Spidey: Back in Black

[flipcollar]

[quote]ryanbCXG wrote:

[quote]flipcollar wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

4. FlipCollar, I’m not sure about the sugar they. I’ve never really monitored my sugar intake, just overall carb intake. Why do you think it hinders fat loss? I’m not being a smart-ass, I just don’t know why it would.

[/quote]

I’m sure others can give you a better answer to this, but my understanding is the overall hormonal/metabolic response in the body that is triggered by sugar intake is different from complex carbs. I know the insulin response/spike is different. My own experience has shown me that this is key for me to make that next ‘leap’ in my diet. I don’t think it matters too much if we’re just talking about getting from, say, 15% to the 10-12 range. But below that, I think more factors start to matter. That being said, I’m all for keeping sugar in your diet if you can reach your goals without eliminating it.
[/quote]

You mind expanding on this? I have never seen this only in studies in insulting resistant population ie diseased (hopefully not us). And when eaten alone ie not a mixed meal with pro and vegg. Also as spidey eats from what i have seen is similar to me, in windows of feeding his system will have many other nutrients that digested still and floating around that should very much negate the effect of insulin spike from sugar. Also keeping insulin quiet for a large portion of the day is key IMO to be handle carbs better lose fat and tap body stores better. But again just opinions from way too much reading but interested to hear your anecdotes If you’re kind enough to share
[/quote]

What you’re saying makes sense for sure. And it may be that since he’s consuming the sugar within said window, it really is just like eating any other carbs. Judging by your avi picture, it looks like you’ve got your own diet pretty dialed in.

Earlier this year I dieted down to about 170, and while I lost a pretty decent amount of fat, I wasn’t real happy with the strength loss that accompanied it. So I upped my protein intake and essentially eliminated all sugar (kept total carbs similar to what they were), along with cutting out alcohol (I had 2 drinks in all of May). So in retrospect, I manipulated 3 variables. Not great science. That being said, this combination worked very well for muscle gain without fat gain. I mostly discounted the alcohol factor because I wasn’t drinking very much in the first place, but that could have been more significant than I realized.

[ryanbCXG]

[quote]flipcollar wrote:

[quote]ryanbCXG wrote:

[quote]flipcollar wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

4. FlipCollar, I’m not sure about the sugar they. I’ve never really monitored my sugar intake, just overall carb intake. Why do you think it hinders fat loss? I’m not being a smart-ass, I just don’t know why it would.

[/quote]

I’m sure others can give you a better answer to this, but my understanding is the overall hormonal/metabolic response in the body that is triggered by sugar intake is different from complex carbs. I know the insulin response/spike is different. My own experience has shown me that this is key for me to make that next ‘leap’ in my diet. I don’t think it matters too much if we’re just talking about getting from, say, 15% to the 10-12 range. But below that, I think more factors start to matter. That being said, I’m all for keeping sugar in your diet if you can reach your goals without eliminating it.
[/quote]

You mind expanding on this? I have never seen this only in studies in insulting resistant population ie diseased (hopefully not us). And when eaten alone ie not a mixed meal with pro and vegg. Also as spidey eats from what i have seen is similar to me, in windows of feeding his system will have many other nutrients that digested still and floating around that should very much negate the effect of insulin spike from sugar. Also keeping insulin quiet for a large portion of the day is key IMO to be handle carbs better lose fat and tap body stores better. But again just opinions from way too much reading but interested to hear your anecdotes If you’re kind enough to share
[/quote]

What you’re saying makes sense for sure. And it may be that since he’s consuming the sugar within said window, it really is just like eating any other carbs. Judging by your avi picture, it looks like you’ve got your own diet pretty dialed in.

Earlier this year I dieted down to about 170, and while I lost a pretty decent amount of fat, I wasn’t real happy with the strength loss that accompanied it. So I upped my protein intake and essentially eliminated all sugar (kept total carbs similar to what they were), along with cutting out alcohol (I had 2 drinks in all of May). So in retrospect, I manipulated 3 variables. Not great science. That being said, this combination worked very well for muscle gain without fat gain. I mostly discounted the alcohol factor because I wasn’t drinking very much in the first place, but that could have been more significant than I realized.[/quote]

Experimentation is the name of the game. And logging so you have an idea down the road of what to try or manipulate next I would agree 2 drinks in a month isn’t much

[PlainPat]

For big movements I can say that either works as well, just agreeing that progression is what matters more. I personally think I enjoy top set work better because I really put all that focus onto one thing rather than knowing I have to go multiple rounds but I have had both work.

[Sutebun]

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

A. 1 ‘top’ set, followed by a few ‘back-off’, lower weight sets
B. More sets, 3-6, of straight or similar weights, no real ‘top’
[/quote]

IMO how you use progression with these concepts is more important. This is what I like to do.

A. When I want to push intensity more. Go for something that is maxing out (but not failure) or one left in the tank between 3-6 reps. Back off reps will depend on the top load and reload %. Progress by increasing intensity each week while the back off volume stays fairly similar.

B. Measure rests between sets and try to decrease rest every week. A good place to start is something that is a challenge at 1:45-2:00 of rest and then decrease by 25-30 seconds next week. Treat the load las if you were doing heavy DE work (all sets but maybe the last couple should be relatively fast).

[anon23385723]

Thanks for all the input guys. Sutebun, thanks for reminding me about rest periods too. Manipulating them was one of the things I thought was most effective about BBB, but I always seem to get lazy and not mess with them. I need to put that back in the tool box for progression.

Today’s lift, well, it just sucked. I went to sleep about 1am, and for some reason, I woke up at like 4am, really awake. I’m usually someone who can fall asleep at will in about 3-5 minutes, but was restless. I went in and out of sleep for like another 90 mins, finally just got up I started my day. While I can train after a long day of school or work, with little food, or even when sick, sleep deprivation is my Kryptonite. I just never have good sessions without decent sleep, and today was no different.

