Spidey: Back in Black

[quote]DoingWork421 wrote:

Just keep it simple man: you’re still at the point where you should just focus on lifting heavy, eating, and getting stronger. Marathon, not a sprint.[/quote]

Ok thanks for all that.

Are you suggesting I just go on to the regular BBB? I’d have to try and manage a 6th day to lift, which is why I kind of drifted away from it (and I don’t like the 2 ‘marathon’ sessions on the 4x a week split).

When you say I’m doing to much MMC or whatever for arms and stuff right now, are you saying I should be trying to add weight to curls and stuff? The light weight pump probably helps with hypertrophy, but one of the biggest reasons for doing light curls, raises, extensions, ect, is because any time I’ve done a program with out some iso work, I’ve gotten hurt, little shoulder and elbow dings. The light work seems to keep things in balance or healthy or whatever.

What would you suggest I do? I don’t do ‘dropsets’ or any real intensity techniques. Just trying to use what I found worked well on BBB, without the stuff that seemed to not. Any tweaks you have I’m open to.

EDIT: Also, not I forgot to mention, I am playing intramural Basketball 1-2x a week now. Another reason I didn’t go on to regular BBB. I tried to last year, and the Squatting 3x a week plus all the pressing (I have a weird left shoulder that can pop out of place during sports if I’m not careful) just was too much.

Upper Endurance

OHP: 3 min rest. omg… this was embarrassing. Reps are kind of a different beast with OHP it seems
105x10
95x11
85x12

Incline Rows: 3 min rest
60’sx3x15

Incline Neutral DB Presses: 60s rest. Didn’t lockout so these really were much harder than expected
45’sx3x16-20

Rope Curls: 60s rest
3x16-20

Face Pulls: 60s rest
3x20

Good fast workout. Felt good. Legs are really sore from yesterday lol

Also, the note about IM Basketball, I MAY drop OHP from my cycle this time, just because the stress from it and Bench on my Shoulders plus the basketball may be too much. Maybe sub it for DB incline. Not sure yet.

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

[quote]DoingWork421 wrote:

Just keep it simple man: you’re still at the point where you should just focus on lifting heavy, eating, and getting stronger. Marathon, not a sprint.[/quote]

Ok thanks for all that.

Are you suggesting I just go on to the regular BBB? I’d have to try and manage a 6th day to lift, which is why I kind of drifted away from it (and I don’t like the 2 ‘marathon’ sessions on the 4x a week split).

When you say I’m doing to much MMC or whatever for arms and stuff right now, are you saying I should be trying to add weight to curls and stuff? The light weight pump probably helps with hypertrophy, but one of the biggest reasons for doing light curls, raises, extensions, ect, is because any time I’ve done a program with out some iso work, I’ve gotten hurt, little shoulder and elbow dings. The light work seems to keep things in balance or healthy or whatever.

What would you suggest I do? I don’t do ‘dropsets’ or any real intensity techniques. Just trying to use what I found worked well on BBB, without the stuff that seemed to not. Any tweaks you have I’m open to.

EDIT: Also, not I forgot to mention, I am playing intramural Basketball 1-2x a week now. Another reason I didn’t go on to regular BBB. I tried to last year, and the Squatting 3x a week plus all the pressing (I have a weird left shoulder that can pop out of place during sports if I’m not careful) just was too much. [/quote]

Not trying to put words in his mouth, but think he’s saying you’re just doing too much. 4 days a week, upper/lower focusing on progression is what you need. Not sure why you’re so adamant about being in the weightroom 5-6 days a week. It’s counterproductive to what you’re trying to do.

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

[quote]DoingWork421 wrote:

Just keep it simple man: you’re still at the point where you should just focus on lifting heavy, eating, and getting stronger. Marathon, not a sprint.[/quote]

Ok thanks for all that.

Are you suggesting I just go on to the regular BBB? I’d have to try and manage a 6th day to lift, which is why I kind of drifted away from it (and I don’t like the 2 ‘marathon’ sessions on the 4x a week split).

When you say I’m doing to much MMC or whatever for arms and stuff right now, are you saying I should be trying to add weight to curls and stuff? The light weight pump probably helps with hypertrophy, but one of the biggest reasons for doing light curls, raises, extensions, ect, is because any time I’ve done a program with out some iso work, I’ve gotten hurt, little shoulder and elbow dings. The light work seems to keep things in balance or healthy or whatever.

What would you suggest I do? I don’t do ‘dropsets’ or any real intensity techniques. Just trying to use what I found worked well on BBB, without the stuff that seemed to not. Any tweaks you have I’m open to.

