Weird Night

sluicy · September 14, 2008, 11:22pm

[quote]EmilyQ wrote:

But if I easily pushed her down and then my 6’ tall husband followed her to the ground to beat the shit out of her because he just WANTED to? I don’t think I would ever be able to respect him enough to have sex with him again.

[/quote]

I’ve been trying to think of how to say this as politely as you did. If my husband did the same thing I would be horrified and completely lose any and all respect for him. Which is why I know he never would do something like that… which is why he’s my husband.

There are two issues:

She’s an inflammatory, drunk, irresponsible neighbor. Wrong.
You want to take advantage of a weaker, chemically influenced woman. Wrong.

Sorry to be totally cliche, but two wrongs don’t settle anything. All it results in is a drunk girl getting beat up by a hotheaded guy. Wow. What does that accomplish?

EmilyQ · September 14, 2008, 11:27pm

[quote]sluicy wrote:
EmilyQ wrote:

The problem with trying to help someone as a friend is that you can’t be direct and honest the way a therapist can. “This is strikingly similar to what you told me last week. Do you see a pattern?” is not something a friend can say.

Nor is “Tell me what it was like for you as a child. Did your mom and dad get along when you were little?” There are social rules that get in the way. Also, the power imbalance is impossible in a friendship.

Hmmm… so how do you retain a power balance and still try and affect the person’s thinking? I would be sure that the other person’s self esteem would have a lot to do with it.

With this girl, I’ve been fairly direct with her before, and she’s been very open to my opinions and has come to me for advice in personal situations.

I don’t feel that it has affected our relationship negatively at all. But perhaps it may limit it in the future? I know we’ll never be really great friends, but we do enjoy each other’s company.[/quote]

I don’t necessarily think you can’t be friends. I was replying more to Gabby’s post saying she’s too messed up, it’s too late. I think he’s probably right that you can’t change her long-established patterns because you can either be her friend or her therapist, but not both. But being a friend and a role model is worth a lot.

When she’s ready to change, she’ll have a good idea of what kind of person she might want to be (someone like you).

What would be ideal is if she had both a high-functioning friend (you) and a therapist (encourage her to check with your local women’s shelter or community mental health center if money is an issue).

EmilyQ · September 14, 2008, 11:31pm

[quote]sluicy wrote:
If my husband did the same thing I would be horrified and completely lose any and all respect for him. Which is why I know he never would do something like that… which is why he’s my husband.
[/quote]

Exactly.

imhungry · September 14, 2008, 11:31pm

[quote]EmilyQ wrote:
SouthernGypsy wrote:
EmilyQ wrote:

Vicomte, I agree. There’s no justification for expressing regret that you didn’t get to beat the fuck out of a severely compromised young girl.

Would you have pity on someone who burst through your door in the middle of the night trying to grab your significant other?

No, but you seem to be confusing the management of a crisis situation with the regretful reflection afterward that it would have been really nice to have had the fun of beating up a drunk girl without having to worry about getting arrested.

Even better if she’s under 18, because how often do you have a chance to beat the fuck out of one of those??

One of the things I love about my husband is that I know he would put himself in harm’s way in order to protect me. That’s really sexy to me, and I deeply value that most men will behave that way.

I also really like that my husband is both strong enough and competent enough as a fighter to defend me. If a violent drunk forced her way into my home I would expect him to do whatever was necessary to keep us safe.

But if I easily pushed her down and then my 6’ tall husband followed her to the ground to beat the shit out of her because he just WANTED to? I don’t think I would ever be able to respect him enough to have sex with him again.

SouthernGypsy, would YOU beat up a young girl who was already down?[/quote]

Emily, I agree with you, totally. I would think that nobody would disagree with you on this, nor do think that you’d disagree with the use of greater force if necessary, correct? Such as if the girl had a weapon, or overpowered his girlfriend, for example.

EmilyQ · September 14, 2008, 11:46pm

[quote]imhungry wrote:

Emily, I agree with you, totally. I would think that nobody would disagree with you on this, nor do think that you’d disagree with the use of greater force if necessary, correct? Such as if the girl had a weapon, or overpowered his girlfriend, for example.[/quote]

Correct.

zephead4747 · September 14, 2008, 11:58pm

[quote]EmilyQ wrote:
imhungry wrote:

Emily, I agree with you, totally. I would think that nobody would disagree with you on this, nor do think that you’d disagree with the use of greater force if necessary, correct? Such as if the girl had a weapon, or overpowered his girlfriend, for example.

Correct. [/quote]

She may of had a gun in her pocket. The point being you justnever know. If you enter someone house uninvited, you’re asking for a death sentance.

I’m glad no one was hurt, but if he had hurt her I sure as hell wouldn’t damn him for it. Anyone forcing entrance is asking for a whipping or death.

