So I Return!

Pharma / TRT
1

Hey everyone,

It’s been a long time since I posted, since about the end of last winter. At that time I completed my first ever cycle: 10 weeks of test E at 500 a week. I started at a lean 192 9% and finished the cycle a little bulky at 220 and 12%, but still not bad. After a stasis and cutting phase I steadied at 212 ~10%. Which I was completely satisfied. i haven’t done a cycle since and continued in a stasis phase and am now at 215. after i finished my cycle i got really busy with my research and was unable to get on here much.

firstly i’d like to thank everyone who helped me prepare the cycle’s concepts and the diet regime. most notably, schwarzenegger, prisoner, inthezone and last but definately not least, bushidobadboy. i hope you all haven’t forgot about me.

i am here again to learn and to raise my knowledge of all aspects of training and AAS. With this, I have now decided to start another cycle within the next month and a half. i’ve been fiddling around with things in my head and have decided on a mix of compounds:

test e weeks 1-12
tren e weeks 1-12
d-bol kickstart weeks 1-4

arimidex weeks 4-16
either nolva or P22’s taper as pct to keep it simple

I obviously haven’t decided on dosages yet since it’s still a bit early, and i won’t ask anyone to make the dosages for me like some newbass. if you want to contribute by all means i welcome the suggestions, but i’m not asking for the contributions. once i decide i will post the proposed cycle for some review.

i’ve had my workout plan composed for a while but am still tweaking it to get the most out of my next cycle.

once again i’m so glad to be back, i’ve learned a ton from this place.

3

Hi mate - nice to meet you.

I must say it is nice to hear that you kept some gains. that is a good story in my book!

I would advise to DROP the tren actually… use acetate for 6 weeks or so… then if you dont like it… or if the sides are crazy… tren enanth is kinda a tough one.
i will leave it at that, i havent used it but i know that it is sensible to try ace forst due to the ease of stopping if necessary.

I would HIGHLY recommend deca…

1-12 Test Enan 500mg
1-10 Nand Deca 2-300mg
1-5! Dianabol 30mg ED

what more could you want? Tren is a little too much for someones second cycle IMO. Deca roooooocks.

OH and use proviron at 350mg a week.

JJ

4

[quote]JoeyD20 wrote:
Hey everyone,

It’s been a long time since I posted, since about the end of last winter. At that time I completed my first ever cycle: 10 weeks of test E at 500 a week. I started at a lean 192 9% and finished the cycle a little bulky at 220 and 12%, but still not bad. After a stasis and cutting phase I steadied at 212 ~10%. Which I was completely satisfied. i haven’t done a cycle since and continued in a stasis phase and am now at 215. after i finished my cycle i got really busy with my research and was unable to get on here much.

firstly i’d like to thank everyone who helped me prepare the cycle’s concepts and the diet regime. most notably, schwarzenegger, prisoner, inthezone and last but definately not least, bushidobadboy. i hope you all haven’t forgot about me.

i am here again to learn and to raise my knowledge of all aspects of training and AAS. With this, I have now decided to start another cycle within the next month and a half. i’ve been fiddling around with things in my head and have decided on a mix of compounds:

test e weeks 1-12
tren e weeks 1-12
d-bol kickstart weeks 1-4

arimidex weeks 4-16
either nolva or P22’s taper as pct to keep it simple

I obviously haven’t decided on dosages yet since it’s still a bit early, and i won’t ask anyone to make the dosages for me like some newbass. if you want to contribute by all means i welcome the suggestions, but i’m not asking for the contributions. once i decide i will post the proposed cycle for some review.

i’ve had my workout plan composed for a while but am still tweaking it to get the most out of my next cycle.

once again i’m so glad to be back, i’ve learned a ton from this place.[/quote]

Great to see you back, I was wondering what the hell happened to you several different times since your departure. Congratulations on the past cycle, and this new one looks great. It is almost exactly the same as the one I was getting ready for until I tore my left rotator cuff.

So needless to say mine was shelved for a good long time while I await my consulation and surgery over the next few months.

I was also going to go with the enan esters for both compounds, like you have indicated. Might want to get yourself some caber just in case something comes up down the road during the 12 weeks buddy. If you need an econo caber source get at me via pm. And Bushy’s advice looks to be most excellent dropping the tren a couple weeks before the test, and rollin with the stasis taper etc.

Great to have you back!

ToneBone

5

[quote] JJ wrote:
I would advise to DROP the tren actually… use acetate for 6 weeks or so… then if you dont like it… or if the sides are crazy… tren enanth is kinda a tough one.
i will leave it at that, i havent used it but i know that it is sensible to try ace forst due to the ease of stopping if necessary.
[/quote]

I’ve never used tren, but I def. agree with this. Everyone I know that’s used it says it’s a love/hate thing, so personally, I’d want the option of a quick way out.

Also JoeyD, I don’t think you mentioned your goals for this cycle? Sorry if I just didn’t see it.

6

Joey
Couple things have changed since last year. First, most people are using their orals formerly kickstarters at week 3 instead of week 1 to allow the test to begin to build saturation levels.

I must concur with the boys above in saying 12 weeks of tren e is not advisable. 8 weeks is here I would cap the tren.

7

[quote]saps wrote:
Joey
Couple things have changed since last year. First, most people are using their orals formerly kickstarters at week 3 instead of week 1 to allow the test to begin to build saturation levels.

I must concur with the boys above in saying 12 weeks of tren e is not advisable. 8 weeks is here I would cap the tren.[/quote]

Whatever!? what’s wrong with 12 weeks of tren E? have you haver done 12 weeks of tren E to be giving that advice?

12 weeks is fine, and I would recomend dbol, then switch to tbol when the back pumps get too bad, and end with winstrol as it’ll also help control the progesterone, and SHBG.

Definitely do my taper off, especially on for 12 weeks and using tren.

My opinion on nandrolone is this: Not a fan, you are wise to use the tren instead.

The notion on this board that there are some compounds a user should stay away from at least for their first few cycles, is totally warrantless and stupid I might add. Hate me if you like for saying that, but it’s the truth.

I used tren Ace on my first cycle, with no problems at all, and I am sure there are plenty of others on here as well who did also.

Cheers.

9

Running Tren E as we speak Pris; if you could not tell from the avatar. :wink:
What’s wrong with 12 weeks of tren E? What’s right with 12 weeks of tren E?
The point is not whether I or you have done 12 weeks of tren e or not. Rather if the OP has any experience with tren at all [which he does not] and then if he be best served popping his tren cherry with 12 weeks of tren e.

Like most you yourself ran ace the first time. Why was that? And did you run it 12 weeks the first time? Why not?
If his degree of suppression from tren is an unknown factor than prudence is warranted. I completely concur that anyone can use anything on any cycle. I have no protest to a virgin user running tren or deca or whatever the first go around. What I would counsel is dosage and duration restriction. There is a reason most people don’t commence their gear lifestyle with a gram of test, 400mg of tren and 400mg of mast a week for 3-4 months even though later on down the road they might end up exactly there.

I’m not even saying higher doses and longer durations on are not better; again when forging into new unexplored territory prudence and restraint are not enemies. You told JoeyD you are not a fan of nandrolone. That’s well and great but certainly it is your direct personal experience that has brought you to that conclusion no doubt. Again, if he is going to be on test e for 12 weeks I find it risky to blindy run 12 weeks of tren e. There is another debate entirely about the cost/benefits of shorter cycles at higher doses versus longer duration with reduced doses; but that is for another time

10

That was my point, and i AM a fan of nandrolone - i think it would serve this guy very well.

It will also allow him a “softer” progestin to use to test the waters… If tren is really needed/wanted, then as i said above and Saps also has made a clearer post on, Tren Ace is usually regarded as safer to try tren with as it is KNOWN to have sides that some cannot stand.

