Hey, I was just wondering if anyone is taking this supp or anyone knows about it…
I work out quite a bit and I hear testosterone is pretty big for muscle building…Anyways
I was thinking of taking this supp because apparently it blocks testosterone from turning into DHT which makes you lose your hair…
I just dont want my testerone levels to be affected by taking this sub, anyone know about this supp
Thanx
i’ve herd of it but have not herd of its benifits i look into that and get back to you
[quote]Buzzsaw wrote:
Hey, I was just wondering if anyone is taking this supp or anyone knows about it…
I work out quite a bit and I hear testosterone is pretty big for muscle building…Anyways
I was thinking of taking this supp because apparently it blocks testosterone from turning into DHT which makes you lose your hair…
I just dont want my testerone levels to be affected by taking this sub, anyone know about this supp
Thanx[/quote]
I use it. Took a while to find a brand I like, NOW’s prostate support. I have prostatitis and this seems to help it. I want to avoid proscar, flomax and related drugs right now so I use the saw palmetto. My family doc actually recommended it and after using proscar, which provides amazing relief but alas killed my sex drive, most of the saw palmettos had no effect on prostate and urine flow except NOW’s product. Also, proscar grew hair which was amazing, saw palmetto doesn’t seem to do that.
As for it’s negative effect on t-levels, I haven’t noticed that. I do take Alpha Male from time to time though so maybe that helps keep it up.
Just man up and take Propecia.
According to the PI, it actually raise Test levels by 15%.
[quote]TheZ-Man wrote:
Just man up and take Propecia.
According to the PI, it actually raise Test levels by 15%.[/quote]
What is the PI? Some studies may indicate test rising but many do not. Also, many people will tell you they experience a problem with mr. happy. My doc, me and many guys have had that experience. Just be aware of it. If you start to notice it stop the propecia cause the longer you’re on the longer it takes to come back I believe.
If you don’t get that side or don’t care about that side it is a great medication.
[quote]Scrappy wrote:
TheZ-Man wrote:
Just man up and take Propecia.
According to the PI, it actually raise Test levels by 15%.
What is the PI? Some studies may indicate test rising but many do not. Also, many people will tell you they experience a problem with mr. happy. My doc, me and many guys have had that experience. Just be aware of it. If you start to notice it stop the propecia cause the longer you’re on the longer it takes to come back I believe.
If you don’t get that side or don’t care about that side it is a great medication.
[/quote]
THe PI is the “product information” that every drug must come with. It is scrutinized by the FDA and must be 100% accurate.
As for “Mr Happy”…
1.8% of men reported a decreased libido after the 1st year.
1.3% of men on the placebo reported the same effect.
Hmmmmm…sounds like there may be a mental aspect going on here.
After 5 years, the studies showed that those reporting side effects decreased to .3%.
If you are one of the unfortunate men who experience a sexual side effect, the effct will reverse after you stop taking the meds. (There is no evidence that the longer you are on it, the longer it will take.)
[quote]TheZ-Man wrote:
THe PI is the “product information” that every drug must come with. It is scrutinized by the FDA and must be 100% accurate.
[/quote]
Hehehehe. I think you are putting a bit too much faith in a government body here. Sure, the product information must match results of some study, but that doesn’t mean that you can absolutely trust it to be 100% truthful, complete and accurate.
There is a lot of money for companies that get a drug approved, people get promotions and huge bonuses, and there is lots of lobbying and funny deals that happen, so, not saying you are wrong at all, but it’s just tricky to put blind faith in the government these days.
[quote]vroom wrote:
TheZ-Man wrote:
THe PI is the “product information” that every drug must come with. It is scrutinized by the FDA and must be 100% accurate.
Hehehehe. I think you are putting a bit too much faith in a government body here. Sure, the product information must match results of some study, but that doesn’t mean that you can absolutely trust it to be 100% truthful, complete and accurate.
There is a lot of money for companies that get a drug approved, people get promotions and huge bonuses, and there is lots of lobbying and funny deals that happen, so, not saying you are wrong at all, but it’s just tricky to put blind faith in the government these days.[/quote]
Fuckin’ Canadians
SP has been known to give one artificially low PSA readings. If you have a prostate problem, taking it could disguise a problem arising.