EDIT: Also, not I forgot to mention, I am playing intramural Basketball 1-2x a week now. Another reason I didn’t go on to regular BBB. I tried to last year, and the Squatting 3x a week plus all the pressing (I have a weird left shoulder that can pop out of place during sports if I’m not careful) just was too much. [/quote]

Not trying to put words in his mouth, but think he’s saying you’re just doing too much. 4 days a week, upper/lower focusing on progression is what you need. Not sure why you’re so adamant about being in the weightroom 5-6 days a week. It’s counterproductive to what you’re trying to do.
[/quote]

Well he said he liked BBB. There’s a 4x a week split on that program but that looks horrible. I like upper/lower splits fine, but I just prefer hitting things more frequently than that.

Have you seen what Big Beyond Belief is, WF? I think it fits most the principals you’re telling me, seriously. I chose NOT to follow it to the letter because I figured 6x was a week was to much like you told me, and even knocked it down a day. lol

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

[quote]DoingWork421 wrote:

Just keep it simple man: you’re still at the point where you should just focus on lifting heavy, eating, and getting stronger. Marathon, not a sprint.[/quote]

Ok thanks for all that.

Are you suggesting I just go on to the regular BBB? I’d have to try and manage a 6th day to lift, which is why I kind of drifted away from it (and I don’t like the 2 ‘marathon’ sessions on the 4x a week split).

When you say I’m doing to much MMC or whatever for arms and stuff right now, are you saying I should be trying to add weight to curls and stuff? The light weight pump probably helps with hypertrophy, but one of the biggest reasons for doing light curls, raises, extensions, ect, is because any time I’ve done a program with out some iso work, I’ve gotten hurt, little shoulder and elbow dings. The light work seems to keep things in balance or healthy or whatever.

What would you suggest I do? I don’t do ‘dropsets’ or any real intensity techniques. Just trying to use what I found worked well on BBB, without the stuff that seemed to not. Any tweaks you have I’m open to.

EDIT: Also, not I forgot to mention, I am playing intramural Basketball 1-2x a week now. Another reason I didn’t go on to regular BBB. I tried to last year, and the Squatting 3x a week plus all the pressing (I have a weird left shoulder that can pop out of place during sports if I’m not careful) just was too much. [/quote]

Not trying to put words in his mouth, but think he’s saying you’re just doing too much. 4 days a week, upper/lower focusing on progression is what you need. Not sure why you’re so adamant about being in the weightroom 5-6 days a week. It’s counterproductive to what you’re trying to do.
[/quote]

Well he said he liked BBB. There’s a 4x a week split on that program but that looks horrible. I like upper/lower splits fine, but I just prefer hitting things more frequently than that.

Have you seen what Big Beyond Belief is, WF? I think it fits most the principals you’re telling me, seriously. I chose NOT to follow it to the letter because I figured 6x was a week was to much like you told me, and even knocked it down a day. lol
[/quote]

Im 99% sure hes talking about the old bbb 5/3/1 scheme not the whole beyond 531 nonsense

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

Ok thanks for all that.

Are you suggesting I just go on to the regular BBB? I’d have to try and manage a 6th day to lift, which is why I kind of drifted away from it (and I don’t like the 2 ‘marathon’ sessions on the 4x a week split).

When you say I’m doing to much MMC or whatever for arms and stuff right now, are you saying I should be trying to add weight to curls and stuff? The light weight pump probably helps with hypertrophy, but one of the biggest reasons for doing light curls, raises, extensions, ect, is because any time I’ve done a program with out some iso work, I’ve gotten hurt, little shoulder and elbow dings. The light work seems to keep things in balance or healthy or whatever.

What would you suggest I do? I don’t do ‘dropsets’ or any real intensity techniques. Just trying to use what I found worked well on BBB, without the stuff that seemed to not. Any tweaks you have I’m open to.

EDIT: Also, not I forgot to mention, I am playing intramural Basketball 1-2x a week now. Another reason I didn’t go on to regular BBB. I tried to last year, and the Squatting 3x a week plus all the pressing (I have a weird left shoulder that can pop out of place during sports if I’m not careful) just was too much. [/quote]

Not trying to put words in his mouth, but think he’s saying you’re just doing too much. 4 days a week, upper/lower focusing on progression is what you need. Not sure why you’re so adamant about being in the weightroom 5-6 days a week. It’s counterproductive to what you’re trying to do.
[/quote]

Well he said he liked BBB. There’s a 4x a week split on that program but that looks horrible. I like upper/lower splits fine, but I just prefer hitting things more frequently than that.

