Questions for Islamo-Fascists

Off Topic Politics and World Issues
1

Here are five simple questions that law-abiding Muslims need to answer in order to differentiate themselves from Islamo-Fascists.

(1) Why are Muslims so quiet in the face of Human Rights violations?

We see no Muslim demonstrations against atrocities perpetrated by Muslims in the name of their religion. Muslim terrorists blowing themselves up in the name of religion and Palestinian nationalism have killed countless innocent people in Israel, the UK, Spain, Jordan, Iraq and elsewhere.

Muslims slaughter millions of innocent Christian Africans in Sudan (Darfur) and tens of thousands in Somalia.
All we see on TV are supposedly mainstream Muslim spokesmen implicitly defending terror on the grounds that Israel occupies Palestinian lands. We see torture, kidnapping and murder in the name of Allah, but we see no anti-torture and anti-murder demonstrations in the name of Allah. We even see Muslims killing Muslims in Iraq.

There are a billion Muslims in the world. How is it possible that essentially none have demonstrated against evils perpetrated by Muslims in the name of Islam? This is true even of the millions of Muslims living in free Western societies. The horrors of 9/11 and 7/7 are excused or obfuscated by conspiracy-theory garbage. Last week British Muslims attempted to blow 10 planes filled with innocent people (some surely Muslims too) out of the sky and the Muslim ?establishment? offers excuses for them.

What are non-Muslims of goodwill supposed to conclude?
When the Israeli government did not stop a Lebanese massacre of Palestinians in the Sabra and Chatilla refugee camps in Lebanon in 1982, great crowds of Israeli Jews gathered to protest their country’s moral failing. Why has there been no comparable public demonstration by Palestinians or other Muslims to morally condemn Palestinian or other Muslim-committed terror?

(2) Why was only one of the Palestinian terrorists Christian?

If Israeli occupation is the reason for Muslim terror in Israel, why do no Christian Palestinians, with the exception of George Habbash (who never acted as a Christian) engage in terror? They are just as nationalistic and just as occupied as Muslim Palestinians. Why do no Christians blow themselves up in busses or restaurants to liberate their country?

(3) Why is only one of the 47 Muslim-majority countries a free country?

According to Freedom House, a Washington-based group that promotes democracy, of the world’s 47 Muslim countries, only Mali is free. Sixty percent are not free, and 38% are partly free. Muslim-majority states account for a majority of the world’s “not free” states. And of the 10 “worst of the worst,” seven are Islamic states. Why is this?

(4) Why are so many atrocities committed and threatened by Muslims in the name of Islam?

Muslims (in the name of Islam) murder thousands of people. In Iraq, in Chechnya, (including hundreds of schoolchildren), in Darfur. While reciting Muslim prayers, Islamic terrorists take foreigners working to make Iraq free and slaughter them in front of TV cameras. Muslim daughters are murdered by their own families in the thousands in “honor killings.” Muslim governments have publicly called for the extermination of Israel. Hizbollah uses Lebanese women and children as human shields whilst raining rockets on civilian targets in Israel.

(5) Why do countries governed by religious Muslims persecute other religions?

No church or synagogue is allowed in Saudi Arabia. The Taliban destroyed some of the greatest sculptures of the ancient world because they were Buddhist. Sudan’s Islamic regime has murdered great numbers of Christians. Christians are persecuted and murdered in Somalia, Northern Nigeria and elsewhere.

Instead of confronting these problems, too many Muslims deny them. There are no Christian or Jewish-based terror groups in the world today. (Dannyrat makes much of Jewish terrorism. The Irgun, which never acted in the name of the Jewish religion, existed 60 years ago).

The sooner we recognise that the Islamic world is in its Dark Ages (Christianity had its Dark Ages a millennium ago) the sooner we will be able to address the growing menace of Islamo-Fascism.

With apologies to Dennis Prager.

2

[quote]coolexec wrote:
A lot.
[/quote]

I’m not a Muslim, so I won’t answer your question. I’ve got a question for you though.

(1) When did you demonstrate against the human rights violations in Abu Ghraib and Guantanamo?

What’s that? You don’t think you’re responsible for that?
Or worse perhaps, you thought they had it coming.
Well, that’s rather funny considering you hold every Muslim reponsible for everything any Muslim ever did.
Talk about double standard eh.

(2) Who do you considere Palestinian terrorists? Where did you learn that only one of them is Christian?

(3) What are you saying Coolexec? The US has a number of Muslim countries they consider to be allies. None of them is free? Why is that? Perhaps the US (and the West in general) is more concerned with promoting easy access to the oil instead of promoting freedom and democracy in the area.

(4) Christians in the name Christ, freedom and pure greed did their fair share of killing. You seem to forget that.