In certain cases it is totally prudent to avoid giving specifics on a drug if you have not taken it persoanlly - as everyones experiences are different and all we can do is share that.
But there are also some times when the general, overall effect of a drug on all is known - Trenbolones CAN cause extreme sides in some (sleep, shutdown, aggression etc) people, SOME people.
I think it isnt necessary for one to have used it personally to be able to share that knowledge to someone else who hasnt used it. It would be a TOTALLY different matter if he HAD used it, or if i was advising to run Tren E for 12 weeks over 8-10 as it is an enanthate ester.

2p

JJ

11

Hey JoeyD, welcome back. I, like InTheZone, have wondered from time to time where you’d gotten to.

Not to takes sides, but anyone, with any bit of experience, knows that the effects of these compounds runs the spectrum. Give JoeyD your testimonies, good or bad, so he can decide based off what the potentials are, whether Tren is worth running for that length of time.

Frankly, I don’t know why anyone wouldn’t err on the side of caution, given the aforementioned posts.

12

I see nothing wrong with tren for any amount of time suggested other than as has been said, enanthate perhaps would not be preferable, my first go round with it i used tren ace with the intention of using it for 10 weeks, however, i dropped it at 5 weeks as it gives me chronic hypertension.

Prisoner; i would also like to hear more on how you layed out the orals, not to be arguementitive obv but as a reference to future ideas i may have, so thanks in advance mate.

13

I just want to say that JoeyD is a bright guy, and the comments being made on both sides are good discussion. He’ll have a good wad of info to help his decision, so good job everyone.

The battle for which was less side prone, seemed to be equal to me. There were several “vets” who had just been, or were using tren enan at the time of my research, who had said their sides were much more tolerable with the enan vs. the acetate. And I’m talking about the sleeplessness, and the sweating. They didn’t have any other sides with enan.
These guys fwiw were using a dose of from 350-450/week.
So I looked at it like this. I’ll use the enan and just maintain a very conservative dose,(200-250/wk).

Obviously as these other guys have said in their defense, the acetate will clear up much faster if a problem arises that is too much to deal with. And yes, there’s something to be said for that for sure. But on the flip side, with a low dose of the enan, I still believe there’s a good chance you’ll do fine and if a problem does arise, you could cut the tren e out straight away and deal with whatever problem for a bit longer, as it probably won’t manifest into any really bad or negative side at the aforementioned dose.

So, I break it down fwiw to the following plusses.

  1. Less shots/week
  2. Less sides with conservative dose.(debateable)
  3. Less expensive (not always, depends)

To me all the side shit is not proven either way if we’re being honest. I’m not going to say enan is cut and dry less side prone, I’ve read even amounts of info for both sides of the party being less side prone. But the people I talked to, happen to be experienced guys who believed the enan was in their opinion less side prone, so I will give it a shot that way when I get back on my feet with the shoulder injury.

Tren is some wicked powerful shit. This we know. Some may argue that 200-250 isn’t enough. I counter argue that, especially for guys with few cycles under their belt like myself and JoeyD.

At any rate, the discussion will go on, and I am just stating my personal opinion since Joey is a friend of mine.
Keeping it civil is great, so let’s continue on gentlemen.

ToneBone

14

Thank you for all your opinions thus far.

I would like to say one thing though. While I value all the advice everyone is giving, I’d like you all to limit your advice to certain criteria if you will to help me better: anecdotal evidence from your own experiences or from someone close to you (that you’ve seen, not just heard about), thorough research on the compound, and theory based on LARGE GROUP studies rather than individual studies.

I, better than anyone else, understand how my body reacts to certain stresses. I am now a qualified organic chemist and was a pharmacology minor in university, and thus can deduce some things on my own, but for the sake of myself and everyone on this board, try to keep your opinions based on somewhat emperical evidence. I’m not starting this cycle tomorrow or anytime soon so try not to rush in trashing a compound but rather discuss it logically and discuss the extent of it’s sides, rather than just a black and white picture.

Above all, and no offense to anyone else, I value the advice of P22, Bushy, Inthezone, and (if anyone can help me contact them): Schwarz and Contrl. They really helped me complete my first cycle successfuly. On that note, I’d like it if you can clarify your suggestion for the orals P.

I’m out of the country on a little vacation now so my net time is somewhat limited but I will try my best to be on as much as I can to further my pre-cycle research.