My Overtraining Nightmare

Training Bodybuilding
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[quote]mch60360 wrote:
Just a sidenote and something to consider, IMO milk is something to avoid in a health conscious diet. You keep reiterating that you are becoming fond of milk like it means something.

As a personal trainer I never recommended milk and often mentioned the idea of cutting back on it. As a Chiropractic student I am finding it is less than desirble for health and will not recommend it once I am a Doctor. [/quote]

I will admit, that dairy products can cause a little inflammation, much mucus production (pretty standard), and some individuals can have an intolerance which causes things like eczema/acne, and some are lactose intolerant…but if these aren’t much of an issue then why the warning against dairy? I fart like crazy and get bad stomach cramps from eating broccoli, but wouldn’t it be a bit narrow minded of me to universally recommend that no-one should eat it?

Going by personal experience, I have never felt more healthy than I did before now that my diet is actually largely dairy based. Before, I was quite a “health freak” - I used cut out dairy because of what I’d heard, and I ate plenty portions of fruit/veg and a range of other things like nuts/fish…and yet I would still get ill really frequently. Then I switched to a very basic “British diet”, (your usual dairy, meat, potatoes, oats etc) and have never looked back since. My health has been great.

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[quote]cmorgan00 wrote:

[quote]mch60360 wrote:
Yes she is on thyroid hormone still.

Just a sidenote and something to consider, IMO milk is something to avoid in a health conscious diet. You keep reiterating that you are becoming fond of milk like it means something.

As a personal trainer I never recommended milk and often mentioned the idea of cutting back on it. As a Chiropractic student I am finding it is less than desirble for health and will not recommend it once I am a Doctor. [/quote]

I see, interesting, the nutritionist/chiropractor I see is also very against milk. I know there’s all that fuss about people being intolerant to it, but i personally don’t notice any negative effects from drinking it.
[/quote]

Since you never answered… How much do you weigh? How Tall are you? Estimated BodyFat? Were you losing or gaining weight when you started noticing the symptoms?

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I kinda figured you didn’t eat enough. Especially carbs. When I’m gaining, I eat almost as many calories just in carbs as your entire daily diet. Right now I’ve leveled off in preparation for a cut, and I’m still almost at 4000 calories per day.

Of course you’re losing strength. You’re using up all your energy and not replacing it. Think about it: Let’s say you use 1 gallon of gas a day in your car. You can’t put 5 gallons a week in it and expect it to keep going. It will develop an acute case of hypofuelism. You can take it home, not drive it, put 5 gallons a week in it until you have a full tank again, and start driving it again, but unless you change something, you’re gonna be right back on the side of the road again.

This would be a good read for you:

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Something tells me the OP isn’t gonna take the diet advice seriously. 2,000 cals is crap you need to double that

Edit: This is something that you can take ideas from, and it’s simple.

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[quote]cmorgan00 wrote:

[quote]its_just_me wrote:
A tip for breakfast:

Night before, shove some oats in a blender with milk and whey protein, mix up and put in the fridge for morning…quick and easy, and you’ll have no excuse for putting off breakfast :)[/quote]

I just tried this, bought a blender, oats, milk, blended it all up, i forgot the whey but i’ll remember then next time. It worked out well, fast and easy and tastes good. Is this sort of thing ideal to have every morning or just some?[/quote]

Yeah have it every morning if you like it!

Oats have been a staple in many countries and for good reasons.

In my opinion, they’re the best complex carbohydrate out there (range of nutrients to support energy) and one other benefit that not many people are that familiar with (aside from extra energy) is the mood enhancing effects of them. They are like little anti-depressants. You’ll notice instantly the lift in mood after taking them.

Old Scottish sayings about porridge, aka oats, used to mention something along the lines of keeping you strong and making you endure longer.

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[quote]beaul wrote:

[quote]cmorgan00 wrote:

[quote]mch60360 wrote:
Yes she is on thyroid hormone still.

Just a sidenote and something to consider, IMO milk is something to avoid in a health conscious diet. You keep reiterating that you are becoming fond of milk like it means something.

As a personal trainer I never recommended milk and often mentioned the idea of cutting back on it. As a Chiropractic student I am finding it is less than desirble for health and will not recommend it once I am a Doctor. [/quote]

I see, interesting, the nutritionist/chiropractor I see is also very against milk. I know there’s all that fuss about people being intolerant to it, but i personally don’t notice any negative effects from drinking it.
[/quote]

Since you never answered… How much do you weigh? How Tall are you? Estimated BodyFat? Were you losing or gaining weight when you started noticing the symptoms?
[/quote]

I haven’t weighed myself in ages, but probably about 12 stone, that’s what I usually weigh. I’m just about 5’11 tall. I last did bodyfat a long time ago, I was about 17%, don’t know what it would be now, probably similar.

