What Do You Think of This Picture?

Training Powerlifting
41

[quote]FightingScott wrote:
(1) What’s on the bar. I’m tired of seeing women get applauded for deadlifting 135. They’re human beings. A lot of times it seems like all this “girl power” bullshit goes too far and you end up seeing young women get a lot of praise for not really doing anything but show up. And that ends up being degrading.
[/quote]

Who are these people that are applauding women who aren’t moving a significant amount of weight?

It can’t be the general public because they’re too busy telling us that heavy weights will make us manly and that our callused hands are disgusting. And, it certainly isn’t the powerlifting community that I’m a part of. I mean, I’ve never heard any sort of girl power reference. When I PR, I hear “Good job. You sucked less than usual”.

To applaud mediocrity is absurd, but I do think that (aspiring) female strength athletes should be encouraged. Do you know how hard it is to call up a coach and tell him you want to compete in whatever strength sport?

Or maybe how scary walking into a gym, where some of the strongest men in the country train, for the first time?

I fell in love with lifting when I was in middle school, when my gym class got a little tour and explanation of the weight room. It took me about 6 years to get the courage to actually step foot in a gym and start lifting.

I wish there was someone there encouraging me when I was younger. Someone telling me that it was not only ok, but awesome that I was interested in lifting. But, I don’t know, maybe I was just too much of a wuss and cared too much about what others would think…

Oh, and considering that she’s BENCHED 140 at 80-some pounds, I highly doubt shes only squatting the bar. Dumbass.

42

[quote]buckeye girl wrote:
FightingScott wrote:
(1) What’s on the bar. I’m tired of seeing women get applauded for deadlifting 135. They’re human beings. A lot of times it seems like all this “girl power” bullshit goes too far and you end up seeing young women get a lot of praise for not really doing anything but show up. And that ends up being degrading.

Who are these people that are applauding women who aren’t moving a significant amount of weight?

It can’t be the general public because they’re too busy telling us that heavy weights will make us manly and that our callused hands are disgusting. And, it certainly isn’t the powerlifting community that I’m a part of. I mean, I’ve never heard any sort of girl power reference. When I PR, I hear “Good job. You sucked less than usual”.

To applaud mediocrity is absurd, but I do think that (aspiring) female strength athletes should be encouraged. Do you know how hard it is to call up a coach and tell him you want to compete in whatever strength sport?

Or maybe how scary walking into a gym, where some of the strongest men in the country train, for the first time?

I fell in love with lifting when I was in middle school, when my gym class got a little tour and explanation of the weight room. It took me about 6 years to get the courage to actually step foot in a gym and start lifting.

I wish there was someone there encouraging me when I was younger. Someone telling me that it was not only ok, but awesome that I was interested in lifting. But, I don’t know, maybe I was just too much of a wuss and cared too much about what others would think…

Oh, and considering that she’s BENCHED 140 at 80-some pounds, I highly doubt shes only squatting the bar. Dumbass.[/quote]

I think I’ve been misunderstood.

I see mediocrity being applauded everywhere. Maybe it’s just not happening in powerlifting. But go to any High School Track Meet where the fat girls AND the fat guys are competing, and I think you’ll understand what I’m getting at.

Maybe this kind of crap doesn’t exist in powerlifting. I don’t know. But applauding mediocrity is pretty prevalent anywhere you look in America where kids under the age of 18 are involved.

Weak girls who go through the motions of making a 10 foot effort in the shot put are applauded because dumbasses underestimate what levels of physical strength they’re capable of. Fat, weak guys get patted on the back for being big and strong just because they take up a lot of space and signed up for the football team.

The “girl power bullshit” I was referring to is the exceedingly low expectations I see for girls in athletics around the country. Again, I’m getting the feeling it probably doesn’t exist in powerlifitng. But women’s lacrosse comes to mind. Sorry, but that sport seems like a joke to me - you can’t steal the ball from anyone?

It just seems to me like there are a lot of over-supportive coaches and soccer mom types out there who are way too quick to yell “Yay! Good for you!” when female athletes do anything at all because the ones doing the cheering have such low expectations of what women are capable of. And that sucks.

You’ll really understand what I’m getting at if you ever watch one of the MTV Made Episodes where it’s pretty obvious that the kid in the show has failed miserably.

I had no idea who this girl was. What I meant to say in my post was:

IF she’s moving serious weight and pushing herself, that’s cool. An 80lb girl (EDIT: An 80lb Person of any age) Squatting 180lbs is cool in the same way that a 242 Greg Panora Squatting 1050 is cool.

IF she’s just squatting the bar, that’s a joke. Just because she’s a child and a girl doesn’t mean that showing up to Squat a bar is an accomplishment. Expect more from her!

BUT I DIDN’T KNOW WHICH WAS THE CASE

I thought that was pretty clear. Is the picture a picture of someone working hard or someone going through the motions? Judging by the pic alone, I can’t tell.

43

[quote]johnnytang24 wrote:
Look up the rules before you make a fool out of yourself[/quote]

I was being facetious (which should have been obvious, it’s not the sort of thing judges miss). But while we’re on the topic, did you realise that many feds don’t allow the heels to come off the ground?

44

[quote]eic wrote:
lucio wrote:
Am I mistaken in remembering Mark Rippetoe writing that there is no correlation between weightlifting (with good form) and height? If I remember correctly weightlifting, even with prepubescents will not stunt growth, how tall one becomes is based purely on ones genetics. Another weightlifting myth… just like how squatting is bad for your knees?

I think Rip did say something like that, but this is not so clear IMO. One of the points of weight training is that it will promote increased bone density along the axial lines of stress. But premature increases in bone density may not be ideal in a person who is not yet fully grown.

I don’t know for sure, but why chance it? IMO, kids at that age should be running around playing tag, swinging from monkey bars, not attempting max singles in a limited ROM.

Besides, aren’t you possibly setting your kid up for major burn out when they are already training for a sport at that age?

Maybe my feelings would be different if it looked like she was having fun in the picture I saw. As is, it kind of makes me think she’s the Jean Benet of weight training. [/quote]

There is nothing wrong with lifting when young or increased bone density. Nothing lifting can do is as bad for a kid as living a sedentary life eating junk or being skinny/scrawny or otherwise malnourished.

Having said that, injuries and imbalances must be avoided, and too much focus on weights might not be ideal when they should be doing a whole range of activities.

Swinging on monkey bars IS a max effort for kids - but they quickly get stronger until they can do it a lot. Incidentally, a newborn baby can pull itself up with one arm - we are little monkeys!

If you are going to compete at a high level in sport in this day and age, you really gotta start training at 3 years old. That goes for sports and pretty much everything else.

Those wraps look a bit dumb though.

45

[quote]FightingScott wrote:
buckeye girl wrote:
FightingScott wrote:
(1) What’s on the bar. I’m tired of seeing women get applauded for deadlifting 135. They’re human beings. A lot of times it seems like all this “girl power” bullshit goes too far and you end up seeing young women get a lot of praise for not really doing anything but show up. And that ends up being degrading.

Who are these people that are applauding women who aren’t moving a significant amount of weight?

It can’t be the general public because they’re too busy telling us that heavy weights will make us manly and that our callused hands are disgusting. And, it certainly isn’t the powerlifting community that I’m a part of. I mean, I’ve never heard any sort of girl power reference. When I PR, I hear “Good job. You sucked less than usual”.

To applaud mediocrity is absurd, but I do think that (aspiring) female strength athletes should be encouraged. Do you know how hard it is to call up a coach and tell him you want to compete in whatever strength sport?

Or maybe how scary walking into a gym, where some of the strongest men in the country train, for the first time?

I fell in love with lifting when I was in middle school, when my gym class got a little tour and explanation of the weight room. It took me about 6 years to get the courage to actually step foot in a gym and start lifting.

