djl, what we are trying to tell you is that supplements are not the answer, not a majic bullet. Most people who lift think that they are eating “well” or “enough” but when you actually do the numbers, you’d laugh at how little they’re actually eating compared to what they need.
Lifting programs must be varied often to keep your body adapting and growing.
Post your body stats, weight, height, fat percentage or a pic so we have an idea of where you are, and we’ll be able to help you.
[quote]sharetrader wrote:
Read the Anabolic Diet thread (all 40 pages of it!). Then get eating.[/quote]
I haven’t read everything in this thread, but I can’t think of a diet that would be worse for someone so heavily involved in athletics.
The Skinny Bastard Diet would be a better choice in this case.
Now go eat!
[quote]djl wrote:
… what type of suppliments would I use after the 6-8 weeks of working out on your critiqued diet? [/quote]
Why don’t you get the eating part down and come back in 6-8 weeks and ask this question?
Worrying about supplements at this point is a complete waste. If you’re not gaining it’s because of your diet!
[quote]djl wrote:
Are their any supplements that won’t stunt your growth but that will help me build muscle mass?[/quote]
yeah food and eat alot of it work out and eat and workout and eat and workout.if youre young enough to worry about stunting youre growth you dont need supps.
[quote]ChrisKing wrote:
sharetrader wrote:
Read the Anabolic Diet thread (all 40 pages of it!). Then get eating.
I haven’t read everything in this thread, but I can’t think of a diet that would be worse for someone so heavily involved in athletics.
The Skinny Bastard Diet would be a better choice in this case.
Now go eat![/quote]
The anabolic diet can work fine for athletes. I’m not an expert or anything, but I recall at least a couple of posters saying if anything it helped their performance. I do think if the original poster is already having trouble eating enough food, then there is no chance of him eating as much as the AD requires.
I can’t wait to see a reply of:
"
breakfast: coca cola
lunch: school fries
dinner: what mom makes
"
[quote]ChrisKing wrote:
sharetrader wrote:
Read the Anabolic Diet thread (all 40 pages of it!). Then get eating.
I haven’t read everything in this thread, but I can’t think of a diet that would be worse for someone so heavily involved in athletics.[quote]
Why?
Again, why?
The rationale for the Anabolic Diet is to promote muscle growth by minimising carb burning and maximising fat burning. This is achieved by having a high fat diet, which in turn increases the activity of fat burning enzymes and reduces the fat deposition activities of insulin. Thus you build muscle but don’t deposit fat. Conventional diet, when in caloric overload, tends to deposit fat as well as building muscle (assuming you are working out). This (conversion of carbs to body fat to supply future energy needs) is one of the main functions of insulin. With a high carb diet, it is much trickier to balance the calorie load to avoid fat buildup.
[quote]Massif wrote:
I can honestly see why parents are concerned about steriods when about half the posts in the steriod forum are like this one.
quote]
I can’t agree more,posts like this are kinda frightening.
Okay first off,you asked for advice you’ve been given it.It seems to me that you came on here almost looking for someone to say,hell yeah juice up kid.You can’t be any older than 17-18 at most and you wanna use steroids,when obviously you don’t know the first thing about them.I believe Rainjack started his first cycle not too long ago and he’s been training probably for longer than you’ve been alive.Follow the advice given on these boards,eat big,lift heavy and all that stuff.I find it incredibly hard to believe that as a teenager you’ve hit any type of ceiling whatsoever,no matter how long you’ve been training. Train for another 10 years or so,during that time…research,know every pro and con thats involved and what the potential dangers could be.
BTW,I know that there are probably plenty of dumb kids out there doing it but does anyone else think that juicing for high school sports is pretty much cheating?
[quote]Boridi wrote:
I can’t wait to see a reply of:
"
breakfast: coca cola
lunch: school fries
dinner: what mom makes
"[/quote]
That is very funny but sorry I have a strict no coke rule during trainning and espicially during sports … I drink probably about one coke a month … now as for the eating stuff … here you are …
Breakfast: I have 2 scrambled eggs, 2 slices of bacon, 2 pecies of toast, an apple or a peach, and a cup of orange juice with water, I have that all most every morning …
Lunch: I usually have a ham and cheese sandwich, an apple, banna, and whatever vegtable the cafeteria has that day, plus a gatorade, water bottle and a protein shake sometimes
Dinner: (what mom fixes) we always have some source of protein, 2 vegtables, sometimes fruit and water to drink
tell me what you think of that? I will take no critisism … be honest and tell me if I need to change my eating habbits even it is every meal … I really appreciate this website and thank you for all of your help so far …
[quote]K-Narf wrote:
Massif wrote:
I can honestly see why parents are concerned about steriods when about half the posts in the steriod forum are like this one.
quote]
I can’t agree more,posts like this are kinda frightening.
