After reading Ian’s article, I still stand by my previous statement:
“When doing SLDL’s for the HAMSTRINGS, never round your lower
back!” When I’m doing my SLDL’s (which look like Romanian DL’s) - I’m
thinking HAMMS first, Glutes second, and low back third! The Flat
back position gets the job done fine, here. Besides, I’m using close to
one and a half times my BW or 4 sets of 6 reps in ultra-strict form,
(using plates no larger than the 35’s). With a “round back” I couldn’t
use more than 135 lbs without worrying about herniating S1 and L5
like I did 11 years ago. This injury took over 7 years to heal completely.
So for me the risk FAAAARRRR outweighs the benefit!
Please correct me if I’m wrong, but doesn’t the rounded position put
the discs in a very compromised position to begin with. Now put some
appreciable weight on the bar and…like nkeago would say, “YOUR FUCKING
WITH FATE!” I understand perfectly well that Ian King has forgot more than
I know about weight training, but this is one “KING trend” I’m going to steer
clear of! Respectfully to all, Joey Z.
you have had an injury and the general rules may not apply to you anymore. lots of powerlifters and even bodybuilders i know have been doing good mornings and stiff legged deadlifts with BOTH rounded backs and arched backs. none that i know have had a problem caused by either method. if you have an injury that hasn’t healed, then don’t do them.
I think if one had Ian King to show him how to do it correctly, there would be no problem. Those who say you’ll get injured are probably not doing it right or just aren’t “bucking the trend” and haven’t tried it.
I think most injuries with round-back SLDL (hell, DL in general) result from using a weight that exceeds ability to maintain proper technique. I’m speaking from experience. If one uses a weight that the weakest muscles in the chain (often the spinal erectors) can’t support, the weight is transferred to the intervertebral ligaments…obviously a recipe for disaster. Use a weight that your muscles can handle and injury shouldn’t be a problem.
Pete/Tek, what you guys said makes sense. I personally include rounded
back goodmornings into my “back” workout. My back IS completely
healed now, and DL’s of all kinds have played a role in my recovery.
I can now perform SUMO or CONVENTIONAL DL’s while using over double
my BW for reps. I do these movements with ZERO pain, provided perfect
form is adhered to. The thread did say “SLDL’s for the HAMSTRINGS,”
not the lower back. The function of the hamstring is as a hip extender
not a spinal flexor. A better question would be: Is the rounded back SLDL
being used for the lower back or for the hamstrings and glutes? I can
see why the rounded back SDL would be employed for the lower back (with
a much lighter weight) but not for the hamstrings. BTW - I injured my back
while unloading a truck, eleven 3/4 years ago - throwing 50lb fertilizer
bags high into a loft…too many bags…too much twisting!
Respectfully to all, Joey Z.
Well Joey, I would tend to agree with you categorically on this one. I had my left acl replaced in april and have been aggressively rehabing it with sldl’s, of the Flat back variety, simply because I REALLY want to get my hamms and lower back strength back to an acceptable level. I also injured myself (slightly) with rounded back slds many years ago, but am quite confident that I was using poor form and too much weight, obviously, in regards to yourself, with a preex injury, they would not be good idea! Unless, of course, you start out with very moderate weight, and at that point, what does the movement REALY do for you. I’m sure Ian has specific parameters for the rounded back execution, and perhaps the staff can enlighten us with some photos and a discertation on the advantages of this movement. Until then, I like yourself will probably avoid it and focus on the Romanian version. By the way for anyone rehabbing their acl’s, since I have begun doing strict, moderate weight full squats, in addition to romanian deads, my acl progress has accelerated thru the roof.
Doing DLs with a rounded back puts more strain on your back–that is simple mechanics. If your back is healthy it may be no problem. But the risk of injury with higher weights is greater that way then with a straight back.
if you really want to hit your hams hard - arched back good morning or romanian deadlifts are the ticket. once you lose the arch, other muscles come into play. how much weight do you use for these exercises? i can get a single with about 395 for a rounded back good morning but i know i couldn’t get an arched back goodmorning with more than 315.
I don’t know if its true that rounded back dl are as safe as flat back, but like they say, if it ain’t broken, don’t fix it. I am not going to go to the gym and tell myself…yeah its round back deadlift time. Do what works for you guys, but the flat back technique has done a marvellous job for my hams.
JRandall, thank you for your excellent response! SDL’s
and RDL’s are superb choices for ACL rehabilitation: they
strengthen - lengthen - and break down scar tissue, all at
the same time!
Pete: My heavy single days are a thing of the past. Your
395lb RBGM is more than impressive! First of all, my BW
is 170, and I train like a B.B. - I use a 3-1-1 cadence on all
my movements, even DL’s. I do RBGM’s as a conditioning
movement only - 3 sets of 10 reps with 175. On all all my
other exercises, I generally employ a 4 sets of 6 rep scheme.
It’s hard to read my power numbers on SLDL’s - RDL’s -
SUMO DL’s and CONV. DL’s because I train with smaller
plates in order to gain greater range, plus I’m doing 3 second
negatives. Having said that, on RDL’s (using plates no larger
than the 35’s) I get 255 for 4 sets of 6 ultra strict reps.
On SUMOS and conventional DL’s I use 25% more weight in the
same fashion. Pete, being a little older now, longevity is my
main objective; I want to be kicking ass 40 years from now!.. Joey Z.