Non-Direct Arm Work Routines (for Big Arms)

Training Bodybuilding
41

[quote]icyhotpatch1 wrote:
My opinion probably means nothing here, but I agree with beginners having an emphasis placed on learning the compounds first before delving into all kinds of other isolation. The idea that direct arm work shouldn’t be done at all, however, is misleading. [/quote]

I get what you’re trying to say, I think, but are you implying that doing 2-3 sets of curls at the end of a “starting strength” workout is going to hinder someone’s ability to learn how to squat, dead or bench?

I don’t think anyone is telling some 140 newb who’s idea of strong is a 135lbs bench, to have an entire day dedicated to arms here. But then again, even if the trainee has an arm day, if that prevents him from doing squats, that is a fault of the trainee not the bicep curl. If some jack ass does nothing but bench and curl 4 days a week, that is the trainees fault, and not the fault of him being shown what a curl was the first day he lifted.

42

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]icyhotpatch1 wrote:
My opinion probably means nothing here, but I agree with beginners having an emphasis placed on learning the compounds first before delving into all kinds of other isolation. The idea that direct arm work shouldn’t be done at all, however, is misleading. [/quote]

I get what you’re trying to say, I think, but are you implying that doing 2-3 sets of curls at the end of a “starting strength” workout is going to hinder someone’s ability to learn how to squat, dead or bench?

I don’t think anyone is telling some 140 newb who’s idea of strong is a 135lbs bench, to have an entire day dedicated to arms here. But then again, even if the trainee has an arm day, if that prevents him from doing squats, that is a fault of the trainee not the bicep curl. If some jack ass does nothing but bench and curl 4 days a week, that is the trainees fault, and not the fault of him being shown what a curl was the first day he lifted.
[/quote]

Well said. Train it ALL. That is how you get big the fastest way possible…not by ignoring whole body parts unless they are injured.

43

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]icyhotpatch1 wrote:
My opinion probably means nothing here, but I agree with beginners having an emphasis placed on learning the compounds first before delving into all kinds of other isolation. The idea that direct arm work shouldn’t be done at all, however, is misleading. [/quote]

I get what you’re trying to say, I think, but are you implying that doing 2-3 sets of curls at the end of a “starting strength” workout is going to hinder someone’s ability to learn how to squat, dead or bench?

I don’t think anyone is telling some 140 newb who’s idea of strong is a 135lbs bench, to have an entire day dedicated to arms here. But then again, even if the trainee has an arm day, if that prevents him from doing squats, that is a fault of the trainee not the bicep curl. If some jack ass does nothing but bench and curl 4 days a week, that is the trainees fault, and not the fault of him being shown what a curl was the first day he lifted.
[/quote]

Well said. Train it ALL. That is how you get big the fastest way possible…not by ignoring whole body parts unless they are injured.[/quote]

I mean, for every guy that “did it right” from the beginning and looks like a pimp, there seems to be 2 dudes who “did it wrong” for Z amount of time. Then they figured out they needed to change, did change and end up where they want and need to be.

Seeing as 90% of people who started lifting today will have quit by this time next year, and 99% by 3 years from now, I don’t see the need or the point in trying to save every newb from himself. (Outside of selling books). Just teach people what the purpose & proper technique of each basic lift is, how to prioritize focus based on goals, how important diet is, and then the rest is really just a journey of self discovery & development.

I’m not saying people shouldn’t be reading and learning about training from gurus and authors. But time under the bar typically trumps reading about time under the bar. But in all reality, at this point I believe someone that is going to “make it”, will do so whether they read 6mil articles and books about it or not, whether they follow “bro-science” or not, or whatever. (I reserve the right to change this opinion.) I just feel like those that are a step above the rest, are gonna get there, no matter the path, because of whatever it is inside that that is pushing them to that level in the first place…

Does that make sense?

44

Makes perfect sense. telling people squats grow your arms bigger isn’t going to make the people who drop out within a year suddenly last longer. They will still quit. They never had it in them. I didn’t see too many guys in college training legs outside of football practice. That doesn’t mean they made less progress. If anything, they were also the ones who made it to the gym nonstop…so they eventually figured out that their arms should be bigger than their quads.

“Squats for arms” people don’t seem to be growing faster. They just seem to be missing the point.

You need to focus on all of it.

45

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]icyhotpatch1 wrote:
My opinion probably means nothing here, but I agree with beginners having an emphasis placed on learning the compounds first before delving into all kinds of other isolation. The idea that direct arm work shouldn’t be done at all, however, is misleading. [/quote]

I get what you’re trying to say, I think, but are you implying that doing 2-3 sets of curls at the end of a “starting strength” workout is going to hinder someone’s ability to learn how to squat, dead or bench?