Have you seen what Big Beyond Belief is, WF? I think it fits most the principals you’re telling me, seriously. I chose NOT to follow it to the letter because I figured 6x was a week was to much like you told me, and even knocked it down a day. lol
[/quote]

I did not mean that you can’t train 5 times a week. I still train every day and make progress.

I was just meaning to say that you seem like you’re chasing too many different rabbits when you should be focused on one.

RE doing BBB 5x/week, I’ve never understood why they didn’t have a 5 day program, whereby you just run the first four days exactly like the six day program, have one off day, then have a fifth day that is just like the last day of the 4x/week program. Still hits the same parameters.

Alternatively, you could just have a fifth day that’s either an arms day, an abs/calves/hiit day, or whatever.

My point in the earlier posts was mostly just to say that instead of worrying so much about your routine at this point, you should just pick something simple and build a base of strength. Because regardless of how long you’ve been lifting, you have to be objective with yourself and say “I’m doing work sets with 155 on bench and 225 on squat. There’s no reason for me to be overthinking the ‘lifting heavy’ part.”

Keep all the more advanced stuff or complex programming as things that you know you can incorporate later when you’re taking your training to whatever the next level is. It’s valuable to you now insofar as you know what the next steps will be when you get there. But be patient as you build that base of strength to work off of.

Don’t overanalyze your programming: just eat, rest, and lift hard.

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

[quote]WhiteFlash wrote:

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:

[quote]DoingWork421 wrote:

Just keep it simple man: you’re still at the point where you should just focus on lifting heavy, eating, and getting stronger. Marathon, not a sprint.[/quote]

Ok thanks for all that.

Are you suggesting I just go on to the regular BBB? I’d have to try and manage a 6th day to lift, which is why I kind of drifted away from it (and I don’t like the 2 ‘marathon’ sessions on the 4x a week split).

When you say I’m doing to much MMC or whatever for arms and stuff right now, are you saying I should be trying to add weight to curls and stuff? The light weight pump probably helps with hypertrophy, but one of the biggest reasons for doing light curls, raises, extensions, ect, is because any time I’ve done a program with out some iso work, I’ve gotten hurt, little shoulder and elbow dings. The light work seems to keep things in balance or healthy or whatever.

What would you suggest I do? I don’t do ‘dropsets’ or any real intensity techniques. Just trying to use what I found worked well on BBB, without the stuff that seemed to not. Any tweaks you have I’m open to.

EDIT: Also, not I forgot to mention, I am playing intramural Basketball 1-2x a week now. Another reason I didn’t go on to regular BBB. I tried to last year, and the Squatting 3x a week plus all the pressing (I have a weird left shoulder that can pop out of place during sports if I’m not careful) just was too much. [/quote]

Not trying to put words in his mouth, but think he’s saying you’re just doing too much. 4 days a week, upper/lower focusing on progression is what you need. Not sure why you’re so adamant about being in the weightroom 5-6 days a week. It’s counterproductive to what you’re trying to do.
[/quote]

Well he said he liked BBB. There’s a 4x a week split on that program but that looks horrible. I like upper/lower splits fine, but I just prefer hitting things more frequently than that.

Have you seen what Big Beyond Belief is, WF? I think it fits most the principals you’re telling me, seriously. I chose NOT to follow it to the letter because I figured 6x was a week was to much like you told me, and even knocked it down a day. lol
[/quote]

Brother, you can do whatever you like. Personally don’t see a need ffor an upper endurance day, or throwing flies in on leg day. If anything I’d do some calisthenics in place of the upper endurance day to help with recovery, not detract from my main objective. Again, just my take. If you’re enjoying what you’re doin’and making progress then don’t listen to my shit.

btw, just wanted to say that I realize that I’m just some guy on the interwebz and am not intending to be a jerk. But in looking at your log I could just recall being in a sort of similar situation and needing to take a day where I got objective with myself and realized I needed to knuckle back down with the basics for a while.

There’s so much information about the thousand other things we can be doing for “massive gainz” that it’s easy to lose sight that while many of those approaches have their place, they are mostly useless without that strong base. Just be patient and focus on getting to a point where you have that base–even basic goals like being able to squat 315 and bench 225 for reps–before you decide you have to go out and get complicated to get to where you’re wanting to go.

Ok I understand where ya’ll are coming from now.