(5) Christians and Jews have lived in peace in Islamic countries for centuries. Only after WWII did we see a change in attitude. Let’s not forget it was the Christian Germans that murdered millions of Jews.

A rather big part of Christianity seems to be stuck in the dark ages also.
Like Marx said: religion is opium for the people.
Every religion has it’s fanatics, comiting attrocities in the name of their deity.
Why do you single out the Muslims Coolexec? Hmmm?

3

Jeebus this is dumb.

4

err, actually Muslim groups strongly denounce acts of terror whenever they occur. I guess some people chose not to listen to them though.

5

[quote]Wreckless wrote:
coolexec wrote:
A lot.

I’m not a Muslim, so I won’t answer your question. I’ve got a question for you though.

(1) When did you demonstrate against the human rights violations in Abu Ghraib and Guantanamo?

What’s that? You don’t think you’re responsible for that?
Or worse perhaps, you thought they had it coming.
Well, that’s rather funny considering you hold every Muslim reponsible for everything any Muslim ever did.
Talk about double standard eh.[/quote]

I seem to recall quite a bit of outrage in this country about that because we care about people, even the ones who hate us. I have never spoken to one person or heard any one person speak about abu garib postitivly. Most people were outraged, you choose not to see it because you hate this country but live happily under its protection.

In Iran, Cuba, North Korea, if you spoke this way about them in thier borders, you be in prison fighting ovet the cockroaches to eat.

[quote]
(2) Who do you considere Palestinian terrorists? Where did you learn that only one of them is Christian?[/quote]

I concider them all terrorits. The elected hamas by a wide margin which makes them cuplable in all of hamas’s violence and blood. Still I don’t want to kill them all, I just want to vaporize hamas into dust, which is a little better then they deserve.

[quote]
(3) What are you saying Coolexec? The US has a number of Muslim countries they consider to be allies. None of them is free? Why is that? Perhaps the US (and the West in general) is more concerned with promoting easy access to the oil instead of promoting freedom and democracy in the area.[/quote]

The only thing good in the middle east is the oil. We should not be concerned with the form of government so long as it is freindly to us. This is what I concider the big mistake of this administrtion, thinking they could change the middle east with democracy. These people want jihad so they can die in it and get corked in the ass by 72 male virgins. So if not us, they pick a fight with somebody.

[quote]
(4) Christians in the name Christ, freedom and pure greed did their fair share of killing. You seem to forget that.[/quote]

They did kick the muslims ass out of Europe in the mean time. So something good came of it.

[quote]
(5) Christians and Jews have lived in peace in Islamic countries for centuries. Only after WWII did we see a change in attitude. Let’s not forget it was the Christian Germans that murdered millions of Jews.[/quote]

BULLSHIT. Christians and Jews were all ways at risk and in the midst of great tension in those countries. The remained Christians and Jews despite the risk.

[quote]
A rather big part of Christianity seems to be stuck in the dark ages also.
Like Marx said: religion is opium for the people.
Every religion has it’s fanatics, comiting attrocities in the name of their deity.
Why do you single out the Muslims Coolexec? Hmmm?[/quote]

Because no other religion or even agnostics and athiests think its a great idea to kill innocent people to get thier point across. Nobody else declares wars on countries and whine like pussies when those countries retaliate. Nobody else kills thier own to foward thier aganda. Nobody else promotes the murder of “Zionists” like we advertise McDonalds. Nobody else parties in the streets when innocent civilians are killed by thier wacked mentality. Nobody else recruits thier kids to do thier dirty work. Not even the USSR, under Stalin did such things.

Dude you think you are smart. You think you are being open minded and everybody else is close minded. You think you have concidered things that nobody else has, but you are wrong. I suggest you take a trip abroad and see what it is like. Or go talk to a soldier who has been there maybe you would get a clearer picture. But in the end you will perhaps think you are smarter than all the rest, even those who have experienced the evil first hand.

6

[quote]pat36 wrote:
Wreckless wrote:
coolexec wrote:
A lot.

I’m not a Muslim, so I won’t answer your question. I’ve got a question for you though.

(1) When did you demonstrate against the human rights violations in Abu Ghraib and Guantanamo?

What’s that? You don’t think you’re responsible for that?
Or worse perhaps, you thought they had it coming.
Well, that’s rather funny considering you hold every Muslim reponsible for everything any Muslim ever did.
Talk about double standard eh.

I seem to recall quite a bit of outrage in this country about that because we care about people, even the ones who hate us. I have never spoken to one person or heard any one person speak about abu garib postitivly. Most people were outraged, you choose not to see it because you hate this country but live happily under its protection.

In Iran, Cuba, North Korea, if you spoke this way about them in thier borders, you be in prison fighting ovet the cockroaches to eat.

