Questions About Peri-Workout Nutrition

Training
121

PROTOCOL 1 (1 priority workout per week)
Workout - 60 = Alpha-GPC
W - 40 = 1 FINiBAR
W - 30 = 2 scoops Surge Workout Fuel
W - 15 = 2 scoops Surge Recovery
During workout (early half) = 1 FINiBAR
During workout (later half) = 1 scoop Surge Workout Fuel
W plus 15 = Grow! Whey 2 scoops
W plus 90 minutes = Grow! Whey 2 scoops

PROTOCOL 2 (Other workouts)
Workout - 60 = Alpha-GPC
W - 40 = 1 FINiBAR
W - 30 = 2 scoops Surge Workout Fuel
During workout (early half) = 1 FINiBAR
During workout (later half) = 1 scoop Surge Workout Fuel
W plus 15 = 1 scoop Surge Recovery, 1 scoop Grow! Whey
W plus 90 = Grow! Whey 2 scoops

Protocol 3 (Metabolic Days)
W - 30 = 1 scoop SURGE WORKOUT FUEL
W plus 1 = 5 g Leucine
W plus 11 = 30 g Hydrolsate Whey

Coach -

I am following your Get Jacked Fast program to optimize fat loss and was wondering how to best incorporate AA/Protein Pulsing into it while working out first thing in the morning (45 - 60 minutes after waking).

I was thinking of Protocol 1 once per week, Protocol 2 on other lifting days, Protocol 3 on Metabolic Days and a low protein day on my Off Day (with protein only in last two meals).

Question 1: Does this seem appropriate?

Any insight you might be able to lend would be most appreciated.

Also, with regard to the other meals, any general guidelines to adjust the schedule / protocol on the lifting days? I was thinking of perhaps eliminating the AM and PM snacks and then replacing one of the remaining meals (Breakfast, Lunch, Supper or Pre Bed) with a 30g WH plus 5 g Leucine Pulse and keeping the other 3 meals as detailed in the plan.

Question 2: Would you recommend something different for optimal results?

Question 3: Any suggestions for how to handle the elliptical interval day?

PS - To Tim and the Biotest brass, let’s get working on that Camaro request for Coach Thib and much thanks for the FINiBAR price reduction (though I was one day too early on my order of supplements to take advantage of it this time around, next time I am sure I will appreciate it)

122

PPS stands for Phosphatidyl Serine.

123

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

Upon wakng up: PULSE
30 minutes later: Breakfast

40 minutes before workout: 1 FINIBAR
30 minutes before workout: 2 scoops Workout Fuel
15 minutes before workout: 1 scoop RECOVERY
During workout: casein hydrolysate, 2 scoops
60 minutes after workout SURGE RECOVERY 1 scoop, CH 1 scoop

60 minutes after solid meal

40 minutes before workout: 1 FINIBAR
30 minutes before workout: 2 scoops Workout Fuel
15 minutes before workout: 1 scoop RECOVERY
During workout: casein hydrolysate, 2 scoops
60 minutes after workout, CH 1 scoop

60 minutes after solid meal
[/quote]

Thibs, for the ‘during workout’, exactly how many grams of protein is 2 scoops of casein hydrolysate? I am thinking 40 grams from what you have recently been discussing about CH, but wanted to be sure.

thanks again

124

Hey Coach,

Awesome thread. I truly appreciate all the work and advice you put into this site. My question is regarding the priority and timing of the compounds in this protocol. Specifically, I am currently at the end of a two month cutting phase (one week left), which has gotten me into me best conditioning to date and will soon be ready to start gaining mass again.

However, due to the very low-carb approach I am taking (the only carbs I am getting are from broccoli, spinach, and nuts), I am a little concerned with how I would transition into the strategy outlined in this thread:

AS previously stated, this is a LOT of calories, and a decent amount of carbs, especially when coming from a VLCD approach. I am planning to add one ‘element’ of this protocol per week over the course of 4-6 weeks in order to ease into it, while leaving all other dietary variables the same as they are today (to start off anyway). Do you think this is a sound strategy, and if so, what order would you recommend adding them in?

Thank you again,

DT

125

Oh yeah


I am currently using the para-workout protocol outlined in your “Refined Physique Transformation” article:

Figured it would help to know where I am coming from.