@ WhiteFlash, the ‘endurance’ day is just code for ‘higher reps’, and i just have noticed I’ve progressed better on main lifts when using more than one rep range. With Omar, or before when I use to do WS4SB, always trying to push my big lifts in the ‘3-6’ range I would stall. I made better progress on BBB doing big lifts through more rep ranges, and kind of cutting out the other shit. I’m taking the flies out from Squat day, I was kind of ‘feeling out’ what I wanted to do but didn’t like it much.

@DoinWork I get where you’re coming from, and you’re right, I need to focus on the bare minimums, I’m too weak to do otherwise. I’m taking out the flies I think, and OHP actually, and just concentrate on:

Chest: Bench and DB Incline
Back: Chins and rows
Quads: Front and Back Squats
Hamstring: DL’s and SLDL’s
Triceps: Floor Press and Extensions

The extensions, biceps, delts, calves, and abs I’ll do higher reps (just bump things up a bracket), as like said I feel better that way and I think it was maybe MODOK on these boards who suggested doing that if you plan on doing something like BBB for an extended time (not just once), I guess for joint health.

I’ll just add a set or cut rest periods for 3 weeks, then taper back for a few weeks, back and forth. Not going to over-complicate this.

Thanks guys. Now all I have to do is put the work in and I think things will sort themselves out.

[quote]DoingWork421 wrote:
btw, just wanted to say that I realize that I’m just some guy on the interwebz and am not intending to be a jerk. But in looking at your log I could just recall being in a sort of similar situation and needing to take a day where I got objective with myself and realized I needed to knuckle back down with the basics for a while.

There’s so much information about the thousand other things we can be doing for “massive gainz” that it’s easy to lose sight that while many of those approaches have their place, they are mostly useless without that strong base. Just be patient and focus on getting to a point where you have that base–even basic goals like being able to squat 315 and bench 225 for reps–before you decide you have to go out and get complicated to get to where you’re wanting to go.[/quote]

This is what I (and others, think it’s safe to say) meant in here. Gotta walk before you fly. Spidey seems like a good kid with his head screwed on straight and takes it in stride.

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:
Ok I understand where ya’ll are coming from now.

@ WhiteFlash, the ‘endurance’ day is just code for ‘higher reps’, and i just have noticed I’ve progressed better on main lifts when using more than one rep range. With Omar, or before when I use to do WS4SB, always trying to push my big lifts in the ‘3-6’ range I would stall. I made better progress on BBB doing big lifts through more rep ranges, and kind of cutting out the other shit. I’m taking the flies out from Squat day, I was kind of ‘feeling out’ what I wanted to do but didn’t like it much.

@DoinWork I get where you’re coming from, and you’re right, I need to focus on the bare minimums, I’m too weak to do otherwise. I’m taking out the flies I think, and OHP actually, and just concentrate on:

Chest: Bench and DB Incline
Back: Chins and rows
Quads: Front and Back Squats
Hamstring: DL’s and SLDL’s
Triceps: Floor Press and Extensions

The extensions, biceps, delts, calves, and abs I’ll do higher reps (just bump things up a bracket), as like said I feel better that way and I think it was maybe MODOK on these boards who suggested doing that if you plan on doing something like BBB for an extended time (not just once), I guess for joint health.

I’ll just add a set or cut rest periods for 3 weeks, then taper back for a few weeks, back and forth. Not going to over-complicate this.

Thanks guys. Now all I have to do is put the work in and I think things will sort themselves out. [/quote]
I like this Spidey, I know it’s easier said than done, but I think getting your strength up on these big exercises that you listed will be great for you. I’m in a similar boat myself, as soon as I’m done with this prep I wanna get strong! Bodybuilding is my passion, but you don’t see a ton of guys with big chest or impressive quads who aren’t benching/squatting at least 300/400, know what I mean?

Thanks WF and Pwolves. I think I sorted things out a bit, and workout was pretty decent today.

Flat BB: So I literally just did not think about it. I didn’t try to tuck my elbows, or use leg drive, or whatever. Just pressed. And honestly probably the strongest I’ve felt in a while. 90s rest
195x2x4-5
185x2x4-5
175x5

Chins: 90s rest
+30x3x4-6
+20x2x5

OH Rope Extensions: My elbow gets wonky, and these always seem to straighten it out. 30s rest
5x8-11

Hercules Curls: I honestly wanted to do something more ‘basic’ like EZ bar curls, but I feel like very time almost all the EZ/straight bars are taken in some bro-circuit circle jerk. 30s rest
5x8-11

Face Pulls:
5x15

Really solid workout. Legs are still a bit tender. Sadly for now, I’ll be play basketball on these nights, and hitting legs the next day. Sucks, but really only way I can do it. Not a big deal though. Will have to raise calories though, just playing 1-2x a week + lifting is a lot right.

