[quote]hoosierdaddy wrote:
good looking out mertdawg… helix this was the methodology i was talking about, i could have sworn this was somewhere on the elitefts site, if i had you looking around for nothing I apologize, but i’ve found that with alot of weaker and friends and some clients its easier to use to WSB method by incorporaing %'s to calculate the appropriate wieght to use…
mertdawg just wanted to steal all the glory
[/quote]
Yea, I found it in about 90 seconds and that’s because I spelled Prilepin wrong twice!
[quote]Helix wrote:
It is interesting and I get the general theory, but again do you have any examples of it put in practice?
I should also say that for the last 7 weeks I have been doing a bill starr heavy/med/light routine and have had a fair bit of success. Everything has been improving weekly cept for my bench.
I just need a change of pace for a little bit and I want to get into the gym 4 days a week because I am on a fairly heavy bulk and want to take advantage of all the extra calories. [/quote]
Remember, Simmons may say 60%, but he’s talking about a percentage of max raw power bench and squat used for
clos(er) grip benches and box squat and often adding some bands and chains which don’t factor in to the weight. If you want to keep it simple, do Westside, but add about 10% on the DE day and do 4-6 hard singles and doubles instead of just going for a max on ME day.
[quote]mertdawg wrote:
Helix wrote:
It is interesting and I get the general theory, but again do you have any examples of it put in practice?
I should also say that for the last 7 weeks I have been doing a bill starr heavy/med/light routine and have had a fair bit of success. Everything has been improving weekly cept for my bench.
I just need a change of pace for a little bit and I want to get into the gym 4 days a week because I am on a fairly heavy bulk and want to take advantage of all the extra calories.
Remember, Simmons may say 60%, but he’s talking about a percentage of max raw power bench and squat used for
clos(er) grip benches and box squat and often adding some bands and chains which don’t factor in to the weight. If you want to keep it simple, do Westside, but add about 10% on the DE day and do 4-6 hard singles and doubles instead of just going for a max on ME day.
[/quote]
Alright, so basically do a few warmup sets @ around 75% then follow it by 4-6x2 @ 90%(As you said)with a single weight. Each week try to add another 5 pounds to the bar. Rest periods kept at around 2 mins (giving a total time of around 12 minutes).
I was basing my template off of westside for skinny bastards and not the orignial 8 keys and it calls for working up to 3RM instead of a 1RM. I imagine I could follow the same scheme with respect to my 3 rep max (4-5 sets of 3 @ 90%-95% of 3 Rep Max). The volume would end up being higher though.
Would you suggest trying something like that and working around my 3 RM instead of doubles based off my 1 RM? I am only curious because Defranco mentions working in the 3 rep max range to get the total volume neccisary for muscle growth.
I imagine that 6 sets of doubles at 90% of 1RM would probably be a ton of volume anyways in the end(when considering the fact that the rest periods are small).
[quote]Helix wrote:
Alright, so basically do a few warmup sets @ around 75% then follow it by 4-6x2 @ 90%(As you said)with a single weight. Each week try to add another 5 pounds to the bar. Rest periods kept at around 2 mins (giving a total time of around 12 minutes).
I was basing my template off of westside for skinny bastards and not the orignial 8 keys and it calls for working up to 3RM instead of a 1RM. I imagine I could follow the same scheme with respect to my 3 rep max (4-5 sets of 3 @ 90%-95% of 3 Rep Max). The volume would end up being higher though.
Would you suggest trying something like that and working around my 3 RM instead of doubles based off my 1 RM? I am only curious because Defranco mentions working in the 3 rep max range to get the total volume neccisary for muscle growth.
I imagine that 6 sets of doubles at 90% of 1RM would probably be a ton of volume anyways in the end(when considering the fact that the rest periods are small).
Thanks for all the help.
[/quote]
If you did 155 x 3, my best guess would be to do
Workout 1: 120 x 9 x 3 (75-90 seconds) I would just try to get all 9 sets in 15 minutes start to finish.
Workout 2: 135 x 6 x 3 (2 minutes)
Workout 3: 150 x 5 x 2 (2 1/2-3 minutes rest)
Therefore, all 3 workouts would take 15 minutes start to finish (not counting warmups).
You WILL add 5 pounds to each workout each time around and with 2 workouts/week, I would bet you’ll add 15-20 to your max in 6 weeks, and 30-40 within 12 weeks which will put you over 200.
If you are concerned about mass, add one set to failure at 120 (your workout 1 weight) after workout 3. I bet you will get 15-20 reps.
[quote]Helix wrote:
Mert, would you reccomend the same protocal for squats?[/quote]
You said your bench was weak. Where is your squat right now? If its a little better, I would drop a set from each workout for the squat. Also, If your using a box, and you want to do a set to failure after the 90% day, I would not use a box for this set.
Wow, sorry for the late reply on this thread. I has away on vacation. My max squat right now is at around 200 pounds(and a little bit probably). Hope you are still around mertdog to reply
[quote]mertdawg wrote:
I think that at the 160 pound max bench range, westside is not necessary or optimal exactly as written.
I would actually recommend benching
2-3x per week but cycling 70%, 80% and 90% for the following basic parameters
With a 160 bench:
Day 1: 70% (110-115) 8-10 sets of 3.
Day 2: 80% (125-130) 6-8 sets of 3.
Day 3: 90% (145) 4-6 sets of 1-2.
Add 5 pounds to all the next time around.
However give yourself no more than 15 minutes from the start of the first work set to the start of the last work set. Push as hard (fast) as possible.
I have used Westiside principles but thinking back, I would not have used them when my bench was still below about 255-275. The 60% would have been way to light and the max effort day would not have been enough volume mainly because I wasn’t using my muscles intensely enough at that point.
I’m only saying this is what I would honestly do if I had it to do over from that level, however we’re all different and you have to choose your own path and find your best program. [/quote]
I would have to second what mertdawg recommended. Use the parameters as he suggested. The other thing is and CT has mentioned this you have to learn how to train yourself you might make mistakes but that is how you learn. Wait till you get your bench to 200 plus lbs and if things start to stall then maybe look at westside for skinny bastards. There is no best program
Mattrose, I realize there is no best program. I am just replacing the max lift/speed work in a westside template with the % system(as per mertdog’s suggestion)