Thanks,
DT

126

[quote]Dan Thompson wrote:
Oh yeah


I am currently using the para-workout protocol outlined in your “Refined Physique Transformation” article:

Pre-Workout (30 minutes prior)
5g glutamine
5g creatine
5g BCAA
Half scoop of whey isolate

During-Workout
40g BCAA
10g glutamine

Post-Workout
40g glutamine
15g leucine
1.5 scoops of whey isolate

Figured it would help to know where I am coming from.

Thanks,
DT
[/quote]

Ohhh, I think they’ve already moved on to the next big thing. That BCAA is no good anymore. Sorry


127

[quote]PerformanceOne wrote:
Hey Coach,

I have two questions (which you probably have answered before) that I can not find the specific answer to:

  1. Would you recommend the same para-workout protocol for someone who is cutting?

  2. If yes, would you recommend using this protocol with a ketogenic diet?
    [/quote]

  3. I would probably keep the same general idea, but lower the carbs ‘a bit’, but not drop them completely.

  4. Using this protocol a ketogenic diet would make it a non-ketogenic diet! But yeah going low-carbs for the whole day except for the protocol is super effective due to an increase in insulin sensitivity.

128

[quote]pflifter wrote:
CT,

If you are making your own pre-post workout drinks due to budget restrictions, what carbohydrate source would you use? Typcially I’ve been using 8oz of 100% cranberry juice and then the rest coming from a blend of dextrose and maltodetrin.

Thanks, [/quote]

Listen, any ‘fast absorbed’ or ‘high glycemic’ carb source will do when it comes to jacking up insulin pre-workout, but rice oligodextrin and palatinose have properties ways outside the scope of regular carbs.

We tend to see protein as being super complex and carbs as super simple. Well, let me tell you this, carb science can actually be more complex than protein science.

129

[quote]LilDaDDyDreW wrote:
What does PPS stand for?[/quote]

phosphatidylserine

130

[quote]Professor Chaos wrote:
Christian,

What exactly is Anaconda? What makes this particular casein hydrolysate blend so special?[/quote]

Hydrolysate means that the product is broken down in peptides, di ans tripeptides. I’m not part of the design team, but my guess would be in what peptides, di and tripeptides the product is being broken down into.

Furthermore Anaconda as a ton more ingredients than only casein hydrolysate.

[quote]Professor Chaos wrote:
Why doesn’t Tim just release it at a high price like Workout Fuel? [/quote]

Because the cost of making workout fuel is low compared the cost of making anaconda, and the profit margin from workou fuel is already minimal.

Ra[quote]Professor Chaos wrote:ndom Question: What do you eat for breakfast on your new, insulin-resistance, low carb diet? I read in one of Poliquin’s Q&A columns that eggs every day results in an allergy to them. What do you think?

Thank you,
Doug [/quote]

I never liked eggs, so that’s not a huge problem for me.

I’m not on a low-carbs diet anymore either.

I pulse with Anaconda upon waking up and have 1 FINiBARS 30 minutes later

131

[quote]holguint123 wrote:
When it comes to beta alanine supplementation, should one use it right before/during a workout, in addition to throughout the day? Or does para-workout timing not matter with beta alanine? Thanks![/quote]

Although research has not shown it yet, there seems to be an acute/immediate effect with Beta-alanine. So yeah, I take it pre-workout.

132

[quote]Italiano wrote:
Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

Upon wakng up: PULSE
30 minutes later: Breakfast

40 minutes before workout: 1 FINIBAR
30 minutes before workout: 2 scoops Workout Fuel
15 minutes before workout: 1 scoop RECOVERY
During workout: casein hydrolysate, 2 scoops
60 minutes after workout SURGE RECOVERY 1 scoop, CH 1 scoop

60 minutes after solid meal

40 minutes before workout: 1 FINIBAR
30 minutes before workout: 2 scoops Workout Fuel
15 minutes before workout: 1 scoop RECOVERY
During workout: casein hydrolysate, 2 scoops
60 minutes after workout, CH 1 scoop

60 minutes after solid meal

Thibs, for the ‘during workout’, exactly how many grams of protein is 2 scoops of casein hydrolysate? I am thinking 40 grams from what you have recently been discussing about CH, but wanted to be sure.

thanks again[/quote]

around 28-35g

133

Christian,

Every politician counts an actual letter or even text message regarding some political viewpoint as around 1,000 voters due to some basic statistics/polls done on the frequency that someone actually writes if they have a problem.

