Again,if you say its working for you, i wont argue that, but i still say people look better if the drop the whey protein (pure, not mixed).If you look at my previous post about casien vs whey, or if you’ve read the “protein pulse” articles, it should be no secret that casien is better than whey (except maybe befor/during or after a workout, depending on your phase of training).
I have used casein, whey, and casein-whey mixtures all with the same results. I have never had any changes in muscle mass, strength, or bodyfat from changing what TYPE of protein I consume. I have only experienced differences from changing my macro-nutrient ratios. I have however experienced physical changes from consuming different carbs (complex or simple)or different fats (unsaturated or saturated) without changing macro-nutrient ratios but I have never had differences from changing protein types. I agree with JW protein has been way over-analyzed, just make sure you get enough.
Like I asid bro I use a blend myself. I just feel most people should worry about getting the protein in the first place. It seems we prety much argee on the finer points…
WSTRAINER, do you not buy those studies because you have read the full text articles or because you have seen anecdotal evidence to the contrary? I do not discount your personal experiences because those are important as well. However, I hypothesize that their lack of progress is coming from the toxins, estrogens, carbs, and fats as you stated and not the protein. Obese people (like used in the Zemel studies) possibly react to whole dairy more favorably than people who are just a little overweight. The fact of the matter is this topic is far from conclusive which makes it hard to make any definate recommendations on whether to take milk protein or not (As I guess Udo apparently made). It is important to look at all the data before making a statement. As I said in my previous statement I do not discount casein as being a part of the weight loss experienced in high dairy diets. Quite to the contrary in fact because milk protein is about 80% casein, 20% whey. I was just trying to sum up some conclusions Dr. Zemel made about why whey may have an effect. I am definately a proponent to using a whey-casein blend as opposed to either alone (as is mother nature).
I am also very aware of the study you mentioned and have read the full text even though it has been a while. I used to use it to disprove people who were anti-casein. The casein group did lose more fat than the whey group but there is an important point to consider that did not come out in the abstract. The casein hydrosylate was not just a casein hydrosylate, it was Met-Rx, which contains casein, whey, vitamins, minerals and so forth. So this study was a comparison of whey hydosylate alone versus Met-Rx, or in other words whey versus a blend. I think most people agree that a whey-casein blend is the best way to go anyway (as does Biotest apparently). If you also notice the whey group also lost fat, just not as much. It would be hard for me to conclude from this study or any other studies that whey or milk protein in general makes people fat. At this point the data seem to fall in favor of milk protein (which includes whey) augmenting fat loss.
Too much of anything is not good for you. Your body can develop allergies and adapt in a negative way developing resistances to its positive effects. That’s why an overall diet of mixed sources and specifically protein from mixed sources is the way to go. Personally, I see no benefit of whey protein other than immediately pre-workout, immediately post-workout, and immediately post-nocturnal. And even at these times, whey protein is just one of many potential tools for good results, not a necessity.