"There is a lot of money for companies that get a drug approved, people get promotions and huge bonuses, and there is lots of lobbying and funny deals that happen, so, not saying you are wrong at all, but it’s just tricky to put blind faith in the government these days. "
BINGO
[quote]Buzzsaw wrote:
Hey, I was just wondering if anyone is taking this supp or anyone knows about it…
I work out quite a bit and I hear testosterone is pretty big for muscle building…Anyways
I was thinking of taking this supp because apparently it blocks testosterone from turning into DHT which makes you lose your hair…
I just dont want my testerone levels to be affected by taking this sub, anyone know about this supp
Thanx[/quote]
As far as stopping you from losing your hair, it won’t work. Forget about it. It may have some value in helping with prostate problems I don’t know about that one.
[quote]vroom wrote:
TheZ-Man wrote:
THe PI is the “product information” that every drug must come with. It is scrutinized by the FDA and must be 100% accurate.
Hehehehe. I think you are putting a bit too much faith in a government body here. Sure, the product information must match results of some study, but that doesn’t mean that you can absolutely trust it to be 100% truthful, complete and accurate.
There is a lot of money for companies that get a drug approved, people get promotions and huge bonuses, and there is lots of lobbying and funny deals that happen, so, not saying you are wrong at all, but it’s just tricky to put blind faith in the government these days.[/quote]
I work in research for a MAJOR drug company. I am engaged to a doctor. I know many docors very closely. I am not anti medicine or anti drug company or anti doctor. However, what was quoted on finasterides sexual side effects has many ways of being skewed. Not from the drug company being evil but even from simple things like people not admitting the side effect and many other variables. Anyway, there are whole forums on yahoo of guys who didnt’ get their sex drive back for 5 years. My physician said his sex drive took a hit and never recovered. Mine took a hit and took forever to come back. I also had major trouble losing fat while using finasteride.
My family docor, my urologist, my doctor friends and people I know at companies making finasteride. Many, many users I know personally and many more I’ve read have had the sex issue. The 1.8% does not seem accurate in any way shape or pharm.
I don’t believe big pharma is evil and there are major conspiracies involved in bringing a drug to market. Rather, I’m fully aware of all the variables and processes in bringing a drug from discovery, to development, to clinical to the market. There is statistical manipulation, embarressed patients not admitting sex disfunction, patient samples who aren’t having sex anyway not noticing it, skewed questionaries, all kinds of variables that allowed this company, the maker of vioxx incidentally, to put that number 1.8% in it’s product information. The fact that the FDA review it means the FDA reviewed it. It does not mean it’s right. I got the side effect. Many others do and will.
The drug is usually effective…That’s why you get the side! If the drug ‘works’ for you it’s lowering DHT correct? Well then, it’s loweing DHT, that helps shrink the prostate…nice!
That helps grow hair…nice!
that makes it hard to get/keep a boner…oooohhh not so nice.
Everyone, the drug works for most people. If you get the sex side effect and you like sex get off the drug. It will only get worse.
[quote]Scrappy wrote:
vroom wrote:
TheZ-Man wrote:
THe PI is the “product information” that every drug must come with. It is scrutinized by the FDA and must be 100% accurate.
Hehehehe. I think you are putting a bit too much faith in a government body here. Sure, the product information must match results of some study, but that doesn’t mean that you can absolutely trust it to be 100% truthful, complete and accurate.
There is a lot of money for companies that get a drug approved, people get promotions and huge bonuses, and there is lots of lobbying and funny deals that happen, so, not saying you are wrong at all, but it’s just tricky to put blind faith in the government these days.
I work in research for a MAJOR drug company. I am engaged to a doctor. I know many docors very closely. I am not anti medicine or anti drug company or anti doctor. However, what was quoted on finasterides sexual side effects has many ways of being skewed. Not from the drug company being evil but even from simple things like people not admitting the side effect and many other variables. Anyway, there are whole forums on yahoo of guys who didnt’ get their sex drive back for 5 years. My physician said his sex drive took a hit and never recovered. Mine took a hit and took forever to come back. I also had major trouble losing fat while using finasteride.
