I am starting to realize my squats are incredibly slow and I was wondering if you had any tips. I did 425 for a comfortable 7 today, but by rep 3 it probably looks like I am grinding (especially out of the hole). However, I have no problem slowly grinding out reps til I get 7-8. I feel like I lack explosive pop at the bottom. Do you have any ideas on cues or exercises to help get me stronger here? I do generally go very deep (hip well below top of the knee), but I like to leave no doubt. I was considering throwing in paused squats on my deadlift day to try and help this, do you think this is smart or should I try other things?
i have a couple sessions to log. I also bought a pair of squatting shoes. i’ve been squatting in chucks for years but they always end up ripping apart because i tie them so damn tight. i did some research and picked a pair of Pillars from Inzer. i tried them today and so far, so good. they have a slightly elevated heel which seemed to allow me to get some quad activation out of the hole. they are also high tops so i get ankle stability as well.
anyway… training is going as planned. so that’s good.
Here’s what i’ve done.
Bench - working max 510
warmup
0x10
135x6
225x6
315x6
65%-330x5
75%-380x5
85%-430x4- was supposed to get 5 but i got a wicked cramp in my lower back at rep 3.
accessory work
reverse grip bench
225x10
275x10
315x10
lat pull downs
somexsome
skwaaatts - working max 630
this cycle we are going to do them to a box. i’m also going to pause them.
warmup
0x10
135x6
225x6
315x6
65%-405x5
75%-470x3-was going to do 5’s but pausing these on the box was HARD.
85%-530x3
decided to do a single today to the box. hit a pretty easy 585 for a good pause. i’ll get a vid of it up soon.
585x1
was going to do some accessory squats but my adductor was shot
[quote]maraudermeat wrote:
i have a couple sessions to log. I also bought a pair of squatting shoes. i’ve been squatting in chucks for years but they always end up ripping apart because i tie them so damn tight. i did some research and picked a pair of Pillars from Inzer. i tried them today and so far, so good. they have a slightly elevated heel which seemed to allow me to get some quad activation out of the hole. they are also high tops so i get ankle stability as well.
anyway… training is going as planned. so that’s good.
Here’s what i’ve done.
Bench - working max 510
warmup
0x10
135x6
225x6
315x6
65%-330x5
75%-380x5
85%-430x4- was supposed to get 5 but i got a wicked cramp in my lower back at rep 3.
accessory work
reverse grip bench
225x10
275x10
315x10
lat pull downs
somexsome
skwaaatts - working max 630
this cycle we are going to do them to a box. i’m also going to pause them.
warmup
0x10
135x6
225x6
315x6
65%-405x5
75%-470x3-was going to do 5’s but pausing these on the box was HARD.
85%-530x3
decided to do a single today to the box. hit a pretty easy 585 for a good pause. i’ll get a vid of it up soon.
585x1
was going to do some accessory squats but my adductor was shot
hypers and ab machine
some x some
that’s it. [/quote]
Impressive as alway Meat. I got Pillars a while ago and love them. They are a very solid shoe.
this video i’m attaching reminds me of a rant from today at the gym.
today was a squat day and for anyone that actually squats… and i’m talking real squats- to parallel and with a bar, not some machine that is supposed to resemble a squat, you will feel my pain. unfortunately, i feel like i’m a rare bread anymore. No one squats anymore… and when they do, it doesn’t resemble a real squat. They put a pussy pad on the bar becuase of thier dainty traps. they squat high. i love watching the average gym goer squat. the first warmup set is usually somewhere close to parallel, but then every set after that the weight added is in direct proportion to their ever limiting ROM. then there are those that have discovered the “box squat”. but most gym goers use a bench. a bench is a horrible choice for box squats-the bench is way above parallel and they always flop down and then bounce off the damn thing. i have no idea how doing this crap ever helps anything. There are good reasons for box squatting. for example, i love box squats to train one’s self to know where parallel is. i also love to pause on the box to build power out of the hole. the crap these douches are doing transfer to nothing. i can see it now, they could ask themselves- “we can either do high plop squats to a bench or we could take turns shoving an oversized dildo up each other’s asses” they would both have the same carryover to a real squat.