So, I propose we start a petition to Tim to release Anaconda. If nothing else, it would appeal to us older folks who have more income and need more help in the weight room.

You’ll find it in the supplements section.

134

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:
PerformanceOne wrote:
Hey Coach,

I have two questions (which you probably have answered before) that I can not find the specific answer to:

  1. Would you recommend the same para-workout protocol for someone who is cutting?

  2. If yes, would you recommend using this protocol with a ketogenic diet?

  3. I would probably keep the same general idea, but lower the carbs ‘a bit’, but not drop them completely.

  4. Using this protocol a ketogenic diet would make it a non-ketogenic diet! But yeah going low-carbs for the whole day except for the protocol is super effective due to an increase in insulin sensitivity.[/quote]

Thanks Coach, much appreciated.

135

[quote]fightnews10 wrote:

Ohhh, I think they’ve already moved on to the next big thing. That BCAA is no good anymore. Sorry
[/quote]

You’re telling me! I just ordered another tub of BCAA powder big enough to sustain a small country and then I stumbled upon this thread and all I can think is “How the hell am I going to afford all of those FINiBars?”

Seriously though, the rate that nutritional recommendations changes is incredible. However, considering that I have made some pretty impressive progress using the aforementioned BCAA/Glutamine/Creatine stack, I am not too worried about it.

I do however want to give this new protocol a try and seeing as how I really do not like carbs I figure that incorporating it into my current dietary plan would allow me to seamlessly transition from cutting to mass building quite nicely. So the question still remains


What’s the best way to transition into this from a VLCD para-workout approach? I would assume it’s best to start by adding the ‘during’ elements, then the ‘after,’ and finally the ‘pre’ in order to make the smoothest transition. Any thoughts?

136

Thibs, what is the most effective ratio of rice oligodextrin, palatinose, and d-glucose if these carbs were to be taken, if you didn’t have Workout Fuel on hand yet?
Two scoops of Surge Workout Fuel has 42g carbs so as an estimated guess I am thinking maybe 18g rice oligodextrin, 18g platinose, 6g d-glucose?
Thanks

137

Ok so if you’re using BCAA the best time to take them would be with your pre workout drink correct? That would be better then during?

138

Thibs,
This seems like an awful lot of water to consume. Are you sticking with the label recommendations for water, or reducing them?

Thanks.

139

Hi Coach,
Someone from the Steroid forum advice me to checkout your forum discussing amino acid & insulin pulsing. With some minor adjustment, I am very surprise to see that I am somewhat close to what is being recommended in the forum. A short introduction is probably in order.

I am on the 4th week of an 8 week cycle of Test Enanthate 500 mg per week. For more information on my cycle you can click on the link below:

I have been following Poliquin’s recommendation on BCAA. It sounds like my BCAA protocol is old news now.

Does this look reasonable to you?

Meal 1 (6AM) - 2 scoop Biotest Metabolic Drive low carb protein, 5 caps BCAA, MV, 8 caps Oil Capsule, 1 tbsp Flax oil.
Meal 2 (7:30AM) - Meat (Grilled beef or Chicken), 3 HB eggs, coffee, green tea.
Meal 3 (10:30AM) - 2 scoop Biotest Metabolic Drive low carb protein, 1 tbsp Flax oil.
Meal 4 (12:30PM) - Meat (Grilled beef or Chicken or Fish), 3 HB eggs, Spinach with Balsamic Vinaigrette dressing, diet soda.
Meal 5 (3PM) - 2 scoop Biotest Metabolic Drive low carb protein, 1 tbsp Flax oil.

If working out:
Pre-Workout(4:15PM) - 30 minutes prior to working out ingest 10 caps Biotest BCAA and 2 scoops Biotest Workout Fuel
Peri-Workout (4:45PM) - 16 caps BCAA and 1 scoop Biotest Surge Recovery.
Post-Workout (6:15PM) - Post workout shake containing: 1 scoop Biotest Surge Recovery, 1 scoop Biotest Metabolic Drive low carb protein, Leucine, glycine, glutamine.

Meal 6 (7:30PM) - Meat (Grilled beef or Chicken or Fish), diet soda, 8 caps Oil Capsule, MV.

Thanks coach

140

[quote]fightnews10 wrote:
Ok so if you’re using BCAA the best time to take them would be with your pre workout drink correct? That would be better then during?[/quote]

It would be 30-45 minutes before the workout.