UFC 106 Matchups

Bigger Stronger Leaner
61

oh god this is rich. tito was never good and the lions den was even worse!

and no tito wasnt made on wanderlei and i never said that. tito was made on the BUSINESS that is the UFC jumping on the MARKETABILITY that was tito ortiz. and you uneducated “UFC fans” fell for it hard.

he defended his belt six times vs fucking bums, after ducking randy and chuck for 3-5 fights. definition paper champ. tito is a bitch.

i think the whats confusing you guys is you for some reason think the ufc was always the penicle of mma and it certainly was not. for a LONG period of time the best fighters ALL fought in japan with almost NO exception. you keep failing back on this bums title reign but it means nothing in the grand scheme of who is/was a good fighter. i mean shit, even tim silvia held a ufc title.

and as for wanderlei every mediocre mma fighter has a win or two over fighters much better than them. its how this sport works. duplicating success is how GOOD fighters are seperated from the mediocre. and his few relevant wins were hardly impressive.

62

[quote]slimjim wrote:
what is it with college freshman, unfettered internet access, and nothing but time on their hands? go get laid kid, 275 posts in a month is the sign of a problem[/quote]

well if your asking ive only been posting about a one day out of a week or two. just when i do post its to tempting to tell people like you who think they have some sort of understanding on something, how far off they are - resulting in a flury of posts like this.

regardless of whether or not you agree with me, im adding and contributing to the site. and whether you know it or not i have much more knowledge on this current topic than you do. perhaps its time to suck up the ego and try and absorb something?

as for get laid… you really have a history of projection don’t you? lets try and keep this relevant and not let all your skeletons outta the closet. k?

63

Baroni gassed? Holy shit.

64

[quote]slimjim wrote:
Deorum wrote:
yea i did forget that fight. belfort is pretty legitimate. add that to his other one or two other good wins and its still not much of a career. it CERTAINLY does not change the fact that tito is a pretty insignificant fighter and whats more a bitch. at least gayweather is a talented bitch, ortiz is a mediocre bitch.

edit: also its no secret vitor wasnt naturally a heavy or light heavy weight. his move was inevitable really.

you know, i hate when people do this. and by this, i mean go look at fightfinder and then disregard teh context in which those fights were conducted. tito took it to the lion’s den when they were viewed in teh same manner that jackson’s camp is today. he beat vladimir matyushenko when he was on the rise, he beat evan tanner when he was on a run. in that day and in those times tito ruled the ufc. without him keeping the organization afloat, we might not have the ufc today - the ppvs that tito headlined were pretty much the only ones drawing anybody in those days.

you can call him insignificant all you want, and in the long run his career may best be remembered as mediocre, but dont try to diminish his career by degrading the fighters he faced, they were all fighting and keeping teh sport alive when they weren’t making shit doing it. today we have athletes, then we had fighters.

ps- vitor was NOT an undersized light heavyweight when he fought there. he seemed to have access to better vitamins back then[/quote]

Totally agree, well said.

65

Koscheck fuckin cheated , every time AJ loses he gets pocked in the fucking eye before hand, i swear koscheck watched the tape and was like mmmm ok pock him in the eye then submit him got it :S

66

I’ve heard previous claims regarding Royce Gracie. “He was never that good, who’d he beat anyway?” What these kids are forgetting is that like any new sport there is an evolution process. In the very beginning those who knew Jiu-Jitsu had a huge advantage over those who did not yet understand the ground game.

Royce Gracie was able to beat people who were much, much larger because of that very reason, maybe that’s accomplishment enough? Who were these people and does it really matter? Royce Gracie was a pioneer and fought 3 and 4 times in one night to win, an accomplishment in and of itself. Suffice it to say that he beat everyone that he stood against at that time, just as Tito Ortiz did for a period of time as UFC champion and that’s all that really matters.

If you want to go further it’s plain to see that you don’t shut down the Lions Den (considered the best mma gym in its time) beat the likes of Wanderlei Silva, Vitor Belfort and go 5 rounds with Randy Couture unless you are one of the best of your day and Tito was and those of us who actually understand the game know this simple fact.

As I stated in my original post Tito’s day is past, but at one time he reigned at the top and simply because the game has once again evolved he doesn’t deserve to be denigrated anymore than does Royce Gracie or any of the earlier fighters from various generations. For it’s because of these fighters that we have champions like GSP, Anderson Silva, BJ Penn and a host of others who would certainly dominate an earlier generation of fighters.

Each successive generation can only be tested by the fighters of their own era. Tito fought them all in his prime, he defeated many and lifted the UFC up on his back in doing so. When any of them fight past their peak, whether it be Ortiz, Hughes or Coleman they can only do themselves harm in immeasurable ways both seen and unseen and that’s sad.