My family docor, my urologist, my doctor friends and people I know at companies making finasteride. Many, many users I know personally and many more I’ve read have had the sex issue. The 1.8% does not seem accurate in any way shape or pharm.
I don’t believe big pharma is evil and there are major conspiracies involved in bringing a drug to market. Rather, I’m fully aware of all the variables and processes in bringing a drug from discovery, to development, to clinical to the market. There is statistical manipulation, embarressed patients not admitting sex disfunction, patient samples who aren’t having sex anyway not noticing it, skewed questionaries, all kinds of variables that allowed this company, the maker of vioxx incidentally, to put that number 1.8% in it’s product information. The fact that the FDA review it means the FDA reviewed it. It does not mean it’s right. I got the side effect. Many others do and will.
The drug is usually effective…That’s why you get the side! If the drug ‘works’ for you it’s lowering DHT correct? Well then, it’s loweing DHT, that helps shrink the prostate…nice!
That helps grow hair…nice!
that makes it hard to get/keep a boner…oooohhh not so nice.
Everyone, the drug works for most people. If you get the sex side effect and you like sex get off the drug. It will only get worse.
[/quote]
Great post Scrappy.
One question,
Does anything that lowers DHT give a negative sexual side effect?
[quote]Scrappy wrote:
vroom wrote:
TheZ-Man wrote:
THe PI is the “product information” that every drug must come with. It is scrutinized by the FDA and must be 100% accurate.
Hehehehe. I think you are putting a bit too much faith in a government body here. Sure, the product information must match results of some study, but that doesn’t mean that you can absolutely trust it to be 100% truthful, complete and accurate.
There is a lot of money for companies that get a drug approved, people get promotions and huge bonuses, and there is lots of lobbying and funny deals that happen, so, not saying you are wrong at all, but it’s just tricky to put blind faith in the government these days.
I work in research for a MAJOR drug company. I am engaged to a doctor. I know many docors very closely. I am not anti medicine or anti drug company or anti doctor. However, what was quoted on finasterides sexual side effects has many ways of being skewed. Not from the drug company being evil but even from simple things like people not admitting the side effect and many other variables. Anyway, there are whole forums on yahoo of guys who didnt’ get their sex drive back for 5 years. My physician said his sex drive took a hit and never recovered. Mine took a hit and took forever to come back. I also had major trouble losing fat while using finasteride.
My family docor, my urologist, my doctor friends and people I know at companies making finasteride. Many, many users I know personally and many more I’ve read have had the sex issue. The 1.8% does not seem accurate in any way shape or pharm.
I don’t believe big pharma is evil and there are major conspiracies involved in bringing a drug to market. Rather, I’m fully aware of all the variables and processes in bringing a drug from discovery, to development, to clinical to the market. There is statistical manipulation, embarressed patients not admitting sex disfunction, patient samples who aren’t having sex anyway not noticing it, skewed questionaries, all kinds of variables that allowed this company, the maker of vioxx incidentally, to put that number 1.8% in it’s product information. The fact that the FDA review it means the FDA reviewed it. It does not mean it’s right. I got the side effect. Many others do and will.
The drug is usually effective…That’s why you get the side! If the drug ‘works’ for you it’s lowering DHT correct? Well then, it’s loweing DHT, that helps shrink the prostate…nice!
That helps grow hair…nice!
that makes it hard to get/keep a boner…oooohhh not so nice.
Everyone, the drug works for most people. If you get the sex side effect and you like sex get off the drug. It will only get worse.
[/quote]
I am merely speaking from what my doctor (who is on it), and my personal experience has shown me.
I have never had a side effect…and the same goes for my friends…
Believe me, our dicks are more important than our hair! (Damn that sounded gay!)
I’m sorry you had a negative experience, but you can’t generalize that the #'s must be higher because YOU experienced it and “people on Yahoo message boards” are bitching.
I understand your point about results of studies being skewed…it’s always possible. However, it seems that you are letting your personal, negative experience to (understandably) skew your opinion of the drug.
