This is my first post and I’m just looking for a bit of guidance.
I started training 3 years ago at 22 years old and 120 lbs (with love handles), and I’m currently 185 lbs (with only slightly larger love handles). I’m happy with the progress I’ve made in that department, although I still consider myself small and need to continue pushing my weight in the right direction.
My problem is that my strength, although it is MUCH better than it was when I started training, is not at a respectable level.
All-time best lifts: 405 deadlift, 300 squat, 235 bench, 140 overhead.
Training history: 2 years muscle-mag style training (Jim Stoppani programs for the most part) with mostly incidental strength gains. 3 months training under a strongman doing a modified conjugate style training with linear, weekly weight increases (new 1RM to 3RM set weekly). Thats when I hit my aforementioned best lifts. 3 months spent correcting muscular imbalances and working on injuries sustained in the previous 3 months (ran Cressey’s Neanderthal No More with great success). 4 months spent trying to train similarly to how I had trained under that strongman, but I ended up spinning my wheels and actually lost some strength. Currently (just finishing my second month) on 5/3/1 4 day split with 1 “big” assistance lift and 2-3 “small” assistance exercises each session.
I’m getting results on 5/3/1 so far, but my question is: would I be better served doing a program with faster progression? Jason Blaha’s novice routine sticks out as something I wouldn’t mind doing.
My lifts are weak for my experience level and weight, but given my absolute piss-poor, bottom of the barrel, loser of the genetic lottery starting point, have I maximized my PERSONAL newb gains and am now ready for a more “intermediate” program like 5/3/1? I wish I had “starting” figures for my lifts so I can see how much progress I’ve actually made, but I remember being excited about deadlifting 225 for the first time if that gives you any idea.
In short: go back and do a 5X5 or 3X5 program that I foolishly neglected doing when I was a true beginner, or stick with 5/3/1 and accept the slower progress?
[quote]dt79 wrote:
Stick with it.[/quote]
x2.
I’m always taken aback by people who complain that 5/3/1 doesn’t progress fast enough for them. You can add a solid amount to each of those lifts in a good solid year or two on 5/3/1 (and your lifts aren’t THAT bad for someone who’s been training muscle-mag-style for 2 years and then did one good year of training). What’s the gawd-awful rush to switch programs when you’re making progress on what you’re doing now?
Your numbers are decent, so don’t get too down on that. Also, stop making excuses that you have shitty genetics. Play the cards you are dealt.
5/3/1 is a solid program that will absolutely make you stronger. As others said, if you are making progress, stick with it.
What does your nutrition look like? Training is a much smaller part of the equation than what you are putting into your body.
Appreciate the feedback from both of you. Thats the way I was leaning, but sometimes its good to hear it from someone else. As for the urge to switch programs, in this instance it comes from the fact that I now feel like I (at least somewhat) know what I’m doing and have developed a strong passion for training that my strength doesn’t reflect.
When I hear about people being able to rep my 1RM after less than 6 months on a novice program, it makes me wonder if I’d be better served doing one. I know patience is the answer though. I’ll check back in in two years and tell you if I’m still weak.
Not making excuses about genetics. I started smaller and weaker than average, but I progress at a fine rate. Now that I’m at the level I’m at I don’t think genetic matter much. It just took a lot of work to get here.
Nutrition: I think I do fairly well in that department. 200 p/ 400 c/ 100 f is average when I’m really pushing my weight and strength up (most of the time) and something like 220 p/ 250 c/ 110 f once I get too soft and need to lose a few lbs. Most of that comes from “clean” foods, but if I feel like eating junk occasionally I don’t stop myself.
Stay with 5/3/1. I was at my peak strength while running 5/3/1 then I got off of it for a while and haven’t been able to get back to where I was. Don’t jump off the bandwagon
Those numbers are not bad. Think about where they’ll be in one more year? Then one more year after that. After 5 years, you’ll easily be in the 1,200+ range.
You guys are awesome. Thanks for the perspective. I think I watch too many videos of SHW powerlifters.
[quote]ZJStrope wrote:
Those numbers are not bad. Think about where they’ll be in one more year? Then one more year after that. After 5 years, you’ll easily be in the 1,200+ range.[/quote]
Basically, this is what I was trying to say in my first post. If you follow 5/3/1 from now for one full year (along with the good-nutrition stuff already discussed here), you might up those numbers to a 365 squat, 275 bench, and 455 deadlift or better. Another year and you might be at 405, 315, and 495. Perhaps even better than that. Isn’t that a pretty good outcome? Sure, you might get there a LITTLE faster on a different program, but why mess with something that is working?
[quote]TrevorLPT wrote:
All-time best lifts: 405 deadlift, 300 squat, 235 bench, 140 overhead.
[/quote]
Are these your current maxes, or close if you haven’t maxed out recently? And if not what are your current maxes?
Not my current maxes but close. Deads are at 405 or slightly higher, bench is probably a bit lower but I’ve cleaned up my form, OHP is at 140 (hit that last week). Squat is lower due to it causing considerable pain in my left knee whenever the weights get close to 300 so Im constantly taking it out of rotation and finding substitutes.
I had most of my meniscus removed years ago, and squats seem to be the only lift that causes consistent issues with it. Not going to bitch about it, though? planning on switching to box squats today and seeing if that helps. If so, regular squats are out until I get a meniscus transplant or knee replacement.
Not my current maxes but close. Deads are at 405 or slightly higher, bench is probably a bit lower but I’ve cleaned up my form, OHP is at 140 (hit that last week). Squat is lower due to it causing considerable pain in my left knee whenever the weights get close to 300 so Im constantly taking it out of rotation and finding substitutes.
I had most of my meniscus removed years ago, and squats seem to be the only lift that causes consistent issues with it. Not going to bitch about it, though? planning on switching to box squats today and seeing if that helps. If so, regular squats are out until I get a meniscus transplant or knee replacement.
I think 531 is a great program, and is something that I always fall back on and am currently on it now.
However, I believe after three years with numbers that you are dissapointed in, I would look into a program that allows for auto-regulation. Wendler has included Joker Sets in his new forms of 531 which allows you to push for some heavy singles, and allows for some leeway into the purposely slow standard progression of 531. This may be the approach you want to take as it allows you to have your cake and eat it too in a way.
I have used and was coached online by Mike Turscherer and experienced gains that I probably would not have realized if using a standardized percentage based program. That program was solely based on auto regulation and perceived rep effort. Now training this way may not be the right choice at this stage of your lifting career.
So IMO 531 with the inclusion of autoregulation and joker sets may be ideal.
[quote]ActivitiesGuy wrote:
[quote]ZJStrope wrote:
Those numbers are not bad. Think about where they’ll be in one more year? Then one more year after that. After 5 years, you’ll easily be in the 1,200+ range.[/quote]
Basically, this is what I was trying to say in my first post. If you follow 5/3/1 from now for one full year (along with the good-nutrition stuff already discussed here), you might up those numbers to a 365 squat, 275 bench, and 455 deadlift or better. Another year and you might be at 405, 315, and 495. Perhaps even better than that. Isn’t that a pretty good outcome? Sure, you might get there a LITTLE faster on a different program, but why mess with something that is working?[/quote]
yup! It took me 8-10 years of fucking around and not being consistent and getting down about the exact thing the poster was saying. I was NEVER realistic and I basically wasted a lot of time. If I had the mindset I have now, I see no reason why I wouldn’t be in the upper echelon of non-competing lifters.
But, it is what it is and you move on. No matter what videos, magazines and most articles say, this is a long term game.