Legs were sore still, but went for it today anyways

Back Squats: 90s rest. Felt strong with these
315x4
295x4
275x3x5

DL’s: 90s rest. Trying to just use straight weight with these, just because I don’t want to press my luck with form getting sloppy
345x5x4-6

Laterals: 30s rest
30’sx2x8
25’sx3x10

Abs + calves

Good workout considering I was sore from BBall. May switch to Sumo pulls, not solid on that though. I think on Squats my bar position may be to high but my back isn’t developed enough to ‘hold’ the lower position as well as I’d like I don’t think lol

So a few notes:

*Really need to put on more weight. Few, if any, people are big or strong at 6’2" 200 lbs. Need not be worried about being super lean and allow myself to get in the 220 range at least. So may bump cals up again
*Thinking I will switch to Sumo for this training cycle. That was the style I “naturally” used early on, but i have grown to like Conventional. I hear getting good at both is best, and since i Squat relatively narrow, I was thinking going Sumo may kind of hit some neglected areas.

Ya’ll have thoughts on either these ideas?

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:
So a few notes:

*Really need to put on more weight. Few, if any, people are big or strong at 6’2" 200 lbs. Need not be worried about being super lean and allow myself to get in the 220 range at least. So may bump cals up again
*Thinking I will switch to Sumo for this training cycle. That was the style I “naturally” used early on, but i have grown to like Conventional. I hear getting good at both is best, and since i Squat relatively narrow, I was thinking going Sumo may kind of hit some neglected areas.

Ya’ll have thoughts on either these ideas?[/quote]

I’ve been trying to gain weight: new years’ resolution of getting up to 215 at 5’10". Been fairly successful so far, but it’s taken being consistent about having some kind of snack every 2 hours. Taken a lot of work, tbh.

[quote]Spidey22 wrote:
So a few notes:

*Really need to put on more weight. Few, if any, people are big or strong at 6’2" 200 lbs. Need not be worried about being super lean and allow myself to get in the 220 range at least. So may bump cals up again
*Thinking I will switch to Sumo for this training cycle. That was the style I “naturally” used early on, but i have grown to like Conventional. I hear getting good at both is best, and since i Squat relatively narrow, I was thinking going Sumo may kind of hit some neglected areas.

Ya’ll have thoughts on either these ideas?[/quote]

Weight thing I agree with you know what to do just eat more youre already pretty lean even if you added 15lbs of at youd still look reasonably well.

Second thing a very good lifter once discussed this with me and we got to the point where as powerlifters this might be a good idea because of the fact that if you squat narrow early in a meet youd tire out those specific muscle groups more so if you pulled sumo later in the meet you might have a better chance of pulling more. We never tested it, but thats where the discussion ended. So I would think pulling sumo would hit “slightly” different musculature

Yeah I’ve been good at hitting my macros every day. Just need to add more cals. Macros will probably be:

Training: 525/210/100

Off Day: 375/210/140

Just got to keep them high, especially with basketball going on right now.

I think I’m going to switch to Sumo, after hearing what PlainPat said and talking to some other knowledgeable folk. Hopefully it leads to some gains

DB Incline: 2 mins rest. Really have to get back in the groove with these, some reps just felt awkward.
70’sx3x8
65’sx10

Incline Rows: 2 min rest.
70’sx4x10

CG Floor Press: 2 min rest. Wow, CG version is wayyyyy harder than regular Floor Press, which I found surprising. Every rep was tough.
145x4x8

Rope Curls: 45s rest
4x12-15

Face Pulls:
4x12-15

Good workout. I’m literally ravenous every time I’m on BBB. It’s like a problem haha

Front Squats: 2:30 min rest. These rape me for high reps. Staying tight is the hardest part
185x2x12
175x12

SLDL’s: 2:30 min rest
225x3x12

Laterals: First set was just ‘swings’, last 2 were strict, full ROM, slow eccentric
40’sx20
20’sx2x16-20

Abs + Calves

Played in basketball tourney. There were some pro ballers playing (like from Europe and stuff). My scrub team of 5 got killed haha. Most my friends who are decent had to drop out at the last minute, and we only had 5 men. So with no subs some of us were dead. Was for charity, no big deal. I did my one sick Euro step I do every game that gets the crowd hype, so no biggie haha