My Experience On the Anabolic Diet

Nutrition
921

Wow, I must say that I’m quite amazed at the numbers everyone is throwing out there in terms of pounds lost. 20 lbs. in 5 weeks? Dang!

I’m at 204 right and probably somewhere in the lower 20s at far as BF% goes. I’ve been lifting regularly as well as biking and running. I’ve been drinking approx. 3 to 4 liters of water a day along with the “retail store” version of HOT-ROX. Apparently the T-Nation version is stronger. Didn’t know that when I made my purchase. It better be stronger for $50. I digress.

I’m going to give this AD diet a shot starting Monday. I’m going to emphasis getting as much Protein as I guess along with fat and low carbs.

Just for refreshment, can someone tell me the difference between this diet and the Atkins diet? Also, do you start the carb loads during the first two transition weeks or after those are over?

922

Samir, coupla things:

-You go 12 days straight staying at <30 grams of carbs per day, excluding any carbs from fiber

-AFTER the 12 days, you do a 1-1.5 day carb up

-After carb up weekend, resume low carbs M-F and then carb up the following weekend, etc…

-Atkins is straight low carbs 24/7/365 where as the AD features high carbs 1-2 days a week. There are various hormonal benefits to the carb spike that have been explained ad nauseum in previous posts.

At the risk of sounding condescending, you sound like you don’t have a good grasp on the mechanics of the AD yet. Try and read this entire thread (yeah, I know it’s a bitch, but it’s a gooood bitch to get through) to really get a grasp of how this works. I’m not saying this to be a dick but rather so that when you begin, you can get it right from the start - I kinda half-assed into the AD after a few weeks of the T-Dawg 2.0 and in hindsight, wish I’d ADed it right from the start. It’s not hard to follow and damn, does it work.

923

Deinabolic -

Thanks for the response and the information. You didn’t come accross as a dick or anything. I do need to go back and read the whole thread and I will. This sounds like a great plan. I’ll be sure to really pay attention to this thread.

924

[quote]samir wrote:
Deinabolic -

Thanks for the response and the information. You didn’t come accross as a dick or anything. I do need to go back and read the whole thread and I will. This sounds like a great plan. I’ll be sure to really pay attention to this thread.

[/quote]

Cool. Good luck and take some before/after pics. Even though I’ve been into training and nutrition for ten-plus years, this is my first foray into low carb eating and I’m learning new stuff about my body everyday. Coolest “diet” ever.

925
926

[quote]Disc Hoss wrote:
Everyone;

Do a google search on “the Anabolic Diet”. There is a source for the CD-ROM and the video. Book is not in hard copy any longer. And if you want to print it, it’s only about 100 pages.

Best,
DH

Sorry HOSS, found the answer to “where can I get a copy of the CD here”.

Thanks

[/quote]

927

[quote]toddjacobs13 wrote:
Gentlemen,

 I have noticed a difference in the recommendations for cutting while on the AD.

DH seems to recommend shortening the carb window and reducing carb intake to around 400 grams per weekend.

Vasu recommends waving calories throughout the week at low levels overall and then spiking with extremely high cals and high carbs on weekends.

I am interested to hear from the AD experts about the relative merits and drawbacks for each approach.

Todd[/quote]

Hey Todd, Like Vasu I like waving calories. I used this approach with great results a few years ago cutting for a BodyBuilding contest. Personally I don’t ‘count’ cals, after this long in the trenches I have a pretty good idea of what/how many carbs/cals I’m getting. It seems to me that the rebound affect you get from going from low cals to high goes hand in hand with the AD.

Not sure of the science but practical experience has shown me time and again that once you ‘starve’ your muscles of something, the body super compensates when you give that something back to it. Witness the ‘Pump’ you get just from wolfing down some carbs on the weekend. Like anything give both a try. Follow the basic template of the AD and success is sure to come your way.

Barry

928

[quote]
I also said that you could probably search for it on limewire or another file sharing service and luck out. (this part made the post, it was edited so I could see why people think I just downloaded it online)
quote]

I was searching Limewire for it but couldnt’ find anything. What did you search by? I tried Anabolic Diet, Anabolic, Diet, Di Pasquale, etc… Nothing came back. Any suggestions?

Thanks.

929

[quote]extol7extol wrote:
Hey all-

I followed the AD back when it was first introduced by Dr. D back in 95 (I think). I still have the video but apparently I have lost the booklet that came with the video.