However, anyone with a modicum of understand of mma wouldn’t be denigrating Tito Oritiz fighting history. In doing so they put on display their own immaturity and lack of understanding of the entire sport.

67

[quote]Judas wrote:
Koscheck fuckin cheated , every time AJ loses he gets pocked in the fucking eye before hand, i swear koscheck watched the tape and was like mmmm ok pock him in the eye then submit him got it :S[/quote]

What tape did Johnson watch to know that Koscheck didn’t like getting kneed in the face on the ground? Things happen in a fight don’t rush to judgement. The bottom line is Johnson couldn’t contend with Koschecks ground game. Like I said to my son before the fight there’s a big difference between a Division 1 wrestling champion and a Junior College champion. I take nothing away from Johnson he’s very good, but he met someone better the other night by the name of Josh Koscheck.

68

I’ve heard previous claims regarding Royce Gracie. “He was never that good, who’d he beat anyway?” What these kids are forgetting is that like any new sport there is an evolution process. In the very beginning those who knew Jiu-Jitsu had a huge advantage over those who did not yet understand the ground game.

Not to rehash some really old shit, I’ve meet Royce three times and rolled with him twice in NY, I have a lot of respect for him.

But there was a LOT of shit going on back then.

69

[quote]Valor wrote:
I’ve heard previous claims regarding Royce Gracie. “He was never that good, who’d he beat anyway?” What these kids are forgetting is that like any new sport there is an evolution process. In the very beginning those who knew Jiu-Jitsu had a huge advantage over those who did not yet understand the ground game.

Not to rehash some really old shit, I’ve meet Royce three times and rolled with him twice in NY, I have a lot of respect for him.

But there was a LOT of shit going on back then.[/quote]

What “shit” are you referring to?

70

[quote]Deorum wrote:
oh god this is rich. tito was never good and the lions den was even worse!

and no tito wasnt made on wanderlei and i never said that. tito was made on the BUSINESS that is the UFC jumping on the MARKETABILITY that was tito ortiz. and you uneducated “UFC fans” fell for it hard.

he defended his belt six times vs fucking bums, after ducking randy and chuck for 3-5 fights. definition paper champ. tito is a bitch.

i think the whats confusing you guys is you for some reason think the ufc was always the penicle of mma and it certainly was not. for a LONG period of time the best fighters ALL fought in japan with almost NO exception. you keep failing back on this bums title reign but it means nothing in the grand scheme of who is/was a good fighter. i mean shit, even tim silvia held a ufc title.

and as for wanderlei every mediocre mma fighter has a win or two over fighters much better than them. its how this sport works. duplicating success is how GOOD fighters are seperated from the mediocre. and his few relevant wins were hardly impressive.[/quote]

Damn…you know your shit. I don’t know what to say:

First of all,who the hell is arguing if the UFC had superior talent or was the pinnacle(spell check is awesome!)of mma at the time? That’s irrelevant to anyone’s belief that Tito was once a good fighter.

Second,when you say…“tito’s entire career was built on an early win over silva”…“he never was a good fighter.”(read your posts)…ummm,what the fuck does it look like you’re saying???

I don’t like calling people dumb-asses often…but damn,dude,your arguments can’t negotiate the curves you’re making. If you can’t even be a man and take responsibility for your own words,there is no credibility behind anything you say from this point on. ESPECIALLY when trying to bash the ENTIRE career of a fighter.

You’re just trying to sound like some MMA genius. We get it…because watching early UFC between the ages of one to ten years old OBVIOUSLY means you have a better base of knowledge than us “uneducated UFC fans.”

I guess suckling a tit while watching those fights got that shit all soaked up in your brain…like some super-baby,MMAth genius. We are so envious.

71

Don’t forget about Tito’s “draw” to former champ Rashad Evans or his near submission of current champ Lyoto Machida. Going 0-2-1 against the last 3 LHW champs doesn’t make you a bad fighter.

Tito might not be the best anymore and he might always be cannon fodder for Chuck Liddell, but I don’t think that makes him irrelevant yet.

72

shit, that dude’s in high school? i was giving him more credit than he deserved…the fact that i thought he was a college freshman without even looking at his profile says something about those posts.

73

[quote]ZEB wrote:
Valor wrote:
I’ve heard previous claims regarding Royce Gracie. “He was never that good, who’d he beat anyway?” What these kids are forgetting is that like any new sport there is an evolution process. In the very beginning those who knew Jiu-Jitsu had a huge advantage over those who did not yet understand the ground game.

