hey guys… im reading through the Anabolic Solution and look at this on pg. 70 …
“Most people who have to increase their daily carbs usually level off between 100 and 200 grams per day. I’ve found that about one-half to one gram of dietary carbs per pound bodyweight per day is the norm in those who are relatively poor fat oxidizers. In a small number of cases it may be necessary to work up to as much as 3 grams of carbs per pound of body weight, depending on the individual and the activity that he or she is involved in.”
wtf? 3 grams per pound of bodyweight. for me that would be 600grams of cho per day. Theres no way that he could be serious about that person still remaining a fat burner.
Wow what an interesting discussion of metabolism we have just had. I can offer some correlations on either side of the fence.
On the one side I have noticed that I can train thai boxing (highly anerobic) and lift on smaller CHO ups with longer periods of low CHO and not experience presumable muscle loss so long as cals are high. Then again during intense times of training I have opted to do mini cho ups after the last training session of each day and found that my fat metabolism was not harmed. I basically feel the same way either way but prefer the lower CHO periods because of the better endurance.
I feel that the 3 hour wrestling/boxing/gymnastics combo workouts on the weekends are far easier if I stay clean low CHO the days before. If I get into too many CHO then I can feel myself crashing half way through. whereas if Im all eggs and beef I have perpetual kung fu strength and last longer. this is all of course based on personal case study.
It’s good to be long term fat adapted, provides room to see legitimate results, especially along the energy line. Energy is key for me and I love the AD format for that. Even during the short periods when I CHO up every double training day with just one big dose of Surge I can still feel good and not fuk up the fat metabolism.
It’s also nice not to crave carbs any more either. That’s the number one reason the 12 day break in is so shitty. Now i could do the 12 day break in twice in a row and love every bit.
Good research though guys. I like how trib has blossomed on the standard Rx 5/2 scheme. See what happens when you stick to it. plus with that avatar you can’t go wrong.
Also check out the cheesecake dessert in Berardi’s gift desserts PDF. I made that shit and it’s mad low CHO and so awesome.
Super high protein low carb lime cheesecake. Fat girls hate it when they see me eat the whole thing at once.
[quote]Bizmark wrote:
hey guys… im reading through the Anabolic Solution and look at this on pg. 70 …
“Most people who have to increase their daily carbs usually level off between 100 and 200 grams per day. I’ve found that about one-half to one gram of dietary carbs per pound bodyweight per day is the norm in those who are relatively poor fat oxidizers. In a small number of cases it may be necessary to work up to as much as 3 grams of carbs per pound of body weight, depending on the individual and the activity that he or she is involved in.”
wtf? 3 grams per pound of bodyweight. for me that would be 600grams of cho per day. Theres no way that he could be serious about that person still remaining a fat burner.[/quote]
It might depend on CHO type. I have found that it takes a lot to break your fat metabolism once you have it chugging. There is a lot of evidence that it has not only economical advantages (8>4-5) but also has a paleological base that has been fostered in humans for however long. So once you get yourself back into your caveman genes it may prove hard to fuck them up.
I went a whole 1 month vacation eating as good as I could in the land of rice. After I got back I popped back into fat burning with little worries. The AD is like a mom, she’ll always welcome you home. In theory.
Bizmark - I’ll be curious to see how your ketone experiment pans out. From reading the eBook a couple of times I don’t necessarily get the impression that it’s actually important for us to be in ketosis while on the AD.
On PWO shakes:
Is there any particular reason why whey would be a superior choice to something like casein or even just whole foods pre and post workout on the AD?
If I understand the science correctly (and I’m sure I don’t) then what the body is going to be looking for are fatty acids in the stomach to power the workout, not carbs or protein to break down. If that’s the case, then why would it be benificial to have a ‘fast digesting’ protein like whey over, say, a big cup of cream?
…I have to echo Chris on this as well. Once completely fat adapted (read 6-8 months min) -the AD can be summed up in one word:
Individualization
The devil is certainly in the details at the beginning -but once you’ve got it all dialed in …the AD is INCREDIBLY convenient INCREDIBLY forgiving and INCREDIBLY adaptive.
The take home message:
Put in the time, be diligent, be patient and once adapted -EXPERIMENT.
peace
[quote]realpeanutbutter wrote:
Bizmark wrote:
hey guys… im reading through the Anabolic Solution and look at this on pg. 70 …
“Most people who have to increase their daily carbs usually level off between 100 and 200 grams per day. I’ve found that about one-half to one gram of dietary carbs per pound bodyweight per day is the norm in those who are relatively poor fat oxidizers. In a small number of cases it may be necessary to work up to as much as 3 grams of carbs per pound of body weight, depending on the individual and the activity that he or she is involved in.”
wtf? 3 grams per pound of bodyweight. for me that would be 600grams of cho per day. Theres no way that he could be serious about that person still remaining a fat burner.
It might depend on CHO type. I have found that it takes a lot to break your fat metabolism once you have it chugging. There is a lot of evidence that it has not only economical advantages (8>4-5) but also has a paleological base that has been fostered in humans for however long. So once you get yourself back into your caveman genes it may prove hard to fuck them up.
I went a whole 1 month vacation eating as good as I could in the land of rice. After I got back I popped back into fat burning with little worries. The AD is like a mom, she’ll always welcome you home. In theory.
[quote]Pauli D wrote:
…I have to echo Chris on this as well. Once completely fat adapted (read 6-8 months min) -the AD can be summed up in one word:
Individulization
The devil is certainly in the details at the beginning -but once you’ve got it all dialed in …the AD is INCREDIBLY convenient INCREDIBLY forgiving and INCREDIBLY adaptive.
The take home message:
Put in the time, be diligent, be patient and once adapted -EXPERIMENT.
peace
realpeanutbutter wrote:
Bizmark wrote:
hey guys… im reading through the Anabolic Solution and look at this on pg. 70 …
“Most people who have to increase their daily carbs usually level off between 100 and 200 grams per day. I’ve found that about one-half to one gram of dietary carbs per pound bodyweight per day is the norm in those who are relatively poor fat oxidizers. In a small number of cases it may be necessary to work up to as much as 3 grams of carbs per pound of body weight, depending on the individual and the activity that he or she is involved in.”
wtf? 3 grams per pound of bodyweight. for me that would be 600grams of cho per day. Theres no way that he could be serious about that person still remaining a fat burner.
It might depend on CHO type. I have found that it takes a lot to break your fat metabolism once you have it chugging. There is a lot of evidence that it has not only economical advantages (8>4-5) but also has a paleological base that has been fostered in humans for however long. So once you get yourself back into your caveman genes it may prove hard to fuck them up.
I went a whole 1 month vacation eating as good as I could in the land of rice. After I got back I popped back into fat burning with little worries. The AD is like a mom, she’ll always welcome you home. In theory.
[quote]Bizmark wrote:
I bought some ketostix and tested to see if I was in ketosis today… all I have to say is, wtf. Not even “trace” amounts of ketones. Ive been taking in 30g carbs per day, about 50 including fiber. And I’m not in ketosis? How could that possibly be? I feel way better on this diet than a normal carb diet, even increased energy. I do not see how I’m not in ketosis.
So I think I need to do a little more experimenting with this. Ill go until next sunday until I do a carb load. Ill test to see if I’m in ketosis on monday, wednesday, and friday. Checking the difference on all the days.
Also, I’m gonna cut out the splenda, cuz I think that might be fucking it up. What Ill do is go for the next few days without splenda, then on tuesday Ill drink some splenda with my coffee and then an hour later check to see if the ketones changed from monday. I’ll let you all know.[/quote]
One is considered in ketosis when he/she is excreting excess ketones either in the breath or urine. My hunch is that you still have circulating ketone bodies in your blood.
As to why you are no longer in ketosis, I think the answer is two-fold: (1) ketosis generally occurs only in the induction phase of Atkins or the AD (and may persist longer if the individual is VERY overweight). Thereafter the body becomes increasingly efficient in regulating how many ketone bodies the liver needs to convert from dietary and body fat. (2) It’s possible that you have slowed down your metabolism significantly through excessive low-carb dieting, and possibly just dieting in general.
Both infrequent cho-ups and dieting for long periods of time (12 weeks or so) are detrimental to long-term weightloss via metabolic slowdown (lower circulating leptin, lower GH, lower test, lower thyroid and T4 output), resulting in diminished returns. I know I’m just some schmuck posting on a T-Nation forum, but this is just my knowledge and experience accrued through extensive reading and similar endeavors as your own.
Ketosis is great for fat-loss, no doubt. But you may want to take a break from a fat-loss phase, maybe slowly returning to maintenance calories and incorporating more frequent CHO-ups for a period of roughly 12 weeks (and remember, it is possible that you may lose weight while increasing calories and CHO… I think Lonnie Lowery’s recent article discussed how long-term dieting made adipose more stubborn… although your focus should basically be on maintenance), and then return to a hypocaloric diet, but still incorporating frequent CHO-ups. Your best bet is probably to seek the advice of CT at his locker room.
As to the splenda messing with ketosis… that’s very possible, but I don’t think ketosis is relevant to you at this point.
[quote]bkmacky9288 wrote:
for chris and ovalpline: i dropped my cals this week from 2500 to 2000 in two days subbing 250 cals at a time…i was 166-7 in the beginning of the week and now im 160 and am now varsity 160 pounder…im happy.
im guessing most of the weight mustve been undigested food cuz ive always worked full intensity so i dont think water couldve been more than 2-3 lbs…im gonna do a two day carb up with 2200 cals both days and im gonna continue at 2000 cals for another week then up to 2500 after the tourny for my metabolism…then do the cycle over and over[/quote]
Dude, that’s awesome. Weightloss and weightgain are really interesting subjects because energy balances (calories in vs calories out) in the body are hardly ever linear. The important thing is that you reached your goal.
Your proposed nutrition plan looks good to me. The only thing I might consider tweaking is the # of calories taken in on the carb-load. That is, pushing them upwards. I would suspect that at that calorie level, with insulin raging, you might be hungry.
Considering it’s the carb-load and you’ll be eating super-clean, you can bump the calories upward without recourse. Then again, if you are feeling just fine, stick with it. The best of luck to you.
ya, ketosis isn’t a huge deal, you don’t need to have the sticks say you’re in ketosis to have fat as you main energy source.
But, ya on the splenda is you read the packs it has spelnda, maltodextrin and dextrose and IS NOT CALORIE or CARB FREE because of that. spenlda itself is really sweet and small so they had to put in two bulking agents. (note they are the same high GI sugary carbs people have post workout)
[quote]Pauli D wrote:
…I have to echo Chris on this as well. Once completely fat adapted (read 6-8 months min) -the AD can be summed up in one word:
Individualization
The devil is certainly in the details at the beginning -but once you’ve got it all dialed in …the AD is INCREDIBLY convenient INCREDIBLY forgiving and INCREDIBLY adaptive.
The take home message:
Put in the time, be diligent, be patient and once adapted -EXPERIMENT.
peace
[/quote]
I couldn’t agree with just about every word of this more.
Hi guys,
Really interested in starting this diet next week.
I have the book and have read it, but a quick question!
You guys seem to speak of 12 days without a weekend carb up? i cant seem to find that in the book, do i have a weekend carb up every week? or just every week apart from the initial start-up phase??
So I started the AD in the beginning of September 2006 with a weight of 160 at about 22% Bodyfat.
Just for kicks, I decided to check my bodyfat today.
Now, these numbers may not be truly reflective of my progress (or lack thereof) because today I took the BF test post workout and during my 36 hour cho up.
Current:
Weight: 178
Bodyfat: 15%
Now, consider that the factors listed above may alter these numbers, let’s assume the weight is the same (although, it’s 4 pounds higher than my pre-cho up), and the bodyfat is up to maybe 18-19%.
At worst, I’ve gained 14 pounds, and lost 2-4%bf and my lifts are finally progressing. At best, I’ve gained 14 pounds, lost 7% BF, and my lifts finally increased.
Either way, life is good on the AD.
AD
EDIT: These numbers from this week include a cake eating fest (a friends birthday last Sunday), and an unscheduled “carb spike” this past Wed (another friend leaving for at least 2 years).
[quote]BrotherO wrote:
Hi guys,
Really interested in starting this diet next week.
I have the book and have read it, but a quick question!
You guys seem to speak of 12 days without a weekend carb up? i cant seem to find that in the book, do i have a weekend carb up every week? or just every week apart from the initial start-up phase??
Thanks guys!!![/quote]
…don’t know which edition you have, but pg 122 of The Anabolic Solution (2002) summarizes it quite nicely.
[quote]AlphaDragon wrote:
So I started the AD in the beginning of September 2006 with a weight of 160 at about 22% Bodyfat.
Just for kicks, I decided to check my bodyfat today.
Now, these numbers may not be truly reflective of my progress (or lack thereof) because today I took the BF test post workout and during my 36 hour cho up.
Current:
Weight: 178
Bodyfat: 15%
Now, consider that the factors listed above may alter these numbers, let’s assume the weight is the same (although, it’s 4 pounds higher than my pre-cho up), and the bodyfat is up to maybe 18-19%.
At worst, I’ve gained 14 pounds, and lost 2-4%bf and my lifts are finally progressing. At best, I’ve gained 14 pounds, lost 7% BF, and my lifts finally increased.
Either way, life is good on the AD.
AD
EDIT: These numbers from this week include a cake eating fest (a friends birthday last Sunday), and an unscheduled “carb spike” this past Wed (another friend leaving for at least 2 years).
[quote]josh.shafer wrote:
AlphaDragon wrote:
So I started the AD in the beginning of September 2006 with a weight of 160 at about 22% Bodyfat.
Just for kicks, I decided to check my bodyfat today.
Now, these numbers may not be truly reflective of my progress (or lack thereof) because today I took the BF test post workout and during my 36 hour cho up.
Current:
Weight: 178
Bodyfat: 15%
Now, consider that the factors listed above may alter these numbers, let’s assume the weight is the same (although, it’s 4 pounds higher than my pre-cho up), and the bodyfat is up to maybe 18-19%.
At worst, I’ve gained 14 pounds, and lost 2-4%bf and my lifts are finally progressing. At best, I’ve gained 14 pounds, lost 7% BF, and my lifts finally increased.
Either way, life is good on the AD.
AD
EDIT: These numbers from this week include a cake eating fest (a friends birthday last Sunday), and an unscheduled “carb spike” this past Wed (another friend leaving for at least 2 years).
Awesome results! What are you goals?
[/quote]
Thanks, I was going to stop at 180lbs, but I now figure that I’ll continue a bulk until March/April. Then?? We’ll see.
