Now obviously, “too much volume” can definitely be true. But sometimes I feel as though I can push myself a little harder in the form of more sets. I’m talking like 8-10 sets for major lifts.(and that’s just one excercise!) Yes, I am using weights that are heavy enough, because my rep range is between 5-10. Any heavier and I would sacrifice good form.
Does anyone else train like this. If so, how are you doing? So far nothing is going wrong but I am kind of new. I have tried 5 x 5 and it didn’t seem to be enough.
[quote]JucinitJack wrote:
Does anyone else train like this. If so, how are you doing? So far nothing is going wrong but I am kind of new. I have tried 5 x 5 and it didn’t seem to be enough. [/quote]
if 5x5 isn’t seeming like enough you aren’t using enough weights, i did madcows program for 5 weeks and by the 3rd week i was dead until sunday night lol
[quote]JucinitJack wrote:
Now obviously, “too much volume” can definitely be true. But sometimes I feel as though I can push myself a little harder in the form of more sets. I’m talking like 8-10 sets for major lifts.(and that’s just one excercise!) Yes, I am using weights that are heavy enough, because my rep range is between 5-10. Any heavier and I would sacrifice good form.
Does anyone else train like this. If so, how are you doing? So far nothing is going wrong but I am kind of new. I have tried 5 x 5 and it didn’t seem to be enough. [/quote]
Well, you could just be that way, but… being new… first I’ll say that having good form requires support and control from the surrounding muscles. This support and control is weak in beginners but it catches up pretty quick. You probably already have the strength to lift a lot more weight if you could keep the form. As you progress you will probably find it takes less to get a good workout because you’ll be able to lift more as you form toughens up.
I was the same way when I first started and I’m the same way when I haven’t lifted in a while. With a fresh start I can lift a bunch but because my form is shot I have to reduce the weight and then I’m not even sore the next day.
Since you are “kind of new”, you will be able to get away with higher volume because you most likely aren’t using weights that are heavy enough to really tax your body (beyond basic fatigue). Might sound a little strange - and I’m not suggesting that you aren’t busting you ass…it’s just that there is a real difference in intensity between one plate, two plates, three plates, etc…you just have to actually reach those points to get where I’m coming from - they just take more out of you.
Trust me, when you start piling more weight on the bar, you will most likely feel less of a need to perform so damn many sets/exercises.
Right now, if you can get away with it - go for it. Just be sure to adjust according to your recovery in the future.
Personally I don’t ever worry about how many sets I’m doing for each exercise or whatever. I hit it until it “feels right”. If I’m supposed to be on my last set and I just don’t feel satisfied yet, I’ll do another. I don’t really worry about overtraining, since I only hit each body part 1x a week, that means it has 7 days to heal.
[quote]anonym wrote:
Since you are “kind of new”, you will be able to get away with higher volume because you most likely aren’t using weights that are heavy enough to really tax your body (beyond basic fatigue). Might sound a little strange - and I’m not suggesting that you aren’t busting you ass…it’s just that there is a real difference in intensity between one plate, two plates, three plates, etc…you just have to actually reach those points to get where I’m coming from - they just take more out of you.
Trust me, when you start piling more weight on the bar, you will most likely feel less of a need to perform so damn many sets/exercises.
Right now, if you can get away with it - go for it. Just be sure to adjust according to your recovery in the future.[/quote]
I pretty much go along with this and will add that being new you also aren’t lifting nearly as hard you think you are and will be eventually able to. Everybody’s different, but I would have to really pace myself to do 8-10 sets of a single exercise. Yesterday was leg day. I did six total sets, 2 each of 3 exercises and one each way for calves, which took a lot out of me and today my legs are sore.
