My Experience On the Anabolic Diet Part III

Nutrition
681

[quote]ashylarryku wrote:

[quote]smithers584 wrote:
Yeah, I am working on my ME degree right now (2 more semesters), so I guess I am not quite a “real” engineer yet, but I have been working as one for GE Aviation for a bit now, so Im close enough haha!

Yes, I realize it is only day 9, its more so that I hate not being able to measure progress. I dont expect to “see” results, but none of my methods are showing even the slightest deviation from day 1, which is hard to except.

I am going to stick with it,no doubt. Just wondering when I am going to be able to measure results.

Thanks for the motivation though guys![/quote]

I’m only in my fourth semester towards my Civil Degree (doing homework as I type this, go figure ;))

Yeah man definitely keep at it. I just realized you’re still in the induction phase. Shouldn’t your calories be a bit higher? The book recommends eating around 18XBW through the induction phase to help make sure you become fat adapted.[/quote]

I HAVE my Civil Degree, and I’m working on my Structural Masters Degree.

You won’t really see noticeable changes until you’ve either dropped like 5lbs or you start really seeing strength increases. I know you want hard data, but the mirror is your best friend for measuring progress. Three weeks is a minimum to see changes if you aren’t doing something radical. Body transformation is a marathon, not a sprint.

682

^^ Yeah I understand, like I said, I am not expecting a transformation in 9 days, just thought I would have something to measure (even if it was like -0.15 lbs/day). I will look to see some measureable changes at the 1 month mark then.

I just read over the diet section of the book again, and it does suggets 18 X BW for calories, but a few sentences down from that suggest finding your maintenance calories. I know mine are around 2800-3000 (I allow for them to change depending on the “demand” I place on my body that day).

I subtracted 500 cals from maintenance and went from there. I think his initial phase is just to ease people into the diet. If you took a normal person and told them to cut there carbs and drop 500 cals from the get go, most would quit. I might be chancing it here, but I feel like this is the way to go for me. I dont see how fat adaption could depend on your calories (as long as they are sufficient enough), I think it really just depends on your dietary breakdown (50% fat, 40% protein, 10% carbs). Whether its 2300-2500 cals (which is where I am ranging now) or 3200 cals( where my “calculated” BMR is, not the 18 X BW), when you cut the carbs and eat 50% fat, your body has no choice but to use fat for fuel.

I really based this decision on some articles by CT. However, I still follow the diet portion of the AD.

I could be completely wrong though.

683

smithers…

hey fellow ME!! you should try to keep your calories up as much as you can during the initial phase. I remember reading that lowering them during it will give your body the effect of starvation. You want to your body to feel like it has plenty of energy source. Obviously this will be the fat you are providing. Another thing is I would actually increase your fat % to above 60%.

I know that it is discussed that if you are trying to cut that you should decrease the amount of fat in the diet but I would wait until you teach your body the cycle. With that amount of protein your taking in, your body could be unsure with what to use for its primary energy source. Another thing I noticed is that you are eating 50g of carbs on workout days. I would keep this days to less than 30g as well.

Once you are more fat-adapted you can begin to increase that amount (mainly through veggies) but you may be sabotaging your results. The less carbs you give your body and the more fat you give it…the easier your body will make the metabolic shift…and that is the only important thing during the first 12 days. Hope this helps…btw i’m new to this as well…Day 10 for me…ill be waiting til Saturday to start my load anyway so ill be on this phase for 14 days. Hope this is helpful.

Brian

684

also this is a more accurate way to calculate your maintenance calories. especially if you are very active.

Its called “The Cunningham Equation”

685

[quote]smithers584 wrote:
^^ Yeah I understand, like I said, I am not expecting a transformation in 9 days, just thought I would have something to measure (even if it was like -0.15 lbs/day). I will look to see some measureable changes at the 1 month mark then.

I just read over the diet section of the book again, and it does suggets 18 X BW for calories, but a few sentences down from that suggest finding your maintenance calories. I know mine are around 2800-3000 (I allow for them to change depending on the “demand” I place on my body that day).

I subtracted 500 cals from maintenance and went from there. I think his initial phase is just to ease people into the diet. If you took a normal person and told them to cut there carbs and drop 500 cals from the get go, most would quit. I might be chancing it here, but I feel like this is the way to go for me. I dont see how fat adaption could depend on your calories (as long as they are sufficient enough), I think it really just depends on your dietary breakdown (50% fat, 40% protein, 10% carbs). Whether its 2300-2500 cals (which is where I am ranging now) or 3200 cals( where my “calculated” BMR is, not the 18 X BW), when you cut the carbs and eat 50% fat, your body has no choice but to use fat for fuel.