[quote]TheZ-Man wrote:
Scrappy wrote:
vroom wrote:
TheZ-Man wrote:
THe PI is the “product information” that every drug must come with. It is scrutinized by the FDA and must be 100% accurate.
Hehehehe. I think you are putting a bit too much faith in a government body here. Sure, the product information must match results of some study, but that doesn’t mean that you can absolutely trust it to be 100% truthful, complete and accurate.
There is a lot of money for companies that get a drug approved, people get promotions and huge bonuses, and there is lots of lobbying and funny deals that happen, so, not saying you are wrong at all, but it’s just tricky to put blind faith in the government these days.
I work in research for a MAJOR drug company. I am engaged to a doctor. I know many docors very closely. I am not anti medicine or anti drug company or anti doctor. However, what was quoted on finasterides sexual side effects has many ways of being skewed. Not from the drug company being evil but even from simple things like people not admitting the side effect and many other variables. Anyway, there are whole forums on yahoo of guys who didnt’ get their sex drive back for 5 years. My physician said his sex drive took a hit and never recovered. Mine took a hit and took forever to come back. I also had major trouble losing fat while using finasteride.
My family docor, my urologist, my doctor friends and people I know at companies making finasteride. Many, many users I know personally and many more I’ve read have had the sex issue. The 1.8% does not seem accurate in any way shape or pharm.
I don’t believe big pharma is evil and there are major conspiracies involved in bringing a drug to market. Rather, I’m fully aware of all the variables and processes in bringing a drug from discovery, to development, to clinical to the market. There is statistical manipulation, embarressed patients not admitting sex disfunction, patient samples who aren’t having sex anyway not noticing it, skewed questionaries, all kinds of variables that allowed this company, the maker of vioxx incidentally, to put that number 1.8% in it’s product information. The fact that the FDA review it means the FDA reviewed it. It does not mean it’s right. I got the side effect. Many others do and will.
The drug is usually effective…That’s why you get the side! If the drug ‘works’ for you it’s lowering DHT correct? Well then, it’s loweing DHT, that helps shrink the prostate…nice!
That helps grow hair…nice!
that makes it hard to get/keep a boner…oooohhh not so nice.
Everyone, the drug works for most people. If you get the sex side effect and you like sex get off the drug. It will only get worse.
I am merely speaking from what my doctor (who is on it), and my personal experience has shown me.
I have never had a side effect…and the same goes for my friends…
Believe me, our dicks are more important than our hair! (Damn that sounded gay!)
I’m sorry you had a negative experience, but you can’t generalize that the #'s must be higher because YOU experienced it and “people on Yahoo message boards” are bitching.
I understand your point about results of studies being skewed…it’s always possible. However, it seems that you are letting your personal, negative experience to (understandably) skew your opinion of the drug.
[/quote]
Well, okay, ignore the yahoo groups, though why would people post this??, there are many who stop taking it due to this effect. 3 family physicians and a urologist told me this about their patients. So it is my experience plus theirs plus the basis of the effectiveness of the medicine
PLUS THIS THREAD IS ABOUT SAW PALMETTO. I like Now’s brand. I don’t work for now. And as for finasteride
I AM TELLING PEOPLE TO TRY IT!
I am just telling my experience and knowledge and telling people to watch out for this effect if they like sex.
Do you think I’m making all this up? I’m just sharing info.
Try finasteride if you want to shrink your prostate or grow hair.
It works.
DON’T BE AFRAID TO STOP IT if you have sides though. that’s all I’m saying
[quote]Scrappy wrote:
TheZ-Man wrote:
Scrappy wrote:
vroom wrote:
TheZ-Man wrote:
THe PI is the “product information” that every drug must come with. It is scrutinized by the FDA and must be 100% accurate.
Hehehehe. I think you are putting a bit too much faith in a government body here. Sure, the product information must match results of some study, but that doesn’t mean that you can absolutely trust it to be 100% truthful, complete and accurate.
There is a lot of money for companies that get a drug approved, people get promotions and huge bonuses, and there is lots of lobbying and funny deals that happen, so, not saying you are wrong at all, but it’s just tricky to put blind faith in the government these days.
