The Right Way to Bulk

Training Bodybuilding
61

[quote]jehovasfitness wrote:
Dave_ wrote:
Ghost22 wrote:
Don’t hate on cookies, ice cream, or fast food.

When used sparingly they’re great ways to add calories and get bigger and stronger.

+1

I make sure I get my protein in first during a meal, then it’s a free-for-all to top up the kcals.

AND Anyone giving advice in these sorts of threads should have at least 1 pic on display (cough hawiimike and headhunter cough)

I just checked hawaiimike’s thread on the supp board. He’s made decent progress since May IMO.
[/quote]

That’s true actually, credit where credit’s due.

62

[quote]Player wrote:
I appreciate all the information (the helpful ones). I AM young and would classify as a begginer. My goal would be to gain about 1 lb/ week for the next 5-6 months. My genetics (in terms of looking big even though I don’t weigh much) are very good, but for maximum muscle growth I still have to try for myself. Im 5’6 BTW.[/quote]

Age, height, weight, pics, training experience, lifts - send them to my email addy if you want.

Why not just follow Max-OT all the way? its a sound training philosophy.

[quote]My diet will be HIGH in calories, mostly coming from clean sources with a lot of protein.
I plan to work very hard on my routine and gain minimum amount of fat so I can strip it off and get to 7% bf in about 2 months.[/quote]

you’re not listening. This is a “post-priori” thing…At your level, you carry on with what you’re doing for a while and focus on exercise selection and adding weight to the bar while gaining bodyweight for a few months and THEN look back and assess where you stand, and make small changes.
You gain a mixture of fat, fluids and muscle when you gain weight with a caloric excess EVEN without training.Training with sufficient volume and progressive overload AND a higher protein intake will “greatly” affect the ratio of lean to fat.

Start a training log on here.

63

[quote]tribunaldude wrote:
First of all “bulking up” is not a method or even a goal, for fuck’s sake. It is merely a consequence of eating a caloric surplus to gain bodyweight while (usually) lifting weights, thats all.

Secondly, MOST people reading this site have wretched potential, and should avoid the idea of “bulking up” altogether. You are most likely not prof X or someone who can someday step on stage carrying enough size and development - and if you WERE you would realize it in your first 1-2 years of training. Eat a slight surplus, track your weight change and add weight to the bar = gain muscle with some fat. Hold the size gained till you have some density and then lean out slowly = you can add 15-20 pounds of muscle to your frame. If you want to call that “bulking up” feel free to do that.

Thirdly, the fact is that most people who have added well over 55-60 pounds of lean mass after puberty allowed themselves to bulk up in the initial stages of their development - thats a far cry from saying that the best way for you to gain muscle is to bulk up since that assumes that you HAVE the potential to gain and keep significant size by allowing yourself to bulk up and then lean out.

In conclusion, allow yourself to “bulk up” ONLY if you know you are young enough
AND have the genetic inclination to hold on to size while dieting down
AND the frame to not look fat in everyday clothes after gaining 30-40 pounds of bodyweight (narrow clavicles and wide hips = a LOT of grief while you’re gaining bodyweight) unless you have the patience to build heavy deltoids over the next 10-12 years or so.
AND if you have the “add weight to the bar” mindset
AND if you have a clue how to make your muscles grow (understand movements within your first year or so of training).

if you satisfy most or all of these conditions, bulking up naturally is a possible solution to try and gain as much size as your body will allow you. [/quote]

This should be posted after every “Just shut up and eat!” post that you see daily on these boards.

Due to age and genetics, most people who “Just shut up and eat!” are going to “Just shut up and get fat!”, regardless of how hard they workout.

64

[quote]forlife wrote:

Due to age and genetics, most people who “Just shut up and eat!” are going to “Just shut up and get fat!”, regardless of how hard they workout.[/quote]

No offense, but while this may be true for the average sedentary person who puts about as much intensity into lifting as I do taking a shit, but BODYBUILDING, the kind most of us are talking about in this forum, is NOT for everyone. It is NOT for people who “train” for a decade but don’t look like it.

Yes, those people may simply get fat if they are told to eat more…but that is simply because they don’t know how to train or simply do not have the drive to do so correctly. In most cases, I am not sure even genetics is to blame for the weak results most are seeing here.

That means the best advice to truly get big is still to “just shut up and eat and lift heavy”. For those who have it in them. that is enough.

65

[quote]jCaesar88 wrote:
matsm21 wrote:
maybe I’m just a simpleton, but I just eat alot, try not to eat complete garbage, and increase food intake if i’m not gaining. I’m not fat, and have added plenty of muscle. I am by no means predisposed to have high strength levels or mass levels, I would be very skinny without lifting.
too much fat gain, throw in a little cardio. not gaining weight, eat more. very simple. No need to count/calculate your macronutrients and calories and grams of bullshit in your food unless you are trying to get very lean.

what’s a little cardio to you. just wondering[/quote]

20-30 minutes on the elliptical 2-3 times/week on off days.

66

[quote]red04 wrote:
Headhunter wrote:

Lift, do A LOT of aerobic training, and try eating a very tiny amount above maintenance. Hopefully, you won’t trigger the fat storage part of the primitive brain, is all I can say.

I took your advice and this is what I look like, WHERE DID I GO WRONG OH GOD!!![/quote]

Well, you ran. Running is bad for your heart. By aerobic, I mean something more along the lines of brief HIIT intervals. Sorry I wasn’t more clear.

Pure aerobics trains your heart to react to a low level of constant stimulus. If you do something intense and short, like fighting or shovelling snow, your heart is not used to that. The shock can cause a myocardial infarction.

67

[quote]Professor X wrote:
That means the best advice to truly get big is still to “just shut up and eat and lift heavy”. For those who have it in them. that is enough.[/quote]

I agree that is the best advice for young people with good genetics. It’s not always the best advice for people in their 30s-50s with crappy genetics.

You’ve seen great results personally, but you started young and have unusually good genetics. Following the same path as you is not going to lead to the same result, for most people on these boards.

68

[quote]Professor X wrote:

That means the best advice to truly get big is still to “just shut up and eat and lift heavy”. For those who have it in them. that is enough.[/quote]

You reap what you sow.

69

[quote]forlife wrote:
Professor X wrote:
That means the best advice to truly get big is still to “just shut up and eat and lift heavy”. For those who have it in them. that is enough.

I agree that is the best advice for young people with good genetics. It’s not always the best advice for people in their 30s-50s with crappy genetics.

You’ve seen great results personally, but you started young and have unusually good genetics. Following the same path as you is not going to lead to the same result, for most people on these boards.[/quote]

But…most of the people on this board barely look like they even lift weights regularly…and genetics are not to blame for that.

I also cringe when people talk about my “unusually good genetics” because no one was talking about them when I was in high school. I look like this because I am “unusually persistent and consistent” in my food intake and training. I spent several years just working on size instead if “bulking and cutting” every six weeks like some here which leads to them running in circles.

If half of these people put as much into this as I did, you would see more people with “unusually good genetics” around than you do right now.

70

[quote]hawaiilifterMike wrote:
Dave_ wrote:
Ghost22 wrote:
Don’t hate on cookies, ice cream, or fast food.

When used sparingly they’re great ways to add calories and get bigger and stronger.

+1

I make sure I get my protein in first during a meal, then it’s a free-for-all to top up the kcals.

AND Anyone giving advice in these sorts of threads should have at least 1 pic on display (cough hawiimike and headhunter cough)

I can’t speak for Headhunter, but my current pics are on this page

I am embarrassed to say that although I do lift weights, as many have observed before, I do not look like I do. I used to blame my genetics and make excuses, but after reading some threads here and on T-Cell Alpha, I realize I look like this because I train like a pre-pubescent little girl/bitch. The one positive thing that have come from reading threads on this forum is that I now take full responsibility for myself looking like shit. That’s a start…[/quote]

I’m 55 years old and have no interest anymore in carrying bodyweight of any sort. I’m currently 6’7" and 245/250 (down from 295), with thyroid disease. As most here will discover, your heart really doesn’t care if the weight is muscle or fat, it just penalizes you for being big. I stay VERY lean and can see my abs. I’m happy with that.

71

[quote]forlife wrote:
Professor X wrote:
That means the best advice to truly get big is still to “just shut up and eat and lift heavy”. For those who have it in them. that is enough.

I agree that is the best advice for young people with good genetics. It’s not always the best advice for people in their 30s-50s with crappy genetics.

You’ve seen great results personally, but you started young and have unusually good genetics. Following the same path as you is not going to lead to the same result, for most people on these boards.[/quote]

So you are concerned that 40 year olds are coming in here like: “hmm, I think I want to be a 280 lb bodybuilder”, and getting fat as a result of the advice given here? Come on, adults are supposed to have a little more common sense than this. Most of the guys here are young, and certainly most of the ones asking basic questions about nutrition are young.

I don’t see how anyone who reads these boards regularly could misunderstand what is meant by “eating big.” Though I’ll concede the point that some are slower than most. lol

72

[quote]Professor X wrote:
I look like this because I am “unusually persistent and consistent” in my food intake and training. [/quote]

You started young, which makes a big difference. A lot of the guys here are at least twice the age you were when you first started hitting the iron.

On genetics, I know guys that have eaten well over maintenance and busted their ass in the gym for years, but are nowhere near your size.

Is that an excuse not to develop the best physique possible, given limitations from age and genetics? Of course not. But you have to be realistic as well. The majority of guys here are a lot older than you were when you started, and probably don’t have the same genetics. They are not going to get as big as you, no matter how much they eat or workout.

73

[quote]forlife wrote:
Professor X wrote:
I look like this because I am “unusually persistent and consistent” in my food intake and training.

You started young, which makes a big difference. A lot of the guys here are at least twice the age you were when you first started hitting the iron.

On genetics, I know guys that have eaten well over maintenance and busted their ass in the gym for years, but are nowhere near your size.

Is that an excuse not to develop the best physique possible, given limitations from age and genetics? Of course not. But you have to be realistic as well. The majority of guys here are a lot older than you were when you started, and probably don’t have the same genetics. They are not going to get as big as you, no matter how much they eat or workout.[/quote]

But age is not ignored here. I have written too many times to count that I don’t think most people need to be all out “bulking up” much over the age of 30-35.

That is WHY I keep harping on the fact that these guys need to stop all of this talk about “slow gains” and realize they only have about 10 good years to make the most of it and gain as much as possible. If they fuck around all of the way through their 20’s, they will NOT be able to take full advantage of their genetic potential.

This has been explained in detail too many times so I am not even sure why we are discussing it now.

This is a bodybuilding forum. When I speak, it is for those with the goal of gaining some serious fucking size. It is NOT for 40 year olds who just started lifting but think they will still gain 100lbs of lean body mass.

Some of this shit is common sense.

74

Most of the time I see “just shut up and eat!” on these boards, there is no caveat about age or genetics. Instead, it’s treated like the universal solution for anyone wanting to be a bodybuilder. It may seem like common sense that your advice only applies to a limited group, but common sense isn’t very common with newbies.

I think you’re doing a lot of good by motivating the younger guys to make the most of their growth window while they have it. Not everyone is in that target group, though.

And not being in that target group doesn’t make people any less of a bodybuilder. You can be a bodybuilder at any age or genetic potential, the point is to make the most of what you have.

75

[quote]forlife wrote:
Most of the time I see “just shut up and eat!” on these boards, there is no caveat about age or genetics. Instead, it’s treated like the universal solution for anyone wanting to be a bodybuilder. It may seem like common sense that your advice only applies to a limited group, but common sense isn’t very common with newbies.

I think you’re doing a lot of good by motivating the younger guys to make the most of their growth window while they have it. Not everyone is in that target group, though.