Back Squats: Kept rest at about 90s, and everything just kind of felt mehh. When I’m sleepy, everything feels heavy, but my movements just aren’t, idk ‘fluid’, more choppy I guess.
265-275x5x5

Paused Front Squats: I like these, especially for teaching myself to use my Quads and stay upright
185x3x3

Banded Front Squats: Seriously nothing wrecks my abs like these, just one set for the pumps
135+Orx10

Shrugs ~SS~ Band Pull-Aparts:
225x4x20
Redx4xAMRAP

And I called it quits there. No point in running myself into the ground. I’m still not sure if I’m really awake, but oh well, got some volume in on Squats, so every little bit counts I suppose.

[pwolves17]

[quote]PlainPat wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:
Just to give ya’ll an idea of how I’m eating, here’s a ‘off day’, of roughly 200/200/120 Macros

Meal 1: Just Coffee + VCO and some Whipping Cream

Meal 2: 6 oz of Steak, 4 Eggs

Meal 3: Pro Shake

Meal 4: 5 oz Chicken, 5 oz Steak, 1.5 cups of Pasta Noodles, 2 servings of green veggies

Meal 5: Pro Shake, 6 homemade sugar cookies, banana, 2 tbsp of PB

So yeah, that’s my day. Nothing crazy. I could easily just go lower calories on off days, but I’m trying not to rush it. Also, I kind of fast a bit, so that first ‘meal’ wasn’t until about 1pm, and I was done by 11. Just ind of naturally how I eat. [/quote]

How is this diet conducive to building health and muscle?[/quote]

What do you mean man? It’s pretty ‘clean’ minus a few cookies. Everything is pretty much whole foods, I only get about 50g of protein from shakes, I get some greens in. [/quote]

Idk how you guys survive eating like this i eat 2.5lbs of chicken, at least 3-4 servings of whole carbs ie pasta or oats, usually a quart of milk, 4-5 tlbs pb, 3 scoops whey, and some eggs sometimes a day and I feel like a fucking ravenous animal some days. Id go nuts eating like this

EDIT: On the other hand if i dont eat like how I do, like if i ate carbs before bed like you do or practically any amount of sugar a day my physique will go to literal dog shit in 2-3 weeks. I pile on fat at an obscene rate [/quote]
I haven’t been in this log for a few weeks but have to comment on a few of these posts. You don’t pile on fat at an “obscene rate” because of eating sugar or eating carbs at night. You get fat because you don’t know or track your macros and are thus eating in a caloric surplus

[pwolves17]

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:
Just to give ya’ll an idea of how I’m eating, here’s a ‘off day’, of roughly 200/200/120 Macros

Meal 1: Just Coffee + VCO and some Whipping Cream

Meal 2: 6 oz of Steak, 4 Eggs

Meal 3: Pro Shake

Meal 4: 5 oz Chicken, 5 oz Steak, 1.5 cups of Pasta Noodles, 2 servings of green veggies

Meal 5: Pro Shake, 6 homemade sugar cookies, banana, 2 tbsp of PB

So yeah, that’s my day. Nothing crazy. I could easily just go lower calories on off days, but I’m trying not to rush it. Also, I kind of fast a bit, so that first ‘meal’ wasn’t until about 1pm, and I was done by 11. Just ind of naturally how I eat. [/quote]

How is this diet conducive to building health and muscle?[/quote]

What do you mean man? It’s pretty ‘clean’ minus a few cookies. Everything is pretty much whole foods, I only get about 50g of protein from shakes, I get some greens in. [/quote]

Spidey, c’mon bud. You’re drinking fad coffee, drinking 2 shakes and eating one balanced meal. How is that pretty much whole foods? Instead of jumping on the newest fad diet nonsense, why not just eat the way really big and strong people have been eating for half a century? 3-4 solid, balanced nutritious high protein meals a day along with solid, consistent training has gotten literally hundreds of thousands of nnatural trainers strong. Listening to some juice monkey or some clown trying to make a buck is gonna leave you spinning your wheels. Every new generation has a few new bright ideas, and some may work, but the best results are still found in the old school. Success leaves tracks homey.[/quote]
Lol! How is any of Spidey’s diet a “fad” or from “some guy on the Internet”? Whatever that means. He is using foods that work well for his lifestyle, budget, and that he enjoys to hit his macro targets and is getting the majority of his calories from whole foods. He’s getting his greens. What’s the problem here exactly? The body recognizes nutrients, not food choices

[pwolves17]

[quote]flipcollar wrote:

Side note: Spidey, eating sugar cookies while dieting seems pretty fucking dumb to me, but I guess do what works for you. At my level of leanness, which I think is relatively similar to yours, I can’t get leaner without dropping sugar entirely from my diet.[/quote]
Yes you could get leaner while eating sugar cookies. You need to either lower calories further or increase energy expenditure

[PlainPat]

[quote]pwolves17 wrote:

[quote]PlainPat wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:
Just to give ya’ll an idea of how I’m eating, here’s a ‘off day’, of roughly 200/200/120 Macros

Meal 1: Just Coffee + VCO and some Whipping Cream

Meal 2: 6 oz of Steak, 4 Eggs

Meal 3: Pro Shake

Meal 4: 5 oz Chicken, 5 oz Steak, 1.5 cups of Pasta Noodles, 2 servings of green veggies

Meal 5: Pro Shake, 6 homemade sugar cookies, banana, 2 tbsp of PB

So yeah, that’s my day. Nothing crazy. I could easily just go lower calories on off days, but I’m trying not to rush it. Also, I kind of fast a bit, so that first ‘meal’ wasn’t until about 1pm, and I was done by 11. Just ind of naturally how I eat. [/quote]

How is this diet conducive to building health and muscle?[/quote]

What do you mean man? It’s pretty ‘clean’ minus a few cookies. Everything is pretty much whole foods, I only get about 50g of protein from shakes, I get some greens in. [/quote]