I don’t think anyone is telling some 140 newb who’s idea of strong is a 135lbs bench, to have an entire day dedicated to arms here. But then again, even if the trainee has an arm day, if that prevents him from doing squats, that is a fault of the trainee not the bicep curl. If some jack ass does nothing but bench and curl 4 days a week, that is the trainees fault, and not the fault of him being shown what a curl was the first day he lifted.
[/quote]

Well said. Train it ALL. That is how you get big the fastest way possible…not by ignoring whole body parts unless they are injured.[/quote]

I mean, for every guy that “did it right” from the beginning and looks like a pimp, there seems to be 2 dudes who “did it wrong” for Z amount of time. Then they figured out they needed to change, did change and end up where they want and need to be.

Seeing as 90% of people who started lifting today will have quit by this time next year, and 99% by 3 years from now, I don’t see the need or the point in trying to save every newb from himself. (Outside of selling books). Just teach people what the purpose & proper technique of each basic lift is, how to prioritize focus based on goals, how important diet is, and then the rest is really just a journey of self discovery & development.

I’m not saying people shouldn’t be reading and learning about training from gurus and authors. But time under the bar typically trumps reading about time under the bar. But in all reality, at this point I believe someone that is going to “make it”, will do so whether they read 6mil articles and books about it or not, whether they follow “bro-science” or not, or whatever. (I reserve the right to change this opinion.) I just feel like those that are a step above the rest, are gonna get there, no matter the path, because of whatever it is inside that that is pushing them to that level in the first place…

Does that make sense? [/quote]

I agree that it is a journey of self discovery and development, but I know that if it weren’t for someone taking an interest and helping me out, I would have given up long ago. In fact I DID give up, but came back to it. All thanks to a guy who used to post on this forum. I’m not sure how he’d take it if I bring his name up, so I won’t.

Sometimes there is value in telling someone something over and over again until they get it.

46

^^ in my business, if I have to tell them over and over and over again- they end up fired. Common sense just isn’t common anymore and I think the elimination of natural selection has left us with more mentally challenged individuals than we can compensate for.

Its bbing and it aint that hard to pick stuff up and put it down.

47

[quote]Loudog75 wrote:
^^ in my business, if I have to tell them over and over and over again- they end up fired. Common sense just isn’t common anymore and I think the elimination of natural selection has left us with more mentally challenged individuals than we can compensate for.

Its bbing and it aint that hard to pick stuff up and put it down.[/quote]

Going into the gym and picking stuff up and putting it down is what most people do. Random strength training. A lot of people do that and get nowhere.

PX has been speaking the plain truth to newbies on here for years. Some get it after a while, most don’t. Those who don’t get it continue going into the gym to “pick stuff up and put it down”, those who get it start bodybuilding.

48

At the moment I’m doing more performance-based training based around my sport.

I still include direct arm training.

That Chad dude is annoying as hell, IMO.

49

[quote]Quick Ben wrote:

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]countingbeans wrote:

[quote]icyhotpatch1 wrote:
My opinion probably means nothing here, but I agree with beginners having an emphasis placed on learning the compounds first before delving into all kinds of other isolation. The idea that direct arm work shouldn’t be done at all, however, is misleading. [/quote]

I get what you’re trying to say, I think, but are you implying that doing 2-3 sets of curls at the end of a “starting strength” workout is going to hinder someone’s ability to learn how to squat, dead or bench?

I don’t think anyone is telling some 140 newb who’s idea of strong is a 135lbs bench, to have an entire day dedicated to arms here. But then again, even if the trainee has an arm day, if that prevents him from doing squats, that is a fault of the trainee not the bicep curl. If some jack ass does nothing but bench and curl 4 days a week, that is the trainees fault, and not the fault of him being shown what a curl was the first day he lifted.
[/quote]

Well said. Train it ALL. That is how you get big the fastest way possible…not by ignoring whole body parts unless they are injured.[/quote]

I mean, for every guy that “did it right” from the beginning and looks like a pimp, there seems to be 2 dudes who “did it wrong” for Z amount of time. Then they figured out they needed to change, did change and end up where they want and need to be.

Seeing as 90% of people who started lifting today will have quit by this time next year, and 99% by 3 years from now, I don’t see the need or the point in trying to save every newb from himself. (Outside of selling books). Just teach people what the purpose & proper technique of each basic lift is, how to prioritize focus based on goals, how important diet is, and then the rest is really just a journey of self discovery & development.

I’m not saying people shouldn’t be reading and learning about training from gurus and authors. But time under the bar typically trumps reading about time under the bar. But in all reality, at this point I believe someone that is going to “make it”, will do so whether they read 6mil articles and books about it or not, whether they follow “bro-science” or not, or whatever. (I reserve the right to change this opinion.) I just feel like those that are a step above the rest, are gonna get there, no matter the path, because of whatever it is inside that that is pushing them to that level in the first place…

Does that make sense? [/quote]

I agree that it is a journey of self discovery and development, but I know that if it weren’t for someone taking an interest and helping me out, I would have given up long ago. In fact I DID give up, but came back to it. All thanks to a guy who used to post on this forum. I’m not sure how he’d take it if I bring his name up, so I won’t.