Not to rehash some really old shit, I’ve meet Royce three times and rolled with him twice in NY, I have a lot of respect for him.

But there was a LOT of shit going on back then.

What “shit” are you referring to?

[/quote]

Ask yourself how a guy like Fred Ettish makes it into the cage…

74

[quote]Big_Boss wrote:
You’re just trying to sound like some MMA genius. We get it…because watching early UFC between the ages of one to ten years old OBVIOUSLY means you have a better base of knowledge than us “uneducated UFC fans.”

I guess suckling a tit while watching those fights got that shit all soaked up in your brain…like some super-baby,MMAth genius. We are so envious.

[/quote]

aha if you only knew. anyway your an uneducated “ufc fan” because your defending tito ortiz as a good fighter. really enough said.

finally im not trying to bash tito to death im just saying what needed to be said. he is a bitch. he never wanted to fight anyone and he never had the talent to hang with the best.

75

[quote]Deorum wrote:
Big_Boss wrote:
You’re just trying to sound like some MMA genius. We get it…because watching early UFC between the ages of one to ten years old OBVIOUSLY means you have a better base of knowledge than us “uneducated UFC fans.”

I guess suckling a tit while watching those fights got that shit all soaked up in your brain…like some super-baby,MMAth genius. We are so envious.

aha if you only knew. anyway your an uneducated “ufc fan” because your defending tito ortiz as a good fighter. really enough said.

[/quote]

you realize that Tito has held the UFC title and, besides Ken Shamrock, has only fought title holders, former title holders, and contenders? As bad as he looked against Lyoto, many have looked worse. Damn kid, if you weren’t so concerned with trying to show people how smart and tough you are (and only showing us how stupid you are,) you might learn something around here.

76

[quote]slimjim wrote:
Deorum wrote:
Big_Boss wrote:
You’re just trying to sound like some MMA genius. We get it…because watching early UFC between the ages of one to ten years old OBVIOUSLY means you have a better base of knowledge than us “uneducated UFC fans.”

I guess suckling a tit while watching those fights got that shit all soaked up in your brain…like some super-baby,MMAth genius. We are so envious.

aha if you only knew. anyway your an uneducated “ufc fan” because your defending tito ortiz as a good fighter. really enough said.

you realize that Tito has held the UFC title and, besides Ken Shamrock, has only fought title holders, former title holders, and contenders? As bad as he looked against Lyoto, many have looked worse. Damn kid, if you weren’t so concerned with trying to show people how smart and tough you are (and only showing us how stupid you are,) you might learn something around here.[/quote]

is this a joke? you really think the past ufc title equated to a good mma fighter. this arguement just died.

edit: let me humor this. i think money is the only thing that will make this arguement really mean anything. next time tito has a fight against a legit fighter lets throw money down. nothing else needs to be said.

77

[quote]Deorum wrote:
aha if you only knew. anyway your an uneducated “ufc fan” because your defending tito ortiz as a good fighter. really enough said.
[/quote]

No,McLovin…I am defending Tito Ortiz as ONCE a good fighter. You claim that he NEVER WAS one. Get it right,fool.

78

[quote]Big_Boss wrote:
Deorum wrote:
aha if you only knew. anyway your an uneducated “ufc fan” because your defending tito ortiz as a good fighter. really enough said.

No,McLovin…I am defending Tito Ortiz as ONCE a good fighter. You claim that he NEVER WAS one. Get it right,fool.
[/quote]

…lol

79

[quote]Deorum wrote:
Big_Boss wrote:
Deorum wrote:
aha if you only knew. anyway your an uneducated “ufc fan” because your defending tito ortiz as a good fighter. really enough said.

No,McLovin…I am defending Tito Ortiz as ONCE a good fighter. You claim that he NEVER WAS one. Get it right,fool.

…lol[/quote]

80

[quote]Deorum wrote:

you realize that Tito has held the UFC title and, besides Ken Shamrock, has only fought title holders, former title holders, and contenders? As bad as he looked against Lyoto, many have looked worse. Damn kid, if you weren’t so concerned with trying to show people how smart and tough you are (and only showing us how stupid you are,) you might learn something around here.

is this a joke? you really think the past ufc title equated to a good mma fighter. this arguement just died.

edit: let me humor this. i think money is the only thing that will make this argument really mean anything. next time tito has a fight against a legit fighter lets throw money down. nothing else needs to be said.[/quote]

First you come on here and bash people for even alluding to Tito being a good fighter…IN THE PAST.

Now you’re wanting to bet money on a RECENT/UPCOMING Ortiz fight to settle the argument against those who say Tito was a good fighter…IN THE PAST. ??? You’re an eunuch.