@meastlake1
Very good post. TY.
TY sirā¦.too bad we canāt do it like most BBāing boards and add my post as a sticky at the top. We could title it something like āFor anyone considering taking Trenbolone, please read thisā. Itād save a lot of novices from even considering taking itā¦..well, shit, probably not. people are gonna do what theyāre gonna do, but maybe, just maybe, it would at least give some people a bit of a pause, maybe force them to think about whether taking something that damaging, is worth it.
I even forgot to add, in terms of adding overall SIZE, Tren really isnāt that great for this purpose. Test, Deca, EQ, D-bol, etc would all be much better for that purpose. And in terms of Trenās ability to harden your muscles, bring out striations and that grainy-look, that is ONLY going to happen, again, to someone who is VERY dieted down (as in, getting ready for a show), when they are below say 7% bodyfat. If you are not that lean, it wonāt matter how hard it makes your muscles, etc. as you canāt see it underneath fat, or when holding a lot of water. I think the problem with just regular gym rats desiring to run this can be attributed to goddam tik tok, instagram, etc. as some clown will make a video saying that theyāre running āTRENā and they go on and on about all itās magical properties, making it seem like this super elite and bad ass drug. What the viewer doesnāt know is, that person is also probably very low BF%, theyāre probably taking a ton of gear (and doing god knows what kind of damage to their organs), and then the problem becomesā¦.is it the Tren specifically thatās responsible for their physique, or is it really just the sum of ALL the compounds that theyāre running? But the young kids, or AAS newbies, get this impression that Tren is some magical, elite drug that will instantly make them look like Jay Cutler or, probably more likely, C-bum. All the kids love C-bumā¦but 99% of them donāt have near the genetics that guy already began with.
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This is the kind of help I value. Iāve heard of the common sides that come with Tren usage. As Iām sure you know, there are so many differing opinions regarding the sides vs the dosage. The sides you experienced, what dosage were you using, and were you combining it with anything in particular that may have compounded all of those? I would only be taking it with TRT (if I chose to use the Tren). Regarding the liver, I am donating blood every 2-3 weeks to lower levels/res blood cells. And I do have Glutathione to combat liver issues (if it would to a safe extent). What are some replacement substances and their dosages you would recommend to replace the Tren? I appreciate the detailed and thoughtful response. Your time is valued. 
I meant to clarify, in your opinion are those sides moderated by a lower dosage? That was my intent. I know of course you canāt definitively answer that question as dosage/genetic response all come into play. Just wanted your opinion regarding the impact or severity of sides in relation to lower dosage, somewhere in the realm of 100-200mgs a week.
I know you didnāt ask me but I wanted to share my experience with you.
Last summer I ran a 100mg/wk of tren along with my TRT of 180mg/wk and 1mg/wk of retatrutide. Pre cycle bloodwork was perfect. This was 11-12 weeks.
Fast forward 16 weeks at my yearly physical. I had been off cycle for 4-5 weeks. Cholesterol came back bad and I had a calcium score done and it came back at 33. The one I had the prior year was 0. After that test the Dr sent me for a scan that showed (2) plaques within my heart.
This is what I was trying to impress upon you previously. Even small doses that donāt give you apparent/noticeable sides are doing damage.
When I say that tren should be reserved for competitors itās because Iāve been there and know what it takes. You need what tren offers when deep in prep to help with strength,
muscle retention and nutrient partitioning. It
also helps get that hard grainy look.
Iām not saying itās good they use it Iām just saying they have a lot of experience with these compounds and they understand the risk but they take it for the sport/stage they love.
The reply I very much value.
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I was by means trying to be a dick to you. My main concern is your health and safety as you try to achieve your goals.
Iām aware thereās nothing quite like Tren, but what would be some replacement substances that seek achieve similar results, albeit not identical I know. Lean, dry growth, fat reduction, minimal water retention. Of course, ideally muscle retention. Iām not a Deca fan due to the water retention and āmuscleā loss. I greatly appreciated the strength gains, but thatās no longer a priority for me at my age and I havenāt used Deca in over two decades. I enjoyed Equipoise during my military days. That was, of course, taken during what was probably peak natural testosterone levels.
I get what your saying with deca but if you keep the dose low, keep a lowish carb diet and keep estrogen managed you wonāt blow up with water. This is what I would recommend. Itās my go to for a building cycle. Just finished this up a few weeks ago.
Week 1-14
250/wk test
150/wk deca
300/wk EQ
25mg/day proviron
25mg/day Anadrol half way through when lifts stall. Can sub for oral of choice. I prefer anadrol.
AI on hand
Organ protection.
I somehow managed to delete what I wrote about 4 hours ago. I still stand that this is the most clueless comment I have seen on T-Nation.
I credit Organon Deca-Durabolin for my success on stage. It was my go-to competition anabolic for the next 20+ years. I always knew that I was actually taking Deca-Durabolin and not some fake. And, yes, I took only 200mg/wk. Water retention caused by Deca never crossed my mind. I took the last injection 7 days out from the show.