I wish there was someone there encouraging me when I was younger. Someone telling me that it was not only ok, but awesome that I was interested in lifting. But, I don’t know, maybe I was just too much of a wuss and cared too much about what others would think…

Oh, and considering that she’s BENCHED 140 at 80-some pounds, I highly doubt shes only squatting the bar. Dumbass.

I think I’ve been misunderstood.

I see mediocrity being applauded everywhere. Maybe it’s just not happening in powerlifting. But go to any High School Track Meet where the fat girls AND the fat guys are competing, and I think you’ll understand what I’m getting at.

Maybe this kind of crap doesn’t exist in powerlifting. I don’t know. But applauding mediocrity is pretty prevalent anywhere you look in America where kids under the age of 18 are involved.

Weak girls who go through the motions of making a 10 foot effort in the shot put are applauded because dumbasses underestimate what levels of physical strength they’re capable of. Fat, weak guys get patted on the back for being big and strong just because they take up a lot of space and signed up for the football team.

The “girl power bullshit” I was referring to is the exceedingly low expectations I see for girls in athletics around the country. Again, I’m getting the feeling it probably doesn’t exist in powerlifitng. But women’s lacrosse comes to mind. Sorry, but that sport seems like a joke to me - you can’t steal the ball from anyone?

It just seems to me like there are a lot of over-supportive coaches and soccer mom types out there who are way too quick to yell “Yay! Good for you!” when female athletes do anything at all because the ones doing the cheering have such low expectations of what women are capable of. And that sucks.

You’ll really understand what I’m getting at if you ever watch one of the MTV Made Episodes where it’s pretty obvious that the kid in the show has failed miserably.

I had no idea who this girl was. What I meant to say in my post was:

IF she’s moving serious weight and pushing herself, that’s cool. An 80lb girl (EDIT: An 80lb Person of any age) Squatting 180lbs is cool in the same way that a 242 Greg Panora Squatting 1050 is cool.

IF she’s just squatting the bar, that’s a joke. Just because she’s a child and a girl doesn’t mean that showing up to Squat a bar is an accomplishment. Expect more from her!

BUT I DIDN’T KNOW WHICH WAS THE CASE

I thought that was pretty clear. Is the picture a picture of someone working hard or someone going through the motions? Judging by the pic alone, I can’t tell.

[/quote]

I didn’t realize that you were talking about women’s lacross and high school track in a thread about a female POWERLIFTER.

The bench video alone should have been a pretty good indicatior of what kind of weight she was moving.

46

[quote]buckeye girl wrote:
I didn’t realize that you were talking about women’s lacross and high school track in a thread about a female POWERLIFTER.

The bench video alone should have been a pretty good indicatior of what kind of weight she was moving.[/quote]

All I saw was the picture. I believe the girls strong but you can’t tell that from nothing but a picture where the plates are cropped out. Sorry I didn’t watch the video. Geeze.

Even after I made the post saying I can’t tell if the girl is strong or not, I followed it up by saying something to the effect of “Whoa, she competed in the WPO. Scratch what I said about the possibility of here being weak.”

I feel like you’re hell-bent on believing I’m a misogynistic asshole and you’d rather misinterpret my posts and make me out to be a huge tool.

I wasn’t talking about sports other than powerlifting in my first post. You asked who the people were that were applauding mediocrity. I tried to give an example of how such a thing was possible even if it is stupid.

Originally I was just trying to say I hope this picture is a case of someone whose trained to be under the bar and not someone just going through the motions. I was ignorant as to who this girl was or the fact that she competed in the WPO. All I had to go by was looking at the picture. And from the picture you can’t tell if the girls’ a freak or if she’s an overpraised, mediocre athlete.

What do I get from looking at just the picture? It’s not a very informative picture. That’s what I get.

What’s you’re beef with what I’ve said?

47

[quote]eic wrote:
power_bulker wrote:
elano wrote:
She didn’t look very happy in that pic did she.

