has no chance in hell of looking like them whether they used steroids or not. Steroids in and of themselves are not why Ronnie Coleman is that much farther ahead of most people as he was bigger than most of the people on this site in HIGH SCHOOL.

Most of the newbies here all act like they are “hard gainers”, “ectomorphs” or skinny fat “FFB’s” with weak genetics…yet they then focus on steroid use as if THAT is why they are making no progress and why others are growing faster???

53

I was offering an interpretation of why he might have said it. Although, on further inspection, the article mentions “non-drugged athletes” in the paragraph above. Perhaps he does genuinely believe they’re myostatin deficient.

54

[quote]Bill Roberts wrote:
Regarding my previous post: My friend did not want to give an opinion of the thought process involved in the myostatin gene statement.

So I don’t know.[/quote]

I really hope you didn’t email who I think you emailed…

55

Professor X: for fuck sake you really are one vituporous prick! You act like a pure asshole in your responses; and yes, you do seem to have a HUGE ego. You seem to imply that if something isn’t impoprtant to you, why hell, why should it have any relevance to anyone’s life? You employ some of the poorest logic i’ve encountered in a long time, and seem to almost always miss the main point of someone’s post or do it purposely so as to have something to argue about (and “hear” yourself pontificate). You simply are one of the most disagreable members on this forum.

Let me use some of your logic in reverse: why is it that the large majority of those people who don’t spend their time seeking out knowledge and trying to learn all they can about training (strength or otherwise) look so damn unimpressive? Why is it that the one’s with the “it aint rocket science” attitude always seem to be the one’s that don’t know what the fuck they are doing in the gym?

You’re right, bodybuilding “aint rocket science”; but guess what, some coaches actually train athletes that have to apply that strength, power, explosiveness, etc. to an actual sport setting. I know, I know, how could that posibbly matter to ANYONE since it doesn’t matter to YOU?!

Crowbar

56

[quote]PonceDeLeon wrote:
Bill Roberts wrote:
Regarding my previous post: My friend did not want to give an opinion of the thought process involved in the myostatin gene statement.

So I don’t know.

I really hope you didn’t email who I think you emailed…[/quote]

I wouldn’t think you could have a reliable guess on that. It is not as if there is only a single person who knows him as well as I described. Or even only a single such person that I could have asked.

Anyway, it doesn’t matter. I had thought I could gain and share some insight on the question at hand – how that statement was likely derived and/or what the communication intent likely was – but not so.

I suppose that the ways of Poliquin – beyond the words of his statements themselves – are not for mere mortals to know :wink:

57

[quote]crowbar46 wrote:
Professor X: for fuck sake you really are one vituporous prick! You act like a pure asshole in your responses; and yes, you do seem to have a HUGE ego. You seem to imply that if something isn’t impoprtant to you, why hell, why should it have any relevance to anyone’s life? You employ some of the poorest logic i’ve encountered in a long time, and seem to almost always miss the main point of someone’s post or do it purposely so as to have something to argue about (and “hear” yourself pontificate). You simply are one of the most disagreable members on this forum.[/quote]

What forum are you posting in? I’m a prick because I know for sure I don’t need to waste my time worrying about Poliquin? How does that make sense to you? I know I don’t need to worry about Eastern European strength athletes because I know for sure what my personal goals are…which are more in line with what this forum is about than most of the posts in this thread.

Are there people logging into the strength sports forum trying to shoe-horn how Kevin Levrone trains into every single thread?

If not, then why the fuck do you jackasses do it here?

The statement this thread is about is ridiculous at best and a flat out lie at worst…so why the hell are you more pissed because I know I don’t need Poliquin instead of being pissed that Poliquin lies so damn much?

Interesting.

[quote]
Let me use some of your logic in reverse: why is it that the large majority of those people who don’t spend their time seeking out knowledge and trying to learn all they can about training (strength or otherwise) look so damn unimpressive? Why is it that the one’s with the “it aint rocket science” attitude always seem to be the one’s that don’t know what the fuck they are doing in the gym?

You’re right, bodybuilding “aint rocket science”; but guess what, some coaches actually train athletes that have to apply that strength, power, explosiveness, etc. to an actual sport setting. I know, I know, how could that posibbly matter to ANYONE since it doesn’t matter to YOU?!

Crowbar[/quote]

Gee, you amazingly intelligent poster, why would an athlete not interested in looking like a BODYBUILDER…be logging into the bodybuilding forum trying to force the conversations to revolve around issues NOT bodybuilding?

If I were worried about “strength training of European Athletes”, I would log into the STRENGTH SPORTS FORUM. Why is it you and those like you are having such a hard time with this concept?

58

All I’m saying is that, believe it or not, training techniques taken from those “other areas” (as if they are fucking foreign countries) can be applied with great success to bodybuilding; but it seems that you are very certain as to what does and does not apply= very closed minded.

I try to listen to ANYONE who has ideas that may improve my strength, power, explosiveness, muscle mass, etc.; and, yes, I’m primarily interested in bodybuilding. The problem seems, to me, to be that the majority of those in bodybuilding have walled themselves off too much from other areas. After all, I think the majority of those pursuing “bodybuilding” are not in it for PURELY asthetic reasons–they have other broader functional interests; this is especially true as one gets older.

I’m 48 y.o., 6’, 275 Lbs., yet I see other reasons to pursue bodybuilding other than pure asthetics.

Crowbar

59

[quote]crowbar46 wrote:
All I’m saying is that, believe it or not, training techniques taken from those “other areas” (as if they are fucking foreign countries) can be applied with great success to bodybuilding; but it seems that you are very certain as to what does and does not apply= very closed minded.
[/quote]

Closed minded? People who waste time trying to process too many conflicting views and opinions will hold themselves BACK. That is WHY the biggest guys in most gyms are often the ones LEAST worried about all of the crap many of the posters on this site occupy all of their time with. Those who made that much progress often seem to have a much more firm grasp of the basics instead of trying to leap over them.

What you mistakingly see as being “closed minded” is more often than not an ability to quickly distinguish what will help me reach my goal and what will not.

But hey, maybe you think you build arms over 20" by accident.

[quote]
I try to listen to ANYONE who has ideas that may improve my strength, power, explosiveness, muscle mass, etc.; and, yes, I’m primarily interested in bodybuilding. The problem seems, to me, to be that the majority of those in bodybuilding have walled themselves off too much from other areas. After all, I think the majority of those pursuing “bodybuilding” are not in it for PURELY asthetic reasons–they have other broader functional interests; this is especially true as one gets older.

I’m 48 y.o., 6’, 275 Lbs., yet I see other reasons to pursue bodybuilding other than pure asthetics.

Crowbar[/quote]

Good for you. What does your desire for those other reasons have to do with me or anyone else?

This is still a forum for bodybuilding training…which means it makes no sense for people like you to get upset because the topic remains on BODYBUILDING.

Your height and weight tell me nothing about body comp.

60

(never mind: it was a poor joke)