Idk how you guys survive eating like this i eat 2.5lbs of chicken, at least 3-4 servings of whole carbs ie pasta or oats, usually a quart of milk, 4-5 tlbs pb, 3 scoops whey, and some eggs sometimes a day and I feel like a fucking ravenous animal some days. Id go nuts eating like this

EDIT: On the other hand if i dont eat like how I do, like if i ate carbs before bed like you do or practically any amount of sugar a day my physique will go to literal dog shit in 2-3 weeks. I pile on fat at an obscene rate [/quote]
I haven’t been in this log for a few weeks but have to comment on a few of these posts. You don’t pile on fat at an “obscene rate” because of eating sugar or eating carbs at night. You get fat because you don’t know or track your macros and are thus eating in a caloric surplus[/quote]

Lol i like how now that macro tracking has become so prevalent that people can come in here and shout like i wasnt tracking anything and just assume youre retarted instead of saying ok you experienced it first hand, doing things like that wont work for you. So arrogant its ridiculous.

[ryanbCXG]

[quote]PlainPat wrote:

[quote]pwolves17 wrote:

[quote]PlainPat wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:
Just to give ya’ll an idea of how I’m eating, here’s a ‘off day’, of roughly 200/200/120 Macros

Meal 1: Just Coffee + VCO and some Whipping Cream

Meal 2: 6 oz of Steak, 4 Eggs

Meal 3: Pro Shake

Meal 4: 5 oz Chicken, 5 oz Steak, 1.5 cups of Pasta Noodles, 2 servings of green veggies

Meal 5: Pro Shake, 6 homemade sugar cookies, banana, 2 tbsp of PB

So yeah, that’s my day. Nothing crazy. I could easily just go lower calories on off days, but I’m trying not to rush it. Also, I kind of fast a bit, so that first ‘meal’ wasn’t until about 1pm, and I was done by 11. Just ind of naturally how I eat. [/quote]

How is this diet conducive to building health and muscle?[/quote]

What do you mean man? It’s pretty ‘clean’ minus a few cookies. Everything is pretty much whole foods, I only get about 50g of protein from shakes, I get some greens in. [/quote]

Idk how you guys survive eating like this i eat 2.5lbs of chicken, at least 3-4 servings of whole carbs ie pasta or oats, usually a quart of milk, 4-5 tlbs pb, 3 scoops whey, and some eggs sometimes a day and I feel like a fucking ravenous animal some days. Id go nuts eating like this

EDIT: On the other hand if i dont eat like how I do, like if i ate carbs before bed like you do or practically any amount of sugar a day my physique will go to literal dog shit in 2-3 weeks. I pile on fat at an obscene rate [/quote]
I haven’t been in this log for a few weeks but have to comment on a few of these posts. You don’t pile on fat at an “obscene rate” because of eating sugar or eating carbs at night. You get fat because you don’t know or track your macros and are thus eating in a caloric surplus[/quote]

Lol i like how now that macro tracking has become so prevalent that people can come in here and shout like i wasnt tracking anything and just assume youre retarted instead of saying ok you experienced it first hand, doing things like that wont work for you. So arrogant its ridiculous. [/quote]

No PW but it’s obv he knows how to get lean. And diet and the statments made that eating sugar vs eating pasta is gonna fatten someone more is kinda not supporting a lot of diet experience. And if tracked you’d find that out eating some sugar vs pasta in the same macros won’t make a diff. But what you do works for you. That’s what matters. And just being blunt you don’t seem to be lean enough to truly grasp the dieting thing. No offense you’re strong and work hard. So not any hate man

[PlainPat]

[quote]ryanbCXG wrote:

[quote]PlainPat wrote:

[quote]pwolves17 wrote:

[quote]PlainPat wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:
Just to give ya’ll an idea of how I’m eating, here’s a ‘off day’, of roughly 200/200/120 Macros

Meal 1: Just Coffee + VCO and some Whipping Cream

Meal 2: 6 oz of Steak, 4 Eggs

Meal 3: Pro Shake

Meal 4: 5 oz Chicken, 5 oz Steak, 1.5 cups of Pasta Noodles, 2 servings of green veggies

Meal 5: Pro Shake, 6 homemade sugar cookies, banana, 2 tbsp of PB

So yeah, that’s my day. Nothing crazy. I could easily just go lower calories on off days, but I’m trying not to rush it. Also, I kind of fast a bit, so that first ‘meal’ wasn’t until about 1pm, and I was done by 11. Just ind of naturally how I eat. [/quote]

How is this diet conducive to building health and muscle?[/quote]

What do you mean man? It’s pretty ‘clean’ minus a few cookies. Everything is pretty much whole foods, I only get about 50g of protein from shakes, I get some greens in. [/quote]

Idk how you guys survive eating like this i eat 2.5lbs of chicken, at least 3-4 servings of whole carbs ie pasta or oats, usually a quart of milk, 4-5 tlbs pb, 3 scoops whey, and some eggs sometimes a day and I feel like a fucking ravenous animal some days. Id go nuts eating like this

EDIT: On the other hand if i dont eat like how I do, like if i ate carbs before bed like you do or practically any amount of sugar a day my physique will go to literal dog shit in 2-3 weeks. I pile on fat at an obscene rate [/quote]
I haven’t been in this log for a few weeks but have to comment on a few of these posts. You don’t pile on fat at an “obscene rate” because of eating sugar or eating carbs at night. You get fat because you don’t know or track your macros and are thus eating in a caloric surplus[/quote]

Lol i like how now that macro tracking has become so prevalent that people can come in here and shout like i wasnt tracking anything and just assume youre retarted instead of saying ok you experienced it first hand, doing things like that wont work for you. So arrogant its ridiculous. [/quote]