Anyways, I followed the AD for about 6 months. As I recall, I quit the AD because of what I thought back then was a little flaccidity, that is, I thought I was gaining fat–but after reading comments by those savvy(i.e., discerning), seasoned veterans, it seems that if I just kept on a bit longer and/or made some adjustments the flaccidity would have dissipated.
Thinking back, I certainly would have added more fiber and water to the low carb week.

Some questions for the more erudite (though certainly NOT limited just to them) ones–at least as far as experience with the AD is concerned:

Could the aforementioned flaccidity be due to too much sodium from bacon, cheese, etc.?

What about too much sodium despite the low carbs–that is, could someone or more specifically, have you experienced bloating, water retention, flaccidiy, or whatever due to too much sodium from yummy bacon, during the low carb (30 grams) week? If so, the only thing that I can think of to remedy the situation is to increase water intake all the more, plus maybe increase potassium intake to X amount? What is the maximum recommended dosage for potassium (K) by the way during the low carb/high protein/high fat strech? 1 gram?

Thanks and later,

extol

P.S. By the way, I HAVE read though the ENTIRE thread. Thus, if anything in the above has been addressed already my apologies in advance. Also, I am by no means a ‘newbie’ so very short, concise, brief, comments/answers will more than suffice–specially if something has already been repeatedly addressed.
[/quote]

Extol: I am not sure if you got your question here answered?
I have had much prior experience with Lyle McDonalds version of the diet and although I didn’t count my calories for fat loss like I should; I have fine tuned the diet more this time around. Having said that, I think you hit the nail on the head when you speculated on the “flaccidity” that you experienced being caused by “high sodium” foods.

Some people are not as sensitve to sodium in food as others. I, like yourself, seem to fall into the latter category. I now try to make lower sodium food choices when on the higher fat part of my week. For example, I tend to use less regular cheese products and more “cream cheese”. I tend to avoid bacon but do include plenty of red meat(beef). If you do not like the puffiness that you get from eating higher sodium foods, then simply select ones that have lower sodium content.

Also, I have found that drinking alot of water, especially with a meal of salty foods, only made the problem worse. Drink plenty of water way before or a whiles AFTER eating those types of foods and that may help. I think SWOLECAT even recommended that in one of his “precontest prep” articles.

Stay strong bro!

Don

930

Samir - as far as trying to ditch fat, sounds like the biggest tweaks are to be done to the carb up days and not the P/F days during the week.

During the week - just figure out what amount of cals you want to consume and hit it. Maybe wave up/down a little within a 500calorie range but for the first month or so, just adhering to the basics should melt the fat off regardless.

Carb ups (disclaimer - I’m learnign as I go here, too): for leaning out, keep the carb sources clean and try carbing for just one full day for starters, not 36 hours as folks looking to gain follow. By clean, I mean whole/dark grain sources, oatmeal and fruits/veggies.

Just a page or two ago, DH mentioned considering keeping your carb intake limited to about 400 grams/day when leaning out instead of the 800+ recommended for bulking. I’ve been doing the 800+ and admittedly not being as strict as I should and seem to have plateaued this past week or so. After a few carb ups, you’ll start to be able to tell when you’ve gone too far by when you go from feeling pumped but tight to just plain soft, if that makes sense.

931

I think both ways work, and many others too. Even on the AD, despite it’s magic and rule breaking, at some point its about caloric intake. Not in the normal sense, but you get my drift.

I like Vas’ creativity. I have no problem whatsoever recommending his ideas. My thought is that (quick synopsis) if you are carb sensitive, then the best way to reduce/cut is to shorten the load and allow for a longer fat cycle.

CAREFUL HERE: Even possibly taking a single meal on wednesday (for about 100-200g CHO in the evening as last meal) and then doing the 12 hour load on Saturday will work well for many. Mixing the “tricky” mid-week spike with much longer of a weekend load can really screw you up though, so I usually only advocate it for cutting on folks who are carb sensitive AND yet feel run down mid week. They are a minority. If you find that you handle the loads easily enough, then feel free to keep the load longer and swing low-cal in the week. Randomness is really the key, in addition to making sure that your weekly amount is below maintenance.

For those who feel a bit weak and sluggish, I first like to spike calories on wednesday and go lower on mon, tues, thurs, fri. For this spike, I’ve done well with two things more than all else. Steak and olive oil. They are just energizing and satisfying. Just put the oil on your salad and steak or take a few spoons. Great for a pickup.

It’s all so relative and individual that you get to have fun and really learn yourself. As long as the CHO is kept in the acceptable range, and the load’s aren’t made too short or too long (12 being low end, @40 or so being high end) then all is good. We deal in “absolutes” with respect to the diet’s basic concepts, but allow for great lattitude with it’s practice thereafter.

Again, the one caveat on all this is to make sure you’ve been on the AD for a few weeks to get that initial adaptation. Don’t start out dieting or it could be rough on you. But really, if you can stick it out, then even that isn’t wrong in an absolute sense.

I don’t know about ya’ll, but that freedom makes the AD all the more appealing.

Now for lean gaining, I’ve seen it work best a few different ways. Opposite ways. ;-0.

For the carb sensitive person, keeping cals about 20+% (depends on YOUR body) above maintenance during the fat/protein phase and then spiking the cals on the load by only a bit more (say another 10%). The intake is pretty evenly distributed with this approach.

For the guy who does well on CHO loads, then moderate/maintenance weekdays and big loads can do well. Just watch that waistline!

For the cautious gainer, try waving the cals in a “coin-flip” fashion. Make tails your maintenance day, and heads your surplus day. Say 30% or more if you like. This should statistically give you 3-4 high days per week and a roughly equal amount of maint. days. It’s a gradual coaxing the works well for people who tend to be endomorphic.

In the end, the inverse caloric truth is in effect on gaining. No surplus = No mass gains.

But you knew that didn’t you? ;-). I just never cease to be amazed at how folks don’t realize that you have to measure and record to be sure. One of the “secrets” of results…measurement

best,
DH

[quote]mozhne wrote:
toddjacobs13 wrote:
Gentlemen,

 I have noticed a difference in the recommendations for cutting while on the AD.

DH seems to recommend shortening the carb window and reducing carb intake to around 400 grams per weekend.

Vasu recommends waving calories throughout the week at low levels overall and then spiking with extremely high cals and high carbs on weekends.

I am interested to hear from the AD experts about the relative merits and drawbacks for each approach.

Todd

Hey Todd, Like Vasu I like waving calories. I used this approach with great results a few years ago cutting for a BodyBuilding contest. Personally I don’t ‘count’ cals, after this long in the trenches I have a pretty good idea of what/how many carbs/cals I’m getting. It seems to me that the rebound affect you get from going from low cals to high goes hand in hand with the AD.

Not sure of the science but practical experience has shown me time and again that once you ‘starve’ your muscles of something, the body super compensates when you give that something back to it. Witness the ‘Pump’ you get just from wolfing down some carbs on the weekend. Like anything give both a try. Follow the basic template of the AD and success is sure to come your way.

Barry[/quote]

932

Thank you to Vasu, DH, and Barry. I found all of your posts very informative. I have been on the diet since the July 4th weekend. I went from 220ish to 242 as of last weekend. Now I just decided to take up rugby and I need to improve my running conditioning. One obvious way to do that is to drop some weight.

My method for weight gain was to keep cals high on Sat-Wed and “low” on Thurs and Fri. With high cals around 5000 and “low” around 3900. I agree with all that waving calories is the best way to achieve any kind of weight fluctuation. RMR is the key here. Bringing the RMR lower is a key to gaining, while raising the RMR is a key to cutting. I do like Vasu’s plan.

Especially since my appetite is largest on the weekends, and the weekends provide a form of relief. However, my concern was that shortchanging the weekday calories my stifle some of the positive hormonal benefits that the diet provides. The bottomline, it seems, is that you just have to experiment and go with what works. I appreciate all of the feedback. I will now go forth and cut!

Todd

933

http://t-nation.com/readTopic.do?id=698977

Progress pics between weeks two and six since starting the AD. Lighting kinda washes out the changes but I’m down +/- 10lbs since starting.

934

Rock on, Dein. Keep’em coming.

DH

[quote]Deinabolic wrote:
http://t-nation.com/readTopic.do?id=698977

Progress pics between weeks two and six since starting the AD. Lighting kinda washes out the changes but I’m down +/- 10lbs since starting.[/quote]

935

[quote]Disc Hoss wrote:
10-20g of heavy whipping cream.
[/quote]

DH - I notice you mention whipping cream a lot. Do you like it because it’s a dense (and inexpensive) form of carb-free calories or is there more to it?

936

Jeff K:

Heavy whipping cream is often used in other diet strategies because it contains minimal CHO, and when consumed with PRO, slows the digestion of the PRO significantly.

I would recommend heavy whipping cream during a gaining phase and flax during a hardening phase. The Omega 3’s in fat do much for the metabolism.

And to borrow from something I read:

“The cream is anabolic. Rheo Blair, Vince Gironda, and others back in the 60s used to make shakes modeled after mothers milk. They used to mix cream or half and half with protein powder.”

937

Cream is just so tasty and allows for some fat w/ the protein for better digestion. It’s good for cutting or gaining. I do think it probably has qualities that are unique. Nothing I can back up, just a feeling. Probably the more “anabolic” possibilities were with the good old fashioned raw cream and half/half. Some speculate that colostrum etc… was the secret. I think it’s just a good, tasty food that allows for a treat when mixed right with protein. Almost like a shake. Flax is good too, but I like some saturated fat mixed in at the same time. My favorite is making a good Banana Grow shake with a few tbsp. of cream and then washing down some fish oil too. I’ll use this as a “snack” when at work.

Best,
DH

[quote]vasudeva wrote:
Jeff K:

Heavy whipping cream is often used in other diet strategies because it contains minimal CHO, and when consumed with PRO, slows the digestion of the PRO significantly.

I would recommend heavy whipping cream during a gaining phase and flax during a hardening phase. The Omega 3’s in fat do much for the metabolism.

And to borrow from something I read:

“The cream is anabolic. Rheo Blair, Vince Gironda, and others back in the 60s used to make shakes modeled after mothers milk. They used to mix cream or half and half with protein powder.”
[/quote]

938

Okay, here’s what I’m going to try as I cut.

Weekdays: 3500 cals, 2500 fat cals, 245 g protein
Weekends: over 5000 cals per day

I will evaluate after three weeks, but my gut feeling tells me that this will work pretty well.

If I really need to kick this into high gear, I will eat high carbs on Saturday only and my diet will like so:

Saturday: over 5000 cals
Sunday-Tues: 3500 cals, 2500 fat cals, 245 g protein
Wed: over 5300 cals, over 4100 fat cals, 300 g protein
Thurs-Fri: 3500 cals, 2500 fat cals, 245 g protein

I am supplementing with Carbolin 19, Cissus, HOT-ROX, cAMPhibolic, Alpha Male (5 days/week), Fish Oil, Flax Oil, Vitamin E, Calcium, ZMA, and a multi (which is a hell of a stack) (and Grow! if you count that as a supp)

Todd

939

wellp folks… I’m 6 weeks in now.

To be honest, I’ve abused the hell out of my body during the last few days, but it was “Bender Week” in Boulder (aka all your friends are back in town and it’s time to have some fun!), and ya know… now I’m over it and ready to keep rockin with the AD!

Some things I’ve noticed so far:

I devised something I called Damage Control. Granted I was drinking for a few days this week, I tried to do it in a way that wouldn’t be too obtrusive to me. Basically I stayed on the normal AD every day but added in the booze. In the last 2 weeks or so, I’ve started to be able to see/feel the glycogen/carb load differene on me on a sunday vs a thursday. These past few days I’ve felt at the point where I normally do on a Monday. My weekend carb load was also kept to an ingestion of less than 200 g a day (beer not counted).

I actually planned this out so it’d be as Controlled as possible. Before you all start to flame me for being a drunk or needing to take control of my life, I would like to tell those that say this to “suckit” and to “get over yourself,” and maybe even to “get a life” as I think I know how to handle myself.

That being said, I think I’ve rolled out of my dark days ok and am ready to get the ball rolling again. I figure that I might hit a small metabolic shift again, but even the last time (only time) it was only for about an afternoon.

Also, during the last week, I knew I’d be drinking, so I thought in advance to chop some calories from the diet to 12x bodyweight, which put the total around 2000 kcal a day, as such I’ve actually lost some chub this last week (about 2 pounds), this on top of a couple compliments from friends I haven’t seen in a while who all say I look a lot bigger, so things are going good!

this is the AeroStallion, over and OUT (but not blacked out, that was so last week)

940

So, spent a goodly portion of company time reading this thread in it’s entirety last week.

I officially started Thursday, so nearly through day five. Just wanted to say hey and give it a bump.

So far pretty smooth sailing, but I was already very low carb so wasn’t a huge transition. Energy is fine and strength as of saturday (leg day) was actually up, tonight is chest w/o so we’ll see. :slight_smile:

Supplements currently include HOT-ROX, Methoxy-7, ZMA, fish oil, multi-vitamin, Grow!, Power Drive, creatine. I was already using all these items, nothing new as of the beginning of this diet…

Sabrina