Anybody remember when the earth was flat? Or the earth was the center of the universe. Evolution is a damn good theory, but it is not science fact , because it cannot be proven with a certainty. You also can’t create a scietific experiment that shows that evolution exists and is applicable how all life came to be. For the record I believe in evolution, I am just saying that it is a fallible science just like all science. Everybody used to thing that cause and effect relationships were temporal. The Einstien figured out that simultaneous causation can exist. Science is great but it is fallible. We are constantly correcting the mistakes of yesterday and in the future people will correct our mistakes. To put your faith in science is just as subjective as religion. To choose not to believe is a religion for you have chosen to make a stance. Is there life after death? I don’t know I haven’t died yet when I do I’ll let you know. Personally, I would love to believe there is no life after death. No consequences for my actions, for me there is enough compelling evidence to suggest there is something beyond our physical selves, for me.
After reading T-Rev’s response, I have to agree with him. Religion is not a matter of debate and what one believes is nobody’s buisness. Now go to a thread about training or whatever.
I will openly admit I cannot prove God’s existance scientifically or otherwise…So on that note I challenge you to provide one single solitary shred of evidence that God does not exist. I do not want to hear is why you think religion is full of shit…as a matter of fact. Take religion out of it…Just prove that God does not exist, period. Some of the best have tried and have not succeeded so, give it a shot!
Good question, Jason. I’m American Indian, of the Niagra Band of the Ojibway Nation. My family is Fish clan. I’m quite traditional in an active ceremonial life within this tribe, whenever possible.
I’m not about to argue a point, but doesn’t the fact that a chicken and humans make use of a yoke sac evolutionary? It doesn’t matter if the use is for different things.
Someone said that because the missing link is still missing that evolution is disproved? Why, just because we don’t have evidence?And Jason…you make a good point…in 5000 years the “Good Book” could be T-Mag. “MASS” will be held 3 to 4 times per week at “Our Lady of Gold’s” Insted of hymn books, log books. TC will be revered as the one who had led his people out of the Crispy Creams…
I spent my childhood in catholic school, I HAVE read the bible cover to cover, to say that the bible DOES NOT teach hate is crazy. if your kid doesn’t listen to you you are to take him to the entrance to the village and STONE HIM TO DEATH, after a batle you are suposed to KILL ALL MEN, ALL CHILDREN,ALL WOMEN WHO HAVE HAD SEX, BUT YOU CAN KEEP FOR YOURSELF ALL THE WOMEN WHO HAVE NOT HAD SEX BEFORE. it teaches that ALL others besides christians go to hell, “I am the way, the truth, the light, no one shal come unto the father but by me”, “I will rain upon him, upon his troops, and upon the many people with him. I will prove my greatness and holiness and make myself known in the sight of many nations; thus they shall know that I am the lord” religion doesn’t teach hate? and please I’m not just speeking of christianity or any of its off shoots, ask someone that is w/ the Nation of Islam what their taught, ask someone who is Jewish what Passover is, POINT IS, ALL RELIGIONS TEACH I’M SPECIAL AND YOU ARE NOT, I GO TO HEAVEN AND YOU DON’T. I must say I am not to familiar with Budism. so don’t get upset when someone is racist,sexist,ect… they are just doing what they were taught.
While religion strikes me as being very close to “named-ignorance” evolution is certainly not proven and it rings quite closely to “possible-conjecture”. As far as what makes a theorem true (in intentionally redundant statement) it is proof, not a consensus. People agreeing means something less that nothing as far as reality is concerned.
Ok, this message is to everyone who has posted. First to those of you who do not believe in the bible, what if it really was inspired of God? What if there was going to be a time in the future that God would destroy the wicked? What if there was only one way of serving and/or worshipping Him? What if there was only one religion that was acceptable to Him? A few of those questions were directed to everyone. Have you ever heard of Pascal’s Wager? He basically said to believe in god on the chance he might exist. Really do you lose anything in life by living a moral life? He felt you might as well believe in god. Do you think that God (if you believe He exists) would accept that form of worship? By the way, I’m curious about something. If those of you who profess to be Christian could answer me a question. Is God a name or a title? Also, if you are following Christ, and he commanded his followers “to be no part of the world just as I am no part of the world”-John 17:16, why do you vote? Christ never gave any political allegiance, except to God’s kingdom. Obviously there are many ramifications of that question. That question also begs the answer to why the pope or any reverend, bishop, minister, etc. is political.
Not to surprised that so many keep dissing the Catholics. Didn’t everybody start dissing Jason when he came down on the jews? Is everyone a bunch of PC wussies here? Is the Jewish religion the only one that shouldn’t get dissed? In fact, why is christianity (mostly catholicism) getting dissed. Not the only one out there people. Or, are you guys those weakkneed PC types? Haven’t seen anyone dissing the Torah or the Koran yet. How about that chubby little budah fellow? Some one said, “The Roman Catholics prey to Mother Mary.” Why not? I’ve never seen it stated in any bible that it is a sin to pray to anyone besides god. In fact, is kneeling at the gravestone of a friend, or family member, and speaking (i.e. praying) to them a sin. Not even a protestant pastor would say it was (at least none that I’ve asked). Don’t confuse the act of praying with worshipping. Or, is praying to your lost family member to say “I’ll never forget you”, worshipping, and therefore a sin. As far as kissing the ring or hands of the Pope because they think he is god. Please politely ask a Catholic if he believes the Pope is God. It’ll probably insult him that you would even think it’s what he believes. Stop thinking in such a limited western mind. There have been many ways of showing respect, welcoming, hospitality, etc. The washing of a guest’s feet is one example that has been in many cultures. Another is Bowing, or Curtsying (?). Well, I guess that’s two myths of Catholicism dispelled. Peace folks!
PS John Doe says “I don’t believe in any religion!” I say, “Okay, but why are you telling me? I didn’t ask.”
JW this following statement shows that you don’t even grasp the most fundamental belief of Christianity. Therefore, how can validly comment on it. "Also Christian means “Christ like” I don’t know any so called Christian who doesn’t: Judge anybody, have pre-marital sex, drink, have preide, etc. " An obviously untrue statement. It is impossible for you to know that every christian that you’ve ever met has cheated on their spouse (Did they all tell you or something)? Or did you see some cheating Tv evangalist and say “Well that’s it, every christian cheats.” Drinking? Uh, where does it say christians can’t drink? There are few churches that believe you can’t. But the point I was alluding to earlier about you not even grasping the most fundamental concept was this. There is no possible way for a christian to be sinless! The was the whole reason for Christ taking human form, to die for our sins. So, if you think your making telling us that christians sin, DUH! That’s why Jesus is my savior. No dissrespect, but I had to clear up this false perception.
Someone said about passing the plate twice, “They past the plate, then came up with some excuse to pass it around a second time! This is greed is it not??” Dude, you choose when and how much you put in. So, I’m not to sure what the problem is here. Usually the first time through is used to collect money for running and maintaing the church. The second time could be for a multitude of reasons. For a sick parish member, the homeless, missionary work, and much more. I’m just not getting the big problem here.
pat, i don’t know ya’ so this is solely on what you said on your post…how does a lack of an afterlife equate to no consequences for actions taken? everyday of my life i deal with consequences for the actions i have taken and decisions i have made in my life. come on. the idea of afterlife gives people, who would not otherwise do so, reason to act with consideration towards others. knowing that i, and others around me, are only here for a finite period of time gives me great motivation to act respectfully and considerately toward those around me. as well i do not want to waste my time partaking in self-destructive activities. another thing…
it must be nice to excuse yourself of the responsibility of proving the existence of a big invisible guy in the sky, and charging all doubters to prove otherwise. again-come on. you have the burden of proof. and i am sure something about ‘faith’ will come into play here in a reply, so i have a question for consideration. what takes more ‘faith’–1. believing in such an accepted idea that it is truly considered the ‘norm’. as well there is no negative backlash for your beliefs in the end. if you are wrong, then you’re just dead. that’s it. -or- 2. believing in something that is so ‘wrong’ that when confronted by theists (9 times out of 10) you are given the burden of proof. you have to prove yourself. not the person believing in a ‘man’ ‘upstairs’. also, if an atheist is wrong, well, he burns in hell for all eternity. man that would suck. so with <1.> you have the priviledge of going with the flow and believing in something that requires, no–demands, no cognitive thought or real personal conviction. the reason you do good (which is already defined for you and neatly set forth) is to win the prize. with <2.> you must define your own ‘good’ based on your personal system of logic and reasoning. you must act with a motivation that comes from within from your own system morals and has nothing to do with a prize of any kind. and you must have the internal fortitude to stand alone.
again, i just had a little something to add.
jason
austin, tx
JW Reading your post on your “thoughts” about religion made me fall to the grown laghing even though its truly sad that your this ignorant… I have been a christian for a year “give or take i got saved when i was 17” and the fact that you try to pass idiotic ideas and think I am goin to think I am wrong…You wanted scientific facts ok FACT: scientists say energy never dies they also admit that humans are energy so what happens? Does our energy just float around… FACT: you said the bible is a joke well why is their an ark on top of the mountain that the BIBLE said Noah’s ark rested on??? Why is their still a standing pillar outside of where soddam, gomorrah (sp) where the bible said that who ever turn’s back to look at the destruction of the city would be turned into a pillar of salt…But the really funny thing that you said is that Homosexuals are genetically made homosexual well last i checked they have all the same genes that homosexuals do they are no different they CHOOSE to live like…And for your last comment I dont hate any body honestly one of my best friends told me he was gay I didnt stop being his friend because of that he still lifts more than anybody I know he is still the same cool guy he just is making a wrong choice…And not that its any of your buisness but Ive never had a girlfriend just because i know of the temptation and am not willing to do that because God will ALWAYS be first in my life and if you dont want to except that their is a God all that says to me is that your a coward that doesnt want to take responsibility for your sins…
So, het what you’re doing is creating a post in which you will be able to post your dislikes of religions. Why? Why is it that religious people are usually the ones that are looked on as intolerant and troublestarters? Honestly, it seems like every arguement I’ve everheard in public over religion, has been because of some jerk agnostic or atheist bringing up the topic to put religious people down. For example, at my job this lady walks past this guys desk and notices that that next to his computer is a small bible. She says something like “What a asshole, he shouldn’t be allowed to bring that shit in here.” She didn’t know that he had been bringing it in for 6 months. Yet, it had done her no harm up to that point. She wasn’t forced to become a christian or some weird stuff like that. So het, got a problem with it, fine. But, in a way you’re acting like one of those TV evangalist I know you must dispise. Later man.
And jason…Yes I have sought non christian books to prove Jesus “our Lord” existed…The history book most of central california High Schools have does recognize that their was a Jesus and that he did die on the cross…The book doesnt say that he was our Lord it says that he was a strong political figure
Just a foot note I didnt want to say every thing I said and not state what faith I am of…I am Baptist no idols, no hate, Just truth
I have a few points to offer, and I admit it’s a matter of interpretation. Not right or wrong, so you can take it or leave it.
-
I agree with Dale in the obsurdity of only saved Christians going to heaven. As a kid, I wondered what kind of God would create people (i.e. native africans) who were doomed to damnation if missionary christians didn’t get to them in time to “save” them. WTF. I choose to believe that’s impossible. We are all God’s children and under His guidance, care and “path”. Spirit takes many forms and religions.
-
I believe the New Testament updates the Old Testament. All the hellfire, wrath, and judgement in the Old Testament is replaced with the glory of Christ in the New Testament. That’s why it’s new. duh. People pull that OT ‘crap’ out and say “The Bible teaches hate and wrath and yada, yada” haven’t finished the book. I say…finish the book, it’s got a great ending.
-
People waiting for the second coming of Christ in the flesh. Christ never left! What the heck are they waiting for? A guy in a robe to walk into the living room? Christ Spirit is ever present waiting for their perception. “I will be with you always” “I will never leave you nor forsake you”
Tim asked the following, "Have you ever heard of Pascal’s Wager? He basically said to believe in god on the chance he might exist. Really do you lose anything in life by living a moral life? He felt you might as well believe in god. Do you think that God (if you believe He exists) would accept that form of worship? [No, neither would most christians. You have to accept christ in your heart.] By the way, I’m curious about something. If those of you who profess to be Christian could answer me a question. Is God a name or a title? [title, just a human word.] Also, if you are following Christ, and he commanded his followers “to be no part of the world just as I am no part of the world”-John 17:16, why do you vote? Christ never gave any political allegiance, except to God’s kingdom. Obviously there are many ramifications of that question. That question also begs the answer to why the pope or any reverend, bishop, minister, etc. is political. [Um, big misrepresentation of that verse. Please reread the whole chapter from the start. After you have, if you are still confused as to what it means, let me know.
Catholics do not have idols! We do not believe that these statues or paintings or gods! They are for purely meditative purpose! A statue of a saint or of the Virgin Mary is not an idol! We do not believe these people are gods! Idols are supposed to be of gods! Therefore they are not idols! They are statues! Just as the great statue of the seated Lincon is not an idol, it’s a statue! Statues of christ are not idols! They are representations of his humanly form! Not him himself! Geez!
“We have just enough religion to hate, but not enough religion to love, one another.” I can’t remember who said it, but he was right.