My Experience On the Anabolic Diet Part II

Nutrition
481

[quote]nz6stringaxe wrote:
Trying to reel me back in, sunshne? Ha, this weekend was just a minor positive experience in a greater field of an overall negative experience with the diet.

I may bring it back in next time I plan a long, serious diet phase, but I’d also like to see what low fat moderate carb fat loss is like.

Y’know, it’s funny. I was on the members-only ISSA question board today, and someone asked something about recommendations to the Metabolic Diet. The administrative response was generally opposed to the idea, but specifically said that without the carbohydrate being used as fuel, more amino acids would be burned as fuel from muscle. That’s basically the complete opposite of what the author claims. By the way, the person who responds to these questions isn’t just ‘some guy behind a monitor,’ so don’t get that impression. His response was quite interesting to see as it was in complete opposition however.

I’ll continue to wade through The Ketogenic Diet and let you guys know what conclusions I make based on its information.[/quote]

so what exactly is your plan to lose fat now? Targeted carbs around workouts only or what?

personally I’m just switching from carbs around workouts and a saturday carb up to just the saturday carb up and adding 2-3 “metabolic pairing” workouts to use up more glycogen during the week. Basically a true CKD

482

Think a bulk is possible by keeping weekly cals ~maintenance then having a one day massive carb load? I never get full from carb loads and I can eat all day (hence why I wanna keep it to one day). The downside to my carb-loads, however, is how hot I get. I cant drink anything because then I literally inflate and become quite sick. Is it possible that this instant bloating effect would nullify at all if my liquid, i.e. almond milk, was with a bowl of cereal?

I wonder because I only drank PWO and at the very end of the day since I was so over heated. However, Im hoping including milk with a meal will lower the bloat because it makes me so sick to instantly bloat up like that

483

I’m not trying to lose fat, I’m trying to gain.
I’m probably going to get to a point of using carbs pwo, ppwo, and maybe breakfast to see how I feel. I feel like I might be one of the people who runs a bit better on carbs. My gains in the gym last summer were outrageous, and my fat was relatively lower while my carbs were very prevalent.

This has all just been an experiment; going to the extremes to see how I react. A classic carb-based diet seems like the best choice for me in a mass phase. I may revisit the AD style when I diet down again over a long term though.

484

[quote]nz6stringaxe wrote:
I’m not trying to lose fat, I’m trying to gain.
I’m probably going to get to a point of using carbs pwo, ppwo, and maybe breakfast to see how I feel. I feel like I might be one of the people who runs a bit better on carbs. My gains in the gym last summer were outrageous, and my fat was relatively lower while my carbs were very prevalent.

This has all just been an experiment; going to the extremes to see how I react. A classic carb-based diet seems like the best choice for me in a mass phase. I may revisit the AD style when I diet down again over a long term though.[/quote]

oh in that case I agree with you. I think both can definitely work but the way I look at it is that if I’m bulking I don’t need something stoking my metabolism because calories will be higher but I’d like to have carbs when I need them most (around workouts and possibly breakfast). While cutting I’d like lower calories during the week (and personally maybe even no carbs at all during the week like a CKD) but then having that once a week large carb up/refeed in order to stoke my metabolism rather than having a straight up TKD where calories would generally be lower and metabolism would likely slow down more.

485

Entire 775g box of raisin bran
2L vanilla soy milk
WW spaghetti
homemade unleavened WW bread
350g french stick baguette
1 baked sweet potato (I forgot how sweet those things are!)
4 apples
4 bananas

I am to be referred to as KING BLOAT.

Man when I look at that list I can’t help but feel like maybe I went a little overboard… just a little…

I’m feeling good though, more or less - ready to kick (my own) ass this week after a bad previous week.

I’ve found with my loads that I tend to stop eating around 3-5pm where I end the load and don’t end up eating anything else until breakfast the following morning.
Would it be wiser to take some protein a few hours before bed? Maybe a few fish oil caps?

486

have any of you guys have b4 and after picture of yourself’s? (no homo) just wanting to see the results you guys have had…

487

[quote]synny wrote:
have any of you guys have b4 and after picture of yourself’s? (no homo) just wanting to see the results you guys have had…

[/quote]

Hey man, no need to affirm your sexuality - I think we’ve all got more or less a common goal here. “The intelligent and relentless pursuit of muscle” ? Yeah, that’ll do!

Unfortunately I didn’t have a camera when I started the AD but I’ve got a few pics from several weeks before and I’ve actually got a camera due to arrive in the mail this week.