I work in research for a MAJOR drug company. I am engaged to a doctor. I know many docors very closely. I am not anti medicine or anti drug company or anti doctor. However, what was quoted on finasterides sexual side effects has many ways of being skewed. Not from the drug company being evil but even from simple things like people not admitting the side effect and many other variables. Anyway, there are whole forums on yahoo of guys who didnt’ get their sex drive back for 5 years. My physician said his sex drive took a hit and never recovered. Mine took a hit and took forever to come back. I also had major trouble losing fat while using finasteride.
My family docor, my urologist, my doctor friends and people I know at companies making finasteride. Many, many users I know personally and many more I’ve read have had the sex issue. The 1.8% does not seem accurate in any way shape or pharm.
I don’t believe big pharma is evil and there are major conspiracies involved in bringing a drug to market. Rather, I’m fully aware of all the variables and processes in bringing a drug from discovery, to development, to clinical to the market. There is statistical manipulation, embarressed patients not admitting sex disfunction, patient samples who aren’t having sex anyway not noticing it, skewed questionaries, all kinds of variables that allowed this company, the maker of vioxx incidentally, to put that number 1.8% in it’s product information. The fact that the FDA review it means the FDA reviewed it. It does not mean it’s right. I got the side effect. Many others do and will.
The drug is usually effective…That’s why you get the side! If the drug ‘works’ for you it’s lowering DHT correct? Well then, it’s loweing DHT, that helps shrink the prostate…nice!
That helps grow hair…nice!
that makes it hard to get/keep a boner…oooohhh not so nice.
Everyone, the drug works for most people. If you get the sex side effect and you like sex get off the drug. It will only get worse.
I am merely speaking from what my doctor (who is on it), and my personal experience has shown me.
I have never had a side effect…and the same goes for my friends…
Believe me, our dicks are more important than our hair! (Damn that sounded gay!)
I’m sorry you had a negative experience, but you can’t generalize that the #'s must be higher because YOU experienced it and “people on Yahoo message boards” are bitching.
I understand your point about results of studies being skewed…it’s always possible. However, it seems that you are letting your personal, negative experience to (understandably) skew your opinion of the drug.
Well, okay, ignore the yahoo groups, though why would people post this??, there are many who stop taking it due to this effect. 3 family physicians and a urologist told me this about their patients. So it is my experience plus theirs plus the basis of the effectiveness of the medicine
PLUS THIS THREAD IS ABOUT SAW PALMETTO. I like Now’s brand. I don’t work for now. And as for finasteride
I AM TELLING PEOPLE TO TRY IT!
I am just telling my experience and knowledge and telling people to watch out for this effect if they like sex.
Do you think I’m making all this up? I’m just sharing info.
Try finasteride if you want to shrink your prostate or grow hair.
It works.
DON’T BE AFRAID TO STOP IT if you have sides though. that’s all I’m saying[/quote]
I’m sorry…
I like to get sidetracked with BS for no apparent reason sometimes.
To continue the hijack: Have you tried using .5 finasteride daily?
Okay, so let’s imagine I’m a big drug company guy, with my fortunes tied to the success of a drug, which I know has a propensity to cause loss of libido or whatnot.
How would I design my study to make the percentage of people who have this side effect artificially low? Anyone? Anyone?
[quote]vroom wrote:
Okay, so let’s imagine I’m a big drug company guy, with my fortunes tied to the success of a drug, which I know has a propensity to cause loss of libido or whatnot.
How would I design my study to make the percentage of people who have this side effect artificially low? Anyone? Anyone?[/quote]
Vroom- Have you tried the drug?
[quote]vroom wrote:
Okay, so let’s imagine I’m a big drug company guy, with my fortunes tied to the success of a drug, which I know has a propensity to cause loss of libido or whatnot.
How would I design my study to make the percentage of people who have this side effect artificially low? Anyone? Anyone?[/quote]
I don’t think you can. But I think the posters point is that many men won’t admit that they are having problems in the area of sex so that skews the study.
No, I haven’t tried the drug, I’m still hacking away at the blind trust thing.
However, sure you can skew your selection criteria, officially or otherwise, to include people who either have low libido or who already have shitty sex lives.