No PW but it’s obv he knows how to get lean. And diet and the statments made that eating sugar vs eating pasta is gonna fatten someone more is kinda not supporting a lot of diet experience. And if tracked you’d find that out eating some sugar vs pasta in the same macros won’t make a diff. But what you do works for you. That’s what matters. And just being blunt you don’t seem to be lean enough to truly grasp the dieting thing. No offense you’re strong and work hard. So not any hate man[/quote]

I mean I just get mad when people are gonna tell me I havent figured out at least something about my body when I wrestled 135 junior year and am now sitting at 215 and not fat 2.5 years later

Its just personal experience. The comment wasnt about sugars necessarily but carbs before bedtime, I had my set base diet at one point when I was sitting around 170 with carbs before bedtime, and I was quickly growing soft within 3-4 weeks of starting the diet and without changing anything else I simply moved the bedtime carbs to split between breakfast and dinner and I stopped getting soft and actually grew leaner. I dont care if people want to say IIFYM or whatever works its just like if I tried it, and carbs before bed don’t work for me, they don’t work for me. Its not a shot at IIFYM saying oh its all bullshit that doesnt work Im sure it does but that particular set up doesn’t work for my body

[ryanbCXG]

[quote]PlainPat wrote:

[quote]ryanbCXG wrote:

[quote]PlainPat wrote:

[quote]pwolves17 wrote:

[quote]PlainPat wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:
Just to give ya’ll an idea of how I’m eating, here’s a ‘off day’, of roughly 200/200/120 Macros

Meal 1: Just Coffee + VCO and some Whipping Cream

Meal 2: 6 oz of Steak, 4 Eggs

Meal 3: Pro Shake

Meal 4: 5 oz Chicken, 5 oz Steak, 1.5 cups of Pasta Noodles, 2 servings of green veggies

Meal 5: Pro Shake, 6 homemade sugar cookies, banana, 2 tbsp of PB

So yeah, that’s my day. Nothing crazy. I could easily just go lower calories on off days, but I’m trying not to rush it. Also, I kind of fast a bit, so that first ‘meal’ wasn’t until about 1pm, and I was done by 11. Just ind of naturally how I eat. [/quote]

How is this diet conducive to building health and muscle?[/quote]

What do you mean man? It’s pretty ‘clean’ minus a few cookies. Everything is pretty much whole foods, I only get about 50g of protein from shakes, I get some greens in. [/quote]

Idk how you guys survive eating like this i eat 2.5lbs of chicken, at least 3-4 servings of whole carbs ie pasta or oats, usually a quart of milk, 4-5 tlbs pb, 3 scoops whey, and some eggs sometimes a day and I feel like a fucking ravenous animal some days. Id go nuts eating like this

EDIT: On the other hand if i dont eat like how I do, like if i ate carbs before bed like you do or practically any amount of sugar a day my physique will go to literal dog shit in 2-3 weeks. I pile on fat at an obscene rate [/quote]
I haven’t been in this log for a few weeks but have to comment on a few of these posts. You don’t pile on fat at an “obscene rate” because of eating sugar or eating carbs at night. You get fat because you don’t know or track your macros and are thus eating in a caloric surplus[/quote]

Lol i like how now that macro tracking has become so prevalent that people can come in here and shout like i wasnt tracking anything and just assume youre retarted instead of saying ok you experienced it first hand, doing things like that wont work for you. So arrogant its ridiculous. [/quote]

No PW but it’s obv he knows how to get lean. And diet and the statments made that eating sugar vs eating pasta is gonna fatten someone more is kinda not supporting a lot of diet experience. And if tracked you’d find that out eating some sugar vs pasta in the same macros won’t make a diff. But what you do works for you. That’s what matters. And just being blunt you don’t seem to be lean enough to truly grasp the dieting thing. No offense you’re strong and work hard. So not any hate man[/quote]

I mean I just get mad when people are gonna tell me I havent figured out at least something about my body when I wrestled 135 junior year and am now sitting at 215 and not fat 2.5 years later

Its just personal experience. The comment wasnt about sugars necessarily but carbs before bedtime, I had my set base diet at one point when I was sitting around 170 with carbs before bedtime, and I was quickly growing soft within 3-4 weeks of starting the diet and without changing anything else I simply moved the bedtime carbs to split between breakfast and dinner and I stopped getting soft and actually grew leaner. I dont care if people want to say IIFYM or whatever works its just like if I tried it, and carbs before bed don’t work for me, they don’t work for me. Its not a shot at IIFYM saying oh its all bullshit that doesnt work Im sure it does but that particular set up doesn’t work for my body[/quote]

Now I am curious. So you are saying you literally can keep macros and training and activity the exact same and eating a majority of those carbs at night makes you softer than eating them at a different time? Just clarifying since I misunderstood before already

But this foes against a lot of studies and what many ppl smarter than myself have found

[PlainPat]

[quote]ryanbCXG wrote:

[quote]PlainPat wrote:

[quote]ryanbCXG wrote:

[quote]PlainPat wrote:

[quote]pwolves17 wrote:

[quote]PlainPat wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:
Just to give ya’ll an idea of how I’m eating, here’s a ‘off day’, of roughly 200/200/120 Macros

Meal 1: Just Coffee + VCO and some Whipping Cream

Meal 2: 6 oz of Steak, 4 Eggs

Meal 3: Pro Shake

Meal 4: 5 oz Chicken, 5 oz Steak, 1.5 cups of Pasta Noodles, 2 servings of green veggies

Meal 5: Pro Shake, 6 homemade sugar cookies, banana, 2 tbsp of PB

So yeah, that’s my day. Nothing crazy. I could easily just go lower calories on off days, but I’m trying not to rush it. Also, I kind of fast a bit, so that first ‘meal’ wasn’t until about 1pm, and I was done by 11. Just ind of naturally how I eat. [/quote]

How is this diet conducive to building health and muscle?[/quote]

