Resting Between Reps

Bigger Stronger Leaner Competitive Bodybuilding
1

It seems like most coaches recommend a tempo of do a rep, go right into next rep. A lot of videos of bodybuilders show them doing that until later in the set, at which point they’ll hit a rep, take a few seconds, hit another, and so on. Probably the best example of what I’m talking about that comes to mind is in Pumping Iron when Arnold’s partner is squatting in that fashion. Anyways, what do you guys think about this? I’ve always trained where I do continuous sets, and if I have to take a break then I don’t count it anymore.

Any input?

2

Resting between reps is essentially deloading the muscle you’re trying to target, and is not only not useful, but actually counterproductive. Not only did CT write about this in his HTH book, but Dr. Colker mentioned it in his book, as well as other well respected BBing authors. Training a muscle is all about intensity, and how hard the muscle has to work. Anything that provides a rest when you do not want it, should be avoided in most cases (we’re not talking about Rest pause, or clusters here).

S

3

If you (the OP, or I suppose anyone) want to employ the technique and keep track of what you are doing, what I do is to record the number of reps performed continually and then add a “+ whatever” for additional reps accomplished with a brief rest-pause.

So for example let’s say I get 10 reps straight and would be unable to get any more (not that one HAS to proceed to that point, but I do) and decide to add some more reps in that manner, and get 4 more.

I would write this as 10+4.

So far as figuring progression and strength level, I count this as being able to do 10 reps.

Inasmuch as rest-pause is precisely what we’re talking about here, I don’t know, why the qualification that we’re not talking about rest-pause?

4

[quote]The Mighty Stu wrote:
Resting between reps is essentially deloading the muscle you’re trying to target, and is not only not useful, but actually counterproductive. Not only did CT write about this in his HTH book, but Dr. Colker mentioned it in his book, as well as other well respected BBing authors. Training a muscle is all about intensity, and how hard the muscle has to work. Anything that provides a rest when you do not want it, should be avoided in most cases (we’re not talking about Rest pause, or clusters here).

S
[/quote]

By that logic, DC style widowmakers are counterproductive.

I hope you win this argument, so that I can stop doing them. lol

I have a love/hate relationship with those.

5

[quote]Mr.Purple wrote:
By that logic, DC style widowmakers are counterproductive.

I hope you win this argument, so that I can stop doing them. lol

I have a love/hate relationship with those.[/quote]

Lol, well, I’m certainly all ears if anyone wants to elaborate on this. Admittedly I’m not the most well versed on DC Training protocols.

S

6

[quote]Mr.Purple wrote:
The Mighty Stu wrote:
Resting between reps is essentially deloading the muscle you’re trying to target, and is not only not useful, but actually counterproductive. Not only did CT write about this in his HTH book, but Dr. Colker mentioned it in his book, as well as other well respected BBing authors. Training a muscle is all about intensity, and how hard the muscle has to work. Anything that provides a rest when you do not want it, should be avoided in most cases (we’re not talking about Rest pause, or clusters here).

S

By that logic, DC style widowmakers are counterproductive.

I hope you win this argument, so that I can stop doing them. lol

I have a love/hate relationship with those.[/quote]

Nah, he stated he wasn’t talking about rest-pause. Widowmakers are pretty much a form of rest-pause, at least in my opinion… so keep doing 'em! lol

7

Oh no.

NOW “rest-pause” means waiting 30-40 seconds and does NOT mean taking just a few seconds between reps? Supposedly?

It was bad enough creating a new meaning for the term (taking what anyone else would call doing another set with 30-40 seconds rest and instead calling the gap “rest-pause”) but now denying the ordinary and long-standing meaning – if that is what is going on – is too much.

8

Yeah rest-pause is traditionally 5-10 seconds between reps or something like that. DC is just DC, we should just call them DC reps, Dante himself has stated that he doesn’t particularly care for the name, one because it can get confused with traditional RP.

