Vonko1988 TRT Log

My only complain now is to fix this early wake up otherwise I feel awesome, I even feel awesome underslept :smiley:

Vonko, when ā€˜foreign’ proteins are injected into the body, it triggers an immune reaction. When for example you get vaccinated, the vaccine (can be proteins of a virus or a pathogenic bacteria) then your body reacts by generating antibodies against this ā€˜invader’ - this is how our immune system works. Vaccines are injected for example multiple times, because the more often you inject a pathogen into the system, the stronger and longer the immune reaction will be.

Unfortunately this reaction can not only happen to ā€˜foreign’ proteins, but also against the bodies own proteins - thats than called an autoimmune disease. In Hashimotos disease for example the body generated anti TPO antibodies, which in turn can be used to diagnose the disease. In diabetes type I the body forms auto antibodies against the betal islet cells which are responsible for generation of insulin in your pancreas.

Now hCG is kind of a thing in between. Its not really foreign because you body expresses very very tiny amounts of it - so typically your body accepts it as ā€˜one of its own’. Thats why typically you are not forming auto antibodies against the injected hCG - not like in the case of a vaccine.
HOWEVER, it can happen, that due to whatever reason (could be very very low levels of impurities in the product) all of a sudden your body turns against the injected hCG.
Something like this can happen with basically every protein; it can happen for example with injected erythropoetin (also a ā€˜natural’ protein of the body) which is a very very bad thing because the people can actually die from anemia and its a difficult disease to treat.
It can also happen with injected hCG, which is less dramatic because even if your body creating these auto hCG antibodies (anti drug antibodies) you are not going to die - because you essentially dont need it (not in a sense of good or bad for TRT, but in a sense of surviving).
The basic idea in cycling is that you lower the probability that such an immune reaction is triggered against the hCG. This idea comes mostly from former time when the hCG wasnt as pure and as controlled as it is today. But especially with underground hCG this can still happen.

Long story short, its outdated due to the high quality standard of todays hCG.

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So basically it can happen but the chance is relatively low provided I use pharmaceutic product?

Yes exactly

Some new developments in my sleeping issues.
10-12 days ago I changed my injection time of the sustanon - instead of morning that I’ve been always doing since I started TRT, I started doing it 17.30-18.00
3-4 days after that the early morning wake ups stopped, but I also started to feel off - lower energy and decreased mood and well being.
The last 3 days my well being is back, but I started to wake up again 5.30 - 6 AM with rush of energy and feeling hot.

Seems something was disturbed by the change of injection time and back in place.

The question is what next steps I can take to fix this issue with sleep? Until end of the week will arrive L-Theanine and Magnesium Glycinate I have ordered.

If these dont solve it I will need to switch to enanthate. I will ask again what is the chance the short esters in the sustanon cause the cortisol spike early morning and why they disappeared for one week after changing injection time?

@highpull @dbossa @dextermorgan @systemlord all your opinions would be highly appreciated

Sounds exactly like my situation. At 6 am our bedroom is stormed by a 3 and a 5 year old. Only difference, no energy on our side.

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It took 6 months for my sleep to improve on TRT. It was terrible for several months, but now the best of my life. Hopefully that is your pattern too.

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I’m afraid I don’t have much for you. With the small dose you take, I would not think a few hours change would matter at all. Very few guys report sleep disturbances on TRT, though it is not unheard of. I suppose you could recheck cortisol and compare, but now its changed again. Or, go back to your previous schedule and see if that fixes it.

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What were your sleeping issues initially? So when you started TRT sleep got worse, then it got better?

Ive read a few people here complaining about sleep disturbances after TRT. I know sleep apnea can be a common reason for that, but Ive done the test before initiating therapy.

Ive had sleeping issue since my nervous system crack down in 2011-2013, but this early morning cortisol spike wake up is a totally new thing since I started TRT.

Im really wondering if some build up of propinate or phenylpropinate no matter how small they are in a 20mg sustanon can cause that. Unfortunately seems there is nobody that can answer this question in the world and there is only one way to find out…

I will go this Saturday for enanthate before they close the border, whether I will switch to it will consider in the following weeks

Guys start TRT and ten other variables they aren’t telling you. Diet. Other hormones hcg, and supps, and new found gym obsessions and etc

For some reason T is always to blame and everything else isn’t or could never be the cause.

The issues reported here are usually followed with a simple history. The longer they post the more truth comes out.

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Bro, I could not understand your idea here :slight_smile:

People have symptoms when they start TRT . They always blame TRT, but they Never look at everything else they changed when starting TRT. Working out, changed diet, supplements, other medications and so on.

The culprit is always T first and everything else
Second.

Sometime it’s just the body getting used to all these hormones again. Is that T? Or is that the process?

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Or estrogen :laughing:

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Im pretty sure the reason for this night time wake up is the TRT. Ive given it a lot of consideration from different angles, timing when it started, other variables and so on.
I dont blame testosterone because it has given me so much, but there is just this one negative I need to fix because it will build up

You’re chasing your tail, as you have been told already. There’s no supplement that will do the trick.
If your hormones are out of whack, your sleep won’t get fixed.

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My hormones look good now.
Only the cortisol rythm seems to sucks and looks like it was disturbed from TRT.
Tonight magnesium glycinate will arrive but yes I dont put too much hope on suplements

I hope the multiple esters in the sustanon cause this issue and that transitioning to enanthate can fix it

I’d be really surprised if the esters are the cause of the issue. Your prolactin is high and you are taking a nasty drug that messes up with dopamine levels in your brain.

E2 is renowned to have a stimulatory effect on the secretion of prolactin by the pituitary gland. It’s well established in the medical literature and many men on TRT suffer from it, me included. So you are using a drug to treat a side effect and you’re not going to the root of the issue.

I recall also seeing a study showing the higher prolactin having an impact on the secretion of cortisol by the adrenals. It seems really in line with what’s happening to you.

Let me add that your doctor doesn’t seem to have a clue on why you have sleep issues, like all the TRT doctor I’ve spoken to. They just give you tons of supplements, hoping that one of them will do the trick.

But most of all, if you feel awesome as you say, why are you so bothered by waking up early? I wish I could sleep less and get more things done during the day.

Agreed. When I got dialed in I stopped sleeping in until noon & was wide awake, rested, early AM finally