(2) Who do you considere Palestinian terrorists? Where did you learn that only one of them is Christian?

I concider them all terrorits. The elected hamas by a wide margin which makes them cuplable in all of hamas’s violence and blood. Still I don’t want to kill them all, I just want to vaporize hamas into dust, which is a little better then they deserve.

(3) What are you saying Coolexec? The US has a number of Muslim countries they consider to be allies. None of them is free? Why is that? Perhaps the US (and the West in general) is more concerned with promoting easy access to the oil instead of promoting freedom and democracy in the area.

The only thing good in the middle east is the oil. We should not be concerned with the form of government so long as it is freindly to us. This is what I concider the big mistake of this administrtion, thinking they could change the middle east with democracy. These people want jihad so they can die in it and get corked in the ass by 72 male virgins. So if not us, they pick a fight with somebody.

(4) Christians in the name Christ, freedom and pure greed did their fair share of killing. You seem to forget that.

They did kick the muslims ass out of Europe in the mean time. So something good came of it.

(5) Christians and Jews have lived in peace in Islamic countries for centuries. Only after WWII did we see a change in attitude. Let’s not forget it was the Christian Germans that murdered millions of Jews.

BULLSHIT. Christians and Jews were all ways at risk and in the midst of great tension in those countries. The remained Christians and Jews despite the risk.

A rather big part of Christianity seems to be stuck in the dark ages also.
Like Marx said: religion is opium for the people.
Every religion has it’s fanatics, comiting attrocities in the name of their deity.
Why do you single out the Muslims Coolexec? Hmmm?

Because no other religion or even agnostics and athiests think its a great idea to kill innocent people to get thier point across. Nobody else declares wars on countries and whine like pussies when those countries retaliate. Nobody else kills thier own to foward thier aganda. Nobody else promotes the murder of “Zionists” like we advertise McDonalds. Nobody else parties in the streets when innocent civilians are killed by thier wacked mentality. Nobody else recruits thier kids to do thier dirty work. Not even the USSR, under Stalin did such things.

Dude you think you are smart. You think you are being open minded and everybody else is close minded. You think you have concidered things that nobody else has, but you are wrong. I suggest you take a trip abroad and see what it is like. Or go talk to a soldier who has been there maybe you would get a clearer picture. But in the end you will perhaps think you are smarter than all the rest, even those who have experienced the evil first hand.
[/quote]

A few points here;

  1. so you “concider” all Palestinians to be terrorists? Then at the same time you are amazed that radical Muslims would “concider” all Americans legitimate targets and celebrate when innocent lives are taken? Someting doesn’t quite compute here.

  2. “Because no other religion or even agnostics and athiests think its a great idea to kill innocent people to get thier point across”. So, essentially here you are denying the existence of non-Muslim terrorist groups by the sound of things. I suggest you do a search on IRA atrocities committed in the past 20 years. I’m pretty sure they didn’t care too much about innocent people.

  3. “Nobody else recruits thier kids to do thier dirty work”. Have you heard of the Childrens Crusade? Again, look it up.

  4. “These people want jihad so they can die in it and get corked in the ass by 72 male virgins.” I think here you must be making a reference to that ‘72 virgins in heaven’ idea, that gets banded around here. The majority of terrorists/suicide bombers/whatever, are motivated by secular, and not religious factors. This is not just my opinion, this is the conclusions of one of your (the US) top security bods who has devoted years studying their motives.

  5. “They did kick the muslims ass out of Europe in the mean time. So something good came of it.” This pretty much discredits your entire post, as it reveals that you obviously have an underlying, irrational hatred of Muslims, and so trying to engage in reasoned debate with you is going to be pointless…

Still, I’ve tried.

7

I only have one question…

What is it like to be an ignorant, racist bigot that wants to group all Muslims via the actions of 0.01% of people in that religion?

The Holocaust, Rwandan Genocide, Bosnian Genocide and other atrocities are started with the support of, and succeed because of people like you. You are no different than a palestinian that classifies all israeli’s as the Enemy or the WTC hijackers, who want to kill all Americans. You are unable (too stupid) to distinguish between those that are not extreme and those that are. It is just far simpler for you to calssify every Muslim in the same fold and justify a mass extermination. A bit like someone else we know of named Bin Laden.

And you didn’t even make these questions up yourself, they have been posted time and time again, and answered time and time again.

8

[quote]juninho wrote:
err, actually Muslim groups strongly denounce acts of terror whenever they occur. I guess some people chose not to listen to them though.[/quote]

Muslim groups denounce events that they deem to be ‘acts of terror.’ What common denominators exist in their definition of ‘acts of terror’?

  1. An event is an “act of terror” if there is political capital to be made when a muslim is hurt or detained (usually in connection with planning or committing an act of violence).

  2. Bombs on busses, in tube stations, in restaurants and on aircraft, placed and/or detonated by Muslims, are not ‘acts of terror.’

  3. Genocide, when the victims are non Muslim, is not an “act of terror.”

  4. Murdering other Muslims is not an “act of terror.”

  5. Implementing the Sharia, stoning women to death, mutilating them and disfiguring people are not “acts of terror.”

  6. The denial of Human Rights to people is not an “act of terror.”

Sorry mate, all that Muslim groups denounce are actions that hinder or retard their mission. The mission is to destroy the West and bring it forcibly into the Islamic world – and to commit violence to that end even while their overall goal remains out of reach. That effort goes under the general rubric of jihad.

Jihad (in Arabic, “struggle”) is a central duty of every Muslim. Modern Muslim theologians have spoken of many things as jihads: the struggle within the soul, defending the faith from critics, supporting its growth and defense financially, even migrating to non-Muslim lands for the purpose of spreading Islam. But violent jihad is a constant of Islamic history. Many passages of the Qur’an and sayings of the Prophet Muhammad are used by jihad warriors today to justify their actions and gain new recruits.

No major Muslim group has ever repudiated the doctrines of armed jihad. The theology of jihad, which denies unbelievers equality of human rights and dignity, is available today for anyone with the will and means to bring it to life.

9

[quote]Z-Man wrote:
I only have one question…

What is it like to be an ignorant, racist bigot that wants to group all Muslims via the actions of 0.01% of people in that religion?

The Holocaust, Rwandan Genocide, Bosnian Genocide and other atrocities are started with the support of, and succeed because of people like you. You are no different than a palestinian that classifies all israeli’s as the Enemy or the WTC hijackers, who want to kill all Americans. You are unable (too stupid) to distinguish between those that are not extreme and those that are. It is just far simpler for you to calssify every Muslim in the same fold and justify a mass extermination. A bit like someone else we know of named Bin Laden.

And you didn’t even make these questions up yourself, they have been posted time and time again, and answered time and time again.
[/quote]

Thank you for your comments which are both uninformed and badly written. I shall ignore most of your drivel, but take issue with one point.

I concluded my original posting with the statement: “with apologies to Dennis Prager.” This has a certain implication and carries an acknowledgement.
I think the word you were looking for, but were to ignorant to find, is ‘plagiarism.’

The questions have been reformulated and updated but they are increasingly relevant. The problem, which is Islamo-Fascism, gets worse.
The tragedy is that you don’t understand it.

10

I have a question too:

Why are so few Christians able to put into practice Matthew 22:39?

I’d like to understand by what contortion of logic you get from your Christ’s teachings that it’s ok to hate arabs, muslims, palestinians and even terrorists.

11

[quote]Z-Man wrote:
I only have one question…

What is it like to be an ignorant, racist bigot that wants to group all Muslims via the actions of 0.01% of people in that religion?

The Holocaust, Rwandan Genocide, Bosnian Genocide and other atrocities are started with the support of, and succeed because of people like you. You are no different than a palestinian that classifies all israeli’s as the Enemy or the WTC hijackers, who want to kill all Americans. You are unable (too stupid) to distinguish between those that are not extreme and those that are. It is just far simpler for you to calssify every Muslim in the same fold and justify a mass extermination. A bit like someone else we know of named Bin Laden.

And you didn’t even make these questions up yourself, they have been posted time and time again, and answered time and time again.
[/quote]

You are comparing him to bin laden? Unbelievable. Note: nothing you say matters after that.

Just for fun, however, I’ll point out the central theme in his discussion: Why isn’t there more of an internal crackdown on these extremists?

Your bilious response did nothing to address that central issue.

JeffR

12

[quote]coolexec wrote:
juninho wrote:
err, actually Muslim groups strongly denounce acts of terror whenever they occur. I guess some people chose not to listen to them though.

Muslim groups denounce events that they deem to be ‘acts of terror.’ What common denominators exist in their definition of ‘acts of terror’?

  1. An event is an “act of terror” if there is political capital to be made when a muslim is hurt or detained (usually in connection with planning or committing an act of violence).

  2. Bombs on busses, in tube stations, in restaurants and on aircraft, placed and/or detonated by Muslims, are not ‘acts of terror.’

  3. Genocide, when the victims are non Muslim, is not an “act of terror.”

  4. Murdering other Muslims is not an “act of terror.”

  5. Implementing the Sharia, stoning women to death, mutilating them and disfiguring people are not “acts of terror.”

  6. The denial of Human Rights to people is not an “act of terror.”

Sorry mate, all that Muslim groups denounce are actions that hinder or retard their mission. The mission is to destroy the West and bring it forcibly into the Islamic world – and to commit violence to that end even while their overall goal remains out of reach. That effort goes under the general rubric of jihad.

Jihad (in Arabic, “struggle”) is a central duty of every Muslim. Modern Muslim theologians have spoken of many things as jihads: the struggle within the soul, defending the faith from critics, supporting its growth and defense financially, even migrating to non-Muslim lands for the purpose of spreading Islam. But violent jihad is a constant of Islamic history. Many passages of the Qur’an and sayings of the Prophet Muhammad are used by jihad warriors today to justify their actions and gain new recruits.

No major Muslim group has ever repudiated the doctrines of armed jihad. The theology of jihad, which denies unbelievers equality of human rights and dignity, is available today for anyone with the will and means to bring it to life.

[/quote]

You’re barking up the wrong tree here I’m afraid. Your post may be applicable to some extremist Muslim groups, or some oppressive Muslim regimes, but I am talking about the majority of moderate Muslims.

I’m guessing from your post that you live in an area which has very few Muslims in it, but where I live by far the most vocal in their condemnation of terrorist attacks such as 9/11 or July 7th, are local Muslim leaders and groups, who denounce any act of killing as being un-Islamic. Again, I guess it’s a matter of whether you choose to listen or not.

13

[quote]Z-Man wrote:
I only have one question…

What is it like to be an ignorant, racist bigot that wants to group all Muslims via the actions of 0.01% of people in that religion?

The Holocaust, Rwandan Genocide, Bosnian Genocide and other atrocities are started with the support of, and succeed because of people like you. You are no different than a palestinian that classifies all israeli’s as the Enemy or the WTC hijackers, who want to kill all Americans. You are unable (too stupid) to distinguish between those that are not extreme and those that are. It is just far simpler for you to calssify every Muslim in the same fold and justify a mass extermination. A bit like someone else we know of named Bin Laden.

And you didn’t even make these questions up yourself, they have been posted time and time again, and answered time and time again.
[/quote]

Ooops you forgot the Conglees genocide and the Somali genocide. But I guess those are ok because they were perpetrated by islamic-facists. Who want all non-muslims dead.

I’d say the majority of muslims hate us and want us dead, not 0.01%. I’d say it’s closer to 70%. 0.01% are actively declaring war at any given time. If they aren’t doing it, they support those who are. I have tried to read the hearts and thoughts of muslims using resources like al-jazeera and some jordanian trash mags, but guess what. They hate us and want us dead. 9/11 was the CIA so we could decalre war on islam, 3/11 spain was also done by the west as was the 7/7 attacks in Engalnd. The U.S and isreal cause the tsunami to kill muslims. This is what they are reporting over there as fact.

Here is what I want to find. A single muslim who does not hate jews. That’s what I want to see. Sure not all muslims want to do away with the west, but they definaltely all hate jews. Even “our friends” like the UE when they stopped importing Coca-Cola becuase the president of coke at the time was a jew.

14

[quote]pat36 wrote:
Z-Man wrote:
I only have one question…

What is it like to be an ignorant, racist bigot that wants to group all Muslims via the actions of 0.01% of people in that religion?

The Holocaust, Rwandan Genocide, Bosnian Genocide and other atrocities are started with the support of, and succeed because of people like you. You are no different than a palestinian that classifies all israeli’s as the Enemy or the WTC hijackers, who want to kill all Americans. You are unable (too stupid) to distinguish between those that are not extreme and those that are. It is just far simpler for you to calssify every Muslim in the same fold and justify a mass extermination. A bit like someone else we know of named Bin Laden.

And you didn’t even make these questions up yourself, they have been posted time and time again, and answered time and time again.

Ooops you forgot the Conglees genocide and the Sudanees genocide. But I guess those are ok because they were perpetrated by islamic-facists. Who want all non-muslims dead.

I’d say the majority of muslims hate us and want us dead, not 0.01%. I’d say it’s closer to 70%. 0.01% are actively declaring war at any given time. If they aren’t doing it, they support those who are. I have tried to read the hearts and thoughts of muslims using resources like al-jazeera and some jordanian trash mags, but guess what. They hate us and want us dead. 9/11 was the CIA so we could decalre war on islam, 3/11 spain was also done by the west as was the 7/7 attacks in Engalnd. The U.S and isreal cause the tsunami to kill muslims. This is what they are reporting over there as fact.

Here is what I want to find. A single muslim who does not hate jews. That’s what I want to see. Sure not all muslims want to do away with the west, but they definaltely all hate jews. Even “our friends” like the UE when they stopped importing Coca-Cola becuase the president of coke at the time was a jew.
[/quote]

hang on, you can’t simply pluck made up %'s out of the air and declare that it means anything.

OK, I’ll play too: The Jews have brought 65.326% of Muslim hatred on themselves via the actions of Israel. Maybe even 66%. It means fuck all but I guess at first glance it makes it look like I have put some thought into my post.

15

[quote]juninho wrote:
coolexec wrote:
juninho wrote:
err, actually Muslim groups strongly denounce acts of terror whenever they occur. I guess some people chose not to listen to them though.

Muslim groups denounce events that they deem to be ‘acts of terror.’ What common denominators exist in their definition of ‘acts of terror’?

  1. An event is an “act of terror” if there is political capital to be made when a muslim is hurt or detained (usually in connection with planning or committing an act of violence).

  2. Bombs on busses, in tube stations, in restaurants and on aircraft, placed and/or detonated by Muslims, are not ‘acts of terror.’

  3. Genocide, when the victims are non Muslim, is not an “act of terror.”

  4. Murdering other Muslims is not an “act of terror.”

  5. Implementing the Sharia, stoning women to death, mutilating them and disfiguring people are not “acts of terror.”

  6. The denial of Human Rights to people is not an “act of terror.”

Sorry mate, all that Muslim groups denounce are actions that hinder or retard their mission. The mission is to destroy the West and bring it forcibly into the Islamic world – and to commit violence to that end even while their overall goal remains out of reach. That effort goes under the general rubric of jihad.

Jihad (in Arabic, “struggle”) is a central duty of every Muslim. Modern Muslim theologians have spoken of many things as jihads: the struggle within the soul, defending the faith from critics, supporting its growth and defense financially, even migrating to non-Muslim lands for the purpose of spreading Islam. But violent jihad is a constant of Islamic history. Many passages of the Qur’an and sayings of the Prophet Muhammad are used by jihad warriors today to justify their actions and gain new recruits.

No major Muslim group has ever repudiated the doctrines of armed jihad. The theology of jihad, which denies unbelievers equality of human rights and dignity, is available today for anyone with the will and means to bring it to life.

You’re barking up the wrong tree here I’m afraid. Your post may be applicable to some extremist Muslim groups, or some oppressive Muslim regimes, but I am talking about the majority of moderate Muslims.

I’m guessing from your post that you live in an area which has very few Muslims in it, but where I live by far the most vocal in their condemnation of terrorist attacks such as 9/11 or July 7th, are local Muslim leaders and groups, who denounce any act of killing as being un-Islamic. Again, I guess it’s a matter of whether you choose to listen or not.
[/quote]

Hell, I think hearing it would be refreshing. I was friends with a muslims fellow. I even went ot his mosque and prayed with him. He was not happy about the attacks because he know people would be outraged at muslims. But the fact is all terrorist attacks lately have been perpertatrated by muslims. This is an undeniable fact, unless you just choose to be blind. We are in a time where peaceful solutions are only attainable at the surrender table. Negotiations have not worked and do not work.

16

[quote]pat36 wrote:

You’re barking up the wrong tree here I’m afraid. Your post may be applicable to some extremist Muslim groups, or some oppressive Muslim regimes, but I am talking about the majority of moderate Muslims.

I’m guessing from your post that you live in an area which has very few Muslims in it, but where I live by far the most vocal in their condemnation of terrorist attacks such as 9/11 or July 7th, are local Muslim leaders and groups, who denounce any act of killing as being un-Islamic. Again, I guess it’s a matter of whether you choose to listen or not.

Hell, I think hearing it would be refreshing. I was friends with a muslims fellow. I even went ot his mosque and prayed with him. He was not happy about the attacks because he know people would be outraged at muslims. But the fact is all terrorist attacks lately have been perpertatrated by muslims. This is an undeniable fact, unless you just choose to be blind. We are in a time where peaceful solutions are only attainable at the surrender table. Negotiations have not worked and do not work.[/quote]

I’m not sure what the point of this post was. I’m not disputing that most terrorist attacks are currently carried out by Muslim groups. I question the relevance of that to this discussion though.

Sorry, you’ve confused me.

17

[quote]juninho wrote:
coolexec wrote:
juninho wrote:
err, actually Muslim groups strongly denounce acts of terror whenever they occur. I guess some people chose not to listen to them though.

Muslim groups denounce events that they deem to be ‘acts of terror.’ What common denominators exist in their definition of ‘acts of terror’?

  1. An event is an “act of terror” if there is political capital to be made when a muslim is hurt or detained (usually in connection with planning or committing an act of violence).

  2. Bombs on busses, in tube stations, in restaurants and on aircraft, placed and/or detonated by Muslims, are not ‘acts of terror.’