Okay first off,you asked for advice you’ve been given it.It seems to me that you came on here almost looking for someone to say,hell yeah juice up kid.You can’t be any older than 17-18 at most and you wanna use steroids,when obviously you don’t know the first thing about them.I believe Rainjack started his first cycle not too long ago and he’s been training probably for longer than you’ve been alive.Follow the advice given on these boards,eat big,lift heavy and all that stuff.I find it incredibly hard to believe that as a teenager you’ve hit any type of ceiling whatsoever,no matter how long you’ve been training. Train for another 10 years or so,during that time…research,know every pro and con thats involved and what the potential dangers could be.
BTW,I know that there are probably plenty of dumb kids out there doing it but does anyone else think that juicing for high school sports is pretty much cheating?[/quote]
I agree with you on cheating and I thank you for advice … I was only intending to use gear to get me over the hump I had gotten to … I was not going to use it for basketball … I just wanted to get over the hump so I could get bigger …
Here is my lifting story … I am 5’ 5" and about 110 lbs. … not very big … i started the BFS program in 7th grade at my school and have been lifting for 4 years now including sticking with the program over the summer … I started off benching 45 lbs. in other words the bar … I deep squated 90 lbs. … not very much … but throught the first two and a half years I did improve slowly … my arms became stronger and so did my legs … after two and a half years I was gaining in weight slowly but surely … but then it seemed I hit a stopping point after 2 and a half years … I had been gaining in bench press and was now at 80 lbs. … however this is where it stopped … I kept slowly improving in all the areas … even slower now cause things were getting harder … but for some reason my arm strength just stopped … I stayed at that amount of weight for two years now and I am just frustrated because all my piers are gaining and I’m staying put.
Bench is pretty much my only problem … I now can bench 85 lbs. steadly but I dont know I just havent seemed to be able to get over that hump … I tried to bench 90 lbs. on tuesday and got the first set of 10 but couldn’t get the second set … I now deep squat 135 lbs. … which is my best lift aside from box squat which I lift 185 lbs. … basically I am just frustrated at this point because I’m not developing and my piers are.
So there you have it the whole story … I didn’t want you guys to tell me I could take roids and everything would be great … I want to grow but I also want to develope … So any information at this point is a help … I appreciate every one who has responded to this thread and just thanks again for all your help …
[quote]djl wrote:
Boridi wrote:
I can’t wait to see a reply of:
"
breakfast: coca cola
lunch: school fries
dinner: what mom makes
"
That is very funny but sorry I have a strict no coke rule during trainning and espicially during sports … I drink probably about one coke a month … now as for the eating stuff … here you are …
Breakfast: I have 2 scrambled eggs, 2 slices of bacon, 2 pecies of toast, an apple or a peach, and a cup of orange juice with water, I have that all most every morning …
Lunch: I usually have a ham and cheese sandwich, an apple, banna, and whatever vegtable the cafeteria has that day, plus a gatorade, water bottle and a protein shake sometimes
Dinner: (what mom fixes) we always have some source of protein, 2 vegtables, sometimes fruit and water to drink
tell me what you think of that? I will take no critisism … be honest and tell me if I need to change my eating habbits even it is every meal … I really appreciate this website and thank you for all of your help so far …[/quote]
Dude - I don’t believe that you are eating enough. Pure and simple. Do some actual research on how much food the human body needs to grow and put on muscle. It’s a lot!!!
Have a look at Massive Eating by Berardi (under the Authors Tab on the left). Read about what he says you need to eat with regard to cutting, maintence and bulking.
Have a look at the caloric and macro breakdown of what you are eating now, and what you need to be eating to bulk up.
If you feed the machine, it will grow.
djl,
Honestly, you are eating like a sparrow. There is no way you are eating enough to get the progress you want.
Perhaps if you doubled your food intake you might be on the right track.
Don’t worry about a complicated dietary plan at this point – you can do that if and when you put on some mass.
Don’t worry about putting on some minor amount of fat. If you want to grow you’ll probably have to say goodbye to your abs.
Something that you can do, that is probably convenient and may be acceptable to your parents also, is take some almonds and cashews or other healthy nuts to school.
They don’t go bad, they don’t need refrigeration and you can probably eat them just about any time of day whenever you can steal a moment. They are also very calorie dense.
[quote]djl wrote:
Boridi wrote:
I can’t wait to see a reply of:
"
breakfast: coca cola
lunch: school fries
dinner: what mom makes
"
That is very funny but sorry I have a strict no coke rule during trainning and espicially during sports … I drink probably about one coke a month … now as for the eating stuff … here you are …
Breakfast: I have 2 scrambled eggs, 2 slices of bacon, 2 pecies of toast, an apple or a peach, and a cup of orange juice with water, I have that all most every morning …
Lunch: I usually have a ham and cheese sandwich, an apple, banna, and whatever vegtable the cafeteria has that day, plus a gatorade, water bottle and a protein shake sometimes
Dinner: (what mom fixes) we always have some source of protein, 2 vegtables, sometimes fruit and water to drink
tell me what you think of that? I will take no critisism … be honest and tell me if I need to change my eating habbits even it is every meal … I really appreciate this website and thank you for all of your help so far …[/quote]
You obviously did not read the articles on this site.
That should be your first step…
[quote]djl wrote:
… now as for the eating stuff … here you are …
Breakfast: I have 2 scrambled eggs, 2 slices of bacon, 2 pecies of toast, an apple or a peach, and a cup of orange juice with water, I have that all most every morning …
Lunch: I usually have a ham and cheese sandwich, an apple, banna, and whatever vegtable the cafeteria has that day, plus a gatorade, water bottle and a protein shake sometimes
Dinner: (what mom fixes) we always have some source of protein, 2 vegtables, sometimes fruit and water to drink
tell me what you think of that? I will take no critisism … be honest and tell me if I need to change my eating habbits even it is every meal … I really appreciate this website and thank you for all of your help so far …[/quote]
If you are serious about gaining, you need to substantially increase your food intake. This can be difficult when you don’t buy your own food. A good way to increase your calorie intake in this situation might be to drink milk (lots of it). Try about a gallon a day. The squats and milk regime is an old standby for putting on mass.
It will also help if you can eat more meat and eggs. For starters, try doubling your breakfast eggs and bacon. For lunch, try to get more ham and cheese on that sandwich. Hardboil a few eggs and take them with your for lunch.
This may not be easy at first if you are not used to this amount of food. Build up to it gradually. The milk is a good place to start, as you can just replace everything else you drink with milk.
[quote]SWR-1222D wrote:
Steroid thread:
http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do?id=354419
Begginers thread (great info for anyone, not just begginers):
http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do?id=640350
Those are 2 very good threads to look through. Taking the time to read through them will be well worth it.[/quote]
Maybe my other post on the first page was too wordy, so I’ll reiderate the 2 threads I pointed out above.
DJL, i just graduated from high school last year and played football (in Sou FL, no less, very competitive). I can honestly tell you that even though you think you are eating right, you arent. I thought i ate right and just couldnt break thru the 180 lb. point, i took lots of supplements, tried all sorts of workouts, etc. but when i finally just started slamming food down my mouth whenever i could, i gained over 30 lbs in the last 8 months or so, and i didnt get fat, shit i had abs at 205 (dont tell prof X, i know he hates the “a” word, lol).
At our age, this game is all about eating a shit pile of food and doing heavy compound exercises (hey, it turned out these old guys do know a thing or two). If your coaches cant except that the training that they are giving you isnt right (which i’m sure it actually is) maybe consider an outside gym. otherwise, man you’re just going to have to force your body to grow, cuz it damn sure isnt gonna slap on muscle like you want on its own, good luck, and stay awaysrom the gear until its necessary (no sooner than like 24-25 years old), you’ll be happy that you did.
Djl. eat more. a LOT more. Check out Berardi’s site for the caloric intake calculator if you really want to see how much you need and then add up what you’re actually eating. It’s no surprise that you aren’t growing on that diet.
Like everyone else is saying: Gear and supps are not required at your level. If you really want to supplement now: a good multi-vitamin/mineral, protein shakes or bars as snacks, and maybe add a teaspoon of creatine to your post-workout drink. At the very least, double your food intake by eating more frequent meals and see how you respond over a the next month. It should be easy at your age. Just Eat.
[quote]Kruiser wrote:
Like everyone else is saying: Gear and supps are not required at your level. If you really want to supplement now: a good multi-vitamin/mineral, protein shakes or bars as snacks, and maybe add a teaspoon of creatine to your post-workout drink. At the very least, double your food intake by eating more frequent meals and see how you respond over a the next month. It should be easy at your age. Just Eat.[/quote]
I had also heard about creatine … Where can I order it?
O, and Im eating a ton more now guys … thanks for all the advice … ive almost doubled my intake and im stickin with it!
JB had a great interview on GrapplersNutrition.com where he lays out for athletes what they need to do to kick butt. He discusses extensively the use of supplements. Here’s the link - grab a paper and pen and take some notes.
www.grapplersnutrition.com/johnberardi1.mp3
And go to the Beginner’s forum and read Vroom’s Are you a Beginner II thread.