[quote]JucinitJack wrote:
Yes, I am using weights that are heavy enough, because my rep range is between 5-10. Any heavier and I would sacrifice good form. [/quote]
You have to remember, that, as has already been said, you need to allow your stabilizing muscles to develop along with your primary muscle groups. It’s simply a matter of overloading them. Good form is important, but there are always ways to sacrifice “good” form without increasing the risk of injury. For example…if you could pull a set of deads for 6 reps at 315, put an extra 20 on it. I’m sure the first 2-3 reps will be squeaky clean, the fourth you’ll struggle but make it. After that to keep the set going, you’d simply want to bring a little more leg into the pull by bending your knees a bit more. You’ll be able to pull the heavier weight while maintaining a safe pull. Cheating makes it harder, not easier…don’t be afraid to stack on some plates and push out of your comfort zone.
Well, if you are “juc’in it” Jack, you may find your recovery is much larger, but remember recovery time is not the same as ‘time spent growing after excercise’. So every time you put your body under stress your DOMs may be minimal but if you do it to often you still will not grow as fast as you optimally can.
Also remember we presume you are a beginner, so what you would consider as heavy weight may not actually be heavy for your CNS. Get strong first, then you will have a better concept of what volume you can handle.
[quote]JucinitJack wrote:
Now obviously, “too much volume” can definitely be true. But sometimes I feel as though I can push myself a little harder in the form of more sets. I’m talking like 8-10 sets for major lifts.(and that’s just one excercise!) Yes, I am using weights that are heavy enough, because my rep range is between 5-10. Any heavier and I would sacrifice good form.
Does anyone else train like this. If so, how are you doing? So far nothing is going wrong but I am kind of new. I have tried 5 x 5 and it didn’t seem to be enough. [/quote]
5x5 = 7/8x5 for me
I do 2-3 “warmup” sets to get up to my work weight. then I do 5 sets of 5 with my work weight. Then tell me 5x5 is no good.
If there’s one thing I’ve learned, it’s that until you start to train seriously, you NEVER lift as hard as you think you can. Therefore, to add on to what others have already said, 5x5 is really challenging if you are truly picking a 5RM, and you shouldn’t require too much more volume.
high volume works, but you cant sustain a maximal effort for all of your sets. Especially as weight increases. The point is to not overdue volume so that your strength increases enough so that you can get a training response from less volume.
make progress, move the weights up, and make sure your putting everything into your sets.
Arnold said there is no such thing as over training, only under eating and under sleeping.
this coming from a genetic freak who did 55 sets of squats in the middle of the woods, then drank beer and fucked a few women all night. the guy knows how to train.
If your hitting all your sets for 5 reps (25 total reps) when doing 5x5, it generally means you can handle more weight. Usually you will miss 1 or 2 by the end.
[quote]tw0scoops2 wrote:
JucinitJack wrote:
Now obviously, “too much volume” can definitely be true. But sometimes I feel as though I can push myself a little harder in the form of more sets. I’m talking like 8-10 sets for major lifts.(and that’s just one excercise!) Yes, I am using weights that are heavy enough, because my rep range is between 5-10. Any heavier and I would sacrifice good form.
Does anyone else train like this. If so, how are you doing? So far nothing is going wrong but I am kind of new. I have tried 5 x 5 and it didn’t seem to be enough.
5x5 = 7/8x5 for me
I do 2-3 “warmup” sets to get up to my work weight. then I do 5 sets of 5 with my work weight. Then tell me 5x5 is no good. :)[/quote]
How you respond to volume is highly dependant on your previous training and current work capacity. As well as different phases and cycles in training. Super volume every day for your whole life may not be good but extra volume here and there, or doing more volume than what others say you should do is not a problem.
While you will do better with more volume as you get more advanced, the 5x5 will “work” for almost anyone to a good extent. Not optimal for all obviously but then nothing is.
I think for someone floundering about for a while without direction and/or not sure where he wants to go next, a 5x5 with separate arm day is the best thing around. Great if you’re coming off a layoff and want to build your size and strength back before raising work capacity, great if you want to drop 20 pounds while maintaining/building strength in major movements…great if youre just starting out.
I use the 5 rep scheme in a different way for myself, when i rotate a new upper body movement in for the first time in a while I start with a 5x 5 for that movement (say Cybex plate loaded press for shoulders) and try to milk that before playing with set-rep schemes to keep the progress coming. I feel that the 5x5 on a fresh movement causes rapid strength gains for a while.