  3. Genocide, when the victims are non Muslim, is not an “act of terror.”

  4. Murdering other Muslims is not an “act of terror.”

  5. Implementing the Sharia, stoning women to death, mutilating them and disfiguring people are not “acts of terror.”

  6. The denial of Human Rights to people is not an “act of terror.”

Sorry mate, all that Muslim groups denounce are actions that hinder or retard their mission. The mission is to destroy the West and bring it forcibly into the Islamic world – and to commit violence to that end even while their overall goal remains out of reach. That effort goes under the general rubric of jihad.

Jihad (in Arabic, “struggle”) is a central duty of every Muslim. Modern Muslim theologians have spoken of many things as jihads: the struggle within the soul, defending the faith from critics, supporting its growth and defense financially, even migrating to non-Muslim lands for the purpose of spreading Islam. But violent jihad is a constant of Islamic history. Many passages of the Qur’an and sayings of the Prophet Muhammad are used by jihad warriors today to justify their actions and gain new recruits.

No major Muslim group has ever repudiated the doctrines of armed jihad. The theology of jihad, which denies unbelievers equality of human rights and dignity, is available today for anyone with the will and means to bring it to life.

You’re barking up the wrong tree here I’m afraid. Your post may be applicable to some extremist Muslim groups, or some oppressive Muslim regimes, but I am talking about the majority of moderate Muslims.

I’m guessing from your post that you live in an area which has very few Muslims in it, but where I live by far the most vocal in their condemnation of terrorist attacks such as 9/11 or July 7th, are local Muslim leaders and groups, who denounce any act of killing as being un-Islamic. Again, I guess it’s a matter of whether you choose to listen or not.
[/quote]

Juninho, I do not know precisely you live although, it would appear from your postings, that they grow something really good there, and you smoke a lot of it.

I do know that you live somewhere in the UK.

Let me try to disabuse you of the notion that there are “Muslim leaders and groups, who denounce any act of killing as being un-Islamic.”

A few days ago your security services uncovered a conspiracy to bomb trans-Atlantic airliners which would have seen as many as 10 United States-bound planes (and their passengers and crews plus the US citizens living underneath the points of detonation) being destroyed by British-born Islamic terrorists.

How did your “local Muslim leaders and groups” react? They claimed that Britain’s foreign policy is responsible for the terror alert. Members of Britain’s Muslim religious, social and political organisations made their opinions known in a letter, addressed to the prime minister signed by MPs Sadiq Khan, Shahid Malik and Mohammed Sarwar, peers Lord Patel of Blackburn, Lord Ahmen of Rotherham and Baroness Uddin and 38 groups including the Muslim Association of Britain, the British Muslim Forum, the Muslim Council of Britain and the Muslim Parliament of Great Britain. It calls for an urgent revision of UK foreign policy.

It calls the Iraqi war a “debacle” and says that the failure to end attacks on civilians in the Middle East, such as the current fighting in Lebanon, is making the UK a threat to extremists.

Understandably their collective opinions on the link between terrorism and foreign policy were described as facile by the government. Juninho, do you seriously believe that a citizen?s loathing of his government’s foreign policy gives him the right to strap explosives to himself and go out and murder innocent people? Do you believe that “extremists” should be appeased in order to avert the potential threat they pose? Do you recall Neville Chamberlain?

So, do your “Muslim leaders and groups denounce any act of killing as being un-Islamic”? Do they publicly condemn the jihadists’ train bombings in Mumbai? In Madrid? Do they speak out against the rockets falling on Haifa? Do they criticise the Islamic Courts in Somalia?

No, they rather attempt to justify the jihadists and lay the blame on policies they personally or politically don’t like.

18

What you guys are unable to understand is that guys like coolexec and company want to group the entire Muslim world, into one big bundle for easy, guiltless extermination. There is no other reason for posting these types of things over and over again. Bin Laden, Hitler and co did the same thing. You label a group, marginalize it and then try to kill them all. What you are trying to do is label all Muslims as Islamo-facists to make this easier on yourselves.

And yes, the Sudanese are complete assholes for perpetrating the genocid on Christians and others, so is the Saudi government for not allowing any opposition to their government. So Was Saddam Hussein for Killing thousands of his own people. But over 40,000 Iraqi’s dead doesn’t bother you guys at all. It is not the fault of the people for the governments that have been thrust upon them after WW1 and 19th century colonialism are mostly dictatorial. Most of these were friendly to the west, barring those countries that have had a revolution of some sort.

If any of you were to attent Friday sermons, you’d hear the weekly condemnation of terrorism and taking of innocent lives, and the responsibility towards peace, yet over and over we get these racists come out and say that most Muslims are terrorsts. I’m hearing statistics of 70%, which is amazing, that would mean you have over 700 million terrorsts running around blowing shit up. How absolutely stupid can you be to believe that stuff?