I didn’t notice a change in my weight when the symptoms started.

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[quote]Liv92 wrote:
Something tells me the OP isn’t gonna take the diet advice seriously. 2,000 cals is crap you need to double that

Edit: This is something that you can take ideas from, and it’s simple.

[/quote]

Up to 2500 actually. Sure it’s a lot less than 4000. I can probably get up to 3000 in the short term quite easily, but 4000 isn’t going to happen over night.

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[quote]cmorgan00 wrote:

[quote]Liv92 wrote:
Something tells me the OP isn’t gonna take the diet advice seriously. 2,000 cals is crap you need to double that

Edit: This is something that you can take ideas from, and it’s simple.
[/quote]

Up to 2500 actually. Sure it’s a lot less than 4000. I can probably get up to 3000 in the short term quite easily, but 4000 isn’t going to happen over night.
[/quote]

Of course not, but that should be your aim to get to at least 4,000. Maybe more wouldn’t be a bad idea once you’ve begun training for a few weeks. The last thing you want is for your problems to start up again because you didn’t want to eat more.

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Here’s what to do when you get back to the gym:

When you get that burning desire to exercise again, and energy levels are back to normal, that’s likely the time to think about going back (maybe wait a little just to be on the safe side).

The main thing when you return is keeping an eye on your intensity and volume. Mainly intensity though. What you should do is pick a load that you’re used to doing 8-10 reps with (I believe that’s what you said you did anyway), reduce the load slightly (like by about 15%) because your strength/muscles will have atrophied after the extended lay-off.

Then, here’s the key part, do ONLY 5 reps per set instead of 8-10. Before, you would have been used to doing 3 sets of 8-10 reps (last set being failure set or near) - this is called “straight sets”. But now, you’ll be doing what’s called accumulative fatigue sets. This means that the load stays the same, and the first few sets aren’t very hard, but as fatigue builds up, the 4th/5th set will get harder and harder (you reach failure or near on your 4th to 6th set).

Because you need to break gently into lifting again, don’t take any sets to failure, just close. Don’t be too concerned about the seeming “lack of effort” because you’ll still make progress every week (sometimes even more than if you pushed to the max every week).

And because you are not going to the max on your sets (except near max on the last set), and you’re not doing as many reps, you can manage a few more sets (typically 4-6 sets).

If you do all the above, you’ll manage to get in enough volume for strength/growth, but not push your body over the limit. Systematic fatigue is easier to control with the method I mentioned. Later on when your health is 100%, and you get your diet in order (taking in enough calories) you can think about doing things like “Ramping”, drop sets and failure sets etc.

Will post an abbreviated example routine for you next…

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[quote]Liv92 wrote:

[quote]cmorgan00 wrote:

[quote]Liv92 wrote:
Something tells me the OP isn’t gonna take the diet advice seriously. 2,000 cals is crap you need to double that

Edit: This is something that you can take ideas from, and it’s simple.
[/quote]

Up to 2500 actually. Sure it’s a lot less than 4000. I can probably get up to 3000 in the short term quite easily, but 4000 isn’t going to happen over night.
[/quote]

Of course not, but that should be your aim to get to at least 4,000. Maybe more wouldn’t be a bad idea once you’ve begun training for a few weeks. The last thing you want is for your problems to start up again because you didn’t want to eat more.[/quote]

Agreed…you’ll need a good ~1000 cals or more than what you were used to. This is pretty easy if you just added another ~200 cals to each meal (can be as easy as adding a milkshake or something else to a meal)

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Here’s a routine:

Basically, you’re going to concentrate on just a handful of exercises (for now). And workout duration is going to be very brief - like around 30-40 mins.

Pick just one or two exercises for each bodypart (compound movement)

Day 1: Back and Chest
Day 2: Legs
Day 3: Off
Day 4: Shoulders and arms
Day 5: Off
Day 6: Repeat

Obviously, only doing one exercise per muscle part would lead to imbalances over time, but it’s good to start with :slight_smile:

Take more off days if needed.

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Won’t hijack thread after this, but dairy I recommend only as a treat. Occasional cheese with a dish or cream with something, or cottage cheese with berries as a dessert. I’d say if broccoli is something that doesn’t agree with you then don’t eat it often. But Dairy affects a large number of people negatively with less benefit than broccoli.

And Europeans are ones who often tolerate dairy better than most.

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[quote]mch60360 wrote:
And Europeans are ones who often tolerate dairy better than most. [/quote]

True, I’m definitely European :wink:

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[quote]cmorgan00 wrote:
I haven’t weighed myself in ages, but probably about 12 stone, that’s what I usually weigh. I’m just about 5’11 tall. I last did bodyfat a long time ago, I was about 17%, don’t know what it would be now, probably similar.

I didn’t notice a change in my weight when the symptoms started.[/quote]

How big are these “12 stones” you speak of? Are we talking like boulders or little pebbles?

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I got two really great books one is “Adrenal Fatigue” by James L. Wilson, the other is
“Cracking the metabolic code” by James B LaValle.

Anyway I think you mentioned if you should take vitamin C, in the supplement section
of Adrenal Fatigue this is what the first paragraph says pertaining to vitamin C

“Of all the vitamins and minerals involved in adrenal metabolism, vitamin C is probably the most important. In fact, the more cortisol made, the more vitamin C used. Vitamin C is so essential to the adrenal hormone cascade and the manufacture of adrenal steroid hormones that before the measurement of adrenal steroid hormones became available, the blood level of Vit C was used as the best indicator of adrenal function level in animal research studies. Vit C is used all along the adrenal cascade and acts as an antioxidant within the adrenal cortex itself.”

Make sure to get a good quality Vit C. If you get a Vit C supplement with bioflavinoids it will double the effectiveness of the Vit C.

I recommend “Adrenal Fatigue” theres alot of good info.

Something else you might want to do, there’s alot of things you could take, but anyway Tyrosine an amino acid is suppose to be good for the thyroid. Even if you eat a good amount of protein you might want to buy some separately and take it. Here is an excerpt from Cracking Metabolic Code

“Tyrosine, an amino acid contained in protein-rich foods, is especially important for endocrine function, and is required for synthesis of epinephrine and norepinephrine, thyroid hormones, and cortisol.”

Also, if you have adrenal fatigue issues try to keep away from big blood sugar spikes and caffeine.

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I have used Power Drive during stressful times of training and studies and find it to help tremendously. It contains Tyrosine.

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Vitamin C 1000mg timed release with bioflavonoids is exactly what I take. 1 a day. It has 1667% of your RDA.

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Mate, anyway, there is a lack of programming in your training. When you spend some time training, and the weights get heavier, and you pass from couch potato to trainee, things get a bit more complicated. The more you train, while you recover, the better the gains from it, but you cant do it always, nobody can. Also as you pass from beginner to intermediate and advanced, the intensity and volume of training changes.

Purpose of programming is, in short term, to prepare you with safety, to get to the point where where your trainig volume, intensity intensivness etc are at the hightest you can handle, for a bit time. then you have to take a step back to allow your body’s systems to recover somewhat, in order to go 2-3 steps forward. Thats usually in the terms of a mesocyle.

Long term now, the point of programming is to build up your training tolerance on intensity and volume, using a step to step approach over the years, as Rome was not built in one day.

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Thanks to all the guys whi have contributed to this thread.
This information is beneficial to me as well.

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I’ve came up with a new meal plan, I worked this out based on foods I enjoy eating and i’ve been going along with it today as I came up with it so I know I can do it:

8am 100g oats, 1 scoop whey powder, 300ml milk = 555 calories

10.30am chicken with vegetables and a banana = 500 calories

1.30pm 120g tuna with olive oil, 125g wholegrain rice and an apple = 494 calories

4.30pm 2 eggs scrambled in 100ml milk, 50g oats in 150 ml milk = 470 calories

7pm sweet potatoes with fish (unprocessed cod for example) = 550-600 calories

10pm 200g cottage cheese and 50g almonds = 460 calories

That’s just over 3000 calories a day spread between 6 meals. A good start I hope. It wouldn’t be hard to increase the amount of throw in a piece of fruit here and there to increase it further.

Any comments? I used oats blended in milk twice, that should be ok right? Milk is 100% lactose free, but it’s still cows milk.

One thing I didn’t include was my supplements. I take fish oil 4 times a day each time with a meal, aswell as vitamins. On gym days, you can add 500 calories to the daily calorie intake because that’s how many calories I get from my post workout drink, so it’s gonna be around 3500+ calories on gym days.

Would it be necessary to add a scoop of whey in with the cottage cheese and almonds before bed?