[quote]Bill Roberts wrote:
I don’t know if Poliquin is right that the obliques have relatively less potential for development than the rest of the body, as for example I’ve had a lot of improvement there, but if that is so then perhaps it stands to reason that men who lived back then that were muscular without any weight training might have proportionally greater obliques than those today who weight-train, as basically they had to have had outstanding genetics to look that way with nothing except as you say wrestling or whatever.
The reasoning being that someone today with the same size overall musculature with weight training would be far smaller than these men if not for the weight training, with the obliques, if Poliquin is correct, not matching up to the rest of the development.[/quote]
It is believed that they lifted weights to some degree even back then. I am sure it was nothing close to what we consider regular training, but it isn’t like the Greeks were completely cluless about building muscle and strength.
I figured the thick obliques had to do with wrestlers needing a lot of dynamic and static “twist” strength. I thought it could be due to a cultural/aesthetic preference as well – maybe the Ancient Greeks didn’t worry about overdeveloping obliques? As to what Poliquin says, I don’t know one way or the other. I think my obliques were thicker when I wrestled, but that in itself says nothing, as a whole host of other factors are different.
Tried searching for links that gave specific info. regarding Ancient Greek athletic training. Didn’t find a lot that was specific, but did find some sociologically interesting information about ‘the games’ and how athletes were viewed:
I think it was in a classical lit class that a prof said to us that the ancient games – the Olympic games, esp. – were like a cross between the games as we think of them and an especially Hedonistic Woodstock (spectators camped out in the surrounding countryside for days, drinking and having orgies). I’ve not done any scholarship of my own to support this. Ahem.
I did find this one tidbit about weight training –
“The relationship between resistance exercises and muscle strength has been known for centuries. In ancient Greece, Milo the wrestler used progressive resistance exercises to improve his strength. His original method consisted of lifting a calf each day until it reached its full growth and this technique provides probably the first example of progressive resistance exercises.”
– also found that ancient Egyptian and Greek societies had weightlifting contests, and that the Greeks supposedly invented dumbells (or at least coined the term); the first one’s being rods with large bells suspended from the ends, their clappers removed so they wouldn’t sound (hence ‘dumb’).
I figured the thick obliques had to do with wrestlers needing a lot of dynamic and static “twist” strength. I thought it could be due to a cultural/aesthetic preference as well – maybe the Ancient Greeks didn’t worry about overdeveloping obliques? As to what Poliquin says, I don’t know one way or the other. I think my obliques were thicker when I wrestled, but that in itself says nothing, as a whole host of other factors are different.
Tried searching for links that gave specific info. regarding Ancient Greek athletic training. Didn’t find a lot that was specific, but did find some sociologically interesting information about ‘the games’ and how athletes were viewed:
I think it was in a classical lit class that a prof said to us that the ancient games – the Olympic games, esp. – were like a cross between the games as we think of them and an especially Hedonistic Woodstock (spectators camped out in the surrounding countryside for days, drinking and having orgies). I’ve not done any scholarship of my own to support this. Ahem.
I did find this one tidbit about weight training –
“The relationship between resistance exercises and muscle strength has been known for centuries. In ancient Greece, Milo the wrestler used progressive resistance exercises to improve his strength. His original method consisted of lifting a calf each day until it reached its full growth and this technique provides probably the first example of progressive resistance exercises.”
– also found that ancient Egyptian and Greek societies had weightlifting contests, and that the Greeks supposedly invented dumbells (or at least coined the term); the first one’s being rods with large bells suspended from the ends, their clappers removed so they wouldn’t sound (hence ‘dumb’). [/quote]
wow can’t believe this thread made it up to the first page again