Shirts and Suits: What's the Point?

Training Powerlifting
21

[quote]Matthew9v9 wrote:
This topic again? [/quote]

Sorry, I don’t frequent the forums as often as I used to…I didn’t know this was beating a dead horse.

So PLers wear this stuff for protection…but as a side benefit they get a couple hundred pounds extra on their bench? Convenient… :wink:

[quote]Mindeffer01 wrote:
Heres an idea. Find a shirt and set it on a bench. Drop a bar on the shirt. The shirt will get smushed by the bar. Now put the shirt on and try the same thing. Big difference, huh? You see, It is the person using the shirt that makes the difference, not the shirt.[/quote]

I think this completely misses the point…and I think you know it.

[quote]Crow wrote:
Right Side Up, you need to change your perspective.[/quote]

That’s what I’ve enlisted you for! Try to convince me there is some legitimate rationale behind the notion.

Agreed. But this seems to sidestep the crux of the issue. I think it’s purely inflationary – by the Feds (publicity) and the participants (ego?).

[quote]moshne wrote:
it all comes down to ego.[/quote]

I think I might agree with this.

Fortunately, I can run faster and farther!

[quote]basementD wrote:
1)Lifters use gear because it is required for the Feds they choose to compete in.[/quote]

This is besides the point.

[quote]
2)A lot of gear lifters are still strong as hell without the gear, the 1000lb bencher is hitting in the 600s or 700s without gear, so he is still strong and gets my respect. [/quote]

Of course – strength is strength, and strength is deserving of respect. I guess what I don’t credit is the difference between a lifter’s natural max lift and their geared max lift.

I’m not sure why the weight matters?

[quote]
4)The sport is supported financially by gear manufacturers, so in a sense gear keeps the sport alive.[/quote]

I think this is an excellent point, but still aside from the root of the issue.

[quote]
In an nutshell, live and let live. If you don’t like gear then look elsewhere. If you like it, then go for it. [/quote]

But of course. This thread wasn’t meant to knock competitive PLers, it was just to try to understand the point of adding this tool which increases performance so conclusively that the lifter shouldn’t even take credit for the increased lift above their raw max.

[quote]Dq wrote:
How many times do poeple have to say it. [/quote]
Once more, please?

Like I’ve said to others who make this point, it is sidestepping the crucial point.

No, lift away – I don’t care at all. It truly doesn’t bother me one bit. I’m just trying to understand the rationale.
Your reference to it helping your injury is interesting though…how much does it add to your raw bench?

Again, I have no problem with you or anyone else (competitive or not) using a shirt…unless we’re both trying to impress a chick and I’m like “Yo, I bench 285” and he’s like “Yo, I bench 360” but his max is the result of 4 guys squeezing him into some shirt that puts his hands parallel with his neck! (kidding, that wouldn’t bother me at all either)

I apologize for starting a thread that has been runover many times before.

I also want to make it clear that I in no way disrespect the goals of lifting as much weight as possible. I just don’t understand why gear is used.

Thanks for all non-trolling input thus far.

22

[quote]aggro-iron wrote:
RJay Floyd wrote:
You dont have to lift in a raw meet to lift raw. You can lift raw in any meet you want to. Who cares if a guy beats you wearing a bench shirt? What do you get for winning? A cheap trophy? Lift raw if you want to lift raw. Wear gear if you want to wear gear. Why do you care what other people do anyway?

I couldn’t have said it any better myself. And I am a raw lifter. The ultimate competition for most of us who will never be world class is against ourselves. Forget what everyone else is doing or not doing and concentrate on your own training.[/quote]

I agree, mostly you are competing against yourself & if you are lifting raw everyone knows that you are at a disadvantage to any competition.

23

[quote]bikemike wrote:
I’ve browsed through these posts quickly, and I still haven’t seen WHY powerlifting suits, shirts, whatever, help. I would like to know the science behind it.[/quote]

Different thread?