And not being in that target group doesn’t make people any less of a bodybuilder. You can be a bodybuilder at any age or genetic potential, the point is to make the most of what you have.
[/quote]

Gee, you see it because the majority of these guys ARE in their 20’s or younger and you can see that by how they fucking write.

I think it is you who underestimates people like me. I deal with people all day long and am generally very good at reading people from limited info. We aren’t talking about what every trolling poster writes on this board as a response. They do not speak for me so their words are irrelevant to this discussion. How many times have you seen me tell someone in their fucking 40’s to bulk up like someone in their 20’s?

Ever?

76

Are you the only person that tells people to “just shut up and eat?”. I see it all the time here, and while you may be more careful to target it to guys in their 20s with good genetic potential, a lot of posters don’t.

77

[quote]Headhunter wrote:
hawaiilifterMike wrote:
Dave_ wrote:
Ghost22 wrote:
Don’t hate on cookies, ice cream, or fast food.

When used sparingly they’re great ways to add calories and get bigger and stronger.

+1

I make sure I get my protein in first during a meal, then it’s a free-for-all to top up the kcals.

AND Anyone giving advice in these sorts of threads should have at least 1 pic on display (cough hawiimike and headhunter cough)

I can’t speak for Headhunter, but my current pics are on this page

I am embarrassed to say that although I do lift weights, as many have observed before, I do not look like I do. I used to blame my genetics and make excuses, but after reading some threads here and on T-Cell Alpha, I realize I look like this because I train like a pre-pubescent little girl/bitch. The one positive thing that have come from reading threads on this forum is that I now take full responsibility for myself looking like shit. That’s a start…

I’m 55 years old and have no interest anymore in carrying bodyweight of any sort. I’m currently 6’7" and 245/250 (down from 295), with thyroid disease. As most here will discover, your heart really doesn’t care if the weight is muscle or fat, it just penalizes you for being big. I stay VERY lean and can see my abs. I’m happy with that.
[/quote]

If that makes you happy, then go for it. Just don’t treat everyone else here like they “have no interest anymore in carrying bodyweight of any sort”. This is a fucking bodybuilding forum. I seem to keep needing to remind you of this point.

It’s true that the body doesn’t “care” whether you are carrying muscle or fat. However, what makes the difference is that simply gaining fat does not condition the heart, whereas the kind of training “we” (I use that term loosely) go through to gain substantial muscle mass DOES condition the heart to function perfectly well with the increase in bodymass.

For instance, an incidental finding on an echo I had a year or so ago showed that I had developed PHYSIOLOGICAL CARDIOMEGALY. In my case, this presented as an increase in ventricular volume, and ventricular wall thickness. These are positive adaptations that occur in response to carrying extra bodyweight, not the more commonly seen increased wall thickness and flaccidity associated with hypertensives and such.

Perhaps you did it wrong.

78

Oh damn Dave_ going Bill Nye the science guy on these people:D.

79

[quote]tribunaldude wrote:
In conclusion, allow yourself to “bulk up” ONLY if you know you are young enough
AND have the genetic inclination to hold on to size while dieting down
AND the frame to not look fat in everyday clothes after gaining 30-40 pounds of bodyweight (narrow clavicles and wide hips = a LOT of grief while you’re gaining bodyweight) unless you have the patience to build heavy deltoids over the next 10-12 years or so.
AND if you have the “add weight to the bar” mindset
AND if you have a clue how to make your muscles grow (understand movements within your first year or so of training).

if you satisfy most or all of these conditions, bulking up naturally is a possible solution to try and gain as much size as your body will allow you. [/quote]

Hopefully satisfying 4 out of those 5 conditions will be good enough since I just turned 33. There’s only one way to find out, so we’ll see about that.

80

If I never found this site, and then never read the comments, and never read the Prof’s posts, I would never be anywhere near where I’m at now.

I always knew I had decent genetics, but I would have continued to under-eat for the rest of my days.

I meet 5/5 of the conditions tribunaldude laid out. I’ve gained 20lbs in the past 3 months and have a long way to go. Check out my log for pics.