My Experience On the Anabolic Diet Part II

Nutrition
501

Sunshne, 10min SS cardio is after 45min weight training. Does that make a difference?

May do full-body workouts last 2 weeks.

Thanks

[quote]sunshne wrote:
Nat7774 wrote:

HIIT = 5min warm up - 20min HIIT - 5min cooldown on off days
SS cardio = 10min SS post WO

Thanks.

Nat, I hope I’m not being too nit-picky, but I noticed your SS cardio is only 10 min. IMHO, if you’re going to do SS, it should be between 30-60 min. 10 min is barely long enough to get out of breath, lol. But if you’re doing 2 or 3 sessions of HIIT a week, you may not even need the SS. Save it for like your last two weeks if you feel like you’re not losing enough.

Since you’re only lifting 3 times a week, why not try full-body workouts? They can really torch fat! How many days do you take between lifting sessions?[/quote]

502

Do you guys count flax meal (or any supplemental fibre) in your daily calorie count?
Also, do you count greens like spinach and broccoli.

I didn’t count either of these at first on my calorie count but then started doing so when I was restricting my calories, I’m not so sure now.

49 calories per 10g of flax meal and I take 3-5 tbsp per day.
So that, coupled with the greens can add up to a fairly significant difference.

503

[quote]andyr wrote:

The conclusion I have come to is do not mix diets.

If you want to follow the guide lines in UD 2.0 then follow it strictly.
If you want to follow the loose parameters of the Anabolic Diet life style then follow it.

If you keep chopping and changing different ideas, it is harder to isolate when something goes wrong.

I think people should at least give whatever diet they are doing at least a few months, before switching to new diets every 2 weeks.

I have been bulking on the AD for around maybe 4-5 months now, and only now have I been working out what it takes to put on mass. The average calories are much higher than on a high carbohydrate diet, and I find my carb loads need to be very big.

I think liquid meals (whey + whipping cream) are a must when bulking on the AD as meeting caloric requirements is hard, and eating red meat is very satiating.

I am going to give the AD bulk phase another 2 months, and if that fails I will probably return back to high carbohydrate bulking. But at least I can say I’ve given it my best shot, at around 4 months+.[/quote]

How’s the bulk going?

[quote]corympvp wrote:

they way the body works it burns fat on fat after the 12 days so once u get leaner if start to take fat away it has to get it from somewhere so it will burn it off the body.

Another way to do a diet similar is Fat load which is a low fat diet for 3 days then high fat 1 day unlimited calories it works well also I have been a guinea pib for Serrano for awhile

[/quote]

by the logic of the AD diet wouldn’t the fat load result in using glycogen for fuel?

also out of curiosity what is your natural body type, ecto?

[quote]bkmacky9288 wrote:

Very good very good! I was thinkin everyone has jumped ship and joined carb-cycling for cutting. However, Im bulking now and Im still making progress (more reps same sets/weight+)with the AD and Im having massive Carb loads. Currently they last one day because I can literally eat ALL DAY, only if I dont take in negligible liquids. Reason being they puff me up to the point of explosion lol But since I am bulikng, think i could go 36 hours instead of my 12[/quote]

Whats your natural body type too? It seems like the carb load would add more fat when bulking but I’m not sure. I have bulked with a CKD before and added a ton of fat unfortunately but also a lot of muscle and really I was just eating too many calories

504

Im meso-endo. I look very muscular, can lose fat fast, but I’m a FFB. My weekly cals arent anything Earth shattering and I have a pretty good volume working right now. I eat 28-3000 cals and Im thinkin to just go all out on carb up making them very clean and including things like dairy free ice-cream here and there. Not super unhealthy but its not clean either. Im not worried about fat gain much. I wanna reach 200 lbs and I have no deadline. Im currently 165 so if it takes me a year fine. But Ive always let my fear of getting fat again hold me back in a cut gain some cut again leaving me with negligible strength gains.

505

That which holds you back has been my problem as well bk. It’s hard to overcome, and it takes a very clear plan which you have to believe in strongly to get around it.

506

[quote]nz6stringaxe wrote:
That which holds you back has been my problem as well bk. It’s hard to overcome, and it takes a very clear plan which you have to believe in strongly to get around it.[/quote]

Thanks for that. Yea Im going to consistantly take in 28-3000 cals and keep my carb loads all clean, well sans half an angel food cake (cant let goodness expire!), and just go all out on rice and beans, quinoa, etc. Im currently up 2 lbs from last Saturday (dont know how much muscle but i did do an all out feeding frenzy on carbs Saturday only). The cool part is my lower back and love handles arent as flabby at all and I just look smoother up front. Not sure what to think of it but we’ll see as time progresses. Until then Im going to add weight to the bar and add cals when I stall

507

For anyone who’s interested I’ve started a training log: http://www.T-Nation.com/free_online_forum/blog_sports_body_training_performance_bodybuilding_log/the_hour_is_now

Go easy on me! haha.

508

anybody had any luck (i mean proper good results) bulking with this diet? i used to run it to cut and it worked a treat, im pretty carb sensitive and was wondering how it works to add lean mass.
recently been using carbs in morning and pre/post workout, all other meals are just high protein moderate fat.

cheers

509

Well Im bulking now (3 weeks in) and Ive been continuely adding reps/weight for all lifts. I had a really dirty 10 hour refeed (starting PWO lasting until I go to bed). Tomorrow Im going to start a clean, sans half an angel foodcake, and make it last 36 hours. Ive gained 5-6 lbs so Im presuming not too much fat gain

510

BK, here’s a question for you:
You’re obviously not following the AD mass guidelines, so what do you think of them? Your approach is a bit more like how I have observed would work better.

To clarify, I’m eating a similar amount of cals as you are right now (slowly weaning OFF the AD, but point still remains), and gaining roughly 1lb a week. I see no need to raise them any higher.

As per the guidelines, we should be eating at LEAST 4,000 daily. I don’t believe this amount could possibly leave fat gain out of the potential problem pool.

I’m trying to follow a more Berardi-based outcome-based decision-making stance.

511

[quote]nz6stringaxe wrote:
BK, here’s a question for you:
You’re obviously not following the AD mass guidelines, so what do you think of them? Your approach is a bit more like how I have observed would work better.

To clarify, I’m eating a similar amount of cals as you are right now (slowly weaning OFF the AD, but point still remains), and gaining roughly 1lb a week. I see no need to raise them any higher.

As per the guidelines, we should be eating at LEAST 4,000 daily. I don’t believe this amount could possibly leave fat gain out of the potential problem pool.

I’m trying to follow a more Berardi-based outcome-based decision-making stance.[/quote]

It’s funny you should comment on this.
Just last night I was skimming over the bulking guidelines in the orginal AD book and it does put me at 4000-5000 which just seems insane to me.

I can imagine working up to that over many months as BW gains are made but to jump right into that is surely suicide.

I’ve been taking 3000-3200 this week and I feel much better for it, the word that comes to mind to describe it is that I feel more ‘solid’.

I decided to start bulking after reading through several threads and something that, I think Professor X said about guys who start lifting and go straight into a cut. Basically he was saying that it’s pretty silly considering beginners have nothing to cut TO.

This really rang true to me so I figured I’d stop being so fat-phobic and up my calories, at least this way I can increase my volume, intensity and actually perform better as a whole - not to mention feel better for the rest of my day.

512

[quote]nz6stringaxe wrote:
BK, here’s a question for you:
You’re obviously not following the AD mass guidelines, so what do you think of them? Your approach is a bit more like how I have observed would work better.

To clarify, I’m eating a similar amount of cals as you are right now (slowly weaning OFF the AD, but point still remains), and gaining roughly 1lb a week. I see no need to raise them any higher.

As per the guidelines, we should be eating at LEAST 4,000 daily. I don’t believe this amount could possibly leave fat gain out of the potential problem pool.

I’m trying to follow a more Berardi-based outcome-based decision-making stance.[/quote]

Exactly how Im approaching it as well. Now if cals get to be 4000+ so be it. But I’m not going to fix what isn’t broken. I’m upping my weights and/or reps for every exercise. So until that stops im going to keep my cals as is. Im just gonna change this weeks carb-up, as I said earlier, to see how energy is with a 90-95% clean, 36 hour, compared to an all out ‘see-food’ approach for ~12 hours.

513

Right, to both of you, it just seems much more logical to work into such a high energy balance rather than falling into it. Besides, I don’t know about you guys, and maybe it’s just the immense stress I’ve been under with school this week, but I feel full, bloated, and just generally not too good digestive-ly all the time. Upping my calories another 1500? I can’t imagine how horrible I’d feel.

By the way, El Sonido is that you in your avi? Is that an RG? This may be an appropriate time to mention I just finished my sophomore guitar jury today at school.

514

[quote]El Sonido wrote:
nz6stringaxe wrote:
BK, here’s a question for you:
You’re obviously not following the AD mass guidelines, so what do you think of them? Your approach is a bit more like how I have observed would work better.

To clarify, I’m eating a similar amount of cals as you are right now (slowly weaning OFF the AD, but point still remains), and gaining roughly 1lb a week. I see no need to raise them any higher.

As per the guidelines, we should be eating at LEAST 4,000 daily. I don’t believe this amount could possibly leave fat gain out of the potential problem pool.

I’m trying to follow a more Berardi-based outcome-based decision-making stance.

It’s funny you should comment on this.
Just last night I was skimming over the bulking guidelines in the orginal AD book and it does put me at 4000-5000 which just seems insane to me.

I can imagine working up to that over many months as BW gains are made but to jump right into that is surely suicide.

I’ve been taking 3000-3200 this week and I feel much better for it, the word that comes to mind to describe it is that I feel more ‘solid’.

I decided to start bulking after reading through several threads and something that, I think Professor X said about guys who start lifting and go straight into a cut. Basically he was saying that it’s pretty silly considering beginners have nothing to cut TO.

This really rang true to me so I figured I’d stop being so fat-phobic and up my calories, at least this way I can increase my volume, intensity and actually perform better as a whole - not to mention feel better for the rest of my day.[/quote]

I’ve been the same way for four years of training(fat-phobic) so I’d cut. Gain 5-10 lbs then cut. So barely any strength gains. So Im putting my fears aside and Im onna gain some weight and have fun cutting for a reason to see just what I built. Im thinkin of bulking into next year. I just really wanna see what I can get to. I know I can cut no problem so I’m workin on my fear now

515

[quote]nz6stringaxe wrote:
Right, to both of you, it just seems much more logical to work into such a high energy balance rather than falling into it. Besides, I don’t know about you guys, and maybe it’s just the immense stress I’ve been under with school this week, but I feel full, bloated, and just generally not too good digestive-ly all the time. Upping my calories another 1500? I can’t imagine how horrible I’d feel.

By the way, El Sonido is that you in your avi? Is that an RG? This may be an appropriate time to mention I just finished my sophomore guitar jury today at school.[/quote]

Whats your fiber and water intake?

516

[quote]nz6stringaxe wrote:
Right, to both of you, it just seems much more logical to work into such a high energy balance rather than falling into it. Besides, I don’t know about you guys, and maybe it’s just the immense stress I’ve been under with school this week, but I feel full, bloated, and just generally not too good digestive-ly all the time. Upping my calories another 1500? I can’t imagine how horrible I’d feel.

By the way, El Sonido is that you in your avi? Is that an RG? This may be an appropriate time to mention I just finished my sophomore guitar jury today at school.[/quote]

I know on carb ups Im always hungry and I blame the insulin highs and the shots of ghrelin that go with it. Now during the week Im hungriest upon waking and PWO. So I believe its either a chemical thing or perhaps you have something up with your GI tract. That is if the bloat is really affecting you

517

[quote]bkmacky9288 wrote:
nz6stringaxe wrote:
Right, to both of you, it just seems much more logical to work into such a high energy balance rather than falling into it. Besides, I don’t know about you guys, and maybe it’s just the immense stress I’ve been under with school this week, but I feel full, bloated, and just generally not too good digestive-ly all the time. Upping my calories another 1500? I can’t imagine how horrible I’d feel.

By the way, El Sonido is that you in your avi? Is that an RG? This may be an appropriate time to mention I just finished my sophomore guitar jury today at school.

I know on carb ups Im always hungry and I blame the insulin highs and the shots of ghrelin that go with it. Now during the week Im hungriest upon waking and PWO. So I believe its either a chemical thing or perhaps you have something up with your GI tract. That is if the bloat is really affecting you[/quote]

Ditto to the hunger upon waking and PWO and ditto also to the damn constant hunger on the loads. On the loads it’s as if some connection between my digestion and my brain is severed and there’s nothing saying ‘Ok, you’re full now… Ok, you’re bloated now… Ok, your stomach just ruptured…’.

[quote]nz6stringaxe wrote:
By the way, El Sonido is that you in your avi? Is that an RG? This may be an appropriate time to mention I just finished my sophomore guitar jury today at school.[/quote]

Yeah it’s me.
It’s an Ibanez Prestige, I’m not sure what the model number would be. It’s not actually mine, I guess you might say I’m between axes right now.
I know this is going to throw us completely off-topic but what is ‘guitar jury’?

518

[quote]nz6stringaxe wrote:
BK, here’s a question for you:
You’re obviously not following the AD mass guidelines, so what do you think of them? Your approach is a bit more like how I have observed would work better.

To clarify, I’m eating a similar amount of cals as you are right now (slowly weaning OFF the AD, but point still remains), and gaining roughly 1lb a week. I see no need to raise them any higher.

As per the guidelines, we should be eating at LEAST 4,000 daily. I don’t believe this amount could possibly leave fat gain out of the potential problem pool.

I’m trying to follow a more Berardi-based outcome-based decision-making stance.[/quote]

When I did a CKD bulk 1.5 years ago I started at like 3200 or so calories but weighed myself too early and didn’t think about water weight or anything so when I saw my weight didn’t go up in just a few days I upped the calories and by the end of the week it was at 3900 calories with a 4000-4500 calorie 1-day (16 hours or so) carb up. Needless to say I gained a lot of fat. I also gained a good amount of muscle though so it makes me think I could do so again with less fat gain if I tried it again with lower calories.

During this time though I

  1. Wasn’t exactly using the best body composition tool for measurements
  2. My training was a split but with HST principles of starting significantly under your max weights for the given rep range so I feel like I had way too many calories for not enough stimulus at times

BKMacky, you sure it’s a good idea to go to a 36 hour carb up when things are going well with 12 and you used to be overweight? I guess experimenting isn’t a bad thing, just saying…

519

Well at school we have our typical finals (as typical as they can be in a music school), but depending on the department, either each semester or year, instrumentalists/vocalists have a jury. It’s a grand assessment of the year, performed in front of the whole (in my case) guitar faculty. They ask you to perform various things and demonstrate this and that. It’s easily one of the most stressful things I could ever imagine. Visual artists and music composition majors have ‘critiques’ which are similar, but the thing with us is how the performance could go wrong for any reason. The stress of it all doesn’t help; memory slips are very common.

520

[quote]pumped340 wrote:
nz6stringaxe wrote:
BK, here’s a question for you:
You’re obviously not following the AD mass guidelines, so what do you think of them? Your approach is a bit more like how I have observed would work better.

To clarify, I’m eating a similar amount of cals as you are right now (slowly weaning OFF the AD, but point still remains), and gaining roughly 1lb a week. I see no need to raise them any higher.

As per the guidelines, we should be eating at LEAST 4,000 daily. I don’t believe this amount could possibly leave fat gain out of the potential problem pool.

I’m trying to follow a more Berardi-based outcome-based decision-making stance.

When I did a CKD bulk 1.5 years ago I started at like 3200 or so calories but weighed myself too early and didn’t think about water weight or anything so when I saw my weight didn’t go up in just a few days I upped the calories and by the end of the week it was at 3900 calories with a 4000-4500 calorie 1-day (16 hours or so) carb up. Needless to say I gained a lot of fat. I also gained a good amount of muscle though so it makes me think I could do so again with less fat gain if I tried it again with lower calories.

During this time though I

  1. Wasn’t exactly using the best body composition tool for measurements
  2. My training was a split but with HST principles of starting significantly under your max weights for the given rep range so I feel like I had way too many calories for not enough stimulus at times

BKMacky, you sure it’s a good idea to go to a 36 hour carb up when things are going well with 12 and you used to be overweight? I guess experimenting isn’t a bad thing, just saying…[/quote]

My 12 hour load was all junk. So, i wanna see how a very clean load goes for 36 hours. I have two 5 hour shifts during this time frame, however, I get these free Greens MRP bars really high quality ingredients. No HFCS, of any kind, and no soy at all. And very tasty! I also have a high caliber nut bar. And Ill probably stuff my pockets with PB&Js :slight_smile: