number 2.
[quote]Stronghold wrote:
You made a bunch of claims regarding the systems we are talking about and NONE of them were even close to true. These authors are presenting their advice in the context of an entire system. No one reads the Anabolic Diet and starts having massive weekend carb ups without dieting during the week, and I think we can assume that this is the same.
This board isn’t “the general public” so you don’t need to worry about us. Keiffer’s blog is called “Dangerously Hardcore” for fuck’s sake, you probably won’t be seeing this stuff on the cover of People Magazine anytime soon. If you had any clue what it was you were saying couldn’t possibly work, then you would know that eating before bed is actually more important to the system than skipping breakfast. You are damn quick to criticize something you know nothing about with your “I talked to da big bros” logic.[/quote]
haha ok, you win.
[quote]Stronghold wrote:
[quote]Akuma01 wrote:
im sorry, but when decades worth of bodybuilders are telling me to eat breakfast, im going to eat breakfast.
Anytime i read an article like this, I tend to recal “scientific” articles with dozens of citings that make some outlandish claim like “the body can only absorb up to 2g of protein per hr.”
After an 8 hr fast, or perhaps even longer because you also read an article that told you not to eat prior to bed, and you plan on heading straight to the gym to “Promote fat loss,” then you A. Need to know lose fat properly, and B. Wont be maintaining too much muscle for very long.
[/quote]
glucogenesis[/quote]
gluconeogenesis? Takes nerd goggles off
if i was a professional bodybuilder i would be eating breakfast too. i’d also be eating atleast double the amount of protein i currently eat as well. why? because professional bodybuilders need to optimize their diets, and since most weigh 250+, i think it would be quite difficult to fit their daily caloric needs in 2-3 meals a day, hence the reason to eat 7-8 meals.
this whole issue all boils down to individuality and what works best for that individual. “hard gainers” wanting to put on mass aren’t gonna fair well with skipping breakfast because what makes them a hard gainer in the first place is that they don’t eat enough to grow. if you take breakfast out, then they’ll really be hard pressed to get enough calories in.
however if you’re a fat ass or want to shed some bodyfat, i think the main take home point in this whole conundrum is that by skipping breakfast your muscles won’t immediately begin to atrophy and you won’t turn into a weakling. hell, throw in some low intensity cardio and you might burn some fat, and get to enjoy a bigger lunch and post workout meal.
the whole “breakfast revs up your metabolic furnace” is obviously bull shit but if eating breakfast causes you to feel and perform better and to hit your goals faster, why stop eating it?
[quote]PB Andy wrote:
[quote]Stronghold wrote:
[quote]Akuma01 wrote:
im sorry, but when decades worth of bodybuilders are telling me to eat breakfast, im going to eat breakfast.
Anytime i read an article like this, I tend to recal “scientific” articles with dozens of citings that make some outlandish claim like “the body can only absorb up to 2g of protein per hr.”
After an 8 hr fast, or perhaps even longer because you also read an article that told you not to eat prior to bed, and you plan on heading straight to the gym to “Promote fat loss,” then you A. Need to know lose fat properly, and B. Wont be maintaining too much muscle for very long.
[/quote]
glucogenesis[/quote]
gluconeogenesis? Takes nerd goggles off[/quote]
Caught me, I type faster than I think apparently.
[quote]Dolce wrote:
if i was a professional bodybuilder i would be eating breakfast too. i’d also be eating atleast double the amount of protein i currently eat as well. why? because professional bodybuilders need to optimize their diets, and since most weigh 250+, i think it would be quite difficult to fit their daily caloric needs in 2-3 meals a day, hence the reason to eat 7-8 meals.
this whole issue all boils down to individuality and what works best for that individual. “hard gainers” wanting to put on mass aren’t gonna fair well with skipping breakfast because what makes them a hard gainer in the first place is that they don’t eat enough to grow. if you take breakfast out, then they’ll really be hard pressed to get enough calories in.
however if you’re a fat ass or want to shed some bodyfat, i think the main take home point in this whole conundrum is that by skipping breakfast your muscles won’t immediately begin to atrophy and you won’t turn into a weakling. hell, throw in some low intensity cardio and you might burn some fat, and get to enjoy a bigger lunch and post workout meal.
the whole “breakfast revs up your metabolic furnace” is obviously bull shit but if eating breakfast causes you to feel and perform better and to hit your goals faster, why stop eating it?
