Three pounds of muscle is great for an experienced guy. That would take months without MAG-10 for some. Maybe the diet just needs adjusting next time.
Muscle soreness!
I am on my first week on MAG10 been following the 400 gr protein / 500 gr Carbs regiment plus 2 workout/day. I have gained 6 lbs since Monday (will check BF this weekend). Did not notice any strenght increase, I have no problem sleeping at night … only drawback so far is that I can feel every muscle in my body … and I mean really sore … but it’s all cool I will be seeing my girl friend this weekend and she can rub that lean body of mine like an Geisha.
Okay I purchased it and it should be here in the next few days (along with tribex and M). I have been doing a dedicated weight workout for 9 months now, but this is my first real attempt at getting big.
I just started the Ocsillating Wave workout and am wondering if I need to move to the growth surge project or If the Ocsillating wave would work or if I could remove the endurance protion of the Ocsillating Wave and work on just strength an size. Any takers?
Here are some results from my 4 week cycle of mag10. You can search the site for my posting on the first two weeks. Basically I bulked for the first two weeks and put on 10-11 lbs(I had a terrible diet during this phase). Started at 177-178 and peaked at 188. BF% stayed the same at 15-16% using calipers. Second two weeks I cleaned up my diet and did meltdown training to lose some fat. Went from 188 to 183. Haven’t checked BF% again yet but mirror tells me I lost a % or two fat and gained about 5lbs. LBM. Strength gains during the cycle were not overly dramatic. Maybe a little more than what you’d expect from Creatine. However, the strength gains survived the period of low weights with meltdown and have continued to go up in the two weeks since the end of the cycle. Cool. I’ve lost a couple more pounds of fat since the mag10 cycle, without even really trying as well. This is very unusual for me as I’ve always had a very hard time losing fat. It seems also that my body is in general is responding to exercise differently than before(in a positive way). Could Mag10 cause some permanent up regulation of androgen receptors?Hmmm. Negatives- problems sleeping for the first week. Felt very bloated, I think I was retaining alot of water. Some elevation of BP and RHR. By the last week I could tell that some natural T suppression was occurring, although tribex and vitex have took care of that rapidly. All in all I’d call it a good experience and I will use it again.
GOOD GOD !.. i’m gonna be coming off of mag-10 this saturday… for a 4 week break !!.. now how am i gonna handle that ??? everything feels tight and great, gained about 10 pounds of muscle i’m now afraid of loosing. i’m hoping that tribex, M, and about 300g. of protein will help keep it…
i also can HONESTLY (!!) say that this cycle of mag-10 was like doing d-bol with finaplix. (back in the day when i did those sort of things).. i just can't say enough what mag-10 has done for me !!! i want to have a ton of it and sit on top of it like a greedy leprachaun on a pot of gold !
Desperate Choad
If you know nothing about the DLM supplement, why would you take it?? If you cant find anything on the net about it, why bother trying it, even if a mate sez it works wonders.
If you gained 10lbs using mag10 and DLM, tell me, which one helped with the gains.
Try to do one thing at a time, to help judge its usefullness
I’ve heard people say in these forums that orals aren’t very good because you lose a lot a lot in the digestive process. How is MAG-10 different or is it? Just wondering before I spend the cashola. I use only Biotest products and I’ve had good luck with all of them. Thx.
Jag, a lot of retention of gains depends on how close you
were already to what you might have eventually achieved naturally (if the cycle put you well above this losses afterwards would be more than if you’re still under that), and also according to whether you happen to be someone who gains a lot of glycogen and glycogen-associated water on a cycle, or not so much.
Typically a drop of several pounds occurs from
the latter effect, with no loss of strength so it’s not a muscle protein loss.
Johnny, uh, you’re right, the “MAG-10 plan
for success” article does indeed say that.
It looks to me like one of those cases
saying, “Well, you can go read this article
for specific information” but not keeping
in mind that that article in some ways violates
the specific recommendations we have for
MAG-10: 400 g protein per day, at least 500 g carbs, low fat, and with carbs in preferably every meal.
Mike, yes, for mass-gain cycles I feel
the recommendations are fairly global,
though it would make sense for example that
a guy who is 5 feet zero inches would
need less than a guy who’s six foot three.
But overall the recommendations are good
for the great majority.
Dieting of course is a different requirement.
It’s true that if someone is not (somehow
having a crystal ball) going to gain muscle
mass rapidly anyway, then in that situation
400 g protein may not be giving any faster
gains than 300 g since the latter would suffice, but unless one knows fast growth is impossible it would be a mistake to limit it with the lower intake.
All I can say with regard to some not getting
excellent results in 2 weeks of MAG-10 is that there are those who don’t get a great deal of results in a particular 2 weeks of a good pharmaceutical steroid cycle either, so I suppose it’s inevitable this will happen with MAG-10 as well. Everyone does well longer term though and I expect the same with MAG-10. Pharmacologically, there’s no difference (except no issues of producing high estrogen or DHT or having alkylated steroids.)
I’m excited to start my first bottle of Mag-10 this coming Monday. I plan on taking measurements and pics so I can track my progress. I don’t think I’m bold enough to do any posting of pics just yet. Bill here’s a question for you…I plan on eating clean and getting all the required P/C/F. First, I was going to start loading creatine tomorrow and since I know that it draws water into the cells, how will the creatine taint my results. If I were to gain say 10 lbs with just the Mag-10, would I gain an additional say…5-7 lbs of water during the cycle. I want my weight results to be from the Mag-10 and I just want to know if the creatine is a bad idea or not.
I have MD-6, Mag-10, Methoxy-7 and Surge…is there anything you would leave out of the mix for these two weeks?
I’m thinking MD-6 with Fish oil capsules in the AM along with the Mag-10 for prework #1.
Methoxy Mid-Day
Creatine and more MD6 prework #2.
Surge Post Workout #2.
Do you see any bad timing with any of this?
Bill, thanks alot for the reply I appreciate it. one more question, when you say over time for people with low responses…do you mean they will gain better in supsequent cycles…or are better by going 4on/4-8 off. Oalso one more while my brain is brewing…do we still keep diet predominately carbs & pro between cycles…or is better to hit up more fats. Thanks again Bill, I appreciate it…Mike
Krak, I’d leave off the creatine and save it for later off weeks. It doesn’t help much while on anabolic steroids, but could raise doubt in your mind as to where your gains are coming from. Yet, in off weeks, if you’re a high responder to creatine, it may have benefit for you.
Mike, I actually meant that those who have
lackluster results on one 2 week cycle will
usually do fine on later ones, but it may
be the case (I don’t know) that it’s indicative of a higher chance of being someone who does better on longer cycles. For sure,
if someone gets disappointing results twice
in a row on 2 week cycles and training and nutrition are correct, I’d go for an 8 week cycle next time. However, that’s not an ordinary result at all in pharmaceutical
anabolic steroid cycles, and it shouldn’t be with MAG-10 either.
In off weeks, definitely you want to have
a fat intake that works out to at least 30%
calories over the day, probably preferably
a little more like 35%, because fat intake
then is quite important to natural testosterone production.
Just got my bottle in the mail today! So Bill everything else I mentioned to take is ok, just lay off the creatine? Just wanted final clarification. Also, where a place I can buy a fabric tape measure…I don’t see any fabric stores around by me, any other suggestions? I have my own calipers but I don’t know how to take the measurements. I’ll have a friend do it for me but where and what exactly do I measure. I’ve had it done before but never really paid attention since I didn’t have my own calipers. Is there a website or anything that someone could direct me towards so I get a relativetly accurate measurement?
The combination is fine, though as a matter of economy I’d save the Methoxy-7 for later, when “off,” since it will do more good then.
I’d make a point of making sure all meals contain a good amount of carbs.
Tape measures made of fabric or easily-flexible
fiberglass (I think that’s what they are) are available at Wal-Marts, K-marts, etc. Hopefully someone else can suggest a website for you that gives good instructions on how to take caliper readings.
I see when not on Mag-10 or steroids, you strongly reccomend 30-35% fats to keep testosterone high. I was wondering what you normally prescribe for the carb and protein percentages at this time as well?
Thanks for your help Bll, I start today and will let you know how it goes…Mike
I’m not sure that for off weeks, other than
making sure to consume maintenance calories in the first week, that advantages and disadvantages of various diets are any different for MAG-10 off weeks as for any other off week.
It seems to me that isocaloric, Massive Eating,
and cyclical ketogenic approaches all work well.
I guess no one is going to answer my question or maybe they can’t. I have heard it said that oral pro-hormones aren’t as effective as a transdermal application. I have heard it said in some forums in here that orals lose their luster in the digestive process. How is Mag-10 different or is it? I’m not doubting its effectiveness, I’m just trying to get some education on the subject before I dish out the cash.
Oral pharmaceutical anabolic steroids
protect themselves from first-pass metabolism at
the 17-hydroxy by including a 17alpha-methyl
which blocks access to that hydroxy. Two disadvantages: liver toxicity, and not a type of modification that’s acceptable to make on a natural product and still count as a natural product.
MAG-10 is protected from first-pass metabolism instead by including a 17-ethylcarbonate group at the 17-position. No liver toxicity, and making an ester of a natural product is accepted as legal and retains status as a natural product.