anyway… onto my squat day.
we have decided to do low box squats for our squat variation this cycle. I’ve also decided to pause mine. so we go in today and start warming up. then Mr. Wiggles come in. I call him that because his ROM resembles a wiggle… that goes for everything. so… he walks in and sees that we are squatting. he walks up to one of the open squat and immidiatly loads 405 onto the bar. he then desperately searches the gym for the pussy pad. the guy next to him already had the other one so that only left one more. he finally found it and strapped it on the chrome bar. We had been in the gym for an hour and had just finished our warmup sets. He’s hardcore so no nee for a warmup…no spit, no lube, right to work. He unracks it and proceeds to do 4 inch squats for many wiggles. ironically my bar was loaded with 405lbs as well. I did my first set of 5 to my low box, pausing for 3 seconds. He walks off to talk for about 15 minutes. When he gets back i’m on my third set with 530lbs. majically he loads the bar with 530lbs. He gets a spotter to give him a big hug of a spot. he starts down for his ATG 3 inch squats. on his 4th “rep” he falls forward and crashes into the rack. He jumps up and announces that he would have gotten it if he had wrapped his knees and wore a belt. I’m assuming that was directed at me since we were in fact using a belt and wrapps. He quickly looks around and unloads the bar, puts it back up, adjusts his pussy pad that had been dislodged from the bar’s vagina. he then does what anyone would do and load it back up with 675lbs. Feeling very insignificant i load my bar with 585lbs to do one measly rep on my low box for a good, long pause. He watches me as he stands next to his loaded bar with 675. He stands there for awhile before unloading it to then load up the manliest leg machine this side of the smith machine… the leg press. I’m not quit certain why he loaded the bar to 675 just to unload it but i have a feeling it was just in case someone new had come in the gym and hadn’t seen him standing next to all that weight…wtf??
It’s sad really. this guy has to be in his mid 40’s and he’s still “lifting” for others. He really thinks people are impressed by his douchebaggery. I can’t imagine anyone is but i could be wrong. although, most of my gym wear lifting gloves, so i could definitely be wrong. don’t get me started on the tag team row/benchers, back bend curlers, spasm shruggers and half rep benchers.
[quote]maraudermeat wrote:
here’s my 585lbs paused box squat from today.
That pause felt like a loooong one. Do you notice carryover from paused box squats (like in the vid) to your actual raw squat? I’ve recently incorporated them as back-off speed sets (2-3 sets x 2-3 reps at 50% max + chains) after my 531 main sets. Too early to tell results yet, but was wondering about your opinion. I agree that just flopping on a box is a waste of time, but if you approach it as a “sitting back” tool and just touch it, would it carry over to the actual raw squat?
[quote]maraudermeat wrote:
here’s my 585lbs paused box squat from today.
That pause felt like a loooong one. Do you notice carryover from paused box squats (like in the vid) to your actual raw squat? I’ve recently incorporated them as back-off speed sets (2-3 sets x 2-3 reps at 50% max + chains) after my 531 main sets. Too early to tell results yet, but was wondering about your opinion. I agree that just flopping on a box is a waste of time, but if you approach it as a “sitting back” tool and just touch it, would it carry over to the actual raw squat?
Thanks agian meet. THat rant was hilarious btw![/quote]
i’ve done both, touch and go and pause. i feel that when i pause the weight i develop a lot of confidence in the hole. if i can pause a moderately heavy weight then i KNOW i can do it through a normal ROM. Also, pausing requires you to stay tight the entire time which is also really important with the way that i squat. i don’t dive bomb at all during my squat. as a result, i have to stay really tight to have power out of the hole.
like i said earlier, i also use it to just gauge depth by going touch and go.
on another note, I don’t sit back at all in my squats. I drop straight down, pushing my knees out the entire time. then to return to the top, i force the knees out harder and push the hips forward.
