Was thinking of going into mountaindog training, john meadows style of training, but not sure if that is only effective for lifters on gear. Just a thought
Props, man! To my eyes, youâve gained some overall weight, which is awesome for just two-three months of solid training. All the proportions seem to be the same, but it looks like your legs are bigger, your back is a bit bigger, and your chest, arms, and shoulders have kept pace. Your forearms have gotten, in my opinion, the most noticeable change.
As for using Mountain Dog trainingâŠIâll give my two cents - hopefully others weigh in too.
Iâll start by saying that John Meadows himself has stated that his programs are not for beginners. In this article, he explains his definitions of beginner, intermediate, and advanced. Just below those definitions, he pretty much says that Mountain Dog training isnât for someone who is still a beginner. Iâll let you be the judge of where you stand with that.
I donât think you need to pay anyone for a programâŠthereâs just too much free information on the internet. For example, use these articles on T-Nation to learn how a Meadows-esque program would be formed.
I am a big believer in the whole âget the most from the leastâ principle. Having said that, I believe that training solidly for three months and then jumping straight into Mountain Dog training isnât going to get you the most from the least. If you like what you read in Johnâs articles, I would suggest continuing to do what you are currently doing, but change some of the exercises to those that John recommends OR keep the same exercises but adopt the rep schemes he recommends OR keep your training the same and integrate his nutritional advice into your life.
My advice is to make the smallest changes possible, give it two to three months, and then analyze your results. Especially while youâre still relatively new to the bodybuilding world because the gains and changes will come as long as you are being consistent.
As for his programs only working for guys on gear: I believe that many of his programs will work for anybody who tries them. I also believe that some of his programs have such high volume or high frequency that a natural person would be hard-pressed to recover properly in order to get the most out of the program. The advice he advocates in his T-Nation articles are just great for a natural lifter (in my opinion.
Hope this helps man. Hopefully the others will chime in with their opinions. Keep being consistent and remember that changes and gains are long-termâŠthey donât happen in a month.
Seems like things are moving in the right direction!
Just my thoughts here, reading all this makes me think youâre overcomplicating your training. At your age and experience, I think the most important thing will be training consistency and making sure your eating habits are in line. I do NOT think you should start Mountain Dog style training. You donât need to be on gear, but I think to get anything out of those programs you should be an experienced lifter with a lot of strength, have a well established MMC, and just more time under the bar in general. Donât get too caught up in fancy shmancy training minutiae. If anything, I think you could simplify your training to something more along these lines: A Tried and True Bodybuilding Program Template - T Nation Content - COMMUNITY - T NATION.
As far as nutrition, since youâre not competing yet, I think you should focus on maintenance and just getting stronger in the gym. âBulking and cuttingâ phases are really overblown and most people donât utilize them properly. Just focus on good eating habits, nail your training and get stronger. Keep it up!
Wow, thank you for that response. I think my decision to want to change was more out of boredom and after reading what you said I will most likely just keep doing what I am doing as it is working. I think I just stumbled across his stuff and fell in love, had a moment of judging of my impulse, and wanted to make the switch. As for his programs, Iâd like to think Iâm no longer a beginner, but that would probably solely be based on my lifts, not my physique, which in that regard I assume I would still be a beginner. You are absolutely right, my best bet is to continue doing what I am doing really. I havenât really read into the nutrition side, I know he is a big believer in intra-workout, but that is because his workouts are such high volume, might not be of much use for me. Back to the grind, 2-3 months and we will see where I stand. So would you advise me to continue trying to add size right now? Or should I try to trim away the fat? Thank you so much I really do appreciate the input.
you are right, I tend to overanalyze in most aspects of my life, not just training, a flaw I got to work on:sweat_smile:. I will definitely not start the mountain dog training and will really try to just simplify everything. I will eat at maintenance, train hard for the next 2-3 months, and check back in. Thank you very much for this, I really do appreciate it, as you can see I overcomplicate things, so hearing your guysâ respected opinions puts me right on track, thank you!
I think you can do a bit of both. Getting both results will depend on your nutrition. @robstein said it best when he said to focus on maintenance. If you know your maintenance calories, add 10% to it and thatâs all the surplus youâll need. If you focus most of your carbs around your workout, your body will use the carbs immediately, rather than trying to hang onto them for later use.
Since T-Nation doesnât allow external linksâŠthis might get deleted. But, because John Meadows is loved by T-Nation, maybe this link will stand. Check out the Peri-Workout Nutrition section on Johnâs website.
Also wanted to add here that when you hit your body with a ton of stimuli it later has nowhere to go and you stall for a long while. This is where do the least you can comes into play. If you can get mad results off of a minimal program, you can keep adding and adding and continue to grow over the course of a few years. You have a great base brother and I will be following along for the ride. Great work mayne
Thank you very much, man. The whole theme of doing the least to get the most is syncing in, will definitely apply it.
Wow, thank you very much!
Hey:
Just wanted to echo what others are saying, nothing new. Stay the course, think slow, clean "bulk (slight excess), make little changes to see what works.
Hopping programs is disaster. Making small changes, both to workout and diet, is key.
Keep it up, making gainzz!
Will definitely just stay on the program I am running now and will adjust my calories to a 10% surplus, thanks!
Late to the show, sorryâŠ
Ok, like Rob mentioned, Iâm also not a fan of âbulkingâ because no matter what training program you follow, what magic dietary plans you employ, you canât force feed your body into growing muscle at a rate quicker than it biologically can if all your nutrient requirements are being met. With that said (and I know Iâve reiterated it countless times over the years -lol), I think youâve made some decent progress, and so long as you continue to follow a decent training approach, with consistency and hard work, youâll continue to progress. I will emphasize that the whole :train for strength" angle doesnât always help if youâre missing out on actually making the muscle do the work. By that, I mean the âbodybuilding styleâ approach of sufficient volume, avoiding deloading the target muscles (non-lockout work), and the appreciation of time under tension vs just moving the weight from point A to point B. Once this clicks for you, itâs amazing how much everything changes.
Diet wise, I suggest ensuring that youâre hitting all of your requirements; enough protein, enough healthy fats, and enough carbs to power through your training but not pile on fat where you have to continually convince yourself that itâs âmostly muscleâ.
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So after getting back from vacation, and rereading this thread, I believe it would be best for me to simplify. I am going to run the template program you have suggested, the clay hyght one, as well as eat at maintenance calories. I think the time away allowed me to clear my head and reevaluate my over complication of everything in regards to training. Should I now be placing more emphasis on the mmc vs. just moving the weight? Or is it more of progressively overloading but doing it while still feeling the target muscle work? Thanks!
Progressive overload is fine, BUT, if youâre not moving the weight with the muscles youâre trying to target, you wonât see the results youâre really after. Once you âgetâ mmc, youâll realize the difference between just moving the weight from point A to point B and actually having tension on your target muscle during the entire set.
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