If you preach this stuff against Israel, it’s Anti-Semitic. If you preach this against Muslims, it’s patriotism.

19

[quote]I’m not sure what the point of this post was. I’m not disputing that most terrorist attacks are currently carried out by Muslim groups. I question the relevance of that to this discussion though.

Sorry, you’ve confused me.
[/quote]

I know, that isn’t to hard to do.

I am saying hearing some denunciation of violent act by mulsims would be nice and would go a looooong way into bridging the gap that now exists. I have yet to hear one public denunciation of violence commited against non-muslims.

Also, I did not pick the percentage completely out of thin air. It wasn’t wholly accurate either, but close. It was some poll conducted by either reuters or the ap in the middle east a couple of years ago. Though you are right, they are not trust worthy source, they probably picked the numbers out of thin air.

20

[quote]Wreckless wrote:
coolexec wrote:
A lot.

I’m not a Muslim, so I won’t answer your question. I’ve got a question for you though.

(1) When did you demonstrate against the human rights violations in Abu Ghraib and Guantanamo?

What’s that? You don’t think you’re responsible for that?
Or worse perhaps, you thought they had it coming.
Well, that’s rather funny considering you hold every Muslim reponsible for everything any Muslim ever did.
Talk about double standard eh.

(2) Who do you considere Palestinian terrorists? Where did you learn that only one of them is Christian?

(3) What are you saying Coolexec? The US has a number of Muslim countries they consider to be allies. None of them is free? Why is that? Perhaps the US (and the West in general) is more concerned with promoting easy access to the oil instead of promoting freedom and democracy in the area.

(4) Christians in the name Christ, freedom and pure greed did their fair share of killing. You seem to forget that.

(5) Christians and Jews have lived in peace in Islamic countries for centuries. Only after WWII did we see a change in attitude. Let’s not forget it was the Christian Germans that murdered millions of Jews.

A rather big part of Christianity seems to be stuck in the dark ages also.
Like Marx said: religion is opium for the people.
Every religion has it’s fanatics, comiting attrocities in the name of their deity.
Why do you single out the Muslims Coolexec? Hmmm?[/quote]

I’ll try answer you:

(1) When did you demonstrate against the human rights violations in Abu Ghraib and Guantanamo?

Interesting point. There were abuses at Abu Ghraib. They were exposed. An internal investigation by the United States Army commenced in January 2004, and reports of the abuse, as well as graphic pictures showing American military personnel in the act of abusing prisoners, came to public attention in April 2004, when a 60 Minutes news report and an article by Seymour M. Hersh (a Jew) reported the story.
The resulting political scandal damaged the credibility and public image of the United States and its allies in the prosecution of ongoing military operations in the Iraq War.
The U.S. Department of Defense removed seventeen soldiers and officers from duty, and seven soldiers were charged with dereliction of duty, maltreatment, aggravated assault, and battery. Between May 2004 and September 2005, seven soldiers were convicted in courts martial, sentenced to federal prison time, and dishonorably discharged from service. Two soldiers, Specialist Charles Graner, and his former fianc?e, Pvt. Lynndie England, were sentenced to ten years and three years in prison, respectively, in trials ending on January 14, 2005 and September 26, 2005. The commanding officer at the prison, Brig. General Janis Karpinski, was demoted to the rank of colonel on May 5, 2005.
This is how democracies deal with abuses of Human Rights. The Muslims, on the other hand, would have plastered pictures of Lynndie England and Charles Graner in their pantheon. They would have been heroes of the Jihad.

(2) Who do you considere Palestinian terrorists? Where did you learn that only one of them is Christian?

Come on Wreckless, even you know it’s true! There has never been a Christian suicide bomber.

(3) What are you saying Coolexec? The US has a number of Muslim countries they consider to be allies. None of them is free? Why is that? Perhaps the US (and the West in general) is more concerned with promoting easy access to the oil instead of promoting freedom and democracy in the area.

I’m not commenting on US foreign policy and agree that you may have a point there.

(4) Christians in the name Christ, freedom and pure greed did their fair share of killing. You seem to forget that.

The point is not that Christians have killed. Sure they have. The issue here is killing FOR Christ and to increase the ‘Christian Empire’ (were there one). This has not happened for a very long time. The Muslims are killing FOR Allah and Mohammed, his prophet, and to restore the Caliphate before conquering the world.

(5) Christians and Jews have lived in peace in Islamic countries for centuries. Only after WWII did we see a change in attitude. Let’s not forget it was the Christian Germans that murdered millions of Jews.

This is complete and utter nonsense and unworthy of a response.