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I donāt wanna argue, but I would argue that what you suggested is not safer than what the OP wants, 100mg/tren per week(assuming he will run it along trt and go back to trt). And also if we kinda ignore the purposes/goals of tren or your stack and talk only safety.
Tren scares you early. EQ, Deca and Anadrol damage you quietly. One feels dangerous and is dangerous. The other is dangerous but doesnāt āfeelā like it. Most people equate danger = how bad it feels. Tren you feel almost immediately. EQ/Deca/Anadrol you wont, until labs or an event. I would say this stack even loses badly regarding cardiovaskular risk, compared to a mere 100mg tren. I am comparing 14 weeks of this āmulti-compound exposureā vs say 8 weeks of a single harsh compound like 100mgs of tren. Chronic or letās say longer multi compound exposure beats acute toxicity in terms of actual morbidity.
I credit Deca with water retention and loss of gains, because that was my experience on it years ago. Iām really sorry that my personal experience offended you to such an extent that you had to include ācluelessā in your response. Iām sincerely happy youāve been using it for 20+ years with monumental success and I hope youāve revolutionized bodybuilding through your usage and personal experience.
This is called arguing.
You need to stop. This is untrue. I am proof. Tren is terrible for you cardiovascular system. 10 weeks of 100mg of tren did way more damage to me that 16 weeks of test/deca/EQ/anadrol and all my previous use combined. My bloodwork and the two plaques in my heart are proof of this. My bloodwork prior to this has always been perfect.
Tren is not safe and should not even be considered by a normal gym goer. There is simply no need.
I have many years of experience with steroids. From I can tell you have a couple.
Iām not sure why you keep interjecting yourself and trying to convince the OP that tren is ok to use?
Have you used it? You talk about it like you have but iām thinking you have not.
You are not the āproofā. You are a case or an example. You are not the rule. Everyone reacts differently.
Yes I used it. Yes I use it right now. Yes it is extremely dangerous for the cardiovascular system. I stated all that before. No I donāt encourage itās use. Can we stop all the people from using it, even the kids nowaydays since this most toxic sh*t is so trendy? No we can not. Can we offer advice to lower the risk somewhat, yes we can. If such advice, that doesnāt do anyone harm bothers you, ignore it.
I will only ever use 3 compounds for my goals and my goals are my own. Test, dbol and tren. Blasting dbol or tren alongside trt. I get zero side effects on either of those 3. Not even a single zit. But i am also NOT the proof. Not even a ācaseā or an āexampleā, rather an anomaly. I am a dry dbol gainer, that stuff is nuclear for me, I always keep at least half. Month later my bloodwork is normal. Am I stupid enough to think normal blood work means there will never be a cumulative damage of sorts? No I am not. But short exposure is less dangerous than multicompound longer exposure. For MOST people.
I never said I was the definitive answer. Iām just siting an example.
But you are right on this very thread.
I agree. This has been done. The advice is donāt use tren. For a typical gym goer the risk is not worth the reward. For a competitor itās still the case but they are very experienced users who are using the drug for specific goals during contest prep and fully understand the damage they are doing. They donāt use it on an off season cycle because itās not appropriate. There are better ways to do things.
That being said, if I step on stage again would I use it in prep? Highly doubtful.
I get your not trying to give bad advice here but telling someone that short term āacuteā usage is ok is just not correct. We donāt have to agree on other points but iāve been in this game and around others that compete and have seen bloods to know what is āsaferā and what is and is not appropriate.
We have both said our piece here so there is no need to continue this on the opās thread.
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Yes we can end the discussion but just a couple of more things, since there is a misunderstandig here, because I apparently donāt pay extreme attention to every word.
Let me rephrase it: Can we offer advice to lower the risk somewhat āon those who made up their mind on using itā, yes we can. Did OP make up his mind and will 100% use it? I hope not. But iāve been on forums way to long and I can recognize patterns.
I also NEVER said acute exposure is okšØ, esp. regarding tren. I said this particular short exposure can and should be less dangerous than a multicompoud longer blast. What can happen, depends on a person and a lot more things. There are no fixed rules. You get f-d up with 100mg, I have idiots around me on 700+ without anything apparent. With tren there are tendencies and they ARE justified. I told OP, even if he wanted to go on stage he probably wouldnāt need 300mgs. If he had made up his mind on 300+ mgs, my interaction in this thread would be very different(something like yours) or non existant.
I more than likely will not use the Tren I have. It will be a shame to have wasted the money. I was meaning to use it for some time now, but life stuff happened and I never did. Are there more appropriate alternatives to Tren, ie Primo or Masteron that can be run in low-moderate dosages? I know weāve spoken on Deca and Androl. I was just looking for your opinions regarding other alternatives.
Perhaps a blessing.
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seems you are already on the trenboloney sandwich by how easy you have been triggered!!!
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Exactly, imagine this amplified on Tren
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