Thanks for the suggestions.
Not expecting/needing anything from TC in terms of threads, was just hoping he would respond to this one. He asked in the beginning for feedback and got it. Just a little something to see if he “got it”.
Why am I still awake?
[quote]OctoberGirl wrote:
Bratt wrote:
Yes! And several long time members have come back and started threads. Lurking women are coming forward and posting. Many good things are happening. All the more reason to keep this thread positive and why I get so frustrated when it is made to seem that the women are just whining.
Thanks, OG, for the post about laroyal’s thread in the t-cell. I PM’d him some thoughts on the subject. However, I’m thinking we should should have that thread here in Powerful Women where it would be open to a great deal more input. T-Cell is very limited in numbers and it’s main focus is bodybuilding and therefore, perhaps bodybuilding training would be mostly the focus of any discussion? I guess we should see what comes of his thread first?
Bad Bratt! Off topic! Me tired. Me go sleep now.
Well that was my intention when I asked laroyal to start the thread.
I thought if it started in the T-Cell it wouldn’t be filled with some of the no-goods that just would be throwing in some junk.
And… this doesn’t mean the women can’t start their own thread about their training questions.
You may want to consider starting a thread in the main forums though if you want a larger audience. Some of the guys don’t check the women’s forums and it’s because sometimes they just don’t feel welcome and sometimes it is too filled up with just cheerleading.
Just do it, just start the threads you want. I don’t know if you need to have TC do it for you. He has already stepped up and done a great job fulfilling the PI request.
[/quote]
Exactly!
If we have questions and can’t post them in Tcell just open a thread here in responce. It’s been done before in responce to Tcell threads…
As far as TC publicly responding… why? He already said what he was doing as far as PIs and getting some interviews plus he said he was going to watch this thread. From what I saw those were the main things most women asked about. What kind of responce are you looking for exactly?
Yes Bratt, I am really unsure of what you are asking for.
This site took a wrong turn regarding woman and as far as I can tell, they are attempting to fix it.
Women won’t ever be given as much time and energy due to the simple fact that there are fewer of us. Plus, the majority of our training issues are the same as the men’s.
And roundastar is correct. This issue has been responded to by TC, just not in this exact thread… TC doesn’t respond to most threads, so I don’t see the big deal.
[quote]Christine wrote:
Yes Bratt, I am really unsure of what you are asking for.
This site took a wrong turn regarding woman and as far as I can tell, they are attempting to fix it.
Women won’t ever be given as much time and energy due to the simple fact that there are fewer of us. Plus, the majority of our training issues are the same as the men’s.
And roundastar is correct. This issue has been responded to by TC, just not in this exact thread… TC doesn’t respond to most threads, so I don’t see the big deal.
[/quote]
I also think that men are the ones who spend the majority of money on the BodyBuilding supps such as the protein powders, Alpha Male and Creatine. Not that women don’t but unfortunately the majority of money spent on “lose weight fast” schemes are women which isn’t a product of Biotest.
Men pay the bills although the site has shown that although they pay attention to the bottom line, they are also considerate of the site members.
I do look forward to seeing what happens.
That and I really liked that link Jillybop send to Rainjack in the Women Training thread in the T-Cell. “Fun with Women”. great article.
EDIT:
Also, I read all the articles including the ones on FigureAthlete. I take what I can use or find interesting and try them out.
I’m sure you know this but not every program works for everyone so just because a program is intended for women doesn’t automatically mean it will give you the results you want.
[quote]rondastarr wrote:
Exactly!
If we have questions and can’t post them in Tcell just open a thread here in responce. It’s been done before in responce to Tcell threads…[/quote]
Again not sure why this seems to be directed at me by both you and OG as I already obviously get that since that is how and why this thread was started by me in the first place! Perhaps I am misunderstanding and it is not directed at me and you are just sharing your opinions?
Maybe you misunderstood… I was NOT criticizing OG or Laroyale for starting the thread in the T-Cell OR suggesting that It should ONLY be here. I was suggesting it could be here TOO.
[quote]Christine wrote:
Women won’t ever be given as much time and energy due to the simple fact that there are fewer of us. Plus, the majority of our training issues are the same as the men’s.
[/quote]
I think every woman who has posted here, including myself, has already made it quite clear that we get that. I don’t understand why that keeps getting brought up as though we don’t. Old habits and misunderstandings die hard? In all my reading on the subject I honestly only ran across ONE female who wanted more than just a little consideration. They wanted equal time/content. ONLY ONE! Yet they seem to be the one stuck in everyone’s mind.
[quote]Christine wrote:
And roundastar is correct. This issue has been responed to by TC, just not in this exact thread… TC doens’t respond to most threads, so I don’t see the big deal.
[/quote]
I must have missed his response elsewhere. Yes, actions speak louder than words, and I have seen the things that have been done in response. I acknowledged that.
I’m not making a big deal about TC responding here I just said I wished he would. I guess… maybe, in my mind I was thinking of closure. He posted in the opening of the topic and a post by him about now, when the subject seems to be pretty much covered would be an end to it. Not literally but symbolically.
Plus he said he wanted to understand and hear what we had to say, one would think a simple thank you to those who took the time would be common sense and good manners. I respect him and based on what I have seen of him and his character it just seemed like he WOULD do that. If he doesn’t NO BIG DEAL. I’m certainly not going to lose sleep over it or judge or bad mouth him or stop coming here anything like that.
I was frustrated with some of the men coming into the thread and the things they said and mentioned TC in regards to that. I thought I was pretty clear what I meant by that. That it was their (TC and Tim’s) consideration I was looking for with this thread. That’s all.
To LightsOutLuthor
My post in response to your posts held NO hate. When I get frustrated I get vehement and swear a lot. But it truly is just frustration, not hate. A little pissed, not ANGRY! And I was responding to you AND past comments by others. I should have added that I think I get what you were trying to say which is that you are against segregation. You feel it weakens the place and we all lose out.
I agree and I don’t think anyone here was wanting that. We don’t want more separate sections and some are in fact fighting to not be pushed out to a completely different site (Figure Athlete) because we feel the same way you do! IMHO there are just enough categories/sections to make sense and we don’t need many, if any, more. If you followed the link posted by OctoberGirl previously you would see that it is not the first time the women felt like they were being pushed out. Another time was when Muscle With Attitude was launched.
This time was when Figure Athlete was launched. The first time was by the company. This time it felt more like some men who wanted us to go play over there and get out of their playground here. I KNOW you are not one of them. I get that you feel we should all play together, not separately. I respect that you maintained a level head and continued to try and make your point clear (finish what you started) when misunderstood.
PHEW!
I can see how this may never end. LOL This forum stuff and communicating with just words is HARD WORK! I’m still learning.
[quote]Bratt wrote:
rondastarr wrote:
Exactly!
If we have questions and can’t post them in Tcell just open a thread here in responce. It’s been done before in responce to Tcell threads…
Again not sure why this seems to be directed at me by both you and OG as I already obviously get that since that is how and why this thread was started by me in the first place! Perhaps I am misunderstanding and it is not directed at me and you are just sharing your opinions?
Maybe you misunderstood… I was NOT criticizing OG or Laroyale for starting the thread in the T-Cell OR suggesting that It should ONLY be here. I was suggesting it could be here TOO.
[/quote]
The reason it was directed at you was because you posted this :
[quote]Bratt wrote:
However, I’m thinking we should should have that thread here in Powerful Women where it would be open to a great deal more input. T-Cell is very limited in numbers and it’s main focus is bodybuilding and therefore, perhaps bodybuilding training would be mostly the focus of any discussion? I guess we should see what comes of his thread first?
[/quote]
Again, there doesn’t need to be a special thread opened here for the topic unless someone has questions. Then that person, if they are not in Tcell or even if they are, can choose to open a thread to ask their questions. So basicly what I am saying is if you want the thread here, copy, paste and put it here and ask all the questions you want.