What do you mean man? It’s pretty ‘clean’ minus a few cookies. Everything is pretty much whole foods, I only get about 50g of protein from shakes, I get some greens in. [/quote]

Idk how you guys survive eating like this i eat 2.5lbs of chicken, at least 3-4 servings of whole carbs ie pasta or oats, usually a quart of milk, 4-5 tlbs pb, 3 scoops whey, and some eggs sometimes a day and I feel like a fucking ravenous animal some days. Id go nuts eating like this

EDIT: On the other hand if i dont eat like how I do, like if i ate carbs before bed like you do or practically any amount of sugar a day my physique will go to literal dog shit in 2-3 weeks. I pile on fat at an obscene rate [/quote]
I haven’t been in this log for a few weeks but have to comment on a few of these posts. You don’t pile on fat at an “obscene rate” because of eating sugar or eating carbs at night. You get fat because you don’t know or track your macros and are thus eating in a caloric surplus[/quote]

Lol i like how now that macro tracking has become so prevalent that people can come in here and shout like i wasnt tracking anything and just assume youre retarted instead of saying ok you experienced it first hand, doing things like that wont work for you. So arrogant its ridiculous. [/quote]

No PW but it’s obv he knows how to get lean. And diet and the statments made that eating sugar vs eating pasta is gonna fatten someone more is kinda not supporting a lot of diet experience. And if tracked you’d find that out eating some sugar vs pasta in the same macros won’t make a diff. But what you do works for you. That’s what matters. And just being blunt you don’t seem to be lean enough to truly grasp the dieting thing. No offense you’re strong and work hard. So not any hate man[/quote]

I mean I just get mad when people are gonna tell me I havent figured out at least something about my body when I wrestled 135 junior year and am now sitting at 215 and not fat 2.5 years later

Its just personal experience. The comment wasnt about sugars necessarily but carbs before bedtime, I had my set base diet at one point when I was sitting around 170 with carbs before bedtime, and I was quickly growing soft within 3-4 weeks of starting the diet and without changing anything else I simply moved the bedtime carbs to split between breakfast and dinner and I stopped getting soft and actually grew leaner. I dont care if people want to say IIFYM or whatever works its just like if I tried it, and carbs before bed don’t work for me, they don’t work for me. Its not a shot at IIFYM saying oh its all bullshit that doesnt work Im sure it does but that particular set up doesn’t work for my body[/quote]

Now I am curious. So you are saying you literally can keep macros and training and activity the exact same and eating a majority of those carbs at night makes you softer than eating them at a different time? Just clarifying since I misunderstood before already

But this foes against a lot of studies and what many ppl smarter than myself have found
[/quote]

Yes, the sugar thing was a general comment that i dont think eating sugar at all is good for me, do i know that from experience no but i cant imagine id do well with it.

But the carbs at night thing was a personal experience. I was around probably 175ish and trying to make it to 170 to wrestle senior year and had a base diet for myself that I followed everyday… So im not sure what the EXACT macros were, but it was less than I had been eating normally because the intent was to lose a few lbs. So I had some of my carbs at night, because I figured I practice at night and lift in the morning so carbs at night would be fine for me… If i remember right it was just 1 cup of rice. So after a few weeks I had lost the weight down to 170 but I was noticeably softer. So i tried to look into other people’s diets, and I noticed that most people just ate meat at night that I was following at the time, not a big carb source.

So I just took that 1 cup of rice and instead split it into 1/2 cup servings at lunch and dinner instead. Stayed the same weight but wasnt as soft after I moved that rice around.

Why? No idea. My non-scientific Idea was that I didn’t have a lot of food in me to begin with so whatever was in my stomach was getting broken down quickly and because I was sleeping 8-9 hours and didn’t use the carb source they were storing as fat… proably broscienced the fuck out of that one but that was just what I figured

[pwolves17]

[quote]PlainPat wrote:

[quote]pwolves17 wrote:

[quote]PlainPat wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:
Just to give ya’ll an idea of how I’m eating, here’s a ‘off day’, of roughly 200/200/120 Macros

Meal 1: Just Coffee + VCO and some Whipping Cream
I apologize for coming across as arrogant, that definitely wasn’t my intent Pat. I took your quote that was more or less “I think that’s still less than 200 carbs?” to mean that you aren’t tracking very closely. In no way
Meal 2: 6 oz of Steak, 4 Eggs

Meal 3: Pro Shake

Meal 4: 5 oz Chicken, 5 oz Steak, 1.5 cups of Pasta Noodles, 2 servings of green veggies

Meal 5: Pro Shake, 6 homemade sugar cookies, banana, 2 tbsp of PB

So yeah, that’s my day. Nothing crazy. I could easily just go lower calories on off days, but I’m trying not to rush it. Also, I kind of fast a bit, so that first ‘meal’ wasn’t until about 1pm, and I was done by 11. Just ind of naturally how I eat. [/quote]

How is this diet conducive to building health and muscle?[/quote]

What do you mean man? It’s pretty ‘clean’ minus a few cookies. Everything is pretty much whole foods, I only get about 50g of protein from shakes, I get some greens in. [/quote]

Idk how you guys survive eating like this i eat 2.5lbs of chicken, at least 3-4 servings of whole carbs ie pasta or oats, usually a quart of milk, 4-5 tlbs pb, 3 scoops whey, and some eggs sometimes a day and I feel like a fucking ravenous animal some days. Id go nuts eating like this

EDIT: On the other hand if i dont eat like how I do, like if i ate carbs before bed like you do or practically any amount of sugar a day my physique will go to literal dog shit in 2-3 weeks. I pile on fat at an obscene rate [/quote]
I haven’t been in this log for a few weeks but have to comment on a few of these posts. You don’t pile on fat at an “obscene rate” because of eating sugar or eating carbs at night. You get fat because you don’t know or track your macros and are thus eating in a caloric surplus[/quote]

Lol i like how now that macro tracking has become so prevalent that people can come in here and shout like i wasnt tracking anything and just assume youre retarted instead of saying ok you experienced it first hand, doing things like that wont work for you. So arrogant its ridiculous. [/quote]
I apologize for coming across as arrogant, Pat, that definitely wasn’t my intent. I took your quote of “I think that’s still less than 200 carbs?” to mean that you aren’t tracking very meticulously if at all. In no way do I think that makes you an idiot or that you don’t know what you’re doing. You’re way stronger than me! I could learn a lot from you man. I just think that different guys have different goals and didn’t think your statements made you quite the guy to be criticizing Spidey’s diet, which is perfectly. I’m sorry if I took out some of my frustration on the other posters on you. I get sick of seeing 10 different guys criticize everything Spidey does, and some of what was said about his diet was downright wrong and ridiculous. The arrogance in this thread is saying “eating sugar is fucking retarded.” If certain guys feel they perform better and like the idea of eating all “clean” foods, then more power to you. Just don’t act like everyone has to do that to get optimal results

[PlainPat]

[quote]pwolves17 wrote:

[quote]PlainPat wrote:

[quote]pwolves17 wrote:

[quote]PlainPat wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:
Just to give ya’ll an idea of how I’m eating, here’s a ‘off day’, of roughly 200/200/120 Macros

Meal 1: Just Coffee + VCO and some Whipping Cream
I apologize for coming across as arrogant, that definitely wasn’t my intent Pat. I took your quote that was more or less “I think that’s still less than 200 carbs?” to mean that you aren’t tracking very closely. In no way
Meal 2: 6 oz of Steak, 4 Eggs

Meal 3: Pro Shake

Meal 4: 5 oz Chicken, 5 oz Steak, 1.5 cups of Pasta Noodles, 2 servings of green veggies

Meal 5: Pro Shake, 6 homemade sugar cookies, banana, 2 tbsp of PB

So yeah, that’s my day. Nothing crazy. I could easily just go lower calories on off days, but I’m trying not to rush it. Also, I kind of fast a bit, so that first ‘meal’ wasn’t until about 1pm, and I was done by 11. Just ind of naturally how I eat. [/quote]

How is this diet conducive to building health and muscle?[/quote]

What do you mean man? It’s pretty ‘clean’ minus a few cookies. Everything is pretty much whole foods, I only get about 50g of protein from shakes, I get some greens in. [/quote]

Idk how you guys survive eating like this i eat 2.5lbs of chicken, at least 3-4 servings of whole carbs ie pasta or oats, usually a quart of milk, 4-5 tlbs pb, 3 scoops whey, and some eggs sometimes a day and I feel like a fucking ravenous animal some days. Id go nuts eating like this

EDIT: On the other hand if i dont eat like how I do, like if i ate carbs before bed like you do or practically any amount of sugar a day my physique will go to literal dog shit in 2-3 weeks. I pile on fat at an obscene rate [/quote]
I haven’t been in this log for a few weeks but have to comment on a few of these posts. You don’t pile on fat at an “obscene rate” because of eating sugar or eating carbs at night. You get fat because you don’t know or track your macros and are thus eating in a caloric surplus[/quote]

Lol i like how now that macro tracking has become so prevalent that people can come in here and shout like i wasnt tracking anything and just assume youre retarted instead of saying ok you experienced it first hand, doing things like that wont work for you. So arrogant its ridiculous. [/quote]
I apologize for coming across as arrogant, Pat, that definitely wasn’t my intent. I took your quote of “I think that’s still less than 200 carbs?” to mean that you aren’t tracking very meticulously if at all. In no way do I think that makes you an idiot or that you don’t know what you’re doing. You’re way stronger than me! I could learn a lot from you man. I just think that different guys have different goals and didn’t think your statements made you quite the guy to be criticizing Spidey’s diet, which is perfectly. I’m sorry if I took out some of my frustration on the other posters on you. I get sick of seeing 10 different guys criticize everything Spidey does, and some of what was said about his diet was downright wrong and ridiculous. The arrogance in this thread is saying “eating sugar is fucking retarded.” If certain guys feel they perform better and like the idea of eating all “clean” foods, then more power to you. Just don’t act like everyone has to do that to get optimal results [/quote]

Don’t worry about it man, we’re all good. Deffinetely agree. I dont care what someone has to eat, has to do, etc its all about making progress. If one makes progress eating like how spidey does then I have no problems with it. It was more of a personal statement that I dont think I personally could eat like that and make progress like he does even though we have different goals

[anon23385723]

I’m glad everyone’s playing nice lol. Thanks for your input Pwolves, obviously your advice on dieting is always appreciated Natty BB’er Master Champion

Upper Body Today

Flat BB: Felt pretty good. Really concentrated on getting on top of my traps, not just my upper back
195x4x5

OHP: Ugh, I decided I’m going to be a man and actually give this some attention. It’s abysmal because I never work on it, but I’ll alternate it with Incline BB every other workout
95x3x8

Hernon Rows: I use to do these a lot. I love BB Rows, but they are hard to do the day before Squats, so these are a solid replacement.
50’sx4x12-15

OH DB Extensions:
25’sx3x10
15’sx25

BB Curl: Will only up weight 5-10 lbs after getting 100 in 3 sets
55x60+20+20+20

Really good workout, pretty basic. While I don’t care either way about the OHP, I know most strong people have good OHP, so I’ll give it some love. Alternating them with Incline I hope will aesthetically improve my shoulder girdle area as well, which I feel can’t ever be OVER-developed.

Also, I tweaked my macros. I looked at a lot of natty BB’ers diets, and really none of them eat all that high of fat. I was eating like 120g on off days, which was good a few years back when I was doing CBL by the book (<30g carbs on off-days) because I needed energy from somewhere. But I’m not doing that this time, so adjusted my 175/200/120 off day to 200/200/100. So I think that will go a bit better. On top of that, Wednesday/Thursdays are the days I usually adjust my macros, and I figured every 2 weeks I’d have a ‘cheat’ meal, which will probably just be me eating a pizza and some donuts or something, nothing crazy.