I had planned to upload some before/after shots upon its arrival but then I went and messed up a little with my carb loads so I’m going to give it another week or two and see if I have some better results to display.
My main battle has been with reducing bodyfat which is what I think this diet is most effective for - I just haven’t been consistent enough with my calories, macros and carb-load timings yet to see really mind-blowing results (except for the water loss in the induction which really surprised me).

I’m eating pretty much the same things each day now (I might upload my meals for critique a little later), finally piecing together a solid workout regimen and fine-tuning the timing of everything so that I’m not fatigued either from general overwork or glycogen depletion too early on in the week.

Anyway, time for my pre-breakfast cardio!
I woke up with a vague headache this morning, it’s a little better now that I’ve desecrated the toilet - even needed a courtesy flush! - but still… those damn pesky carbs…

Too much information? Nah!

488

[quote]El Sonido wrote:
synny wrote:
have any of you guys have b4 and after picture of yourself’s? (no homo) just wanting to see the results you guys have had…

Hey man, no need to affirm your sexuality - I think we’ve all got more or less a common goal here. “The intelligent and relentless pursuit of muscle” ? Yeah, that’ll do! [/quote]

lol, it’s all good synny, I’m a girl anyway. :slight_smile: wink, wink :wink: I would love to make a comment about how you use my pic for your avi, but sadly I’m not there yet.

I don’t think I’ve been on the AD long enough to see any noticeable results yet, but I have been meaning to take some pics. I started lifting last august, and I’ve lost 45lbs and at least 12% bf since then. So yeah, I’m pretty proud of my progress thus far. I’m hoping the AD will help me get nice and shredded, and get that tummy flat(er). After three C-sections, I’m not sure how ripped the midsection will get. :slight_smile:

[quote] I woke up with a vague headache this morning, it’s a little better now that I’ve desecrated the toilet - even needed a courtesy flush! - but still… those damn pesky carbs…

Too much information? Nah![/quote]

um yeah, TMI!!! :stuck_out_tongue: Just kidding! I swear I look pregnant again after my carb load…

489

Just wanted to ask what experience others have had by varying the carb-up duration, food types and fat intake for cutting? I’m reading Lyle McDonald - A Guide to Flexible Dieting and UD2 he goes into lots of variations and details on “structured re-feeds” that make alot of sense. Just wondering if anyone has incorporated this advise with the AD P/F guidelines. Cheers.

490

[quote]Nat7774 wrote:
Just wanted to ask what experience others have had by varying the carb-up duration, food types and fat intake for cutting? I’m reading Lyle McDonald - A Guide to Flexible Dieting and UD2 he goes into lots of variations and details on “structured re-feeds” that make alot of sense. Just wondering if anyone has incorporated this advise with the AD P/F guidelines. Cheers.[/quote]

You know I asked that question myself…

The conclusion I have come to is do not mix diets.

If you want to follow the guide lines in UD 2.0 then follow it strictly.
If you want to follow the loose parameters of the Anabolic Diet life style then follow it.

If you keep chopping and changing different ideas, it is harder to isolate when something goes wrong.

I think people should at least give whatever diet they are doing at least a few months, before switching to new diets every 2 weeks.

I have been bulking on the AD for around maybe 4-5 months now, and only now have I been working out what it takes to put on mass. The average calories are much higher than on a high carbohydrate diet, and I find my carb loads need to be very big.

I think liquid meals (whey + whipping cream) are a must when bulking on the AD as meeting caloric requirements is hard, and eating red meat is very satiating.

I am going to give the AD bulk phase another 2 months, and if that fails I will probably return back to high carbohydrate bulking. But at least I can say I’ve given it my best shot, at around 4 months+.

491

I hear what ur saying about mixing diets but the AD can be tailored to find what works and is not written in stone to some degree. I just want to tweak it to find what works best for me as I feel progress could be better. I like the AD weekdays and donâ??t agree with Lyle’s lower fat requirements I think the high fat really helps. The carbup however leaves room for variation as it could be 5, 12, 24 or 36hrs & I think Iâ??m taking in too much fat / junk which is holding back my fatloss it seems Lyle has more detail and great ideas in this area. Also Lyle’s training system seems to be geared towards fatloss which should also work well cutting on the AD. Ultimately Iâ??d like to find a happy medium for maintenance and the right balance for fatloss. This could work well long term incorporating Lyle’s Flexible Dieting strategy.

So just some thoughts taking the best from both systems without moving too far outside of the ADs framework to find what works best. BTW Iâ??ve been on AD for 2 months.