Sometimes there is value in telling someone something over and over again until they get it.

[/quote]

Part of me agrees with Lou, and part of me agrees with you also, but I don’t think you guys are that far a part either way. You’re just talking about two different types of people.

You “gave up” out of frustration. Some dude saw the “worth the trouble” in you, and helped you out. You didn’t give up because you are a bitch and a pussy. You gave up, as you put it, because you weren’t getting what you knew you shoudl have been. There is a difference.

We all need a lighthouse when the bay is foggy, but the difference is some people just get in the dingy, paddle to shore and go and pick up knitting, where others wait until the sun shines in the morning and burns off the fog, and other still just navigate that shit.

Lou is talking about the knitters, you are talking about the dudes waiting for the sun shine to burn off the fog.

At least, that is what I think, lol. I could be wrong.

50

[quote]Quick Ben wrote:

[quote]Loudog75 wrote:
^^ in my business, if I have to tell them over and over and over again- they end up fired. Common sense just isn’t common anymore and I think the elimination of natural selection has left us with more mentally challenged individuals than we can compensate for.

Its bbing and it aint that hard to pick stuff up and put it down.[/quote]

Going into the gym and picking stuff up and putting it down is what most people do. Random strength training. A lot of people do that and get nowhere.

PX has been speaking the plain truth to newbies on here for years. Some get it after a while, most don’t. Those who don’t get it continue going into the gym to “pick stuff up and put it down”, those who get it start bodybuilding.
[/quote]

after re-read, I can see how you might have taken my post as a shot against you. Not the intent.

51

Quoting CB:
You didn’t give up because you are a bitch and a pussy. You gave up, as you put it, because you weren’t getting what you knew you shoudl have been. There is a difference

End Quote- I’m no good witht he multiple quote/delete stuff.

CB you’re right on - There is a difference. And I think I oversimplified it when I said pick stuff up put it down. It should be Heavy stuff -lol.

It just annoys me when there are guys in the gym who Don’t pick stuff up the right way. Instead of finding out how to get it done, they just quit and say this is too hard. Nothing in life is easy and you have to work for what you want.

52

If I wasn’t pushed to do so, I probably never would have gotten my blood work done. I put an awful lot of effort into this for a long time with subpar results, and it wore me the fuck out. So kids, if any of you are in that boat, you might want to get that lab rapport.

Btw, Lou: no worries.

53

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Yeah…Chad is not a bodybuilder…and bodybuilders shouldn’t follow Chad.[/quote]

I agree. He is mostly focused on strength and health, hence some of his quirks like his obsession with pull-ups.

However, being a savvy businessman, Chad has provided hypertrophy routines in his books to have some cross-over appeal with the body builder crowd. And those routines all include direct arm work.

54

I pride myself in having decent ‘arm genetics’.

From 2005 - 2009 I hadn’t done any direct arm training, but did lots of rowing and pressing variations, with the occasional pull-up thrown in for good measure. There was a time when I could pull-up my then 200 lbs of bw plus another 100 lbs worth in plates dangling below my manhood.
My arms didn’t grow that much.

Then I started doing direct arm work and they responded pretty quickly.

Cliff notes:

  • lots of rowing and pressing variations
  • high training frequency
  • pull-ups (weighted)

=> arms grew some, but direct arm training worked a lot better’n faster and isn’t actually that time consuming if done after the money exercises as a, say, dense 10 min bonus ‘arm session’.

Good day.

55

[quote]Quick Ben wrote:
If I wasn’t pushed to do so, I probably never would have gotten my blood work done. I put an awful lot of effort into this for a long time with subpar results, and it wore me the fuck out. So kids, if any of you are in that boat, you might want to get that lab rapport.

Btw, Lou: no worries.[/quote]

You had low testosterone? Or why did you take that blood work done?

56

I say train it all…

Adapt and grow or give up the ghost…

57

The people with the biggest arms in the world dont do any direct arm work
Exhibit A
http://www.methodsofhealing.com/files/2010/08/obese-women.jpg

58

Greg Valentino would be envious of that arms.

59

[quote]kaisermetal wrote:
Greg Valentino would be envious of that arms.[/quote]

You mean THAT isnt Greg?

*double checks

60

Their tris lagging, esp. compared to most of the women of their size! They should do something about it.

Actually I was very saaaad this summer. :o( Trained at a gym during schoolyear, where girlz did heavy training, squats-deads-militaries-pullups, and yes, they did 6-8 direct arm-work excersises (bis-tris supersets, all of them for some reason.)

And in my summer-gym, all the things they do is treadmill and then adduction-abduction. Why? :o( They will not look good if their whoole body is a chunk of something on bones without muscles.

Here’s a women template for arms:

dip machine ss. cable ez curls
rope pushdowns ss. incline db curls
overhead tri extensions ss. preacher machine curl
v-bar pushdowns with rope curls

3-4 sets of 10-15 reps on each, increasing the load every set. And they were average young and middle aged women and some girlz under 20. :stuck_out_tongue: