Rebirth of the Juggernaut: Brute Force and Ignorance (Part 1)

[flappinit]

You are correct. Fury is not corn fed. Not many boxers could be described that way. Maybe Andy Ruiz Jr.

[T3hPwnisher]

Oh yeah, I’m sure you know what to do, but more recipes are always helpful. It’s funny: I’m so much more creative nutritionally now that I’m losing fat. Most likely just to have SOMETHING to do. I went through so much food gaining weight that any way I could streamline the process I’d take, but now that I’m having so little food I have so much more time that I may as well see what I can come up with.

[alex_uk]

@T3hPwnisher

more recipes are always helpful.

That’s true - I’ll take a look!

I’m definitely in the streamline as much as possible boat - breakfast is premade for several days in advance (oats, yogurt and raspberries - just throw 2 scoops of plain whey in, in the morning). Dinners are cooked 2 days at a time in an instant pot (and usually mince based) Lunch is a 3 minute to make affair and snacks - whey or nuts!

[T3hPwnisher]

Oh man, if you got an instant pot, you ever make chili in it? One of my favorite mass gaining foods.

[alex_uk]

Literally just finished eating it for my dinner!

Usually goes 1kg of mince, 3 tins of beans (harricot X 2 and kidney X 1) tin of chick peas and 2 jars of tomato sauce with cumin, chilli and black pepper (used to use garlic but I have a mild intolerance to it - boo!). Love chilli throw it in a tortilla wrap with cheese, beautiful!

[flappinit]

Strongly considering pulling the trigger on an instant pot. Are they as good as I hear?

[T3hPwnisher]

They are SO worth it. I have the actual instant pot brand, but I’m sure all the competitors are great too.

It’s a fast slow cooker. That’s so valuable. Think of anything that you spend 8 hours making in a slow cooker and now make it in an hour or less. Great for when you forget to make dinner, but also REALLY shines for big get togethers. We did like ALL of our thanksgiving sides in the instant pot this year: just churned them out like a factory. We actually have 2 of them: a 6 quart and an 8 quart.

Now, I’m a sucker for all plug in cooking electronics, so there’s also that. I have an indoor smokeless grill I’m itching to use come winter time. But still, for large batch, easy meals, highly recommend instant pot.

---

Hey all you big brains, check out this passage I just read from “Practical Programming for Strength Training”

"Type I [muscle] Fibers (slow twitch) are described as slow oxidative, meaning they rely primarily on aerobic or oxidative pathways…they are extremely fatigue resistant since they produce enzymes that enable the use of an essentially inexhaustible energy substrate: fatty acids. The enzymes that break down fatty acids are dependent on the presence of oxygen for their function; they are thus referred to as oxidative, or aerobic, enzymes

Type IIa fibers…are capable of generating energy from both glucose and fatty acids

Type IIb fibers…rely for fuel on the process of glycolyssis, by which glucose is borken down to yeild ATP"

Watching me lift, it’s pretty apparent I’m very slow twitch. I also say I tend to feel and perform better on high fat/low carb diets. Does one relate to the other? Do I like high fats because I’m primarily slow twitch, am I primarily slow twitch because I eat high fat, is it just a coincidence? Do fast lifts thrive on high carbs?

@FlatsFarmer I feel like this is something you’d be able to speak to. Be happy to hear from others as well. Just kinda nifty.

[flappinit]

Generally, endurance athletes, like triathletes or ultramarathon runners are primarily slow twitch. High intensity stuff does not generally build slow twitch muscles (or I should say, does not build them as much as it builds the other ones) - I would be very surprised to find out that you’re primarily slow twitch. Would say FOG (fast oxidative glycolytic) or fast twitch, with a solid amount of slow twitch because your endurance is good too.

[Voxel]

@T3hPwnisher

borken

I think it’s possible that when you went low-carb you were in ketosis for a long while and it suited you. @JamesBrawn007 or @mertdawg would know more

You might be interested in this post

Estimated 1RM Percentages Off the Chart for Me

Depending on muscle fiber ratio and training experience there can be a lot of variation relative to the charts. In fact you can use the80% test to estimate your muscle fiber dominance. You try to get as many reps with your 80% as you can. The number of reps you get gives us a clue about your fiber dominance (at least in the tested muscles). Traditionally… 80% of max 3-4 reps = VERY fast twitch dominant 5-6 = fast twitch dominant 7-8 = High proportion of fast twitch and intermediate fibers …

Fast lifts do not necessarily thrive on high carbs as far as I’m aware. As per,

@Voxel

Here are some variations to consider, I didn’t write this (CT did), but note that case 3 and 4 have the highest carbohydrate needs. I’m not sure how you train, but if it’s case 2 you might be taking in more carbs than you need,

CASE 1 – Marius is an Olympic lifter, each of his workouts last about 2 hours because he needs more mobility work, then he needs plenty of warm-up sets to work on his technique. When he gets to his work sets he does 5 sets of 2 on the snatch, 5 sets of 2 clean & jerks and 5 sets of 2 front squats. This is a total of about 30 work reps… maybe up to 60-70 reps when we count warm-ups. And none of the sets are longer than 10 seconds (this means that he never needs to rely on glycogen for fuel).

CASE 2 – Will is a powerlifter. His workout lasts about 90 minutes. He does one main lift (squat for example) for 5 sets of 3 reps, 2 main assistance exercises (let’s say front squat and goodmorning) for 5 sets of 5 each. He finishes off with some muscle building work, 3 sets of 8 leg curls and 3 sets of 8 leg extensions. He has a total volume of about 115 reps. 16 of his sets last a little over 10 seconds. So he does use a little more glycogen for fuel than Marius but doesn’t rely heavily on it.

CASE 3 – Danko is a bodybuilder. His workout lasts about 60 minutes. He is in pre-contest mode and does supersets to have a higher caloric expenditure. He does three supersets: A1 Bench press + A2 Bent over row ; B1 Incline DB press + B2. Chin-ups ; C1 Weighted dips + C2 Seated cable row. He does 4 sets of 12 reps per exercise using a fairly slow tempo. His volume is around 290 reps and his sets all last longer than 20 seconds, relying heavily on glycogen for fuel.

CASE 4 – Taz is a Crossfiter. He does a WOD with a time cap of 30 minutes. During those 30 minutes he does 4 rounds of:

20 deadlift @ 225lbs

20 power clean @ 135lbs

20 push press @ 135lbs

20 KB swings @ 32lbs

20 burpees

Each round has 100 reps so his workout includes a total of 400 reps. He uses mostly glycogen for fuel since the 30 minutes are non-stop

So workout volume thrives on glucose/glycogen, if we oversimplify it.

[T3hPwnisher]

@flappinit

Generally, endurance athletes, like triathletes or ultramarathon runners are primarily slow twitch.

But it begs a chicken and egg sorta question: are these athletes slow twitch because the training makes them that way, or because the weeding out process of the sport eliminates those that are fast twitch? Endurance has always been where I excelled, but simply wasn’t what I had interest in.

Do concur that I’m most likely a mixture, but I imagine it leans heavily on the slow side.

Back to the instant pot: did forget to mention that things TASTE much better coming out of it vs a slow cooker as well. Locks in the flavor.

@Voxel I don’t imagine I’ve ever actually gotten to ketosis. I think I’ve kept protein too high and still allow myself enough carbs to not quite cross the threshold.

Absolutely appreciate the links. Curious reading.

[Voxel]

I wonder what lack of explosiveness implies for fiber ratios. I always thought explosive people were just good at using their stretch reflex and that’s inspired by insertions, tendons et al.

[T3hPwnisher]

@Voxel

I always thought explosive people were just good at using their stretch reflex and that’s inspired by insertions, tendons et Al.

I’d consider handspeed in boxing as an interesting contrast to that. I shared my work on the BAS a while back and noted that I could generate significant force but VERY slow speed in doing so. There’s a bit of a stretch reflex in combination punching, but the job itself tends to be fired absent said reflex.

[flappinit]

Good point.

On the instant pot, yeah, the guy I do programming with at work has one and raves about how quickly you can make pulled chicken out of it, and the taste. Jeez. Might go for that today - my wife works right next to a walmart.

[T3hPwnisher]

Oh yeah, pulled chicken/pork is stupidly easy and delicious. I’ve made ribs in it too that were yummy. Liquid smoke helps there. Wife has made Hawaiian luau style pig that was amazing. Meatloaf too. Hell, whole cookbooks based just around the instant pot, haha. I have a keto one that has a bunch of recipes I want to try. Most of my experimental cooking was done when I was home and the Mrs was at work, but COVID teleworking put a hold on that.

[dagill2]

@T3hPwnisher

if you got an instant pot, you ever make chili in it?

I wasn’t aware you could use an instant pot for anything else?

[Koestrizer]

I learned in university that the distribution between fast and slow twitch mucle fibers is mainly genetically determinated. It then changes with training stimulus but only to a degree.

@T3hPwnisher

are these athletes slow twitch because the training makes them that way, or because the weeding out process of the sport eliminates those that are fast twitch?

So if you look at any pro sport it is most likely the latter.

[T3hPwnisher]

@dagill2

I wasn’t aware you could use an instant pot for anything else?

You need to make pot roast in it. And eat an entire pot roast.

For me.

Because god do I miss doing that.

[dagill2]

I don’t need telling twice.

[flappinit]

My handspeed slows the second I stop thinking about the snap, haha.

Speaking of boxing, my favorite combo right now is jab body-jab head-cross-lead hook body-lead hook head-cross or 9-1-2-7-3-2. Fires off sooooo nicely. The body jab at the beginning is more of a rangefinder/feint, then a nice snap to the head followed quickly by a cross which brings you in range for that body shot.

[T3hPwnisher]

So @Voxel, with the links you provided I feel we discussed 2 different things. I’m not as much interested in what would be the best fuel for those activities, but moreso what type of fuel does the athlete that performs those activities gravitate toward. What you wrote makes total sense as far as being strategic in the nutrition one employs, but I feel there’s also been observations that some trainees are more carb tolerant than others. Like, I’ll still bring sugar to a strongman comp and chow down on it, but I also feel AWFUL once it’s all said and done having binged on so many carbs. Meanwhile, I’ve put away hundreds of grams of fat (sometimes in a single meal) and felt fantastic afterwards.

Does fiber distribution play a role in how well a trainee responds to carbs?