I really based this decision on some articles by CT. However, I still follow the diet portion of the AD.

I could be completely wrong though.[/quote]

Sounds like you’re on the right track. I agree with AirBoren when saying you should up the cals a little bit during the induction and keep fat at least 60%, but you can do what you’re doing and see what happens. If you’re not getting ready for a show or photoshoot or something, theres no rush. Summer is a ways away :wink:

Also, i may have missed it, but what is your height and current estimated bf%?

686

Im 5’11", 194 lbs, guessing I am around 15% BF, but I have no real idea. It is kinda hard to tell without measuring, but I have no accurate way to do it accessible to me. If you look at my back, I look like Im probably 10% BF, but if you look at my front, I look like Im 15% because that is where I tend to carry all my fat. My waist measures about 34" around the biggest part.

AB - I am also waiting until this weekend to refeed, so I feel your pain on the initial phase.

Honestly, about the calories, I really eat when I am hungy, eat until I am satisfied (not stuff, but enough to last me 2-3 hours), then eat again. If I am not hungry 2-3 hours later, I eat no later then the 3 hour mark since my last meal. I just calculated how much to eat at each meal to meey my daily intake. I probably could fit in more calories, but I definately feel like I am eating enough!

However, I have noticed that while 2300-2400 hundred cut the cake the first week, in order to eat and not feel hungry at any point throughout the day, I am ending closer to 2500 cals this second week. Also, when I have a strength workout, my cals have been increasing by about 200-300 cals based on the “eat when I am hungry” approach.

687

[quote]smithers584 wrote:
Im 5’11", 194 lbs, guessing I am around 15% BF, but I have no real idea. It is kinda hard to tell without measuring, but I have no accurate way to do it accessible to me. If you look at my back, I look like Im probably 10% BF, but if you look at my front, I look like Im 15% because that is where I tend to carry all my fat. My waist measures about 34" around the biggest part.[/quote]

Sounds like you should definitely see some bpdy comp changes in due time man. Just be patient, trust the power of the AD, and train like a mad man!

688

Yeah, Im sure I will. I am actually seeing improved sleep quality like I mentioned earlier and I definately have more energy during the day. I dont have that afternoon crash anymore, which is amazing!

What are you guys eating every day? My diet is pretty much the same every day, consisting of:

Eggs scrambled every morning
Turkey Breast (Boars Head Deli Meat, delicous)
2 40g Whey/Casein Shakes with some source of fat (almonds or Natural PB)
Hamburger patties (actually made burgers using lettuce as the bun, a little messy but does the trick)
Chicken (all sorts of varieties and recipes)
10 oz of Steak twice a week
Tuna (blah)
All sorts of cheeses, with breakfast and lunch
Salads with most meals

689

Thats about what my menu looks like with a few others. I was on a low-fat diet before this so I’m indulging in some fatty things that probably aren’t the best for you but some others things I eat are:

Almond Butter (Blue Diamond makes one that have 6 carbs (5 are fiber)!! so its 1 net carb.
Heavy whipping cream to throw in the shakes
Sugar-free jello-- this is a favorite for many ADers…5 calories (1g of protein).
Olive Oil–this is a must…you should be using olive oil excessively everyday.
Fish Oil–i would recommend taking about 10 caps a day.

Brian

690

[quote]ashylarryku wrote:

[quote]Griff14 wrote:
Hey guys! Long time reader that just found this thread (not in this forum that often). I’ve been on the anabolic diet since early November (with a 3 weak break during the holiday season). Started at 240 lbs (15.4% b.f)) to 210 right now with what I assume just under 10% b.f (will do official measurement in the next couple weeks, but abs are visible for the first time in my life).

If i can contribute to any questions please feel free. In the mean time I will be reading the entire forum to catch up. I plan on continuing the diet until I reach 5-7% b.f[/quote]

Great to have another fellow ADer on the forums! Sounds like you’ve been having great experience so far. If you don’t mind, would you tell us what your daily cals have been like while cutting? And what your training/cardio has been like? I’ve been bulking and realized I gained around 6 pounds in just a few weeks with little fat, love this diet![/quote]

I have been using the diet more so for cutting purposes. I don’t have a specific calorie number per day, but I do feel like it was not enough. I’m on a student budget, but if money was not an issue I would of upped my protein a significant amount by purchasing more meat. The first week was total hell but after that I felt I was losing weight a bit too quick (e.g. 5 pounds a week). It was weird, I was getting stronger but just felt like I was getting too small too fast. Cardio was done in the morning (11am) and consisted of cross-trainer, jogging or biking (for 45 minutes) but since have switched to sprinting/plyometric circuits as reading has led me to believe this is better for muscle retention. Lifting is always done at night (730pm) and the key for me was “heavy lifting”. Supplements include HOT-ROX and fish oils. Hope that helps a tad. Fire away if you want to know anything else.

691

[quote]AirBoren wrote:
Thats about what my menu looks like with a few others. I was on a low-fat diet before this so I’m indulging in some fatty things that probably aren’t the best for you but some others things I eat are:

Almond Butter (Blue Diamond makes one that have 6 carbs (5 are fiber)!! so its 1 net carb.
Heavy whipping cream to throw in the shakes
Sugar-free jello-- this is a favorite for many ADers…5 calories (1g of protein).
Olive Oil–this is a must…you should be using olive oil excessively everyday.
Fish Oil–i would recommend taking about 10 caps a day.

Brian[/quote]

Yeah, I forgot to mention olive oil, I use it in everything. I also mix 2 tbsp’s with some red wine vinegar and use it as my salad dressing, helps get the fats in.

Havent broken down and bought a fish oil yet, probably going to take Flameout, but need to do some more research.

How are you guys adapting to the diet? I feel great now (pretty much have after day 6) and my strength is normal, but my energy is up, which is great. However, like I said, I have no indications that I am actually becoming fat adapted, other then I felt like crap days 1-5 (light headed, vision got blurry a few times, had no energy) and now I feel great.

692

I eat a LOT of eggs. I go through 5 dozen in about a week probably. A lot of deli meat, EVOO, lots of flax seed (all carbs are pretty much fiber), spinach, and steak whenever I go out to eat. Some peanut butter and walnuts too (walnuts have some good omega-3s and only 2 net carbs an ounce).

Question: I’m thinking of spending the next few months eating around maintenance level and altering body comp (lose fat, build muscle, stay same weight). I’ve been gaining on around 3,500 cals a day so i’m thinking of eating probably no more than 3,000 on weight training days and 2,500 on rest days (adding in some cardio to increase G-Flux). Also, I was thinking of having my second day of carb-up at around 3,500 cals, and then dropping to maybe a little below 2,000 the day after to take advantage of the high leptin and do some HIIT and betabolic work.

What do you guys think? Should I stick to 1 day or 36 hour CHO loads if trying to just do a body comp change?

693

[quote]ashylarryku wrote:
I eat a LOT of eggs. I go through 5 dozen in about a week probably. A lot of deli meat, EVOO, lots of flax seed (all carbs are pretty much fiber), spinach, and steak whenever I go out to eat. Some peanut butter and walnuts too (walnuts have some good omega-3s and only 2 net carbs an ounce).

Question: I’m thinking of spending the next few months eating around maintenance level and altering body comp (lose fat, build muscle, stay same weight). I’ve been gaining on around 3,500 cals a day so i’m thinking of eating probably no more than 3,000 on weight training days and 2,500 on rest days (adding in some cardio to increase G-Flux). Also, I was thinking of having my second day of carb-up at around 3,500 cals, and then dropping to maybe a little below 2,000 the day after to take advantage of the high leptin and do some HIIT and betabolic work.

What do you guys think? Should I stick to 1 day or 36 hour CHO loads if trying to just do a body comp change?[/quote]

Hey man,

This is a decent goal, and it will work well on this type of diet…gaining muscle and losing fat. You simply have to play with the amount of intake vs training(type and amount).

I have personally been training twice per day, 3 days on, 1 day off, repeat…whilst eating BIG paleo…only one cheat meal per week and am gaining muscle and seem to be losing SOME fat too…well, this weeks measurement will tell fat loss for sure:)

Anyway, I would highly recommend training twice per if you can…and you will see more boyd comp changes, without the need for cardio!

GJ

694

GJ,

What do your twice daily routines look like? Also, what does your peri workout nutrition look like?

We all know the benefits of PWO immediately after training.

We all know the fat burning benefits of light cardio after training.

Is there an issue with drinking my PWO shake while walking at 65% max heart rate? I usually take about 10-20 minutes drink my shake, so I thought why not drink and walk at the same time. If I keep the intensity low enough, then will it work?

Also, anyone doing fasted cardio? I dont have class until 1100 this semester, so I get up everyday at 7 and cook breakfast. However, I could delay breakfast 45 mins and go do some light cardio.

695

[quote]smithers584 wrote:
Yeah, Im sure I will. I am actually seeing improved sleep quality like I mentioned earlier and I definately have more energy during the day. I dont have that afternoon crash anymore, which is amazing!

What are you guys eating every day? My diet is pretty much the same every day, consisting of:

Eggs scrambled every morning
Turkey Breast (Boars Head Deli Meat, delicous)
2 40g Whey/Casein Shakes with some source of fat (almonds or Natural PB)
Hamburger patties (actually made burgers using lettuce as the bun, a little messy but does the trick)
Chicken (all sorts of varieties and recipes)
10 oz of Steak twice a week
Tuna (blah)
All sorts of cheeses, with breakfast and lunch
Salads with most meals

[/quote]

Bacon mushrooms and eggs or some keto-pancakes
whey shake with evoo
veggies and meat/fish
whey shake with evoo
veggies and meet/fish
some nuts, some cheese of meet in the evening

thats the red line for almost every weekday, eating about 3000 cals, my maintainance level before the AD

Today, halfway the 4th week, i feel a little panic…
I couldnt resist to step on the scale this morning, and I gained weight since last week.
but i want to loose my bf, so gaining weight is not my purpose. My waist has also grown 1cm, after dropping 4 in the first weeks.
Have my bf measured upcoming friday, but for now i feel insecure and fat!!

696

[quote]Gymjunkie wrote:

[quote]ashylarryku wrote:
I eat a LOT of eggs. I go through 5 dozen in about a week probably. A lot of deli meat, EVOO, lots of flax seed (all carbs are pretty much fiber), spinach, and steak whenever I go out to eat. Some peanut butter and walnuts too (walnuts have some good omega-3s and only 2 net carbs an ounce).

Question: I’m thinking of spending the next few months eating around maintenance level and altering body comp (lose fat, build muscle, stay same weight). I’ve been gaining on around 3,500 cals a day so i’m thinking of eating probably no more than 3,000 on weight training days and 2,500 on rest days (adding in some cardio to increase G-Flux). Also, I was thinking of having my second day of carb-up at around 3,500 cals, and then dropping to maybe a little below 2,000 the day after to take advantage of the high leptin and do some HIIT and betabolic work.

What do you guys think? Should I stick to 1 day or 36 hour CHO loads if trying to just do a body comp change?[/quote]

Hey man,

This is a decent goal, and it will work well on this type of diet…gaining muscle and losing fat. You simply have to play with the amount of intake vs training(type and amount).

I have personally been training twice per day, 3 days on, 1 day off, repeat…whilst eating BIG paleo…only one cheat meal per week and am gaining muscle and seem to be losing SOME fat too…well, this weeks measurement will tell fat loss for sure:)

Anyway, I would highly recommend training twice per if you can…and you will see more boyd comp changes, without the need for cardio!

GJ[/quote]

Thanks for the feedback GJ. I’m earning my civil engineering degree at KU right now so i’m not sure if time really allows me to train 2X a day, but i might be able to if i really zone in and get everything under control. I’m also just started up on Wendler’s 5/3/1, but i actually heard of someone doing two-adays for 5/3/1 (but they have the Anaconda Protocol).

Can I ask what your two-aday training, cardio (if any) and workout nutrition is like?

Currently I’m doing:
-2 Hours: solid meal
-20/30 minutes: 1 scoop of Whey +5-10g BCAAs (sometimes glutamine too)
During: 15g BCAAs
Imediately After: 1 sccop Whey +5-10g BCAAa
+45 Minutes: solid meal

697

[quote]protein-pro wrote:

Bacon mushrooms and eggs or some keto-pancakes
whey shake with evoo
veggies and meat/fish
whey shake with evoo
veggies and meet/fish
some nuts, some cheese of meet in the evening

thats the red line for almost every weekday, eating about 3000 cals, my maintainance level before the AD

Today, halfway the 4th week, i feel a little panic…
I couldnt resist to step on the scale this morning, and I gained weight since last week.
but i want to loose my bf, so gaining weight is not my purpose. My waist has also grown 1cm, after dropping 4 in the first weeks.
Have my bf measured upcoming friday, but for now i feel insecure and fat!!
[/quote]

Yes, I forgot about bacon, I have two slices of thick cut bacon every morning with my eggs! However, I miss drinking OJ.

Pro - Are you measuring at the same time everyday? My waist measurements very through out the day, and they are the smallest first thing in the morning, so with only 1cm of deviation, I think you are probabaly fine. I weigh myself on the same day at the same time once a week, but back when I used to weigh myself everyday, my weight would always fluctuate with a standard deviation of about 2 lbs.

Are you taking pics at all or just measurements? Do you feel leaner? I actually feel like I look leaner in certain areas than when I started 10 days ago, but that could just be my mind playing tricks on me in the mirror.

698

i felt a lot leaner… my feeling fluctuates more than my weight…
sometimes i feel so good, and i think i really loose the fat. and a few hours later i feel fat and bloated… i made a before pick and i have my bf measured once a month… we will see in a few days… my waistsize was at a random time, dont know what is was last time.
Its just it is still hard to believe i wll succeed with all the nice, fat food, i f**** woth my mind :slight_smile:

699

[quote]smithers584 wrote:
GJ,

What do your twice daily routines look like? Also, what does your peri workout nutrition look like?

Currently, I am doing 3 days on, 1 day off twice per day, until I need to deload(as of today).
I do:
PUSH
PULL
LEGS
OFF
REPEAT

AM workouts are 3 reps(using the perfect rep, ramping etc) and PM is 5x5, also ramping, but quicker. My AM workouts REALLY amp my nervous system and wake me up.

As of last week, I have tried a new peri-workout strategy. I mix 60g WPI+various other aminos in a big jug with 1.5ltrs water. Drink 1/3 15 minutes prior to training and the rest during. I then have 1-2 scoops WPI 30-60mins postworkout. PM session is the same, but less WPI and aminos, because session is shorter(30odd mins).

We all know the benefits of PWO immediately after training.

We all know the fat burning benefits of light cardio after training.

Is there an issue with drinking my PWO shake while walking at 65% max heart rate? I usually take about 10-20 minutes drink my shake, so I thought why not drink and walk at the same time. If I keep the intensity low enough, then will it work?

NO…stop doing that right now. If you are doing your cardio and drinking your PWO shake, you will simply burn the aminos off during your cardio instead of the fat! I did this for a while with slow results, until someone pointed it out to me. Save the PWO shake for AFTER weights ans cardio.

Also, anyone doing fasted cardio? I dont have class until 1100 this semester, so I get up everyday at 7 and cook breakfast. However, I could delay breakfast 45 mins and go do some light cardio.[/quote]

Wouldn’t hurt…take some BCAA’s on your empty stomach. To be totally honest, cardio is overrated man. To smash the fat off, I would rely heavily of weights and diet. Design your weight training so that you have some lactic acid(circuit) work in there and ditch the cardio. You might need some, if some fat is very stubborn, but only if getting into comp shape IMO. To get under 10%, you shouldn’t need any.

GJ

700

[quote]ashylarryku wrote:

[quote]Gymjunkie wrote:

[quote]ashylarryku wrote:
I eat a LOT of eggs. I go through 5 dozen in about a week probably. A lot of deli meat, EVOO, lots of flax seed (all carbs are pretty much fiber), spinach, and steak whenever I go out to eat. Some peanut butter and walnuts too (walnuts have some good omega-3s and only 2 net carbs an ounce).

Question: I’m thinking of spending the next few months eating around maintenance level and altering body comp (lose fat, build muscle, stay same weight). I’ve been gaining on around 3,500 cals a day so i’m thinking of eating probably no more than 3,000 on weight training days and 2,500 on rest days (adding in some cardio to increase G-Flux). Also, I was thinking of having my second day of carb-up at around 3,500 cals, and then dropping to maybe a little below 2,000 the day after to take advantage of the high leptin and do some HIIT and betabolic work.

What do you guys think? Should I stick to 1 day or 36 hour CHO loads if trying to just do a body comp change?[/quote]

Hey man,

This is a decent goal, and it will work well on this type of diet…gaining muscle and losing fat. You simply have to play with the amount of intake vs training(type and amount).

I have personally been training twice per day, 3 days on, 1 day off, repeat…whilst eating BIG paleo…only one cheat meal per week and am gaining muscle and seem to be losing SOME fat too…well, this weeks measurement will tell fat loss for sure:)

Anyway, I would highly recommend training twice per if you can…and you will see more boyd comp changes, without the need for cardio!

GJ[/quote]

Thanks for the feedback GJ. I’m earning my civil engineering degree at KU right now so i’m not sure if time really allows me to train 2X a day, but i might be able to if i really zone in and get everything under control. I’m also just started up on Wendler’s 5/3/1, but i actually heard of someone doing two-adays for 5/3/1 (but they have the Anaconda Protocol).

Can I ask what your two-aday training, cardio (if any) and workout nutrition is like?

Currently I’m doing:
-2 Hours: solid meal
-20/30 minutes: 1 scoop of Whey +5-10g BCAAs (sometimes glutamine too)
During: 15g BCAAs
Imediately After: 1 sccop Whey +5-10g BCAAa
+45 Minutes: solid meal[/quote]

Hey man,

see my post above re my current routine and peri workout nutrition. I might change back to simply taking in BCAA during training and WPI shake with aminos PWO. Overall food intake/type is probably more the key.

GJ