As far as buying the book vs not buying the book…I think Alpha said it best in his training log…
-Another note on that…Invest in knowledge. Don’t ask 1,000 stupid questions that could all be answered by spending $20 bucks on a book with ALL of the answers (5/3/1, Precision nutrition, Starting Strength). If you can’t afford it, send me a PM about why – if I can’t use my brain to figure out a way for you to earn $20, I’ll send you the money myself! - There are no free lunches, and you will have to work hard and earn every bit you get. If it was easy-everyone would do it! A new you does not come in 6 easy installments of $19.95!
[quote]vali wrote:
I wouldn’t recommend 5 3 1 for a beginner- first off increases are only once a month and second it stresses rep maxes over regular weight increases.[/quote]
So adding 120 pounds to squat and deadlift numbers, and 60 pounds to bench and press numbers a year is too slow?
[/quote]
Absolutely. Both my squat and deadlift went from 95 to 325 and 405 respectively for 2rm within my first 8 months of training. If I had chosen 5/3/1 at that particular time I would have just been repping both below 200.
I didn’t really know any better so I just decided to throw 10, sometimes 20lbs extra on the bar most weeks.
Now, I’d be thrilled with 120/60lbs a year, but not as a rank beginner. That’s just too slow. [/quote]
well then you are the exception to the rule. Most do not have those gains in such a short period of time.[/quote]
I find that hard to believe considering I was training in a commercial gym just 3x/week following Nate Green’s “Built for Show” of all programs…lol. Right from the beginning I had a solid trainer who first and foremost taught me the importance of mobility, soft tissue work, etc. He programmed a personalized dynamic warm up for me before an actual strength program so I think I can attribute alot of my rapid gains to that perhaps?
There is really nothing to say you can’t make adjustments if you are a total noob.
you could re-evaluate your 1RM every 2nd wave and work off a higher number
maybe ditch the 90% of 1RM rule
Do your 5/3/1 with an extra ‘heavy’ single in week 3 which progressively increases 10 to 20 lbs each month until you get to that magical 200 bench, 300 squat, 400 dead goal.
I realise this isn’t THE program, but it would solve the total noob problem. It would teach programming and goal setting from the go … which is something most new lifters lack.
[quote]vali wrote:
I wouldn’t recommend 5 3 1 for a beginner- first off increases are only once a month and second it stresses rep maxes over regular weight increases.[/quote]
So adding 120 pounds to squat and deadlift numbers, and 60 pounds to bench and press numbers a year is too slow?
[/quote]
Absolutely. Both my squat and deadlift went from 95 to 325 and 405 respectively for 2rm within my first 8 months of training. If I had chosen 5/3/1 at that particular time I would have just been repping both below 200.
I didn’t really know any better so I just decided to throw 10, sometimes 20lbs extra on the bar most weeks.
Now, I’d be thrilled with 120/60lbs a year, but not as a rank beginner. That’s just too slow. [/quote]
well then you are the exception to the rule. Most do not have those gains in such a short period of time.[/quote]
This may hit a nerve but most people would be a lot stronger if they gained some balls. Not to say said gain is bad … I wouldn’t be too pleased either if my bench only went up 60 lbs in a year from a complete beginner.
It’s not really about being an exception, it is about really wanting to move forward and being a little self absorbed.
I don’t have the link here, but in one of his “blood and chalk” episodes Jim recommended a full body routine for the rank beginner. basically doing 5/3/1 on two movements and doing the other 2 movements as assistance exercises (boring but big style) . his main point being that they still need to master proper form, and will be using small enough weights the full body routine won’t burn them out like it would someone using heavier weights.
as for the noob gains, in 6 months of being a total idiot i went from benching 115 to 205, and squating 135 to 275. Then i stalled out completely until i gave up (lame i know)… 3 years later i am back and i bought a few good books instead of trying to sort through the stacks of internet material available. that being said there are lots of ways someone could use 531 and still make beginner gains. Could up the RM by twice as much every month (ie 10 instead of 5, and 20 instead of 10) until you stall out, then restart and only up the gains by the recommended amount. A noob can easily skip the deload weeks. Or they could cram 2 weeks of training into 1. All of these would work for a short while (while the weights are still small) without burning out. Then when you are burnt out do a deload week and start the program as written.
[quote]vali wrote:
I wouldn’t recommend 5 3 1 for a beginner- first off increases are only once a month and second it stresses rep maxes over regular weight increases.[/quote]
So adding 120 pounds to squat and deadlift numbers, and 60 pounds to bench and press numbers a year is too slow?
[/quote]
Absolutely. Both my squat and deadlift went from 95 to 325 and 405 respectively for 2rm within my first 8 months of training. If I had chosen 5/3/1 at that particular time I would have just been repping both below 200.
I didn’t really know any better so I just decided to throw 10, sometimes 20lbs extra on the bar most weeks.
Now, I’d be thrilled with 120/60lbs a year, but not as a rank beginner. That’s just too slow. [/quote]
well then you are the exception to the rule. Most do not have those gains in such a short period of time.[/quote]
This may hit a nerve but most people would be a lot stronger if they gained some balls. Not to say said gain is bad … I wouldn’t be too pleased either if my bench only went up 60 lbs in a year from a complete beginner.
It’s not really about being an exception, it is about really wanting to move forward and being a little self absorbed.
[/quote]
I’m just thankful I wasn’t reading TNation at that time. I may have gotten the impression that I need to slow things down a bit to 5/10lbs a month or else I might hurt myself.
[quote]jskrabac wrote:
Absolutely. Both my squat and deadlift went from 95 to 325 and 405 respectively for 2rm within my first 8 months of training. If I had chosen 5/3/1 at that particular time I would have just been repping both below 200.
I didn’t really know any better so I just decided to throw 10, sometimes 20lbs extra on the bar most weeks.
Now, I’d be thrilled with 120/60lbs a year, but not as a rank beginner. That’s just too slow. [/quote]
well then you are the exception to the rule. Most do not have those gains in such a short period of time.[/quote]
I think making these gains depends on a lot of different issues that we summarize by saying “Newb.”
I had crazy gains in strength myself but I also started lifting weights when I was 14 years old so to name a few: puberty, tons of free time, ate food like it was my job, lifted twice per day, had goals of being a huge ass line backer. I can remember drinking a liter of chocolate milk while I was lifting so I would have the calories to GFH(Get F*cking Huge) as I use to say.
Like someone has said in this thread already, you can make huge gains as a Newb unless you put a cap on your strength and say, “I am shooting for a 60# gain in bench this year.” that sh*t will hold a you back.
[quote]GluteStrength wrote:
Okay, so apparently nobody read the part where it say’s I’M NOT NEW TO LIFTING, JUST NEW TO 5/3/1.
Anyway, where can I buy this magical book at?[/quote]
Who’s talking about you?
[quote]GluteStrength wrote:
I’m not a beginner to lifting weights, I’m just a beginner doing the 5/3/1 program. Anyway, this program is extremely simplistic and I was overthinking my original question, which I already had answered for me. Thanks anyway guys.[/quote]
You mean ^this^ post where you get pissy and give posters a sarcastic “thanks anyways?”
I figured the thread was over and we could talk about something worth while besides a cheap guy that doesn’t want to buy a $20 book.
And if you want to buy the book I have a couple options for you:
1)Go to page 1 where someone already posted a link to it.
2)Do a Google search for it.