9

OP, do you mean holding the weight in a locked out position untill you muster up enough strength to complete another rep. If so this technique can be very useful. The whole 20 rep squat program is based off this. I feel its practically just like rest-pause reps except with rest pause you can handle heavier weights because you get to completely unload the muscle for a brief period of time.

10

[quote]AnabolicPower wrote:
OP, do you mean holding the weight in a locked out position untill you muster up enough strength to complete another rep. If so this technique can be very useful. The whole 20 rep squat program is based off this. I feel its practically just like rest-pause reps except with rest pause you can handle heavier weights because you get to completely unload the muscle for a brief period of time.[/quote]

Yeah that is what I’m talking about. See Ed Carney’s last set (starts at 0:45). Talk about time under tension haha.

11

Stu-
Can you elaborate on the argument that it’s counterproductive? I can see that for people with a low work capacity, that would be pretty nasty on their recovery, but I’m talking about using it as an extended set technique. I’m basically wondering if anyone that does high volume has ever tried using this regularly, and how has it helped/hurt them as compared to straight sets, or even to failure sets.

Bill-
Thanks for chiming in. That’s the kind of notation I used when I did a low volume style regimen a few months back and it worked great for keeping track of things. Do you use an extended set like that on all sets?

Maybe I should clarify what I’m asking. I’ve done extended sets before while using low volume, but even then, then extension was done only as long as I could continuously pump out reps. SO, has anyone used widowmaker-type sets on other exercises regularly while on a high volume? It seems like doing it every set would be counterproductive for a typical training phase, but maybe at a time when you’re looking to kick your ass and hope for some supercompensation effects.

I think I might try doing something where my last set only is a widowmaker, see if that is in balance between crazy and typical.

12

I’ve always been under the impression that a rest pause is when you do as many reps as you can, rerack the weight for 10 seconds, then unrack and knock out 2-3 more reps, then maybe repeat one more time. If we’re talking about short rest intervals between actual sets (30 seconds), then I’m not picturing this as a method to prolong a set (increase ability to move a heavy weight), but as 2 individual sets… uh,… what was the original question again? -lol

S

13

You seem to have a good concept of the training method. Using it every set for high volume training sessions would be very taxing and probably counter-productive. Use it as an intensity booster. The last set is a good start.

14

[quote]The Mighty Stu wrote:
I’ve always been under the impression that a rest pause is when you do as many reps as you can, rerack the weight for 10 seconds, then unrack and knock out 2-3 more reps, then maybe repeat one more time. If we’re talking about short rest intervals between actual sets (30 seconds), then I’m not picturing this as a method to prolong a set (increase ability to move a heavy weight), but as 2 individual sets… uh,… what was the original question again? -lol

S[/quote]

I interpreted the original question as being one of employing rest-pause, according to traditional meaning, not the DC meaning.

Myself I don’t understand “rest-pause” as having to mean another series of reps after the brief rest, but rather that it can be a few seconds pause between each rep. This was the method the OP was asking about. However, what you say – going for another brief series of continuous reps – is the more standard approach.

I can’t document that going for one additional rep at a time with these pauses has traditionally been included as rest-pause.

I really didn’t understand why you criticized it as unproductive and then said that your comments related to unproductivity weren’t in reference to rest-pause, when this was rest-pause being talked about.

However if it is the case that you make a distinction between single reps after brief pauses vs short series of reps (2 or 3 at a time) after the pauses, and don’t call taking those same periods for the same purpose “rest-pause” if there are singles between, then I see what your distinction was, but I wouldn’t agree on the “unproductive” part.

15

So I hit 8 reps on curls and I know I can get one more, so I take two extra breaths and hit 9 reps and now I think I can get 10, so I do the same thing and hit 10…those two extra reps are counterproductive? That just doesn’t seem right. The person that only does 8 reps and doesn’t push himself will have a better workout? Arnold talked about a pain period we must endore where we seperate champions from gym rats. This pain period obvioulsy means squeezing out a couple extra reps even if it means takeing a few extra breaths between sets…Idk I’ll do me and I think that stuff is fine.

