So my stats are
Male, 16, 5’9, 155 pounds and around id say 20%bf?? I have pictures on my first post although the pics were in good light.
Max bench is barely 135
Squat max:245
Deadlift no max
Lat pulldowns i do 120llb for around 7-8 rep range
Overhead press barbell:95
Dumbell overhead max : 100 barely
So im taking your advise and bulking but how strong should i get to have a “Solid foundation of muscle” to go with when i cut
Someone said this on my first post so based on strength when would i be considered to have “a base of muscle”
I’d say a base of solid strength would be 315 squat, 225 bench and a 405 deadlift and maybe a 185 OHP. Considering your age them numbers are going to take time to achieve. I wouldn’t bulk aggressively but eat in a surplus slightly.
Not really sure what strength numbers have to do with when you should cut.
I hit a 405x3 deadlift, 225x3 bench, 308x3 squat and could put bodyweight overhead for reps when I was 68kg and not particularly lean and certainly didn’t look like I lifted.
I’m going to give you the only advice I find suitable but it’s not what you want to hear. Find another hobby, this one is not for you.
Agreed with the above, but 315x5, 225x5, 405x5. I think 185 OHP is a reach because most of the guys I know don’t OHP that much, and they’re benching high 300’s, squatting 500’s, and deadlifting 5/600s.
In my opinion, the “stats for a base of muscle” should be Based Around the Amount Muscles. Not the lifts. Lots of guys with big muscles don’t deadlift. Or they do seated presses with limited ROM instead of Standing Pressing.
Use something like that (kinda silly) ffmi scale to evaluate how much of muscles you have. Re-evaluate every so often to monitor your progress. That scale is rediculous to use to determine who’s on or not on steroids, or what your genetics are like, or whatever nonsense Ewe Tube says.
But if you measure consistently, do the calculations, and your number goes up, you are more muscley.
If there was a standard for how much you should lift before worrying about your aesthetic appearance - and there isn’t - you wouldn’t be there. You can be strong and lean without benching, squatting, or deadlifting, but you’re just so far off the mark, attitude-wise, I’m going to side with @kd13 here.
I don’t think I’ve ever met a single person who can bench press high 300’s and not OHP 185. That sounds literally insane to me, and honestly, I think you’re lying. I also think you’re lying about having lots of friends who bench high 300’s. Maybe if someone else is helping them the way your ‘friend’ helped you bench more. But I can tell you from my own powerlifting experience, that I could OHP MUCH more than 185 when I could bench anything over about 370, and I didn’t even practice OHP.
And please, for the love of God stop starting a new thread every day.
EDIT: LOL I thought I was responding to the OP.
You’re more credible than he is, so I’ll throw you some benefit of the doubt. Do you really know people who suck that much at OHP and bench high 3’s? I’m trying to picture that, and it just doesn’t make sense to me. That’s 185 is HALF of a high 3’s bench. And the 2 lifts use mostly the same muscles. Even when I sucked at OHP and never did it in training, I could do 200+ when I was that good at bench.
He’s a big exorcist archer with a 2 inch ROM, only benches, and hardly does any OHP work, so I can see why his OHP is only 185. He’s one example, I think the other guys are in their 200s for OHP.
Most people I know suck at OHP because they don’t prioritize it. Many of them also claim that OHP doesn’t have “carryover” to Bench, which I don’t agree with…
You have a base of muscle when you have a base of muscle. Strength isn’t really a factor. Think of where you’ll be after dropping 10-20 (or more) pounds. You need to be carrying at least some muscle in the first place, otherwise you up up skinny, small, and flabby.
It’s not a strictly measurable thing like “16-inch arms and 26-inch quads before cutting.” It’s more of a “know it when you see it”-thing. In general, teens should focus on sticking with consistent training and eating habits. Not bulking or cutting for weeks/months at a time. Train hard and smart 3-5 days a week, eat 3 meals a day 7 days a week, and your physique will improve whether you’re starting off chubby or underweight.
FWIW, the reason this thread didn’t get moved into his “main” thread is that the question is at least broad enough that it could be useful for other beginners.
I don’t know if it does or not. I’ve never consistently trained both lifts at the same time. I can tell you that my OHP went up without training it when I was just benching alot. I can also tell you that now that I barely train bench, but train OHP all the time, my bench is less than what it used to be. But I don’t really know what that means, because my bench was so far ahead of OHP at one point.
The lifts are clearly related. Front delts, triceps, all the stabilizer muscles involved. All of that is important to both lifts. So there’s clearly plenty of correlation. As with any lift, you fail because of the weakest link in the chain. So the degree to which one lift helps the other is largely based on why you’re failing either lift. So like, if I keep bringing up my shoulder strength, but my chest sucks and is the reason I’m failing on bench, continuing to improve my shoulders will have diminishing returns on the bench press.
When I was training at commercial gyms, I stopped benching for almost 4 months and just did OHP. I wasn’t even OHPing that much - 3x8-10 of 115, and my bench was back to where I left off in a few weeks. Around this time, my bench max was 260, and I hit 275 after another few weeks. Not an accurate max, but I tested my OHP right after that to plan out an OHP Smolov Jr (which I never did) and only hit 145x2 or 3.
I trained both a few months ago in a DUP format, along with slingshot bench and push press. I recently hit a daily minimum of 280. Missed 285 recently though, and 287 on duffalo too (this being in a Bulgarian-ish format)
I’m currently in meet prep, so I’m going to prioritize bench press, but I’m going to try to do a Bulgarian-ish program on Trap Bar Deadlift and OHP just for fun after the meet is over.
Dude just stop, youve started like 7 topics all asking the same shit and people have been trying to help you and giving you the same answers everytime. Just stop posting and listen ffs.
You totally just hopped around to whatever was closest to what you wanted to hear…
Not only that, but you also lowered the standards for yourself. He said 315 squat and 185 OHP, where did you get 300 and 150 from?
But ima tell you, YOUNGBLOOD @kickassgum that there’s nothing impressive about a 315 squat, 225 bench, or 405 deadlift, or a 155 ohp. Feel free to pursue these numbers if it helps you put on some decent muscle though.
At your age, height, weight, and especially you bf % guesstimate, i’d say you dont need to be worried with cutting or bulking. Pick a good strentgh program, bust your ass in the gym, and eat half decent. And stop looking in the mirror. I’m sure all the more experienced guys here will tell you, or have already. This stuff is a marathon, not a sprint, and people looking for a miracle way to get jacked and shredded in a matter of a few months often end up dissapointed and frustrated.