[quote]Bratt wrote:
Again not sure why this seems to be directed at me by both you and OG as I already obviously get that since that is how and why this thread was started by me in the first place! Perhaps I am misunderstanding and it is not directed at me and you are just sharing your opinions? [/quote]
Mine was somewhat directed at you as you are the OP. But it also is just part of the discussion.
[quote]I’m not making a big deal about TC responding here I just said I wished he would. I guess… maybe, in my mind I was thinking of closure. He posted in the opening of the topic and a post by him about now, when the subject seems to be pretty much covered would be an end to it. Not literally but symbolically.
Plus he said he wanted to understand and hear what we had to say, one would think a simple thank you to those who took the time would be common sense and good manners. I respect him and based on what I have seen of him and his character it just seemed like he WOULD do that. If he doesn’t NO BIG DEAL. I’m certainly not going to lose sleep over it or judge or bad mouth him or stop coming here anything like that.[/quote]
I don’t see this as having anything to do with manners and I hope you don’t mean that because that was a bit of a snarky comment. I am sure you didn’t mean it that way.
I don’t need closure. I’m not dating the website.
[quote]
I agree and I don’t think anyone here was wanting that. We don’t want more separate sections and some are in fact fighting to not be pushed out to a completely different site (Figure Athlete) because we feel the same way you do! IMHO there are just enough categories/sections to make sense and we don’t need many, if any, more. If you followed the link posted by OctoberGirl previously you would see that it is not the first time the women felt like they were being pushed out. Another time was when Muscle With Attitude was launched. [/quote]
The only reason I had started a previous thread in protest for women was when we were moved off-site completely. You weren’t here then so you probably are unaware that the women’s forum had been moved off-site. I started a thread to bring it back.
But I also don’t want you to take it as an attack.
This is just a discussion, batting ideas around.
We need both sides, all sides, who am I kidding? Very rarely is it only two sides right?
[quote]LightsOutLuthor wrote:
Yo Momma wrote:
LightsOutLuthor wrote:
If you lift like men, why separate yourself from the men?
Same reason there is an Over 35 Forum.
Some training issues are different for those of us who are over 35. Some non-training issues are different, too. Have you seen all the TRT threads in that forum? Why would a young man like yourself be interested in going into that forum?
Yeah, I’m old so I go into that forum, but I’m also female, and interested in Strength Sports, so I come here, too. Because there are female only issues, like training through a heavy period, or pregnancy, that have no place for someone without a vagina.
Do you REALLY want to discuss bra rash, or how the hell to get a bench shirt over a pair of D-cup breasts?
No, I get that. I can say I DO NOT wanna talk bra rash (though I can tell you Gold Bond powder helps)…
My point is: Does there need to be
a MENS powerlifting thread, and a womens
a MENS strength sports, and a womans.
a MENs powerful image, and a womans?
My opinion is if 85% of the posts in the strength sports thread (for example) apply to men and women - GO RIGHT AHEAD and post a thread pertaining to a women-specific issue. But don’t go sequestering yourselves in a specific thread.
Cuz guess what will happen? You’ll stay there, we’ll stay in our corner, and all those ‘common ground’ subjects? I’ll never see those you put in, and you’ll never see mine. And that’s a shame.
It’s the same issue of creating a bunch of cells (like someone wanted a “former fat boy” cell). You split up or identify yourself by all these ‘subgroups’, the logical limit to that is we all have a single thread we belong to. Guess what - that sucks.[/quote]
I think you missed the point where we wanted to be portrayed on her as something more than a figure athlete. Wanted to be shown as powerful along with the men, not as an after thought all the time.
Yes, we train the same, most of the time. But how many times have you seen a female in the Powerful Image section? How about interviewed for strength type articles ect? That is where my problem was. As well as some comments I got from the I am afraid to eat group that has shown up on this site…
Now, as far as Men posting over here - - I welcome them. There input, critques and all.
[quote]rondastarr wrote:
Exactly!
If we have questions and can’t post them in Tcell just open a thread here in responce. It’s been done before in responce to Tcell threads…
Bratt wrote:
Again not sure why this seems to be directed at me by both you and OG as I already obviously get that since that is how and why this thread was started by me in the first place! Perhaps I am misunderstanding and it is not directed at me and you are just sharing your opinions?