I’ve never really seen people smiling while attempting a max lift. :slight_smile:

Yeah, but she doesn’t look like she’s grimacing with effort, clinching teeth, etc. She looks like she’s frowning and going through the motions. The more I look at it, the more disgusting it is. [/quote]

The more I read your post, the more digusting it is. Sounds like you are going through the motions of being a douche.

48

I saw an 11 year old girl pull double bodyweight at the state fair meet a couple years ago. I thought that was cool and I think this is cool.

As far as getting hurt/stunting growth… isn’t that what kids do? Go into a commercial weight room and ask how many of the young guys have jacked up ankles, knees, backs and shoulders and then ask how many are powerlifters. There will be many of the former and few of the latter.

I don’t understand why the immense forces involved in jumping, running, landing and playing are okay but the forces in lifting a weight are bad. Our bones are built for compression after all, it’s bending that does them in.

49

[quote]buckeye girl wrote:

Oh, and considering that she’s BENCHED 140 at 80-some pounds, I highly doubt shes only squatting the bar. Dumbass.[/quote]

There is no way an 80lb 13 year old girl is going to be able to squat more than 100 pounds. That is unless you throw a bunch of gear on her to do most of the lifting.

[quote]buckeye girl wrote:

The bench video alone should have been a pretty good indicatior of what kind of weight she was moving.[/quote]

I bet she can barely bench the bar without all that gear on.

BTW whoever said a 135 deadlift was crappy for a girl, go find some girls on the street and see if they can pull 135. I bet none of them can budge it unless they’ve trained the deadlift for at least a few months or have done some serious manual labor prior to the lift.

50

I think she’s absolutely adorable. Throw in the fact that she’s actually doing something active instead of eating pizza and watching cartoons all day… and from the looks of it, loving what she does… and I don’t see a problem.

In that picture, she’s squatting 2x25kg plates.

51

[quote]elano wrote:
That is unless you throw a bunch of gear on her to do most of the lifting.[/quote]

Oh boy, this could get interesting…

52

[quote]DragnCarry wrote:
elano wrote:
That is unless you throw a bunch of gear on her to do most of the lifting.

Oh boy, this could get interesting…[/quote]

I think we can all agree that a person geared up can lift significantly more weight that if they were lifting raw. I dunno why you are expecting people to get all ralled up.

If the gear only adds 100 pounds to the bar and she lifts 180, then the gear has done most of the lifting. A 1xBW raw squat is still pretty good for a 13 year old girl.

53

[quote]elano wrote:
buckeye girl wrote:

Oh, and considering that she’s BENCHED 140 at 80-some pounds, I highly doubt shes only squatting the bar. Dumbass.

There is no way an 80lb 13 year old girl is going to be able to squat more than 100 pounds. That is unless you throw a bunch of gear on her to do most of the lifting.

buckeye girl wrote:

The bench video alone should have been a pretty good indicatior of what kind of weight she was moving.

I bet she can barely bench the bar without all that gear on.

BTW whoever said a 135 deadlift was crappy for a girl, go find some girls on the street and see if they can pull 135. I bet none of them can budge it unless they’ve trained the deadlift for at least a few months or have done some serious manual labor prior to the lift.[/quote]

135 IS a joke. This is like that big hoopla while back about how a 315 deadlift isn’t good for a male. Well, a 135 deadlift isn’t good for a female. It sucks.

That 11yo 80 pound girl I mentioned above pulled 160, raw dog. Both of the girls we took to NASA Nationals in October pulled 112.5 kg (248 pounds) in singlets and had only done full deadlifts from the floor once or twice before the meet. They’d only been training with us at all for a couple months. If we could get them training a little more consistently they’d be pulling around 300.

I think most people are clueless. They got some idea in their head of how much weight is “a lot” and never shake it. This is why they stay weak.

54

[quote]elano wrote:
I think we can all agree that a person geared up can lift significantly more weight that if they were lifting raw. [/quote]

No argument there.

[quote]
If the gear only adds 100 pounds to the bar and she lifts 180, then the gear has done most of the lifting.[/quote]

You’re not going to make depth with gear that will give you 100lb carry-over if you’re only lifting 180lb. It doesn’t work that way.

55

Yeah okay lets see these girls who pull 248# having only deadlifted once or twice.

56

[quote]DragnCarry wrote:

You’re not going to make depth with gear that will give you 100lb carry-over if you’re only lifting 180lb. It doesn’t work that way.

[/quote]

I dunno, I’ve never used the stuff. Just saying she wouldn’t have near as impressive #s without the gear.

57

[quote]conorh wrote:

I think most people are clueless. They got some idea in their head of how much weight is “a lot” and never shake it. This is why they stay weak.
[/quote]

I doubt that’s the major reason why most people stay weak. For most people “a lot” of weight means more that they can personally lift. It’s relative. Did you think that a 225 bench was “a lot” when your max was 135? Did you think that a 405 bench was “a lot” when you could bench 225? If you can deadlift 500lbs, of course your idea of “a lot” of weight is going to be different than somebody who can’t even pull 135.

58

[quote]elano wrote:
conorh wrote:

I think most people are clueless. They got some idea in their head of how much weight is “a lot” and never shake it. This is why they stay weak.

I doubt that’s the major reason why most people stay weak. For most people “a lot” of weight means more that they can personally lift. It’s relative. Did you think that a 225 bench was “a lot” when your max was 135? Did you think that a 405 bench was “a lot” when you could bench 225? If you can deadlift 500lbs, of course your idea of “a lot” of weight is going to be different than somebody who can’t even pull 135.[/quote]

That was my whole point. We should just get the entire idea of “a lot” out of our heads.

I wish the girls had let us photograph them at the meet (first time female lifters in singlets = Conor wasn’t allowed near with a camera); they are not large ladies.

I am probably hyjacking and didn’t need to insert my agenda into this thread, my post just reflects something I’ve noticed on these boards and in our gym lately. People are just amazed if anyone lifts any remotely heavy weight and subsequently put out no effort. When I try to point out that a certain number or another isn’t that great (sucks) I am vilified.

Phil Kramer, 581 deadlift at 181 - “Anyone can have a big deadlift if they would just lift their sack up and do it.”

59

Personally it’s “odd” but its no different than getting your kid into gymnastics into an early age and (especially girls) seeing them wreck their bodies often times. Only difference this isn’t foofy and “girly”. She’s causing no more damage to her body than if she did gymnastics so if she likes doing it… go for it girl, crush the weight and crush all your naysayers.

60

[quote]FightingScott wrote:
buckeye girl wrote:
I didn’t realize that you were talking about women’s lacross and high school track in a thread about a female POWERLIFTER.

The bench video alone should have been a pretty good indicatior of what kind of weight she was moving.

All I saw was the picture. I believe the girls strong but you can’t tell that from nothing but a picture where the plates are cropped out. Sorry I didn’t watch the video. Geeze.

Even after I made the post saying I can’t tell if the girl is strong or not, I followed it up by saying something to the effect of “Whoa, she competed in the WPO. Scratch what I said about the possibility of here being weak.”

I feel like you’re hell-bent on believing I’m a misogynistic asshole and you’d rather misinterpret my posts and make me out to be a huge tool.

I wasn’t talking about sports other than powerlifting in my first post. You asked who the people were that were applauding mediocrity. I tried to give an example of how such a thing was possible even if it is stupid.

Originally I was just trying to say I hope this picture is a case of someone whose trained to be under the bar and not someone just going through the motions. I was ignorant as to who this girl was or the fact that she competed in the WPO. All I had to go by was looking at the picture. And from the picture you can’t tell if the girls’ a freak or if she’s an overpraised, mediocre athlete.

What do I get from looking at just the picture? It’s not a very informative picture. That’s what I get.

What’s you’re beef with what I’ve said? [/quote]

My point was that I don’t see mediocrity being applauded in powerlifting.

My beef is that you paid any attention at all to the posts with videos of her lifting, or even the title of the album, you would have known how stupid it would have been to suggest that she’s being praised for being a mediocre athlete.