[pwolves17]

[quote]PlainPat wrote:

[quote]pwolves17 wrote:

[quote]PlainPat wrote:

[quote]pwolves17 wrote:

[quote]PlainPat wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:
Just to give ya’ll an idea of how I’m eating, here’s a ‘off day’, of roughly 200/200/120 Macros

Meal 1: Just Coffee + VCO and some Whipping Cream
I apologize for coming across as arrogant, that definitely wasn’t my intent Pat. I took your quote that was more or less “I think that’s still less than 200 carbs?” to mean that you aren’t tracking very closely. In no way
Meal 2: 6 oz of Steak, 4 Eggs

Meal 3: Pro Shake

Meal 4: 5 oz Chicken, 5 oz Steak, 1.5 cups of Pasta Noodles, 2 servings of green veggies

Meal 5: Pro Shake, 6 homemade sugar cookies, banana, 2 tbsp of PB

So yeah, that’s my day. Nothing crazy. I could easily just go lower calories on off days, but I’m trying not to rush it. Also, I kind of fast a bit, so that first ‘meal’ wasn’t until about 1pm, and I was done by 11. Just ind of naturally how I eat. [/quote]

How is this diet conducive to building health and muscle?[/quote]

What do you mean man? It’s pretty ‘clean’ minus a few cookies. Everything is pretty much whole foods, I only get about 50g of protein from shakes, I get some greens in. [/quote]

Idk how you guys survive eating like this i eat 2.5lbs of chicken, at least 3-4 servings of whole carbs ie pasta or oats, usually a quart of milk, 4-5 tlbs pb, 3 scoops whey, and some eggs sometimes a day and I feel like a fucking ravenous animal some days. Id go nuts eating like this

EDIT: On the other hand if i dont eat like how I do, like if i ate carbs before bed like you do or practically any amount of sugar a day my physique will go to literal dog shit in 2-3 weeks. I pile on fat at an obscene rate [/quote]
I haven’t been in this log for a few weeks but have to comment on a few of these posts. You don’t pile on fat at an “obscene rate” because of eating sugar or eating carbs at night. You get fat because you don’t know or track your macros and are thus eating in a caloric surplus[/quote]

Lol i like how now that macro tracking has become so prevalent that people can come in here and shout like i wasnt tracking anything and just assume youre retarted instead of saying ok you experienced it first hand, doing things like that wont work for you. So arrogant its ridiculous. [/quote]
I apologize for coming across as arrogant, Pat, that definitely wasn’t my intent. I took your quote of “I think that’s still less than 200 carbs?” to mean that you aren’t tracking very meticulously if at all. In no way do I think that makes you an idiot or that you don’t know what you’re doing. You’re way stronger than me! I could learn a lot from you man. I just think that different guys have different goals and didn’t think your statements made you quite the guy to be criticizing Spidey’s diet, which is perfectly. I’m sorry if I took out some of my frustration on the other posters on you. I get sick of seeing 10 different guys criticize everything Spidey does, and some of what was said about his diet was downright wrong and ridiculous. The arrogance in this thread is saying “eating sugar is fucking retarded.” If certain guys feel they perform better and like the idea of eating all “clean” foods, then more power to you. Just don’t act like everyone has to do that to get optimal results [/quote]

Don’t worry about it man, we’re all good. Deffinetely agree. I dont care what someone has to eat, has to do, etc its all about making progress. If one makes progress eating like how spidey does then I have no problems with it. It was more of a personal statement that I dont think I personally could eat like that and make progress like he does even though we have different goals[/quote]
For sure man, I won’t insist that you have a bowl of low fat ice cream before bed every night…more for me

[ryanbCXG]

[quote]pwolves17 wrote:

[quote]PlainPat wrote:

[quote]pwolves17 wrote:

[quote]PlainPat wrote:

[quote]pwolves17 wrote:

[quote]PlainPat wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:
Just to give ya’ll an idea of how I’m eating, here’s a ‘off day’, of roughly 200/200/120 Macros

Meal 1: Just Coffee + VCO and some Whipping Cream
I apologize for coming across as arrogant, that definitely wasn’t my intent Pat. I took your quote that was more or less “I think that’s still less than 200 carbs?” to mean that you aren’t tracking very closely. In no way
Meal 2: 6 oz of Steak, 4 Eggs

Meal 3: Pro Shake

Meal 4: 5 oz Chicken, 5 oz Steak, 1.5 cups of Pasta Noodles, 2 servings of green veggies

Meal 5: Pro Shake, 6 homemade sugar cookies, banana, 2 tbsp of PB

So yeah, that’s my day. Nothing crazy. I could easily just go lower calories on off days, but I’m trying not to rush it. Also, I kind of fast a bit, so that first ‘meal’ wasn’t until about 1pm, and I was done by 11. Just ind of naturally how I eat. [/quote]

How is this diet conducive to building health and muscle?[/quote]

What do you mean man? It’s pretty ‘clean’ minus a few cookies. Everything is pretty much whole foods, I only get about 50g of protein from shakes, I get some greens in. [/quote]

Idk how you guys survive eating like this i eat 2.5lbs of chicken, at least 3-4 servings of whole carbs ie pasta or oats, usually a quart of milk, 4-5 tlbs pb, 3 scoops whey, and some eggs sometimes a day and I feel like a fucking ravenous animal some days. Id go nuts eating like this

EDIT: On the other hand if i dont eat like how I do, like if i ate carbs before bed like you do or practically any amount of sugar a day my physique will go to literal dog shit in 2-3 weeks. I pile on fat at an obscene rate [/quote]
I haven’t been in this log for a few weeks but have to comment on a few of these posts. You don’t pile on fat at an “obscene rate” because of eating sugar or eating carbs at night. You get fat because you don’t know or track your macros and are thus eating in a caloric surplus[/quote]