Any thoughts?

[quote]andyr wrote:
Nat7774 wrote:
Just wanted to ask what experience others have had by varying the carb-up duration, food types and fat intake for cutting? I’m reading Lyle McDonald - A Guide to Flexible Dieting and UD2 he goes into lots of variations and details on “structured re-feeds” that make alot of sense. Just wondering if anyone has incorporated this advise with the AD P/F guidelines. Cheers.

You know I asked that question myself…

The conclusion I have come to is do not mix diets.

If you want to follow the guide lines in UD 2.0 then follow it strictly.
If you want to follow the loose parameters of the Anabolic Diet life style then follow it.

If you keep chopping and changing different ideas, it is harder to isolate when something goes wrong.

I think people should at least give whatever diet they are doing at least a few months, before switching to new diets every 2 weeks.

I have been bulking on the AD for around maybe 4-5 months now, and only now have I been working out what it takes to put on mass. The average calories are much higher than on a high carbohydrate diet, and I find my carb loads need to be very big.

I think liquid meals (whey + whipping cream) are a must when bulking on the AD as meeting caloric requirements is hard, and eating red meat is very satiating.

I am going to give the AD bulk phase another 2 months, and if that fails I will probably return back to high carbohydrate bulking. But at least I can say I’ve given it my best shot, at around 4 months+.[/quote]

492

Was up all my name is Cory Gregory I have studied under Dr.Eric Serrano on fat loading and the Anabolic diet for over 5 years if you guys have any question please feel free to ask. I just recently used the diet to get real lean for a show and photo shoot September 2008 and now have been bulking up on a moderate version of it. I have taken my body to a ripped 170 as in pic and now back up to a 227 power lifting weight. I am also a lifetime drug free athlete so I could really feel jump in hormone levels if done correctly. thx

493

Hey Cory, what tips / advice can you provide for getting ripped on the AD? Thanks.

[quote]corympvp wrote:
Was up all my name is Cory Gregory I have studied under Dr.Eric Serrano on fat loading and the Anabolic diet for over 5 years if you guys have any question please feel free to ask. I just recently used the diet to get real lean for a show and photo shoot September 2008 and now have been bulking up on a moderate version of it. I have taken my body to a ripped 170 as in pic and now back up to a 227 power lifting weight. I am also a lifetime drug free athlete so I could really feel jump in hormone levels if done correctly. thx[/quote]

494

the way that I did the diet was on a 12 week type deal like most other guys but i used it in like 3 different phase’s.

Phase #1
start with 12 days adaption phase like normal AD diet I ate

#1 4 whole eggs with cheese

#2 1/2 cup walnuts or almonds

#3 Meat Greens and cheese cubes

#4 cheese cubes and fish like tuna

#5 meat greens and cheese

#6 before bed 1-2 scoop low carb whey

keep carbs under 50 or so for sure make sure and count everything

then I loaded 48 hours first month on weekend everything in sight but am 100% during week

Phase #2 weeks 4-8
same diet- but on weekends load 24 hours

Phase #3 weeks 4-12
same diet
take out nuts use shake instead
2 weeks out take out cheese also use meat load only 1-2 meals with sweet pot on weekend 1 day with meals

they way the body works it burns fat on fat after the 12 days so once u get leaner if start to take fat away it has to get it from somewhere so it will burn it off the body.

Another way to do a diet similar is Fat load which is a low fat diet for 3 days then high fat 1 day unlimited calories it works well also I have been a guinea pib for Serrano for awhile

Cory

495

Thanks Cory,

Thats just what im looking for. Im eating walnuts and cheese at the moment so I think will phase them out slowly to aid with fatloss and also use shakes before bed instead of steak and greens.

I posted this a couple of pages ago so with ur advice and my plan it may actually work well. Any comments.

Thanks.

[quote]Nat7774 wrote:
Hey guys,

Im looking to cut over the next 8 weeks by gradually tweaking the AD and cardio program. My 1st 8 weeks Ive made decent muscle gains nice fat loss but would really like to accelerate the fat loss now. Training = 3 x week upper / lower & would like change training routine for the last 2 weeks only… Any advice?

History

Weeks 1-6 - 18x - 36hr CHO-up - 2xSS cardio
Weeks 7-8 - 15x - 36hr CHO-up - 2xSS cardio

Plan

Week 9 - 14x - 36hr CHO-up - 2xHHIT cardio
Week 10 - 13x - 36hr CHO-up - 2xSS cardio (de-load)
Week 11 - 12x - 36hr CHO-up - 2xHHIT + 2xSS cardio
Week 12 - 12x - 24hr CHO-up - 2xHHIT + 2xSS cardio
Week 13 - 12x - 24hr CHO-up - 2xHHIT + 2xSS cardio
Week 14 - 12x - Mid + 12hr CHO-up - 3xHHIT + 2xSS cardio
Week 15 - 12x - 12hr CHO-up - 3xHHIT + 3xSS cardio
Week 16 - 12x - Mid + 1meal CHO-up - 3xHHIT + 2xSS cardio

HIIT = 5min warm up - 20min HIIT - 5min cooldown on off days
SS cardio = 10min SS post WO

Also should I lower fat to 50% and up protein to 40% @ 1.5xBW?

Thanks.
[/quote]

496

[quote]andyr wrote:
Nat7774 wrote:
Just wanted to ask what experience others have had by varying the carb-up duration, food types and fat intake for cutting? I’m reading Lyle McDonald - A Guide to Flexible Dieting and UD2 he goes into lots of variations and details on “structured re-feeds” that make alot of sense. Just wondering if anyone has incorporated this advise with the AD P/F guidelines. Cheers.

You know I asked that question myself…

The conclusion I have come to is do not mix diets.

If you want to follow the guide lines in UD 2.0 then follow it strictly.
If you want to follow the loose parameters of the Anabolic Diet life style then follow it.

If you keep chopping and changing different ideas, it is harder to isolate when something goes wrong.

I think people should at least give whatever diet they are doing at least a few months, before switching to new diets every 2 weeks.

I have been bulking on the AD for around maybe 4-5 months now, and only now have I been working out what it takes to put on mass. The average calories are much higher than on a high carbohydrate diet, and I find my carb loads need to be very big.

I think liquid meals (whey + whipping cream) are a must when bulking on the AD as meeting caloric requirements is hard, and eating red meat is very satiating.

I am going to give the AD bulk phase another 2 months, and if that fails I will probably return back to high carbohydrate bulking. But at least I can say I’ve given it my best shot, at around 4 months+.[/quote]

Very good very good! I was thinkin everyone has jumped ship and joined carb-cycling for cutting. However, Im bulking now and Im still making progress (more reps same sets/weight+)with the AD and Im having massive Carb loads. Currently they last one day because I can literally eat ALL DAY, only if I dont take in negligible liquids. Reason being they puff me up to the point of explosion lol But since I am bulikng, think i could go 36 hours instead of my 12

497

sweet everyone is different glad u like the diet man I had unreal gains from it I think it is superior to anything out there…

Cory

498

[quote]corympvp wrote:
sweet everyone is different glad u like the diet man I had unreal gains from it I think it is superior to anything out there…

Cory
Musclepharm.com[/quote]

I like the simplistic approach you took for cutting. Meat based load with a sweet potatoe a couple times during the day and minor, but effective, changes. Nice. Now What would you say is the word for bulking? Im at 3000 now but I would love to blindly add cheese to everything and put a blind-fold on for carb ups. But Im smarter than that. However, I’m now cuious as to your approach

499

[quote]andyr wrote:
Nat7774 wrote:

If you keep chopping and changing different ideas, it is harder to isolate when something goes wrong.

I think people should at least give whatever diet they are doing at least a few months, before switching to new diets every 2 weeks.

[/quote]

This is excellent advice!!! I just wanted to point this out, since many people on this thread are voicing some frustration. Remember, just the induction phase and the first couple carb loads take up one month on the AD. Waiting at least four months before second-guessing yourself is excellent advice.

Nat, I’ve been playing around with the length of my carb loads to see what works best. So far I’ve done 36 hours, 12 hours, and 24 hours. I like the 24 hours best, I feel like I can get pretty full in that time. However, I have less LBM than most of you, so you may need more glycogen to fill up than I do. :slight_smile:

500

[quote]Nat7774 wrote:

HIIT = 5min warm up - 20min HIIT - 5min cooldown on off days
SS cardio = 10min SS post WO

Thanks.
[/quote]

Nat, I hope I’m not being too nit-picky, but I noticed your SS cardio is only 10 min. IMHO, if you’re going to do SS, it should be between 30-60 min. 10 min is barely long enough to get out of breath, lol. But if you’re doing 2 or 3 sessions of HIIT a week, you may not even need the SS. Save it for like your last two weeks if you feel like you’re not losing enough.

Since you’re only lifting 3 times a week, why not try full-body workouts? They can really torch fat! How many days do you take between lifting sessions?