Being soft prevents people from learnign from their mistake. If she had gotten her ass kicked she probably would think twice before getting shitfaced and trying to force an entrance.

imhungry · September 14, 2008, 11:59pm

[quote]EmilyQ wrote:
imhungry wrote:

Emily, I agree with you, totally. I would think that nobody would disagree with you on this, nor do think that you’d disagree with the use of greater force if necessary, correct? Such as if the girl had a weapon, or overpowered his girlfriend, for example.

Correct. [/quote]

It just looked to me that there’s too many people letting their emotions get the best of them.

Hitting a woman for no real reason is WRONG, unless it’s in self defense, and necessary. If either me, or my girlfriend is being attacked, the girl is going down and the cops are being called. I will do whatever I need to do to make her stop, period.

But, if she doesn’t pose any real threat, then fine. I’m not going to hit her, just because she f’ed with someone I love, and woke me the f-ck up out of a sound sleep.

I sure as hell would think about it, though.

In the OP’s case, everyone involved did the right thing.

dk44 · September 15, 2008, 12:04am

[quote]zephead4747 wrote:
EmilyQ wrote:
imhungry wrote:

Emily, I agree with you, totally. I would think that nobody would disagree with you on this, nor do think that you’d disagree with the use of greater force if necessary, correct? Such as if the girl had a weapon, or overpowered his girlfriend, for example.

Correct.

She may of had a gun in her pocket. The point being you justnever know. If you enter someone house uninvited, you’re asking for a death sentance.

I’m glad no one was hurt, but if he had hurt her I sure as hell wouldn’t damn him for it. Anyone forcing entrance is asking for a whipping or death.

Being soft prevents people from learnign from their mistake. If she had gotten her ass kicked she probably would think twice before getting shitfaced and trying to force an entrance.[/quote]

Zep, I love you, you make me believe in the future. If I was a dog I would hump your leg.

imhungry · September 15, 2008, 12:21am

[quote]dk44 wrote:
zephead4747 wrote:
EmilyQ wrote:
imhungry wrote:

Emily, I agree with you, totally. I would think that nobody would disagree with you on this, nor do think that you’d disagree with the use of greater force if necessary, correct? Such as if the girl had a weapon, or overpowered his girlfriend, for example.

Correct.

She may of had a gun in her pocket. The point being you justnever know. If you enter someone house uninvited, you’re asking for a death sentance.

I’m glad no one was hurt, but if he had hurt her I sure as hell wouldn’t damn him for it. Anyone forcing entrance is asking for a whipping or death.

Being soft prevents people from learnign from their mistake. If she had gotten her ass kicked she probably would think twice before getting shitfaced and trying to force an entrance.

Zep, I love you, you make me believe in the future. If I was a dog I would hump your leg. [/quote]

Woulda, coulda, shoulda, doesn’t matter.

I’m not hitting some young, drunk chick, AFTER she’s already down. I’m not going to be proactive in beating someone’s ass, “for just in case”.

zephead4747 · September 15, 2008, 12:36am

[quote]imhungry wrote:
dk44 wrote:
zephead4747 wrote:
EmilyQ wrote:
imhungry wrote:

Emily, I agree with you, totally. I would think that nobody would disagree with you on this, nor do think that you’d disagree with the use of greater force if necessary, correct? Such as if the girl had a weapon, or overpowered his girlfriend, for example.

Correct.

She may of had a gun in her pocket. The point being you justnever know. If you enter someone house uninvited, you’re asking for a death sentance.

I’m glad no one was hurt, but if he had hurt her I sure as hell wouldn’t damn him for it. Anyone forcing entrance is asking for a whipping or death.

Being soft prevents people from learnign from their mistake. If she had gotten her ass kicked she probably would think twice before getting shitfaced and trying to force an entrance.

Zep, I love you, you make me believe in the future. If I was a dog I would hump your leg.

Woulda, coulda, shoulda, doesn’t matter.

I’m not hitting some young, drunk chick, AFTER she’s already down. I’m not going to be proactive in beating someone’s ass, “for just in case”. [/quote]

Then don’t. If you even walk into someone’s house uninvited don’t be suprised when you’re looking down the barrel of a 12 gauge.

Personally? After she hit the floor I would of held her down and had the girlfriend call the police.

Vicomte · September 15, 2008, 12:38am

[quote]zephead4747 wrote:
EmilyQ wrote:
imhungry wrote:

Emily, I agree with you, totally. I would think that nobody would disagree with you on this, nor do think that you’d disagree with the use of greater force if necessary, correct? Such as if the girl had a weapon, or overpowered his girlfriend, for example.

Correct.

She may of had a gun in her pocket. The point being you justnever know. If you enter someone house uninvited, you’re asking for a death sentance.

I’m glad no one was hurt, but if he had hurt her I sure as hell wouldn’t damn him for it. Anyone forcing entrance is asking for a whipping or death.