24

[quote]aggro-iron wrote:
RJay Floyd wrote:
You dont have to lift in a raw meet to lift raw. You can lift raw in any meet you want to. Who cares if a guy beats you wearing a bench shirt? What do you get for winning? A cheap trophy? Lift raw if you want to lift raw. Wear gear if you want to wear gear. Why do you care what other people do anyway?

I couldn’t have said it any better myself. And I am a raw lifter. The ultimate competition for most of us who will never be world class is against ourselves. Forget what everyone else is doing or not doing and concentrate on your own training.[/quote]

I agree with both of these posts.

25

well said aggro-iron. I bench raw and won’t talk crap about assisted benchers. You don’t hear NASCAR drivers talk crap about Formula drivers because their cars have more power, different tires, etc…

26

[quote]Right Side Up wrote:
Matthew9v9 wrote:

… Powerlifting gear, when used wisely, can protect against injury and prolong your lifting and training career.

So PLers wear this stuff for protection…but as a side benefit they get a couple hundred pounds extra on their bench? Convenient… :wink:

[/quote]

RSU, I noticed you like to cut out the IMPORTANT part of what Reape was saying…the part where he address WHY it helps you.

I’ll reiterate with emphasis:
Read Reape’s article, “10 Strength Training Tips”.

"Tip #5: Use powerlifting equipment but limit belt use.

… Powerlifting gear, when used wisely, can protect against injury and prolong your lifting and training career.

This can be done by wearing “looser-than-meet” gear around a problem area like the low back or shoulders. A loose squat suit with straps down or loose groove briefs [u]can take a lot of stress off the hips, groin, and low back while keeping warmth where it’s needed[/u]. A loose bench press shirt is just the ticket most older lifters need [u]to protect their problem shoulders. [/u]

That’s also for bikemike who aparently didn’t see it either. As for “the science”, are you looking for formulas and references to be sited? If so, check with Reape, maybe he can assist.

Personal note: I have not yet competed. I don’t even use PL gear other than a belt on days that I test myself, and I don’t plan on using it, but I can respect someone else’s wishes if the choose to WITHOUT having to try and make them think their achievements are suspect.

Matthew

27

[quote]Matthew9v9 wrote:
Personal note: I have not yet competed. I don’t even use PL gear other than a belt on days that I test myself, and I don’t plan on using it, but I can respect someone else’s wishes if the choose to WITHOUT having to try and make them think their achievements are suspect.

Matthew[/quote]

Amen brother!! Let’s all live and let live!!

28

thanks did not know that.jon

29

they restrict range of movement and give additional spring, if you try a shirt suit it is uncomfortable and rips you bloody but helps handle more weight

30

excellent response

31

I too thought this thread would be about the office and your clothes requirements.

Sirt and tie–and always a belt–everyday but Friday.

ps RSU–props on the Woodward book from several threads ago on the politicals.

32

you have a great outlook and looks like a good bench also.

33

there have been some good points in explaining why PL’rs use gear

1st and formost it helps prevent injury (this is why the first bench shirt was introduced)

2nd it allows for bigger totals and new records… making events more exciting

3rd like said gear makers are major sponsers keeping the sport alive

Also I like the comparison to other sports… there are very few if any sports where technology hasnt advanced a great deal so athletes (or drivers in the case of motorsports) can set new standards all in an effort to better suit athletes needs and make the sports more exciting.

hell I might watch nascar if it was still based on factory mid-size rear wheel drive cars with big blocks… but now its all based on cars that all look almost exactly alike no matter the make and are based on platforms (small block rear wheel drive) that the car companies don’t even produce! The reason they do this is to make the sport safer, more competative, and more exciting.

34

[quote]JNeves wrote:

Also I like the comparison to other sports… there are very few if any sports where technology hasnt advanced a great deal so athletes (or drivers in the case of motorsports) can set new standards all in an effort to better suit athletes needs and make the sports more exciting.
[/quote]

Or Olympic swimming with the full body suits that provide more buoyancy and with the new red contact lenses baseball players are using.