I know the feeling meat! It always seems like guys like do it with 1/16th squats and quarter benches, although I’ve seen it with ‘rack pull’ shrugs from above the knee.
[quote]maraudermeat wrote:
deads- real max- 700, working max-630
warmups
135x6
225x6
315x6
working sets
70%- 440x3
80%-505x3
90%-565x4 +1 rep
315x10
405x10
short and nasty.
[/quote]
565 is about 80% of your real max–do you go higher than that very often?
Edit: BTW I started a training log, I decided to do CT’s beast building–seems everyone’s doing 5/3/1 these days! Anywhoo, when you have a minute drop by and let me know whatcha think!
[quote]maraudermeat wrote:
deads- real max- 700, working max-630
warmups
135x6
225x6
315x6
working sets
70%- 440x3
80%-505x3
90%-565x4 +1 rep
315x10
405x10
short and nasty.
[/quote]
565 is about 80% of your real max–do you go higher than that very often?
Edit: BTW I started a training log, I decided to do CT’s beast building–seems everyone’s doing 5/3/1 these days! Anywhoo, when you have a minute drop by and let me know whatcha think!
on the third week we hit 95% of our working max and that’s 600 for me and that’s plenty for me. Deadlifting and squatting heavy in the same week and also having fairly heavy sets before the last one keeps the working weights fairly low. the actual max of 700 would be totally fresh after a good deload.
i find that moderate weight for reps seem to give me the best bang for my buck. it also doesn’t beat me up like it used to when i was training close to my actual max. that Wendler guy is pretty damn smart.
i’ll check out your log. is your avatar a recent competition pic??
[quote]maraudermeat wrote:
deads- real max- 700, working max-630
warmups
135x6
225x6
315x6
working sets
70%- 440x3
80%-505x3
90%-565x4 +1 rep
315x10
405x10
short and nasty.
[/quote]
565 is about 80% of your real max–do you go higher than that very often?
Edit: BTW I started a training log, I decided to do CT’s beast building–seems everyone’s doing 5/3/1 these days! Anywhoo, when you have a minute drop by and let me know whatcha think!
on the third week we hit 95% of our working max and that’s 600 for me and that’s plenty for me. Deadlifting and squatting heavy in the same week and also having fairly heavy sets before the last one keeps the working weights fairly low. the actual max of 700 would be totally fresh after a good deload.
i find that moderate weight for reps seem to give me the best bang for my buck. it also doesn’t beat me up like it used to when i was training close to my actual max. that Wendler guy is pretty damn smart.
i’ll check out your log. is your avatar a recent competition pic??
[/quote]
Gotcha, so after a solid deload is an ideal time to test your max lifts. I figured there was a very good reason why everyone was following Wendler’s program, I just wanted to take the path less traveled.
Yes that pic was from 11/20/10–I was at 175 before carbing up, after a couple weeks of pizza and ice cream I’m back at ~193 and looking average again–lol. I’m cutting back on the junk now and getting down to business!
warmups- used the 4 board to warmup today. it was much easier on my shoulders than full ROM warmups. I’m going to keep doing these until my shoulder is fully healed.
4 board
135x4
225x4
315x4
405x4
working sets- full ROM
70%-355x3
80%-405x3
90%-455x3- this set felt really good and strong
4 board- long pause on board- all sets were fast and strong
405x1
495x1
545x1
Ive been doing Tates over the last month - NOTHING hits the tris right above the elbow like them! Great movement!
Oh…I see some nice benching in here as well haha. I like the idea of using the boards - Tried it this past week with a 3 board after the main 3s sets - felt good and helps me get accustomed to heavier weight i wanna hit eventually at Full ROM. Do you think its a better idea for a raw bencher (sticking point at bottom half of the movement - if i can get it up to where 3 boards would be, i always lock it out) to incorporate these as a supplementary lift for the bench, or you think speed benches w chains/bands would help more? Thing is, i can’t exactly point whether my weakness is in the delts or tris. Sometimes i blast great out of the bottom (delts?) but then freeze right below the half-way point (Tris?), sometimes i feel too slow out of the bottom and don’t even feel the tris kicking in before i stall…
Or maybe i’m bullshitting myself and should just keep pushing. After all, my bench is only 275, maybe everything is too weak lol…
[quote]mlekava000 wrote:
Ive been doing Tates over the last month - NOTHING hits the tris right above the elbow like them! Great movement!