[/quote]
Exactly.
Why in the fuck does everything turn into a pissing match on this site? Christ it’s annoying.
[quote]Icarus wrote:
[quote]Dolce wrote:
if i was a professional bodybuilder i would be eating breakfast too. i’d also be eating atleast double the amount of protein i currently eat as well. why? because professional bodybuilders need to optimize their diets, and since most weigh 250+, i think it would be quite difficult to fit their daily caloric needs in 2-3 meals a day, hence the reason to eat 7-8 meals.
this whole issue all boils down to individuality and what works best for that individual. “hard gainers” wanting to put on mass aren’t gonna fair well with skipping breakfast because what makes them a hard gainer in the first place is that they don’t eat enough to grow. if you take breakfast out, then they’ll really be hard pressed to get enough calories in.
however if you’re a fat ass or want to shed some bodyfat, i think the main take home point in this whole conundrum is that by skipping breakfast your muscles won’t immediately begin to atrophy and you won’t turn into a weakling. hell, throw in some low intensity cardio and you might burn some fat, and get to enjoy a bigger lunch and post workout meal.
the whole “breakfast revs up your metabolic furnace” is obviously bull shit but if eating breakfast causes you to feel and perform better and to hit your goals faster, why stop eating it?
[/quote]
Exactly.
Why in the fuck does everything turn into a pissing match on this site? Christ it’s annoying.
[/quote]
Because some people refuse to accept the fact that there are things besides their own dogmatic approach that work.
Great discussion. I am definitely interested in applying this approach. I am in the midst of a quick recomp and have been dieting in the more traditional bodybuilding method for the last 2 weeks. I’ve loss 6 pounds in that time frame and about 3/4 of an inch off my waist with minimal loss of strength. I would consider these results atypical for me (I’ve done a couple of these short (4 weeks or so) recomps). In any event, I’m game for something different to fill out the last 2 weeks of my recomp. I’m not breakfast type of guy, although I do have a decent sized one (nutrient wise) since that is considered the norm. In any event, I don’t think skipping breakfast will be all that hard for me.
Couple of questions I have for the people using this approach:
- What type of macro breakdown do you use in terms of pro, fats, carbs?
- On your last meal of the day, would you try to stick with something that is a little easier/faster to digest (meaning ditch casein, fat or fiber as last meal)?
[quote]Stronghold wrote:
[quote]Icarus wrote:
[quote]Dolce wrote:
if i was a professional bodybuilder i would be eating breakfast too. i’d also be eating atleast double the amount of protein i currently eat as well. why? because professional bodybuilders need to optimize their diets, and since most weigh 250+, i think it would be quite difficult to fit their daily caloric needs in 2-3 meals a day, hence the reason to eat 7-8 meals.
this whole issue all boils down to individuality and what works best for that individual. “hard gainers” wanting to put on mass aren’t gonna fair well with skipping breakfast because what makes them a hard gainer in the first place is that they don’t eat enough to grow. if you take breakfast out, then they’ll really be hard pressed to get enough calories in.
however if you’re a fat ass or want to shed some bodyfat, i think the main take home point in this whole conundrum is that by skipping breakfast your muscles won’t immediately begin to atrophy and you won’t turn into a weakling. hell, throw in some low intensity cardio and you might burn some fat, and get to enjoy a bigger lunch and post workout meal.
the whole “breakfast revs up your metabolic furnace” is obviously bull shit but if eating breakfast causes you to feel and perform better and to hit your goals faster, why stop eating it?
[/quote]
Exactly.
Why in the fuck does everything turn into a pissing match on this site? Christ it’s annoying.