Maybe you misunderstood… I was NOT criticizing OG or Laroyale for starting the thread in the T-Cell OR suggesting that It should ONLY be here. I was suggesting it could be here TOO.
rondastarr wrote:
The reason it was directed at you was because you posted this :
Bratt wrote:
However, I’m thinking we should should have that thread here in Powerful Women where it would be open to a great deal more input. T-Cell is very limited in numbers and it’s main focus is bodybuilding and therefore, perhaps bodybuilding training would be mostly the focus of any discussion? I guess we should see what comes of his thread first? [/quote]
[quote]rondastarr wrote:
Again, there doesn’t need to be a special thread opened here for the topic unless someone has questions. [/quote]
I disagree. Another reason for the thread to be somewhere other than the T-Cell is so that other trainers or trainees who are not part of the T-Cell can ANSWER questions. People outside of the T-Cell do have valuable experience and input.
[quote]rondastarr wrote:
Then that person, if they are not in Tcell or even if they are, can choose to open a thread to ask their questions. So basicly what I am saying is if you want the thread here, copy, paste and put it here and ask all the questions you want.[/quote]
[quote]Firebug9 wrote:
LightsOutLuthor wrote:
Yo Momma wrote:
LightsOutLuthor wrote:
If you lift like men, why separate yourself from the men?
Same reason there is an Over 35 Forum.
Some training issues are different for those of us who are over 35. Some non-training issues are different, too. Have you seen all the TRT threads in that forum? Why would a young man like yourself be interested in going into that forum?
Yeah, I’m old so I go into that forum, but I’m also female, and interested in Strength Sports, so I come here, too. Because there are female only issues, like training through a heavy period, or pregnancy, that have no place for someone without a vagina.
Do you REALLY want to discuss bra rash, or how the hell to get a bench shirt over a pair of D-cup breasts?
No, I get that. I can say I DO NOT wanna talk bra rash (though I can tell you Gold Bond powder helps)…
My point is: Does there need to be
a MENS powerlifting thread, and a womens
a MENS strength sports, and a womans.
a MENs powerful image, and a womans?
My opinion is if 85% of the posts in the strength sports thread (for example) apply to men and women - GO RIGHT AHEAD and post a thread pertaining to a women-specific issue. But don’t go sequestering yourselves in a specific thread.
Cuz guess what will happen? You’ll stay there, we’ll stay in our corner, and all those ‘common ground’ subjects? I’ll never see those you put in, and you’ll never see mine. And that’s a shame.
It’s the same issue of creating a bunch of cells (like someone wanted a “former fat boy” cell). You split up or identify yourself by all these ‘subgroups’, the logical limit to that is we all have a single thread we belong to. Guess what - that sucks.
I think you missed the point where we wanted to be portrayed on her as something more than a figure athlete. Wanted to be shown as powerful along with the men, not as an after thought all the time.
Yes, we train the same, most of the time. But how many times have you seen a female in the Powerful Image section? How about interviewed for strength type articles ect? That is where my problem was. As well as some comments I got from the I am afraid to eat group that has shown up on this site…
Now, as far as Men posting over here - - I welcome them. There input, critques and all.[/quote]
Well, even though the horse has been beaten to a thick cream by now, I’ll ask that you re-read some of the clarification posts that have occurred.
My entire point of this was kinda in opposition to your last sentence there: “men, feel free to post here, but we wanna be treated as separate”. Most men won’t visit, because the concept is that somehow your topics are strange and different and unrelated to anything we do. That’s not the case!
If you’ll further notice, I got in a little trouble for supporting your comment and saying that the women who ARE NOT figure athletes and ARE NOT interested in reading about that shouldn’t be relegated to a web page called that, and focused on that.
My simple suggestion is this (and I think most agree with it). Post in the thread that makes sense for what you’re doing.
If you’re a powerlifter, post there.
Since 85% of the time (I keep using that number) it doesn’t matter if you’re male or female, do you need a female only section to post about the other 15% that is gender-specifc? I don’t think so…because the 85% will either get duplicated, ignored by men, or ignored by the women who would rather read the ‘original’ forum.
Seems that it should simple enough to post a topic in the thread and ask a gender-specific question if needed rather than compartmentalizing it off into the corner where it will get ignored.
It’s like when I try to organize my pantry at home. If I decide all canned goods go in an area, that’s great. But then if I try to go by the vegetables, I start spreading things thin. Then if I want a faced-row of just green beans, I’ve got 1 of each item in a category and no room on the shelf! Get my point? (besides me having OCD?)
(final point - in actuality, I have all the ‘Powerful Images’ turned off, so I can’t speak to percentages one way or the other, since if someone is in my office and sees a lot of ‘skin’ on the screen they might think I’m looking at porn.)
[quote]Bratt wrote:
I disagree. Another reason for the thread to be somewhere other than the t-cell is so that other trainers or trainees who are not part of the t-cell can ANSWER questions. People outside of the t-cell do have valuable experience and input.
[/quote]
Why don’t you just start another thread?
I wanted the thread of my question in the T-Cell.
why don’t you start a thread of your interests in the forum of your choosing?
[quote]OctoberGirl wrote:
But I also don’t want you to take it as an attack.
This is just a discussion, batting ideas around.
We need both sides, all sides, who am I kidding? Very rarely is it only two sides right?
[/quote]
Not taking it as an attack. Yet! ; )
3 sides. Yours, mine and the truth. Here at T-Nation there are as many sides as there are people!
However I did see a common thread and the possibility of common ground and was simply, in all of this, hoping to make that obvious and understood by as many people as possible. Starting to feel like I’m beating a dead horse so I’ll let it go now. Enough talking. Time for doing. Time for a training log in the Training Log section. Actions speak louder than words. Hope you will all check it out once I get it started in the next few days. If it still exists! Looks like there’s some reorganizing goin’ on here.
[quote]OctoberGirl wrote:
Bratt wrote:
I disagree. Another reason for the thread to be somewhere other than the t-cell is so that other trainers or trainees who are not part of the t-cell can ANSWER questions. People outside of the t-cell do have valuable experience and input.
Why don’t you just start another thread?
I wanted the thread of my question in the T-Cell.
why don’t you start a thread of your interests in the forum of your choosing?
[/quote]
OG! I don’t want or need to start another thread. I was simply responding to why I even mentioned it, just as A THOUGHT, in the first place. Conversations take several posts back and forth. A specific point (sentence or paragraph) gets further CLARIFIED. That’s all.
I’ve already said MULTIPLE times and have show by my past actions that if I wanted to start a thread I would. But thanks for the encouragement! : ) LOL
EDIT: PS When you first posted about the thread you did not say it was you that wanted it or where you wanted it. Laroyale didn’t even say it was you so how could I know that it was as you wanted/intended it to be?
OK, really! I’m going to shut up now!
[quote]Bratt wrote:
rondastarr wrote:
Exactly!
If we have questions and can’t post them in Tcell just open a thread here in responce. It’s been done before in responce to Tcell threads…
Bratt wrote:
Again not sure why this seems to be directed at me by both you and OG as I already obviously get that since that is how and why this thread was started by me in the first place! Perhaps I am misunderstanding and it is not directed at me and you are just sharing your opinions?
Maybe you misunderstood… I was NOT criticizing OG or Laroyale for starting the thread in the T-Cell OR suggesting that It should ONLY be here. I was suggesting it could be here TOO.
rondastarr wrote:
The reason it was directed at you was because you posted this :
Bratt wrote:
However, I’m thinking we should should have that thread here in Powerful Women where it would be open to a great deal more input. T-Cell is very limited in numbers and it’s main focus is bodybuilding and therefore, perhaps bodybuilding training would be mostly the focus of any discussion? I guess we should see what comes of his thread first?
rondastarr wrote:
Again, there doesn’t need to be a special thread opened here for the topic unless someone has questions.