Oh…I see some nice benching in here as well haha. I like the idea of using the boards - Tried it this past week with a 3 board after the main 3s sets - felt good and helps me get accustomed to heavier weight i wanna hit eventually at Full ROM. Do you think its a better idea for a raw bencher (sticking point at bottom half of the movement - if i can get it up to where 3 boards would be, i always lock it out) to incorporate these as a supplementary lift for the bench, or you think speed benches w chains/bands would help more? Thing is, i can’t exactly point whether my weakness is in the delts or tris. Sometimes i blast great out of the bottom (delts?) but then freeze right below the half-way point (Tris?), sometimes i feel too slow out of the bottom and don’t even feel the tris kicking in before i stall…
Or maybe i’m bullshitting myself and should just keep pushing. After all, my bench is only 275, maybe everything is too weak lol…[/quote]
i like using the boards for warming up to my full ROM work because they are easy on the shoulders and they don’t take much out of me. i feel very fresh when i get to my working sets. also i like to work up to a weight above my first working set. this makes my first working set feel really light. i used to train supramaximally all the time but haven’t felt the need since starting 5/3/1.
from what you describe your issue may be a form issue. is your bar path consistant?? are you rowing the weight down and really using the lats to support the weight at the chest? if the lats are weak that can lead to instability, weakness in the bottom of the lift and inconsistent bar paths. i always say that one should be able to bent over row for 10 reps what one could max bench for 10 reps. if you can’t, your lats are weak compared to your bench strength.
if you could get me a vid of a moderately heavy set of bench i could give you some suggestions.
I realise that any discussion about form is useless without a vid, so i’ll try to shoot something this coming wednesday (probably my 3 set - it’s my 5/3/1 week - this is a moderately heavy load for me). I think my lats are much stronger than the guideline you posted - i haven’t done 10 reps on bench in forever, but i figure im probably good for ~ 205 on that. I do BB Row sets of 10 with 225 without too much trouble. Now, whether i activate them enough during bench or not is a whole different issue - i try to visualize BENDING the bar towards me as im bringing it down - i think that’s a good cue for activating the lats (“rowing” the weight down). Maybe i need to make a better conscious effort. As far as bar path - good point, i’ve nevber taped myself benching, so i have no idea. Maybe i should apply some chalk on the bar and then see where the lines are on my shirt?
Finaly, i have a hard time figuring out WHEN to flare the elbows at the bottom. Sometimes the transition from tuck to flare feels smooth, and the bench feels really strong. Other times, i flare too early, and struggle throwing my elbows under the bar to help me finish the lift, if you know what i mean? Im trying to figure out the timing of that, but its a work in progress.
Anyway, thanks for the feedback meet and i’ll come back to you with a vid. Keep lifting and good luck in the next session (Don’t forget to post, your thread is pretty much the only reason i enter the clusterfuck that the “bodybuilding” forum is)!)
sounds like you are very well educated about benching properly and obviously put a lot of thought into it.
i don’t think much about tucking and i don’t really tuck very severly. it’s more about when i unrack i’ll force the outside edges of my hands into the bar and that naturally rolls my elbows in a bit. i find that the best way to tuck in a natural way, for yourself, is to find a natural bar path. if i bring the bar down too high on my chest the elbows flare way too early. if i bring it down low, my elbows stay rolled in until they need to flare. so, bar path IMO, really determines when you flare. row the bar down low really forcing the meat of the edges of your hands into the bar and then explode the bar back towards the shoulders.
definitely get me a vid though.
thanks for the kind words. it’s nice to see people are reading.