[/quote]
Because some people refuse to accept the fact that there are things besides their own dogmatic approach that work.[/quote]
Obviously everyone is going to have a little bias towards their own approaches, for reasons ranging from it was taught to them for ages to it worked for them. Maybe eating breakfast has worked wonders for him and that’s why he strongly advocates it. I don’t think slight bias necessarily means he’s completely refusing to accept any other ideas that go against his beliefs. With that said, we could all use a more open mind to new ideas.
[quote]Stronghold wrote:
Because some people refuse to accept the fact that there are things besides their own dogmatic approach that work.[/quote]
I know, I meant it as a rhetorical question. Guess I should have pointed that out. LOL.
I think most posts in this thread make a valid point. A lot of things work for a lot of people.
Good news. I hate eating breakfast. All through HS I never ate my first meal until lunch, I started forcing myself to eat it once I started bodybuilding, but stopped after I read in a few articles how not eating for a few hours after cardio in the morning keeps you burning fat since your body is already in fat burning mode.
The past few years I have gone back to eating breakfast (mostly because I work out in the mornings as my Gym is too full in the afternoon/night to get a serious workout in.) and I find it makes it keeping lean much harder, especially since once I ‘break the seal’ with breakfast, I just can’t stop eating.
This has been working well for me.
I love breakie and thought I would die without.
Turns out I didn’t expire and it took about 5 days to adjust fully.
I had wired myself and my body into that way of operating.
I have now re-wired myself.
Fat loss = good. Muscle loss = none so far.
Now if only I could find away to skip the whole morning thing altogether (the get up early and go to work in the rain bit) then everything would be sweet…
Skipping breakfast for fat loss???
Sumo wrestlers have been skipping breakfast as a fat gaining strategy for decades. Doesn’t sound right to skip breakfast to lose weight…
At the end of the day it all boils down to input vs. output. If you eat two meals a day, but you eat 4,000 calories in those two meals, you are most likely going to get fat. If you eat 6 meals a day, with 2500 calories, the opposite would happen (and vice versa).
I think skipping breakfast is just one option to help people lose weight because it allows them to have bigger and more satisfying meals towards the end of the day. Unfortunately, you may end up with hunger pains in the morning. It’s a trade off. I’ve read quite a bit on Martin’s website and he mentions that the hunger pains go away.
I’ve tried the IF style for a couple weeks and unfortunately I’m still getting the hunger pains. Anyone else noticed similar effects?
Where are the big muscles at? Would all of the guys who gained 50+lbs of lean body mass doing this raise their hand?
[quote]Professor X wrote:
Where are the big muscles at? Would all of the guys who gained 50+lbs of lean body mass doing this raise their hand?[/quote]
No one is going to gain serious muscle on this backloading idea. I don’t care. Fat loss yea maybe due to lack of cals. I still think front loading cals would work better for fat loss. This back loading idea just seems to be exactly what I wouldn’t do. I’m constantly trying to gain and have never tried it so I can’t sit here and slam it, but I’m highly skeptic.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
Where are the big muscles at? Would all of the guys who gained 50+lbs of lean body mass doing this raise their hand?[/quote]
Where are the big muscles at? Siphoning off the oxygen to your brain possibly.
Would all of the guys who misconstrued this as a serious bulking plan rather than a fat loss strategy for the percentage of the population it suits, please raise their hand?
[quote]Cheeky_Kea wrote:
[quote]Professor X wrote:
Where are the big muscles at? Would all of the guys who gained 50+lbs of lean body mass doing this raise their hand?[/quote]
Where are the big muscles at? Siphoning off the oxygen to your brain possibly.
Would all of the guys who misconstrued this as a serious bulking plan rather than a fat loss strategy for the percentage of the population it suits, please raise their hand?
[/quote]
Actually I apologise to Prof x as my response seems a little harsh.
Not 50+lbs but someone on the site claims 24lbs lbm in 65 days.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
Where are the big muscles at? Would all of the guys who gained 50+lbs of lean body mass doing this raise their hand?[/quote]
I don’t think anyone has argued that they should skip breakfast when gaining. Just a short-term thing when trying to lose some fat.
I would die, and so would others around me, if I had to skip breakfast. Skipping breakfast falls under the “not cool” category for me.