I disagree. Another reason for the thread to be somewhere other than the T-Cell is so that other trainers or trainees who are not part of the T-Cell can ANSWER questions. People outside of the T-Cell do have valuable experience and input.
rondastarr wrote:
Then that person, if they are not in Tcell or even if they are, can choose to open a thread to ask their questions. So basicly what I am saying is if you want the thread here, copy, paste and put it here and ask all the questions you want.
[/quote]
Then start the thread!
[quote]rondastarr wrote:
Bratt wrote:
rondastarr wrote:
Exactly!
If we have questions and can’t post them in Tcell just open a thread here in responce. It’s been done before in responce to Tcell threads…
Bratt wrote:
Again not sure why this seems to be directed at me by both you and OG as I already obviously get that since that is how and why this thread was started by me in the first place! Perhaps I am misunderstanding and it is not directed at me and you are just sharing your opinions?
Maybe you misunderstood… I was NOT criticizing OG or Laroyale for starting the thread in the T-Cell OR suggesting that It should ONLY be here. I was suggesting it could be here TOO.
rondastarr wrote:
The reason it was directed at you was because you posted this :
Bratt wrote:
However, I’m thinking we should should have that thread here in Powerful Women where it would be open to a great deal more input. T-Cell is very limited in numbers and it’s main focus is bodybuilding and therefore, perhaps bodybuilding training would be mostly the focus of any discussion? I guess we should see what comes of his thread first?
rondastarr wrote:
Again, there doesn’t need to be a special thread opened here for the topic unless someone has questions.
I disagree. Another reason for the thread to be somewhere other than the T-Cell is so that other trainers or trainees who are not part of the T-Cell can ANSWER questions. People outside of the T-Cell do have valuable experience and input.
rondastarr wrote:
Then that person, if they are not in Tcell or even if they are, can choose to open a thread to ask their questions. So basicly what I am saying is if you want the thread here, copy, paste and put it here and ask all the questions you want.
Then start the thread![/quote]
rondastarr
Read the post I wrote to OG an hour before you posted this.
[quote]Bratt wrote:
rondastarr wrote:
Bratt wrote:
rondastarr wrote:
Exactly!
If we have questions and can’t post them in Tcell just open a thread here in responce. It’s been done before in responce to Tcell threads…
Bratt wrote:
Again not sure why this seems to be directed at me by both you and OG as I already obviously get that since that is how and why this thread was started by me in the first place! Perhaps I am misunderstanding and it is not directed at me and you are just sharing your opinions?
Maybe you misunderstood… I was NOT criticizing OG or Laroyale for starting the thread in the T-Cell OR suggesting that It should ONLY be here. I was suggesting it could be here TOO.
rondastarr wrote:
The reason it was directed at you was because you posted this :
Bratt wrote:
However, I’m thinking we should should have that thread here in Powerful Women where it would be open to a great deal more input. T-Cell is very limited in numbers and it’s main focus is bodybuilding and therefore, perhaps bodybuilding training would be mostly the focus of any discussion? I guess we should see what comes of his thread first?
rondastarr wrote:
Again, there doesn’t need to be a special thread opened here for the topic unless someone has questions.
I disagree. Another reason for the thread to be somewhere other than the T-Cell is so that other trainers or trainees who are not part of the T-Cell can ANSWER questions. People outside of the T-Cell do have valuable experience and input.
rondastarr wrote:
Then that person, if they are not in Tcell or even if they are, can choose to open a thread to ask their questions. So basicly what I am saying is if you want the thread here, copy, paste and put it here and ask all the questions you want.
Then start the thread!
rondastarr
Read the post I wrote to OG an hour before you posted this.
[/quote]
Ok then, stop complaining then,
and yes, feel free to take this as an attack if you would like.
[quote]rondastarr wrote:
Ok then, stop complaining then,
and yes, feel free to take this as an attack if you would like.
[/quote]
To label the responses I have written as complaining is just too silly for me to consider it an attack.
I’ve tried multiple times to disengage from this thread today but you keep “baiting” me back re-posting things I’ve already responded to. If you have a problem with me just come out and say it. I’ve never had ANY interaction with you before so I certainly have no idea.