35

[quote]ironheadpl wrote:

Not every Fed has raw divisions. NASA has Power Sports, NAP has raw BP div. & there are some more but not all.[/quote]

Were you naming the ones that do have RAW divisions? I compete in the APF and IPA, those r the 2 most gear heavy feds and they both have raw divisions. I’m not aware of feds that don’t have any raw divisions.

36

[quote]Right Side Up wrote:
I just don’t understand why gear is used.
[/quote]
bro people do what people do because they can -and that’s it. if you really want to understand just try it sometime. you might even like it.

37

Man, I guess my next question would be:

Why the hell does everyone get so freakin’ touchy about this?

I really don’t give a crap what anyone else does. My questions were perfectly legitimate and I thought someone might be able to see where I was coming from – if I was missing something, I thought they might be able to articulate the purpose or help me see the matter in a different light. Let’s just say articulation is in high demand, round here.

The only interesting thing I heard was that it helps prevent injury…this doesn’t explain, however, why lifters use double, triple, quadruple, and quintsexseptfuckinuple ply suits.

The plethora of comments regarding it being a necessity to compete warrants no response other than “no shit sherlock.”

Then those who say things like “they can do whatever they want to do…why do you care…get a life…” are simply responding over-defensively, missing the point of the question, and falsly inferring that I have a problem with suits in the first place.

This thread could die for all I care, I just thought someone might be able to make a legit argument for suits.

*Sasquatch – you’re quite welcome, I’m glad you enjoyed the book.

38

Here’s the way it was put to me by guys on the inside of the sport.

-The “gear is for safety” thing is a wash with the bigger weights it lets you use. The injuries are just as common, just different than they were in the old days.

-Lots of guys who do use gear believe it has gotten out of hand, but they use it anyway, in oreder to stay competitive.

-Raw meets are dominated by bible thumpers and a turn-off for that reason.

-People, like yourself, are being turned off to the sport after getting bad reactions to reasonable questions that any newcomer would have.

39

HOW DOES IT WORK? By locking the various bodyparts into position, meet gear provides somewhere between linear and exponential resistance in the range of motion and become a virtual spring to help move the weight. The drawbacks are you still have to stabilzie and lockout the weight, not to mention tweak the gear to get weights in the squat and bench low enough to pass. In reality, only sumo lifters get much out of gear in the DL. Looser gear can prevent injuries via stabilization, load abosorption, and heat retention, but meet gear is to lift more weight and DEFEAT your competition. Like Dale jrs car or Lance’s bike.

REASON IT IS AROUND Gear companies support powerlifting. Powerlifters support gear companies. Powerlifters, like everybody else, all make choices on risks and costs they will bear to compete at a certain level. Hence why few lift raw, many more lift single ply, some lift double ply and greater. The same with steroid use…How far will you go?

WHY I USE IT. It complicates my training and leaves me bruised and even bloody at times. I am not wild about lifting gear, but i embrace it and consider myself a student of the gear as it is a cost of admission to compete at the highest levels. I don’t like paying $100+ for my sons new aluminum bat but i sure liked the way the ball came off it last night. Few things in life, and i have done a few out of the normal mainstream of things that put hair on end, compare to lifting on a national platform. I don’t make the rules or make the gear. I just like the feel of the hunt in competition…as much as i like winning.

jmo
jack

40

[quote]Right Side Up wrote:
Man, I guess my next question would be:

Why the hell does everyone get so freakin’ touchy about this?

[/quote]

Because people keep bringing it up in a condescending way and then the rest of the non-gear folks jump on board and bad-mouth the gear-head’s numbers. Try being civil about it and not condescending. Reread your original post and ask yourself if your snide tone was necessary.

I don’t even USE gear, or compete, and it read that way.