Lol i like how now that macro tracking has become so prevalent that people can come in here and shout like i wasnt tracking anything and just assume youre retarted instead of saying ok you experienced it first hand, doing things like that wont work for you. So arrogant its ridiculous. [/quote]
I apologize for coming across as arrogant, Pat, that definitely wasn’t my intent. I took your quote of “I think that’s still less than 200 carbs?” to mean that you aren’t tracking very meticulously if at all. In no way do I think that makes you an idiot or that you don’t know what you’re doing. You’re way stronger than me! I could learn a lot from you man. I just think that different guys have different goals and didn’t think your statements made you quite the guy to be criticizing Spidey’s diet, which is perfectly. I’m sorry if I took out some of my frustration on the other posters on you. I get sick of seeing 10 different guys criticize everything Spidey does, and some of what was said about his diet was downright wrong and ridiculous. The arrogance in this thread is saying “eating sugar is fucking retarded.” If certain guys feel they perform better and like the idea of eating all “clean” foods, then more power to you. Just don’t act like everyone has to do that to get optimal results [/quote]

Don’t worry about it man, we’re all good. Deffinetely agree. I dont care what someone has to eat, has to do, etc its all about making progress. If one makes progress eating like how spidey does then I have no problems with it. It was more of a personal statement that I dont think I personally could eat like that and make progress like he does even though we have different goals[/quote]
For sure man, I won’t insist that you have a bowl of low fat ice cream before bed every night…more for me ;)[/quote]

I prefer a container. Gf and I always need to buy two otherwise she gets none

[PlainPat]

[quote]ryanbCXG wrote:

[quote]pwolves17 wrote:

[quote]PlainPat wrote:

[quote]pwolves17 wrote:

[quote]PlainPat wrote:

[quote]pwolves17 wrote:

[quote]PlainPat wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:
Just to give ya’ll an idea of how I’m eating, here’s a ‘off day’, of roughly 200/200/120 Macros

Meal 1: Just Coffee + VCO and some Whipping Cream
I apologize for coming across as arrogant, that definitely wasn’t my intent Pat. I took your quote that was more or less “I think that’s still less than 200 carbs?” to mean that you aren’t tracking very closely. In no way
Meal 2: 6 oz of Steak, 4 Eggs

Meal 3: Pro Shake

Meal 4: 5 oz Chicken, 5 oz Steak, 1.5 cups of Pasta Noodles, 2 servings of green veggies

Meal 5: Pro Shake, 6 homemade sugar cookies, banana, 2 tbsp of PB

So yeah, that’s my day. Nothing crazy. I could easily just go lower calories on off days, but I’m trying not to rush it. Also, I kind of fast a bit, so that first ‘meal’ wasn’t until about 1pm, and I was done by 11. Just ind of naturally how I eat. [/quote]

How is this diet conducive to building health and muscle?[/quote]

What do you mean man? It’s pretty ‘clean’ minus a few cookies. Everything is pretty much whole foods, I only get about 50g of protein from shakes, I get some greens in. [/quote]

Idk how you guys survive eating like this i eat 2.5lbs of chicken, at least 3-4 servings of whole carbs ie pasta or oats, usually a quart of milk, 4-5 tlbs pb, 3 scoops whey, and some eggs sometimes a day and I feel like a fucking ravenous animal some days. Id go nuts eating like this

EDIT: On the other hand if i dont eat like how I do, like if i ate carbs before bed like you do or practically any amount of sugar a day my physique will go to literal dog shit in 2-3 weeks. I pile on fat at an obscene rate [/quote]
I haven’t been in this log for a few weeks but have to comment on a few of these posts. You don’t pile on fat at an “obscene rate” because of eating sugar or eating carbs at night. You get fat because you don’t know or track your macros and are thus eating in a caloric surplus[/quote]

Lol i like how now that macro tracking has become so prevalent that people can come in here and shout like i wasnt tracking anything and just assume youre retarted instead of saying ok you experienced it first hand, doing things like that wont work for you. So arrogant its ridiculous. [/quote]
I apologize for coming across as arrogant, Pat, that definitely wasn’t my intent. I took your quote of “I think that’s still less than 200 carbs?” to mean that you aren’t tracking very meticulously if at all. In no way do I think that makes you an idiot or that you don’t know what you’re doing. You’re way stronger than me! I could learn a lot from you man. I just think that different guys have different goals and didn’t think your statements made you quite the guy to be criticizing Spidey’s diet, which is perfectly. I’m sorry if I took out some of my frustration on the other posters on you. I get sick of seeing 10 different guys criticize everything Spidey does, and some of what was said about his diet was downright wrong and ridiculous. The arrogance in this thread is saying “eating sugar is fucking retarded.” If certain guys feel they perform better and like the idea of eating all “clean” foods, then more power to you. Just don’t act like everyone has to do that to get optimal results [/quote]

Don’t worry about it man, we’re all good. Deffinetely agree. I dont care what someone has to eat, has to do, etc its all about making progress. If one makes progress eating like how spidey does then I have no problems with it. It was more of a personal statement that I dont think I personally could eat like that and make progress like he does even though we have different goals[/quote]
For sure man, I won’t insist that you have a bowl of low fat ice cream before bed every night…more for me ;)[/quote]

I prefer a container. Gf and I always need to buy two otherwise she gets none[/quote]

This is what would appeal to me doing flexible dieting, because I specifically designate cheat meals for when I’m with the girlfriend because I know we are going to end up eating froyo at some point. It doesn’t matter how much I want to say no, if I get the puppy eyes I’m gonna eat froyo lol

[ryanbCXG]

Lol know that feel. She loves baking and is too damn good at it and loves spoiling me. Ie making me fat