16

Basically what you are talking about is “rest-pause” or “clusters” depending on how you would do it. It has its place, but definately shouldn’t be used in everything you do. For me, on some exercises, like squats, and deadlifts I NEED to use these methods sometimes, because my conditioning isn’t good enough to keep up.

17

[quote]The Mighty Stu wrote:
Mr.Purple wrote:
By that logic, DC style widowmakers are counterproductive.

I hope you win this argument, so that I can stop doing them. lol

I have a love/hate relationship with those.

Lol, well, I’m certainly all ears if anyone wants to elaborate on this. Admittedly I’m not the most well versed on DC Training protocols.

S
[/quote]

I’ll give the topic a shot.

First, you can never truly “deload” the upper leg musculature during an exercise like squats (unless you’re talking about racking the weight between reps). Even if you were to lock out the knees so that the bone structure was supporting the weight, the upper leg musculature would still need to contract to stabilize the knee/hip joint.

Yes, standing (with knees and hips still slightly flexed) places the muscles in a more advantageous position (due to leverage and myofibrillar cross bridge contact) than they would be in at say parallel, or atg. But the leg musculature is still having to support the weight of the bar.

Otherwise, why ever do anything other than weak ROM partials?

Second, the quad “widowmaker” protocol that DC training (and is basically the “breathing squat” protocol popularized by Strossen, and seen in the video above with Arnold) is designed to place the upper leg musculature under a load for an extended duration of time. The theory is that since the legs (quads especially) are used to supporting and carrying around the bodyweight on a daily basis, they respond well to longer duration exercises.

Standing and taking a few deep breaths between later reps allows for some energy replenishment, but since the muscles must still support the weight and therefore must stay at least partially contracted, they aren’t allowed to fully recover. One is therefore able to “gut out” quite a few more reps with the weight than they could if they had simply gone to technical failure without the rest, and there is also a very pronounced “lactic acid” release (which some argue is correlated to GH release).

Not saying that this is the only method of training legs that works, or even that it’s necessarily better than other methods of leg training which don’t see to prolong TUT. Just trying to explain (to the best of my understanding) why it’s done. I do think it’s a very effective method though, personally, especially for quads. Platz would probably be the best example, but there are quite a few other DC’ers out there who swear by it and have the wheels to back it up.

Here’s Justin Harris showing how it’s done:

And of course, Platz:

I don’t really think that such extreme methods are necessary for most upper body exercises though. If you want to take a breath between your last couple reps (and try to get one more), that’s probably as far as you need to go in most cases.

18

[quote]The Mighty Stu wrote:
I’ve always been under the impression that a rest pause is when you do as many reps as you can, rerack the weight for 10 seconds, then unrack and knock out 2-3 more reps, then maybe repeat one more time. If we’re talking about short rest intervals between actual sets (30 seconds), then I’m not picturing this as a method to prolong a set (increase ability to move a heavy weight), but as 2 individual sets… uh,… what was the original question again? -lol

S[/quote]

Well, the term has apparently been around since the 40’s, and several people have used the concept in different ways. Strossen’s “breathing squats” protocol is one, Trudel’s “DC RP” is another, and Mike Mentzer’s protocol is yet another.

Mentzer’s protocol was basically 4-5 singles done with a 10-15 second rest between reps using near 1RM weights (and sometimes even forced reps). So it kind of depends on which specific method you’re talking about.

19

Just to clarify for anyone getting confused with the DC terminology

A DC rest-pause set is where you rerack the weight for 10-15 breaths, then unrack and continue.

The widowmaker is similar to what the OP is describing, you dont rerack the weight, and just take a few breaths between the reps in order to do a lot of reps with heavy weight.

I think Bill is correct in how he logs them, I do exactly the same, if Im doing a normal set with some extra reps I will put something like 10+2, so I can keep track of strength progression

20

I don’t do a whole lot of volume, usually only one top set per exercise. That is why I’ll take a couple of breaths and squeeze out additional reps on for example the lat pulldown. If I had another exercise for back width coming up, I probably wouldn’t go for those “extra” reps. I’m afraid of not doing enough work I guess…