Being soft prevents people from learnign from their mistake. If she had gotten her ass kicked she probably would think twice before getting shitfaced and trying to force an entrance.[/quote]

I hate when people play ‘worst case scenario’, it’s silly. The Muslim guy on the plane could be loaded up with explosives, as well, you know…

The whole point of my argument is that this girl posed no reasonable threat to anyone there. Use your brains. I would have no problem busting up a woman if she invaded my house and I felt reasonably threatened, but that is not the case here.

There’s nothing ‘soft’ or ‘hippie’ about having the self-control and discipline to not do something stupid just because it makes you feel like the conquering hero. One cannot say that anyone invading their home at any time in any situation warrants their utter physical destruction. That’s crazy.

If I was walking down the street, and I saw a hundred-pound
rottweiler running at me snarling and ready to pounce, I would beat the fuck out of it, certainly, with a big ol’ stick and a song in my heart.

If it was a twelve-pound schnauzer, I’d restrain it with my foot and be annoyed at the inconvenience, not bash its skull in. Sure, the schnauzer might have rabies, or be carrying a loaded pistol, but still, I would observe and act accordingly.

You know, hippie shit.

zephead4747 · September 15, 2008, 12:41am

[quote]Vicomte wrote:
zephead4747 wrote:
EmilyQ wrote:
imhungry wrote:

Emily, I agree with you, totally. I would think that nobody would disagree with you on this, nor do think that you’d disagree with the use of greater force if necessary, correct? Such as if the girl had a weapon, or overpowered his girlfriend, for example.

Correct.

She may of had a gun in her pocket. The point being you justnever know. If you enter someone house uninvited, you’re asking for a death sentance.

I’m glad no one was hurt, but if he had hurt her I sure as hell wouldn’t damn him for it. Anyone forcing entrance is asking for a whipping or death.

Being soft prevents people from learnign from their mistake. If she had gotten her ass kicked she probably would think twice before getting shitfaced and trying to force an entrance.

I hate when people play ‘worst case scenario’, it’s silly. The Muslim guy on the plane could be loaded up with explosives, as well, you know…

The whole point of my argument is that this girl posed no reasonable threat to anyone there. Use your brains. I would have no problem busting up a woman if she invaded my house and I felt reasonably threatened, but that is not the case here.

There’s nothing ‘soft’ or ‘hippie’ about having the self-control and discipline to not do something stupid just because it makes you feel like the conquering hero. One cannot say that anyone invading their home at any time in any situation warrants their utter physical destruction. That’s crazy.

If I was walking down the street, and I saw a hundred-pound

rottweiler running at me snarling and ready to pounce, I would beat the fuck out of it, certainly, with a big ol’ stick and a song in my heart. If it was a twelve-pound schnauzer, I’d restrain it with my foot and be annoyed at the inconvenience, not bash its skull in.

Sure, the schnauzer might have rabies, or be carrying a loaded pistol, but still, I would observe and act accordingly.

You know, hippie shit.[/quote]

The hell are you talking about. You’d be singing a different tune if this was some addict looking to rob their appt.

Your muslim coorelation is terrible. Average joe muslim isn’t hurting anyone. Avg drunk home invading jane very possibly might.

imhungry · September 15, 2008, 12:46am

[quote]zephead4747 wrote:
imhungry wrote:
dk44 wrote:
zephead4747 wrote:
EmilyQ wrote:
imhungry wrote:

Emily, I agree with you, totally. I would think that nobody would disagree with you on this, nor do think that you’d disagree with the use of greater force if necessary, correct? Such as if the girl had a weapon, or overpowered his girlfriend, for example.

Correct.

She may of had a gun in her pocket. The point being you justnever know. If you enter someone house uninvited, you’re asking for a death sentance.

I’m glad no one was hurt, but if he had hurt her I sure as hell wouldn’t damn him for it. Anyone forcing entrance is asking for a whipping or death.

Being soft prevents people from learnign from their mistake. If she had gotten her ass kicked she probably would think twice before getting shitfaced and trying to force an entrance.

Zep, I love you, you make me believe in the future. If I was a dog I would hump your leg.

Woulda, coulda, shoulda, doesn’t matter.

I’m not hitting some young, drunk chick, AFTER she’s already down. I’m not going to be proactive in beating someone’s ass, “for just in case”.

Then don’t. If you even walk into someone’s house uninvited don’t be suprised when you’re looking down the barrel of a 12 gauge.

Personally? After she hit the floor I would of held her down and had the girlfriend call the police.[/quote]

I agree with if someone comes into my house uninvited, then there’d be repercussions. But this is after the fact. And yes, I’d hold her down and call the cops.

Vicomte · September 15, 2008, 12:52am

[quote]zephead4747 wrote:
Vicomte wrote:
zephead4747 wrote:
EmilyQ wrote:
imhungry wrote: