My Experience On the Anabolic Diet

Nutrition
3522

[quote]Cthulhu wrote:
I actually started this diet a week ago,when I finished bulking.
I’m not really fat or anything,just want to lean out a bit after a long bulk.
Strength has gone through the roof,which is kind of weird since it’s been a little over a week now.
Yeah,I admit that some of the people on here get to me with the unfounded,ignorant comments they sometimes make,but after all the people on here who do know what they’re doing and do what they do kind of balances it out.
Thanks Tribulus.
I’m happy you’re not one of “those guys”.[/quote]

No shit.
More than just good manners then, an open mind as well. If you give it time to take hold I think you’ll like it. Did you hit your crash yet? Mine wasn’t too bad, but some guys have get it rough.

3523

[quote]zed962 wrote:
Make sure you get some fats during the load, as well. Some peanut butter in your oatmeal or on your bagel, a little butter and sour cream on your baked potato, you get the idea.

Personally, I don’t focus too much on utilizing solid protein sources or supplements during the loads. The incidentals do add up. However, I do have a scoop of whey or a few eggs with breakfast and then have a solid protein source at dinner (i.e. a cheeseburger or steak). This strategy gives me just enough protein without overdoing it.

Experiment a bit and adjust when needed. Remember, when starting out, focus on the essentials of the diet. As you get that down, your experiences help you to dial it in even more after a few months of focusing on the basics.

Zac
[/quote]

This is pretty close overall to how i do it. I do throw in some EVOO and FFA’s as well though.

3524

@ zed962:

I think I misunderstood you. Do you mean a fat spike? I’ve never heard of that. I thought you meant a mid week carb spike which re-reading your other post I see that i think I missed your point entirely.

3525

As far as clean carbup suggestions go, try whipping up some couscous with a heavy pour of EVOO. Plenty of complex carbs and “clean fats”.
Peace

3526

[quote]ovalpline wrote:
Suggestions needed:
I’m going to shoot for 450 carbs on saturday and sunday from oatmeal, sweet potatoes, and brown rice… buuuuut, I was wondering what I should accompany each meal with… I’ve read Disc Hoss saying repeatedly that the carb-load is a protein-controlled time… with that in mind, I really don’t know what else to eat with my carbs. I know I’m a rookie and I shouldn’t be focusing on fine-tuning, I just feel so in the dark.[/quote]

First of all…are you doing 450/day or 450 total? Are you bulking or cutting? If you are bulking, that is NO WHERE NEAR enough, if it’s for the total time.

Personally, I eat breads/pastas/veggies and fruit those days. I take a few tablespoons of olive oil to get in the fats if I find my fat intake is too low.

Believe it or not, veggie sandwiches with olive oil can be VERY good during carb ups. You’d be surprised how much a few tablespoons of olive oil make the difference…

Pasta salads w/olive oil…yum

Although, I am having a difficult time (in the past few weeks) with too much protein each day. But…each week it gets better.

Basically, you have to adjust each day/week until you get it dialed in…I’ve pretty much nailed my weeklies…except for total cals. For example, I find if I stick to 3000 cals at a 60%fat, 38pro will be a differnt body comp (after a week)than if I do 3000 cals on 55 fat 40 pro.

Weird but true. But to be fair, I had a few days of too much fat during the weekdays.

Live, do, experiment, learn, move on…

That being said…and while I’m loathe to give this advice (primarily because it does not help you directly, i.e: give the answers), you’ll have to keep fine tuning it yourself to your taste and body.

And make sure to keep all of us on this thread updated as we can learn from each other.

AD

3527

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
@ zed962:

I think I misunderstood you. Do you mean a fat spike? I’ve never heard of that. I thought you meant a mid week carb spike which re-reading your other post I see that i think I missed your point entirely.[/quote]

Trib,

My bad. We are not even close to being on the same page. What I meant in my original post is a mid-week spike in calories. Vasudeva’s calorie cycling wave basically involves a deficit for two days, a spike in calories for one day, a deficit for two more days, and then really increasing the calories for the carb-load.

However, even though there is a drastic increase in calories halfway during the week, it’s still a fat/protein day. I’m just trying to figure out if I want to really increase the protein or just bump it up to about 250 grams and really push the fats.

Sorry for the mix-up.

Zac

3528

So here’s what I would call my AD carb loading manifesto . . . in bullet form for easy digestion:

  • A great way to start your carb load is with a high GI/II shake.
  • Eat every two hours.
  • Do not overfeed at any one point despite your overwhelming desire to want to.
  • Take in a lot of Greens to balance out the highly acidic nature of the AD. We need to take care of our digestive track.
  • Take a glucose agent like Vanadal Sulfate or R-ALA for improved insulin sensitivity and glycogen storage.
  • Do not eat a large carb-based meal before bed - you will not sleep well.
  • Begin your carb load with the highest glycemic foods and work your way down
  • You’re done when you begin to hold excess water subcutaneously, not necessarily when you feel bloated. Bloating usually comes as a result of eating too much at one sitting.
  • A mid-week carb spike can be beneficial but make it one meal, dinner is best, and give yourself a couple of hours before going to sleep.
  • Drink lots of water. It will aid in digestion and help you hydrate.
  • Eat fruit. Your liver’s glycogen stores need to be replenished and fructose is the primary facilitator of this.
  • Ensure you take in EFAs and a balance of monos/sats/polys during your load
  • Don’t worry about your protein intake outside of your PWO
  • Total caloric intake varies from person to person but ensure you at least match your average daily caloric intake during the week to aid in resting your leptin balance.
  • Most people do not eat enough during their carb ups, especially during a mass cycle. Maximize your meals with dense foods like rice, chick peas, potatoes, pastas, etc.
  • And finally, those who are cutting, do not fear the carb load . . . it is essential to keep you moving forward on your fat loss progress. To find out if you are getting enough calories in, perform the iodine/thyroid test to gauge where your metabolic rate is at.

Hope that is of some help to those who are searching the thread for info on carb ups.

Cheers,

Sasha

3529

Working on day 5 of the break in period. Just wanted to drop in and introduce myself. I’ve learned a lot from the thread already, and I hope this thing stays alive.

Does anyone else have a problem with getting too much protein. I really have to limit my protein intake to make sure I get 60% fat cals.

Barrett

By the way, what happened to Disc Hoss?

3530

zed962 wrote:
“What I meant in my original post is a mid-week spike in calories. Vasudeva’s calorie cycling wave basically involves a deficit for two days, a spike in calories for one day, a deficit for two more days, and then really increasing the calories for the carb-load.”

On the weeks I’ve managed to do this I’ve noticed better progress in terms of fat loss. Although it was not something I set out to do intentionally. I just wasn’t very hungry on Mon and Tues, gorged myself on Wed and costed into the weekend from there. When I weighed in on Fri afternoon (when I always do) I had dropped substantially more than the previous week.

I noticed the same effect when I did it a few weeks later. Once again, not something I set out to do. Serendipity I believe it’s called.
Peace
Bill

3531

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
Cthulhu wrote:
I actually started this diet a week ago,when I finished bulking.
I’m not really fat or anything,just want to lean out a bit after a long bulk.
Strength has gone through the roof,which is kind of weird since it’s been a little over a week now.
Yeah,I admit that some of the people on here get to me with the unfounded,ignorant comments they sometimes make,but after all the people on here who do know what they’re doing and do what they do kind of balances it out.
Thanks Tribulus.
I’m happy you’re not one of “those guys”.

No shit.
More than just good manners then, an open mind as well. If you give it time to take hold I think you’ll like it. Did you hit your crash yet? Mine wasn’t too bad, but some guys have get it rough.[/quote]

I have quite a bit of experience in nutrition and working out already.
I’ve done low carb diets to cut down a bit.
Hell,I’ve even done higher carb diets.
Thought I’d just give it a try because whenever I do something unexpected in nutrition,my body always acts weird.
I’ve packed on 20 pounds in my bench pressing in just one week(355 pounds).
I think this diet had a lot to do with it.
No.
Not yet.
I think it’s kind of weird how I haven’t crashed yet and it’s been 10 days already.
Did you do the 12-14 day induction phase too,or just went for it?

3532

[quote]Cthulhu wrote:
I have quite a bit of experience in nutrition and working out already.
I’ve done low carb diets to cut down a bit.
Hell,I’ve even done higher carb diets.
Thought I’d just give it a try because whenever I do something unexpected in nutrition,my body always acts weird.
I’ve packed on 20 pounds in my bench pressing in just one week(355 pounds).
I think this diet had a lot to do with it.
No.
Not yet.
I think it’s kind of weird how I haven’t crashed yet and it’s been 10 days already.
Did you do the 12-14 day induction phase too,or just went for it?[/quote]

I figured you did, maybe I have you mixed with somebody else. I thought I remembered reading you saying that you didn’t like low carb diets?

I did 13 days and I crashed on the evening of day 8. Felt like moderate food poisoning for about 12 hours overnight and then abruptly disappeared.

Yeah this has to be a powerlifters dream. Like I was saying before. At about the fifth or sixth week my strength took off(for me) and I started growing more noticably, my wife brought it up. Getting harder too, not really leaner, but my muscles themselves.

3533

Really, you can take either approach. The body is highly adaptive. And it is also dependent on your goals and training.

If higher PRO feels right to you, then go higher PRO… And watch how your body responds. I really believe there is something to listening to what you feel is right.

I found that once I was fat-adapted, my body always found a way to tell me what I needed more or less of.

I am not sure that helps you, brother. But that’s my recommendation.

Lately, I’ve returned to CHO on Sunday and Wednesday… I lift heavy Mon/Tuesday, Wed off, Thurs/Friday light, Sat/Sun off. I create the deficit days on Thurs/Fri/Sat, maintenance on Mon/Tuesday, and some serious calories on Sunday/Wed.

It seems to be working well, and my recovery is superb.

3534

To the question of protein, I use that as my baseline goal, always trying for 260 - 290g daily, adding calories with fat and keeping the carbs under 30g. When sticking at 2000cal day to cut, I find this the easiest approach, heading to chicken breasts and greens as my main meals every two hours from 2 to 8. After four months this has proven the simplest answer and the most convenient.

As for the carb load and when to stop, that has been more difficult. The first flush of carbs is still great, though not as wonderful as it was the first time, but better and longer - kinda like other things. Be careful, because I have found that the filling out and smoothing over is not a quantitative change but qualitative like water going from hot to boiling. There is also a lag which I found out. So an hour or so after a carb meal, I found myself feeling bloated and my abs just vanished.

My advice is to taper it off near the end. Sodium, too, has been a problem since I don’t salt my food and thus on the weekends I get excess water retention. I am currently doing a half day load of about 250g on Wed. followed by a full day of about 700-800g on Saturday and it seems to help with mid week lag.
Anyhow, as Tribulus has said, take your time and approach it in an organized manner and this diet will be your good friend.

3535

[quote]SashaG wrote:
So here’s what I would call my AD carb loading manifesto . . .

…Hope that is of some help to those who are searching the thread for info on carb ups.

Cheers,

Sasha
[/quote]

Great stuff as usual SashaG, thanks.
BTW, do you happen know whether Vanadyl Sulfate or R-ALA is most effective in enhancing insulin sensitivity, if you had to choose one?

3536

Damn, excellent advice all around. Thanks a lot. Interesting to hear about the resetting of leptin levels from CHO feed. Makes sense. Seriously, I 'd like to reiterate: I’m really appreciative of the responses. Excellent help. I start the carb load tomorrow morning and, of course, I shall post my experiences. Thanks all.

3537

Well you guys, I just found one more reason to be on the anabolic diet… so heres what happened… recently I went to the doctor because my adenoids are extremely large and when I get sick they start to block my air passages so that I cant breathe.

Well I’ve been going to doctors for years and they’ve recommended this and that but nothing worked. So I decided to go to a “food” doctor I guess you could say and see what he had to say about it.

He said that for my adenoids to become healthier I would need to cut out most of my grains, starches, and sugars… I was like, holy shit, not only does not eating grains and starches improve how I look, but it will also allow me to breathe when I get sick. ahaha.

so for people who have trouble with adenoids or tonsils, just follow this diet and it should clear that up.

But the only problem now is that my carbups are gonna consist of fruit and maybe a lil bit oatmeal or something. kinda bland but thats ok cuz the meats makes up for it over the week.

3538

I’ve had better results with R-ALA.

3539

[quote]ovalpline wrote:
… I start the carb load tomorrow morning and, of course, I shall post my experiences. Thanks all.[/quote]

My fiest couple carb loads had me snorin by Sat. afternoon.

3540

[quote]Tiribulus wrote:
Cthulhu wrote:
I have quite a bit of experience in nutrition and working out already.
I’ve done low carb diets to cut down a bit.
Hell,I’ve even done higher carb diets.
Thought I’d just give it a try because whenever I do something unexpected in nutrition,my body always acts weird.
I’ve packed on 20 pounds in my bench pressing in just one week(355 pounds).
I think this diet had a lot to do with it.
No.
Not yet.
I think it’s kind of weird how I haven’t crashed yet and it’s been 10 days already.
Did you do the 12-14 day induction phase too,or just went for it?

I figured you did, maybe I have you mixed with somebody else. I thought I remembered reading you saying that you didn’t like low carb diets?

I did 13 days and I crashed on the evening of day 8. Felt like moderate food poisoning for about 12 hours overnight and then abruptly disappeared.

Yeah this has to be a powerlifters dream. Like I was saying before. At about the fifth or sixth week my strength took off(for me) and I started growing more noticably, my wife brought it up. Getting harder too, not really leaner, but my muscles themselves.[/quote]

I said I wasn’t much of a fan of low carb diets like the Atkins diet.
This is more like a carb cycling diet with the high carb days.
With this kind of diet I wouldn’t of made comments until I tried it.
Are you doing this diet to bulk up a bit or lean out?
Or is it because you had diabetes?
Yeah,I’m looking to crash any day now.
Maybe this week.

The funny thing is I’ve been eating 29-30 carbs,not really 10 a day,so thats probably why it’s taking a bit longer.
Since this is gonna be my last week of the diet before the carb up,I’ll probably try hitting no more then 20 carbs a day.

3541

[quote]Cthulhu wrote:
I said I wasn’t much of a fan of low carb diets like the Atkins diet.
This is more like a carb cycling diet with the high carb days.
With this kind of diet I wouldn’t of made comments until I tried it.
Are you doing this diet to bulk up a bit or lean out?
Or is it because you had diabetes?
Yeah,I’m looking to crash any day now.
Maybe this week.

The funny thing is I’ve been eating 29-30 carbs,not really 10 a day,so thats probably why it’s taking a bit longer.
Since this is gonna be my last week of the diet before the carb up,I’ll probably try hitting no more then 20 carbs a day.[/quote]

I see, I guess I didn’t catch the details.

I started to get leaner, but since seeing it’s effects on me and listening to some of the vets here I’ve turned it into a bulk. I’m not letting myself get fat, but I want to get bigger and stronger so I just quit worrying about my abs for now.

I had my diabetes under control already when I started. DiPasquale was starting to publish AD flavored articles in one of the mags back when I got away from training the first time, can’t remember which one, but I remembered being intrigued then.

As far as the crash, it’s possible you won’t really. A couple guys way back in the thread said they didn’t, but most do. It wasn’t a big deal to me especially since I was expecting it.